ARRRGHHH.......Ike Ibeabuchi!!

First topic message reminder :

Insanity struck and the world lost Tyson's REAL successor. He was truelly exciting. The first man to beat prime versions of David Tua and Chris Byrd, and what makes these victories even more impressive is that he was a relative novice.

But what do you think....

Had he not been incarcerated would he have become the best heavyweight of his generation? and how do you think he would have matched against the late 90's early 00's versions of Holyfield, Tyson and Lennox?

More interestingly, he is 2 years younger than Vital Klitschko. Therfore, he, and not the Klits, would have shaped the heavyweight divison we know today. It would still be the most prestigious prize on planet earth. Imagine the President bouncing Haye around the ring like a rag doll.

GOD I MISS IKE IBEABUCHI!!!! DO YOU??

azania wrote:The Klits dont like it up them (Wlad maybe according to the more sordid posters). They like to fight at their own pace and set the tempo. Ike wouldn't allow them that luxury.

Probably not though, as no other boxer has really managed it. He could spark Wlad out if he got through but the brothers have never really been outboxed.

The point is, Ike was an improving fighter. By the time he faced the brothers, he would have been a much better fighter. Moreover I always found Ike the type who fought at the opponent's level before stepping up.

Spot on Nico,Lewis won 10 of the 12 rounds and giving Tua 2 rounds was generous on the judges part. Lewis said it would be a walk in the park and it was.

Don't forget Chris Byrd easily out boxed Tua and took some of his best shots, and Tua was being schooled in their first fight against Rahman when he landed a blow after the bell which Rahman didn't have time to recover from and the fight was stopped in Tua's favour at the start of the next round. Tua did have an impressive record of K.O.s but he was no world champion.

Hard too say as i don't think we saw the finished and prime version of Ike, but based on what i saw i could see him steamrollering anyone from the last decade or so other than Lewis and possibly a motivated Bowe.

TheMackemMawler wrote:

J.Benson II wrote:

azania wrote:

J.Benson II wrote:Even when Tua was in top condition, he still wasn't exactly something special and nor was he all that difficult to out-box.

The somewhat chinny Oleg Maskaev fought Tua before Ike did and was dealing with him fairly comfortably before Tua landed late on.

Rahman also went on to give a conditioned Tua a boxing lesson before getting knocked out in controversial circumstances.

Yes he was. Hence all kept away from him and refused to stand toe to toe. I don't think I ever saw Ike being out-boxed. He had a tremendous jab. As for sparring sessions, many boxers get done in by sparring partners and then perform better in the ring when it matters.

Yes, but Ike hadn't yet fought anyone who would have had the ability to out-box him. Somebody like Lewis would surely have had the tools to do so.

As things stands, Chris Byrd was the best boxer Ike faced and while I admit the stoppage was very impressive, its hardly like the fight had been a one-sided beat-down up to that point. It was a pretty even affair and I believe that one judge had Byrd ahead.

Byrd himself says that he arrogantly underestimated Ike's boxing ability and was expecting a comfortable decision victory over what he then thought was just a unskilled mauler. However, Byrd went on to say that he overall found Wlad a far more difficult, awkward and accomplished opponent to face.

I also agree that sparring sessions aren't a very reliable source but I still think its a cause for concern if a boxer is having problems in training, especially if its against someone quite limited like Kirk Johnson.

OMG!! what are you talking about. Chris Byrd was an exceptional boxer in his prime, he could outbox anyone of a comparable size, he just lacked the physical attributes to compete with the behemoth's. Ike probably would have KO'd Lewis in the first fight, and then in the return, Lewis would do a negative jabbing number on him (if he hadn't retired). Remember thats what Lewis did after Vit in 2003 and remember ike is 2/3 years younger than Vit. Thus, in 2003, Ike would be more experienced/skilled as well as retaining his natural physical attributes.

With regards to the Byrd comments on Wlad, these can be expected, afterall, he had fought a 35 fight Pro ...who was an Olympic superheavy Gold medalist!!?? what is your point? (Ike was a 19/20 fight up and coming pro with minimal amateur experience).

