Australia vs Wales 2nd test - Teams and Live match thread

[Pete C (Kiwireddevil)]

First topic message reminder :

Australian playing 22:
Aussie team is:
15. Adam Ashley-Cooper (NSW Waratahs)
14. Cooper Vuna (Melbourne Rebels)
13. Rob Horne (NSW Waratahs)
12. Pat McCabe (Brumbies)
11. Digby Ioane (Queensland Reds)
10. Berrick Barnes (NSW Waratahs)
9. Will Genia (Queensland Reds)
8. Wycliff Palu (NSW Waratahs)
7. David Pocock (captain, Western Force)
6. Scott Higginbotham (Queensland Reds)
5. Nathan Sharpe (Western Force)
4. Rob Simmons (Queensland Reds)
3. Sekope Kepu* (NSW Waratahs)
2. Tatafu Polota Nau (NSW Waratahs)
1. Benn Robinson (NSW Waratahs)

Run on Reserves: 16. Stephen Moore (Brumbies), 17. Ben Alexander (Brumbies), 18. Dave Dennis (NSW Waratahs), 19. Michael Hooper (Brumbies), 20. Nic White (Brumbies), 21. Anthony Fainga’a (Queensland Reds), 22. Mike Harris (Queensland Reds)

Wales : Leigh Halfpenny (Blues); Alex Cuthbert (Blues), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Ashley Beck (Ospreys), George North (Scarlets); Rhys Priestland (Scarlets), Mike Phillips (Bayonne); Gethin Jenkins (Toulon), Matthew Rees (Scarlets), Adam Jones (Ospreys), Bradley Davies (Blues), Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys), Dan Lydiate (Dragons), Sam Warburton (Blues, capt), Ryan Jones (Ospreys).

Replacements : Matthew Rees (Scarlets), Paul James (Bath), Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys), Ryan Jones (Ospreys), Lloyd Williams (Blues), James Hook (Perpignan), Ashley Beck (Ospreys). Richard Hibbard, Paul James, Luke Charteris, Justin Tipuric, Rhys Webb, James Hook, Scott Williams. (BBC has the bench wrong)


Venue: Etihad Stadium, Melbourne. Capacity ~56,000
Weather: http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2158177 - ~12 deg C, showery. But there is a roof.

Tour Previews:
http://www.v2journal.com/wales-summer-tour-preview.html
http://www.v2journal.com/australias-june-tests-preview.html

[gavstar]

to the poster who said jenkins is the kicking coach, yes he is.kicking technique and mental preparation.( what a fantastic job he's done with 1/2p) and he's also been helping biggar at the ospreys, and its paying off.


tactical kicking is not his responsibility, thats howley. do you honestly think that the tactical kicking is down to jenkins! you 're having a laugh! i suspect it was a wind up

[gowales]

Well actually Gatland has said in the past that Jenkins takes care of the "tactical" kicking strategy.

[RubyGuby]

Just came on here as watching Sa v England match so time for just one post.

Wales lost to a last minute kick away to Australia and everyone is getting hysterical. FFS, Wales are there, they are competing with the best and whilst there is plenty of room for improvemnent why so much negativity. It was a tough break for Wales who unusual of late lacked composure and leadership when they needed it most. Its a young side and they need to keep hold of the ball like they did V France to shut the game out. We have had some good breaks recently and these are fine lines that we need to be aware of. Our composure and execution was not there in the last few minutes.

[gavstar]

so jenkins is now in charge of how the 9/10 and whoever else gets a kick,
and its jinks who has been behind all this ping pong madness. well well who would have thought they would have given old jinks so much power over how wales play their game. that means hes in charge of the game management too then? and thats cr@p as well! got a lot to answer for has our jinksey!!!!!!

[wales606]

Well, Gethin is our best tactical kicker...oh, wait..you meant the other jenkins.

[HERSH]

Well played Wales but you'll always be Plucky losers down under.

[bedfordwelsh]

Bedford, the yellow did kill us, it made us hide in our shells afraid to make mistakes. We kicked the ball away as a default and through fear of making a mistake.

I am furious, but very relieved we didn't win. It would've been a crime!

Blues,

It didn't cost us the game though we scored 6pts while he was off, what cost us the game was our own inability to close out the gamefrom the 77th minute.

Poor kicking (all game) in the last minutes coupled with porr discipline is waht cost us in the end.

[bedfordwelsh]

Am gonna give two views on this one now while I am livid furious and feel sick andf another later when I have calmed down.

Now-

1. Our kick and chase game was shicking again time and time again Priestland kicked to far with no one chasing.

2. Howley should have had the minerals to make changes earlier, our line out was poor all first half so should have dragged Rees off at half time.

3. I am not a huge Hook fan (Biggar should have been there) but Priestland for me again was poor so Hook should have been used.

4. For all the rave reviews Beck has been getting is defence is (currently) not up to it at this level, was turned inside out in first half and was at fault for they try.

