Ask the Tart: Archive 1

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Thread archived from https://www.606v2.com/t2445-ask-the-tart - Kiwireddevil

CrippledTart wrote:
By popular demand (Miky), here is a v2 verson of my 606 thread "Ask Me Ref".

As stated on the 606 version, this isn't just for people to ask me questions (I do not consider myself to be the biggest wrestling genius in the world contrary to the impression you get from some of my posts!), it's for people to ask questions and ANYONE who knows the answer to provide it.

This is not an opinion thread, per se. It is for those random wrestling musings you may have had but never got the answer to.

So if there's anything you ever wondered about wrestling, and never knew who to ask, go for it.

Bobby Roode wrote:If Hogan and Bischoff could create their perfect wrestler, who or what would it be like?

Hero wrote:2. Austin.
He’s widely regarded as one of if not the greatest ‘star’ to grace the industry. Whilst Hogan & HHH are often derided by the IWC for using their influence and power backstage, Austin seems above derision. Firstly what abuse of politics has Austin been guilty of, and why does he not fall into the Hogan/HHH category in the eyes of the IWC?

Good question. Steve Austin definitely used his political clout at times, but it was when he thought something was bad for business. Triple H and Hogan have a tendency to bury wrestlers they see as a threat, whereas Austin to my knowledge never acted that way.

He was fiercely protective of his character, and a student of the industry who had a good idea of what was good and bad for business. He was also accused of being paranoid at times.

Austin refused to work programmes with Jeff Jarrett and Billy Gunn in the summer of 1999. Gunn because he didn't rate him, Jarrett because the two had personal heat over Jarrett criticising the "Austin 3:16" gimmick as blasphemous. There were rumours he wouldn't put over Triple H in 1999 as well, but these are believed to be unfounded (he did a job for him at No Mercy). He also refused to do the job in an unadvertised match with Brock Lesnar on Raw in 2002, arguing that it would be bad for business. Austin's logic was that, as the biggest name in the company, it would have more effect if Brock ran through others on his way to a big PPV showdown between the two, where he would be happy to put Brock over.

The business he did in 1998 and 1999 was phenomenal, and meant that he had no political challengers. However Triple H's ascendance led to tension, and Austin felt insecure in his spot as the top guy. This led to a drastic change around 2000, when he suddenly became harder to work with. Austin did not take well to Vince having a new favourite, and protected his territory any time he felt challenged. He did not last much longer as a full-time main eventer, mainly because of his condition but also largely because the situation had diminished his passion for wrestling.

Another key was Austin's character: He was the toughest guy in the room. He took on all kinds of numbers and usually won. This made incredible money but did not lend itself to putting others over. In fact the WWF didn't want him doing jobs to anyone when they could help it - even tainted ones - while so much money was rolling in. Austin's character was dominant, not just physically but also in that he took up everyone's attention. This was a big plus for the WWF in his peak run, but in his latter years it became a hindrance. As the sheriff, when he was for all intents and purposes retired, he undercut every wrestler he came into contact with. And without great feuds to sink his teeth into, his promos suffered, he relied more on the tired beer drinking routine, and became something of a parody.

Austin didn't boost an awful lot of careers, but it wasn't with malice. Therein lies the difference between him and Triple H or Hogan. For the most part, he did what he thought was right for business.

Just a quick and REALLY random question:

Was there any significance to Punk shouting "It's clobberin time" during his entrance at MITB? Was it in anyway related to The Thing from Fantastic Four or ?

from dj legless moved by request

What was the deal with Hogan putting Goldberg over in Atlanta. I have heard that he had creative control and didn't really do to much clean jobs.

Was this because they were losing the ratings and it would have been good for business?

So what happened to my answer to him then Nando

the-gaffer wrote:So what happened to my answer to him then Nando

he asked to me to move the question here and remove the article cos he thought he'd get a better answer here

fernando wrote:

the-gaffer wrote:So what happened to my answer to him then Nando

he asked to me to move the question here and remove the article cos he thought he'd get a better answer here

Crips > Gaffer

Jammy31 wrote:Just a quick and REALLY random question:

Was there any significance to Punk shouting "It's clobberin time" during his entrance at MITB? Was it in anyway related to The Thing from Fantastic Four or ?