My point is, if Ike had been champ over the past decade (instead of the Klits) then the heavyweight title would be the biggest accolade in the sporting universe, STILL!! and media coverage would not be on the decline

Look, my point is that I don't see how anyone can say with any certainty that Ike would have the beating of Lewis and the K's since he hadn't yet fought anyone who even remotely resembled their style.

Who knows? He might have dethroned them in spectacular fashion, or he could have just found himself at the receiving end of their jabs.

Sometimes when a boxers career is cut short, it can be a blessing as well as a curse. In some cases, it creates a mystique around them which can elevate their status. Ike is an example of this. Due to his short career, the flaws in his game have remained undetected.
If Golota had quit after the Bowe fights, I'm sure there would be people on forums suggesting that he would have beaten Lewis too. Its all speculation at the end of the day.

IMO, any boxer like Ike that has serious mental and emotional issues is never going to have any longevity or consistency in the sport. Had Ike's career continued, my bet would be that his performances and behaviour would have become increasingly erratic and unpredictable. I wouldn't rule out an in-ring meltdown.

As for his "natural physical attributes". I wouldn't really call them natural. The guy was clearly on heavy amounts of juice which no doubt would have helped towards his superior strength and stamina.

Apparently the mental issues started after the Tua fight. He did take a lot of punches. He became bi-polar and lost the plot. Prior to that there wasn't any evidence or behaviour that indicated mental health problems.

How good could he have been? On the evidence of his fights, very good. A natural fighter with very good balance. Had he continued I believe he would have taken out Lewis. Its no wonder that Maloney wanted no part of him for Lewis.

it was too soon to say for sure, but he 2 wins very impressive. i think the division would have benefited from his presence though reguardless of his dominace. he definetly had the power to worry most hws, and his chin seemed to be iron clad, cant see anyone ko him. at worst he would have forced the likes of wlad/vitali/lewis etc to get into a war or pull of massive performances, i dont think anyone would have had a easy night with ike.

also tua best fighter never to have won a world title imo

eddyfightfan wrote:it was too soon to say for sure, but he 2 wins very impressive. i think the division would have benefited from his presence though reguardless of his dominace. he definetly had the power to worry most hws, and his chin seemed to be iron clad, cant see anyone ko him. at worst he would have forced the likes of wlad/vitali/lewis etc to get into a war or pull of massive performances, i dont think anyone would have had a easy night with ike.

also tua best fighter never to have won a world title imo

Don't forget bomber graham!!

There are a load of excellent black fighters in the decades prior to the 1960s that never got title shots or won titles so would definately have a fair number of them above guys like Tua or Graham. Langford, Burley, Bivins, Wills etc All highly unlucky to fall victim of the colour issue.

would take audley a few hundred fights to throw that many!

Chris Byrd an exceptional boxer? Since when?

According to Wikipedia he was due a parole hearing on May 1st of this year but can't see anything anywhere about the result... anyone know if it happened and the outcome?

azania wrote:Apparently the mental issues started after the Tua fight. He did take a lot of punches. He became bi-polar and lost the plot. Prior to that there wasn't any evidence or behaviour that indicated mental health problems.

How good could he have been? On the evidence of his fights, very good. A natural fighter with very good balance. Had he continued I believe he would have taken out Lewis. Its no wonder that Maloney wanted no part of him for Lewis.

Thats whaty I have read in the past aswell.

I've seen a recent pic of him and he looks like he's been sitting off with Kirkland Laing having a bevy on a park bench.

That fight took a lot out of both men if were being honest. The exchanges were brutal and how neither man went down is beyond me. Ike cast iron chin inevitably proved to be his downfall in life.

All we can say is he would have been a handful for any heavyweight of that era. I can only see loses to Lewis, the Klits. I think he would have spanked the Bowe who fought Golota.

also tua best fighter never to have won a world title imo.

Not even in the top 10.

Nothing against Tua (a decent, if limited, fighter and there's no doubting that he was in top shape for his fight against Ike) but he does tend to get overrated (both on here and the old 606 site) and presented as some kind of wrecking ball.

Personally didn't see anything from Ike that suggests that Lewis couldn't have handled him. He'd have a chance but I'd consider it fairly slim. To say that he was on his way to reaching a level that would have allowed him to beat Lewis is reaching somewhat (cue mentions of McCall and Rahman).