He is a comic book fan so I guess it's possible?

Jammy31 wrote:Just a quick and REALLY random question:

Was there any significance to Punk shouting "It's clobberin time" during his entrance at MITB? Was it in anyway related to The Thing from Fantastic Four or ?

My only guess, if it's a wrestling reference, is that it was a nod to Dusty Rhodes. Dusty often talked about "clobberin'" when he commentated in WCW. I believe, though I might be wrong, that "It's clobberin' time" might have been one of Dusty's early catchphrases.

Ahhhh ok Thank you Sodhat and Tart

Punk has said it a few times, I noticed it on a Raw (not sure when). I assumed that he had always done it and I'd never noticed!

fernando wrote:from dj legless moved by request

What was the deal with Hogan putting Goldberg over in Atlanta. I have heard that he had creative control and didn't really do to much clean jobs.

Was this because they were losing the ratings and it would have been good for business?

The pressure's on now!...

Hogan had creative control in WCW. He was in complete charge of his character's direction; the writers booked most of his storylines, but if he didn't like them, he didn't have to do them, and they would have to re-write and re-write until Hogan agreed. He could also insist on who he feuded with, and who won.

The obvious response to that is "Why would Hogan offer to lose to Goldberg then?".

Well, Hogan was a businessman. He wanted to make money. The hotter his opponent, the more money he made when he beat them. Hogan could see that Goldberg was the hottest thing in the company in the Summer of 1998. By dropping the strap to him, WCW could push Goldberg to the moon only for Hogan to later end the streak, getting his win and the world title back, in a huge money match.

Hogan knew that ending Goldberg's streak was the biggest prize in WCW at that time. He could have said "I want to end the streak and I want to do it now", but where would that have left him? He would have been criticised for being selfish, and he would have undercut Goldberg's potential to draw against him in the future. Most importantly, it could be construed as one wrestler with too much power sabotaging WCW for his own gain. By dangling the carrot of a clean win over the most famous name the industry had ever seen, Hogan was offering to turn Goldberg into an instant megastar, helping WCW in the process, whilst benefiting himself down the line.

Why was the match on free TV when it could have drawn massive money on PPV? Because Hogan knew that, with the event in front of 40,000 spectators on home turf in Atlanta, his altruism and its result would be witnessed by some very important people in TBS, the arm of Time Warner that ran WCW. These were the people who made the big financial decisions but weren't usually present at WCW events. They would be making a rare trip to Nitro given its proximity to TBS's Atlanta HQ, and they would see Hogan as a company man whose unselfishness would not only give WCW a victory over the WWF in the ratings but also created a "moment", with 40,000 going wild for the hometown hero winning the world title. He would prove to them that he was still relevant and still had the same Hogan star power, drawing 40,000 to the building and spiking the rating, all very useful politically.

Eric Bischoff was a desperate man. The WWF had overtaken WCW in the ratings, and he felt that an event like this could shift the momentum in WCW's favour once again. He also wanted to impress the TBS higher ups. Hogan's offer was gleefully accepted.

The aftermath can be found in the book "The Death of WCW"!

Cheers for that crips.

Sorry about that gaffer, someone suggested I move the question here so I pm"ed Nando then realised you left a reply but I couldn't read it. Thanks anyway.

Who annoys your more, HHH or Gaffer?

Clarke James wrote:Who annoys your more, HHH or Gaffer?

I think that should be a poll in itself.

Triple H annoys me more than gaffer.

Who annoys you more, Clarke James or Gaffer?

Crips, I seen you mention on another thread that you thought that some people overrate Mr Perfect. How did you rate him yourself?

liverbnz wrote:Crips, I seen you mention on another thread that you thought that some people overrate Mr Perfect. How did you rate him yourself?

Well, without wishing to make this too much of an opinion thread, I think that time has done him many favours. He was a good worker at a time when the WWF had very few good workers, so he stood out a lot more than he would now. I thought he was quite a one-dimensional character and only average on the mic. This became particularly clear when he turned babyface and just didn't have a connection with the audience.

I'm not saying he was bad at all, just overrated. His athleticism stood out for that time and place, and his gimmick was fantastic, but I don't think he was someone they could have ever built the company around as some suggest. I think he was slotted in the right place on the card; as someone who could have good matches just below the main event, but couldn't be relied upon to sell tickets.

Crips, this one may have been done to death or asked earlier, but what is the plan for Vince moving over and handing the reins to someone else?

Who? When? What influence will he retain?

sodhat wrote:Crips, this one may have been done to death or asked earlier, but what is the plan for Vince moving over and handing the reins to someone else?

Who? When? What influence will he retain?

In a recent interview, Vince said he never wants to retire.

He has no life outside WWE. He is a complete workaholic and it is unheard of for him to take a holiday. It's hard to imagine that he could cope with retirement.

I think he will continue to gradually delegate duties as he gets older and can no longer keep going at the same pace, but I think that as long as he is physically and mentally capable he will always be the boss.

I have yet more questions (sorry)!

What is the relationship actually like between JR and Michael Cole? They seem to have antipathy on screen and I wonder what they really think of each other being the top two announcers in WWE, and thus in direct competition.

Second question: don't HHH and JR have a history of not really getting along? I wouldn't have thought he and Vince would have brought him back...

It looks like the WWE are trying to give the IWC what they want just now without actually saying it of course in order to really sell the fact to the IWC that Hunter has a far bigger say on things, Bryan winning the MitB, christian and Punk winning World Titles and JR back as play by play on RAW

Who, taking into account matches/promos/feuds/etc, has been the biggest success for WWE over the past 5 years?

That has to be Cena surely, he has closed 3 of the last 5 WrestleMania's and was in the other World Title match in the other two, he has won a Rumble and had an uninterrupted 13 month+ World Title reign, again this is without the actual facts but I'd bet he has been in most PPV main events. Edge would probably be second with Orton third

I would have said Cena as well gaffer, just wanted to see other peoples opinions.

1) Cena (by a long way)
2) Edge
3) Orton
4) HBK
5) Mysterio

I think I'd have Batista and Undertaker at 4 and 5

sodhat wrote:I have yet more questions (sorry)!

What is the relationship actually like between JR and Michael Cole? They seem to have antipathy on screen and I wonder what they really think of each other being the top two announcers in WWE, and thus in direct competition.

Second question: don't HHH and JR have a history of not really getting along? I wouldn't have thought he and Vince would have brought him back...

There is genuine animosity between Ross and Cole, which isn't surprising given how they've been played off against each other by Vince McMahon in recent years. I don't know if it has ever escalated into anything, but it is always simmering under the surface.

Both come from such different wrestling backgrounds. Ross is the journeyman who learnt his craft outside WWE and often in direct competition with them. He is old-school and sees through the corporate BS. He rubs people the wrong way, he's grumpy, but he knows he is good. Vince may not like him, he may not even respect him, but he also knows that Ross is good. Cole is the golden boy who came through the system, has never worked for any other promotion, and matches the description Vince McMahon and Kevin Dunn want in an announcer: A young (not so much any more), inoffensive, newsreader-type who they could mould through the machine. Vince really wants him to succeed, as it would mean getting rid of Ross once and for all, but Cole hasn't been a huge success. With the exception of his heel run earlier this year, he's never really enhanced the product; as a commentator, he's nowhere near Ross's level of being able to sell the product.

Naturally, whenever one replaces the other, as has happened numerous times, the resentment grows. Ross isn't happy to see a far inferior commentator sitting in "his" chair, and Cole isn't happy that no matter what he does, he's always reminded that Jim Ross is better.

Triple H and Ross definitely don't have a great relationship, but I think as gaffer says Triple H is trying to appeal to the "Internet crowd" in his new on-screen role. I also think Triple H is probably more of a wrestling traditionalist with less issues than Vince about "rasslin'" - I get the impression he's not so hung up about everything needing to look and sound slick. Given that he has increased backstage influence I presume he pushed for Ross's return in response to the recent poor ratings.

Gregers wrote:Who, taking into account matches/promos/feuds/etc, has been the biggest success for WWE over the past 5 years?

There's obviously not a definitive scale to judge this on, but if we go purely on how much money they've made the company, John Cena has clearly been the top star of that period and made the most money. I would put Undertaker second based mostly on the fact that his streak is the biggest draw in wrestling and has contributed significantly to Wrestlemania buyrates in the last five years, but also because he was still a regular for the majority of that time and usually in main events. After that, it's very hard to tell. Triple H would probably be third, then it gets a bit more difficult. The last two slots would be between Batista, Michaels, Edge and Mysterio; Jeff Hardy was a big deal at one point but only for a very short period of time. Michaels was in a major selling point of Wrestlemania for two years running, and had hot angles with Jericho, Vince and Hogan, so I would put him in fourth, with Edge just beating Batista into the final two slot, because he was such a major part of TV and PPVs during that time, usually in world title matches.

It's too subjective to base a top 5 on promos, matches, etc. Therefore my top 5, based on drawing power in that period, would be this:
1) Cena
2) Undertaker
3) Triple H
4) Michaels
5) Edge

A "next five" would be something like this:
6) Batista
7) Rey Mysterio
8) JBL
9) Orton
10) Jeff Hardy

Crips,

The 'Invasion' whilst i appreciate that in reality WWE purchased WCW, can you confirm whether the actual program that followed was run at an angle?

Clarke James wrote:Crips,

The 'Invasion' whilst i appreciate that in reality WWE purchased WCW, can you confirm whether the actual program that followed was run at an angle?

Yes, it was run at an angle of 86 degrees.

Davieswasacrippledtart wrote:

Clarke James wrote:Crips,

The 'Invasion' whilst i appreciate that in reality WWE purchased WCW, can you confirm whether the actual program that followed was run at an angle?

Yes, it was run at an angle of 86 degrees.

Thanks.

Damn my grammatical failure.

Could you also confirm it was run as an angle?

Yes, the invasion angle was an angle, based on the true story of the WWF purchasing WCW.

Davieswasacrippledtart wrote:Yes, the invasion angle was an angle, based on the true story of the WWF purchasing WCW.

Thanks very much.

Would you perhaps agree that given the significance in this purchase and the subsequent angle that followed; that this infact did shift the way in which WWE programming was viewed?

Not sure if this has been asked but:

If memory serves me right didn't HHH knacker his leg up shortly before the beginning of the Invasion angle? Do you know what the plans would have been if HHH would have been fit and involved?

more_awesome_than_a_ri wrote:Not sure if this has been asked but:

If memory serves me right didn't HHH knacker his leg up shortly before the beginning of the Invasion angle? Do you know what the plans would have been if HHH would have been fit and involved?

On a similar note Benoit also got injured before the storyline, was there any plans for him to 'defect' given his previous time with WCW & ECW?

If TNA were to be, hypothetically, bought out by WWE. Which current TNA wrestlers could you see making it in WWE?

I apologise if this question makes me sound like Im being funny but Im not:

Who are you cripps and how do you know so much?

Gregers wrote:If TNA were to be, hypothetically, bought out by WWE. Which current TNA wrestlers could you see making it in WWE?

Two issues here:

a) which TNA talent would WWE want
b) which TNA talent would work for WWE

It is also worth noting that they probably aren't that many spots available in the existing roster, though with some trimming I think that the following guys would have a shot.

A.J. Styles
MCMG
Beer Money
Crimson / Gunner
Matt Morgan
The Pope (possibly - though I am not sure the reasons behind his initial exit)
Eric Young (one up from Santino)
Kurt Angle (depending on his wellness position and desire to tour again)
Samoa Joe (would give him a go, though he could ask for his release quite quickly)

I don't think that any of them bar Angle would be main eventers though there would be a few good ones for the mid card, it would again depend on how many of them were willing to accept such a position. If the tag team is going to be built up the two tag teams could feature - if not then they probably wouldn't be hired at this time.

Question about ECW.
When did it start up and who actually started it and funded it?

What was their successes and failures?

Marshall wrote:

more_awesome_than_a_ri wrote:Not sure if this has been asked but:

If memory serves me right didn't HHH knacker his leg up shortly before the beginning of the Invasion angle? Do you know what the plans would have been if HHH would have been fit and involved?

On a similar note Benoit also got injured before the storyline, was there any plans for him to 'defect' given his previous time with WCW & ECW?

It's simply impossible to tell, because the WWF didn't know what it's plans were from week to week! The addition of ECW to the Invasion wasn't originally part of the plan; it only came around as a desperate attempt to revive a dying storyline. Similarly, the defections by WWF wrestlers to The Alliance only happened because WCW was such a weak faction.

The WWF, presumably, thought that merely putting a group of wrestlers under the "WCW" name would be enough to make huge money from an inter-promotional war. I really think that's as far as their planning went. The whole angle was pretty much written as it went along (seriously, would you have written it like that?!) so there is no definitive answer to either of these questions.

I mentioned it the other day on another thread but it got lost in the wash so I thought I'd bring it up here.

It used to be the case that wrestlers would drink a few before a match, Andre the Giant was noted for it and obviously there's Austin's and more recently James Storm's gimmick. Surely though if an injury was to occur during a match where one of the wrestlers is deemed intoxicated then insurance companies wouldn't pay out, has there been a tightening on drinking on the job within wrestling due to this or is it still allowed?

DJ Legless wrote:Question about ECW.
When did it start up and who actually started it and funded it?

What was their successes and failures?

It was an indy promotion with several different names before settling on Extreme Championship Wrestling in 1993. The ownership transferred from Joel Goodhart to Tod Gordon around that time. Paul Heyman was also brought in around the same time to replace Eddie Gilbert as booker. This was when the ECW revolution began, as an indy promotion that almost became a viable national promotion through sheer word of mouth. Later, Gordon left and Heyman became the owner. There wasn't really a benefactor behind it; the promotion just ran week to week. Vince McMahon did provide very minor financial assistance, but this was mainly so that he would be a creditor if they went bust and could buy the company at a favourable price, which he later did.

For the in-depth story, you're better off looking at Wikipedia mate.

It could take me some time to go through what I deem their strengths and weaknesses, but I'll choose one of each. Heyman's greatest strength as a booker was accentuating wrestlers' positives and hiding the negatives. He took the likes of Taz, Sandman, Tommy Dreamer, 911, The Dudleys, The Pitbulls, Sabu, The Blue Meanie, Stevie Richards, The Public Enemy, Al Snow and Mikey Whipwreck, who would never have made it in the big leagues on their own, and he made them all huge stars within the context of ECW. Later, when many of those same wrestlers went to WWE or WCW or TNA, their weaknesses were often soon exposed and they were midcarders at best. He moulded misfits like Cactus Jack, Steve Austin, Chris Benoit and Rob Van Dam - who would all later become WWE champions - from unwanted cast-offs into the hottest names in the industry. Similarly, Raven, Shane Douglas and Justin Credible were curtain jerkers elsewhere who became ECW franchise players. He introduced the lucha libre style into America; Rey Mysterio, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Jericho and many others all got their foot in the US door via ECW. In short, Heyman created stars at a rate that other promotions could only dream of, and he did so by making careful use of every drop of talent they had and everything that made them unique.

The company's biggest weakness - and I believe there were many - was that it never made a penny! However big it became, it was always struggling to pay the bills. For all the talk about what a great promotion it was, it never drew. It was a niche promotion and, however big a deal it seemed within the industry, however influential it was on the industry, it was always going to get to a point where it couldn't grow any further.

Crips,

I was watching This Video online, and there's a section during the match where the 2 opponents do nothing to each other for about 5 minutes. In these days were audibles not called? Or was it simply a case of waiting for an opponent to recover? How long have audibles been in the business.

Hero wrote:I mentioned it the other day on another thread but it got lost in the wash so I thought I'd bring it up here.

It used to be the case that wrestlers would drink a few before a match, Andre the Giant was noted for it and obviously there's Austin's gimmick. Surely though if an injury was to occur during a match where one of the wrestlers is deemed intoxicated then insurance companies wouldn't pay out, has there been a tightening on drinking on the job within wrestling due to this or is it still allowed?

Drinking on the job has never been a major part of wrestling. It's never been deemed acceptable to get in the ring with a drunk wrestler, or a wrestler who is under the influence of drugs. Austin's beer drinking only became a major part of his gimmick as the years went on, and it was only ever post-match or post-promos. I don't remember him ever drinking before a match. Sandman would legitimately drink before and during his matches in ECW, and many wrestlers hated getting in the ring with him, but I guess it was seen as part of the ECW rebel spirit.

Of course, the corporate atmosphere of WWE in 2011 is a world apart from the ECW locker room in 1997, or World Class in 1986. So yes, in general I think drinking is frowned upon a lot more. But it's never been something where a promoter has said "oh yes, that's fine, get as drunk as you want before the match".

As for insurance, my simple answer is I don't know. My longer answer is that wrestling promotions don't always make the most sensible decisions, and wrestlers and promoters, being conmen by nature, would probably just hope to get away with it.

Clarke James wrote:Crips,

I was watching This Video online, and there's a section during the match where the 2 opponents do nothing to each other for about 5 minutes. In these days were audibles not called? Or was it simply a case of waiting for an opponent to recover? How long have audibles been in the business.

Audibles have been in the business forever. I expect the two participants in the match were just very inexperienced.

Davieswasacrippledtart wrote:

Clarke James wrote:Crips,

I was watching This Video online, and there's a section during the match where the 2 opponents do nothing to each other for about 5 minutes. In these days were audibles not called? Or was it simply a case of waiting for an opponent to recover? How long have audibles been in the business.

Audibles have been in the business forever. I expect the two participants in the match were just very inexperienced.

Are you Gavin from Autoglass?

King Beer wrote:Are you Gavin from Autoglass?

No I'm not, but he seems like a thoroughly decent bloke, if slightly dull.

Following on from a few questions at the top of the page, I was watching RAW last night, and Lawler couldn't hide his delight at Ross replacing Cole on the show. He seemed to mention it every 5 minutes in and not so subtle attempt to annoy Cole. Do you know what the relationship between Cole and Lawler is like?

liverbnz wrote:Following on from a few questions at the top of the page, I was watching RAW last night, and Lawler couldn't hide his delight at Ross replacing Cole on the show. He seemed to mention it every 5 minutes in and not so subtle attempt to annoy Cole. Do you know what the relationship between Cole and Lawler is like?

Lawler and Ross are genuinely close, and Lawler much prefers his on-air chemistry with Ross than with Cole.

I don't think there is a great deal of animosity between Lawler and Cole, but they aren't good friends either. I think he was probably just happy to have his friend back. Don't forget also that in kayfabe terms Lawler doesn't like Cole.

Davieswasacrippledtart wrote:

liverbnz wrote:Following on from a few questions at the top of the page, I was watching RAW last night, and Lawler couldn't hide his delight at Ross replacing Cole on the show. He seemed to mention it every 5 minutes in and not so subtle attempt to annoy Cole. Do you know what the relationship between Cole and Lawler is like?

Lawler and Ross are genuinely close, and Lawler much prefers his on-air chemistry with Ross than with Cole.

I don't think there is a great deal of animosity between Lawler and Cole, but they aren't good friends either. I think he was probably just happy to have his friend back. Don't forget also that in kayfabe terms Lawler doesn't like Cole.

Ah yes, forgot about that. (Ha seems some wrestling fans do have short memories).

Which wrestler in WWE/TNA most needs a Heel turn?

likewise:

Which wrestler in WWE/TNA most needs a Face turn?