5. And before all the idiots get on here (most here already I guess) the yellow card decision DIDN'T cost us the game becuase we scored 6 pts while he off, it was our own indecision done that but how hell was that not a red.

Ok calmed down a bit now so lets see if my views have changed mmmmmm No

1. After watching the Boks and the way Petersen and Habana chase kicks makes me realise how shockingly poor our kick chase game was.

2. STill think Howley should have got Rees off at half time add to that Phillips should have come off earlier and probably Warburton should have come off.

3. Hook has to start next week, still not his biggest fan but Priestland is poor at the moment.

4. Becks time will come but for me Sc Williams back in the centre next week.

5. Yellow should have been a red but it was still our mistakes that cost us the game.

Team for the 'dead rubber' next week

Jenkins Hibbard A Jones
AWJ (c) Evans
Lydiate R Jones Tipuric

Phillips (just) Hook

North JD Williams Cuthbert (did he touch ball today)

Halfpenny

James Owens Charteris Warburton

Webb Priestland Beck

[Guest]

Agree with that apart from the Hook call. I feel anxious and nauseous every time i see him in a Wales shirt. I still haven't forgotten how he played in the 10 shirt at the rwc.

I agree Rhys' tactical kicking wasn't the best (he kicked too long and our chasers didn't chase well enough regardless) but his restarts were spot on and his defensive shift was superb.

Two brilliant last ditch scrag tackles on Genia that saved us a lot of trouble. he also had to deal with a lot of messy ball, and he put in some lovely up and unders (and some shockers)

Consistency is Rhys' problem, and I don't think dropping him will help that. Despite some of his bad kicks, he is still a better 10 for Wales than Hook is, I feel

Oh and I've just noticed you've got Hibbs starting. i don't want him anywhere near the team. he popped up in the few scrums he was a part of, and just guess who it was that gave the two penalties away at the end? (I'm pretty sure it's him, will double check on the highlights later)

Owens to start with Rees on the bench for me

[sheephead]

Does anyone know why ianto wasn't on the bench? Is he injured ?

[bedfordwelsh]

rugby,

I feel same way about Hook and I agree about Priestlands consistency but on the flip side another bad performance could have just the same affect. If he starts then I hope Howley has the balls to change it if its going wrong.

As for Hibbard, well I was surprised to see Owen out of the 22 altogether today so if its between Hibbard and Rees then Hibbard gets nod at mo.

[bedfordwelsh]

Did hear that Evans was injured but not sure, for me he starts next week.

[Guest]

definitely, we need ianto back for our lineout asap.

Bedford - I get what you mean about Rhys, but I don't think he played anywhere near as badly as some of the overreactions from people on this thread.

They keep giving out why did he kick it? Well because when Webb passed it to him (ignoring the two forwards near him) there were only 2 other Welsh backs outside Rhys, against 4 Aussie players.

Rhys had the option to 1. take it in himself, and risk getting pinged right in front of the posts for holding on (and let us consider Rhys' history of going into contact with the ball, isolated, this would have been a very likely outcome) or 2. kick it away.

He opted for 2, and i don't blame him, just wished he hadn't kicked so far, and that we'd made Australia work harder to make their way back up the pitch.

[thebluesmancometh]

dreamer, I think if you stop justifying it so much the argument might die out. I agree with you totally, but you can see why there is such a reaction being so close to victory.

[Guest]

not really, bluesman. I don't really like it when people ignore what actually happened, the way he's been talked about is disgusting, I just really don't like seeing Welsh players treated that way.

By all means criticise, but it's been completely OTT imo.

[thebluesmancometh]

It is only OTT because they have someone to vent against. If they all agree'd with each other for 2 mins they would have gone to find someone else to whine about.

Bedford

We scored 6 points and conceded 3 in the yellow. We failed to even attempt to exploit the extra man, that says everything I need to know about Welsh rugby, we are afraid to lose. We should be treating the first 2 tests like the third, pretend theres nothing to play ofr and go out there to play for pride and passion alone. When the opportunity comes up we need to throw the kitchen sink at it and punish teams, instead of tryinto protect a 1 point lead for 25 minutes.

[gavstar]

priestland will be in the future squad ,either as 2nd to biggar or the first choice 10, so he will play again next week if they think he will benefit from it.

hooks 'freestyle' could mean we would loose by more, why wasnt his mid week game considered good enogh for a start today? he's not a serious future contender for 10.

[Biltong]

It was a pile of bull crap, the whole series is a farce with refs having such favor to the home teams ,
Welsh scrum murders the Aussie one with six resets called from the ref on the seventh scrum Wales slip the bind straight penalty to Australia.

NH teams are not allowed to compete for the ball at the break down instant penalty if they do, the SH boys can come in from any angle of their feet and treat the break down as a swimming pool.

It is not a level playing field ,those who blindly say it isn't are wrong.

Yup, I agree totally. You'll get the Old welsh haters like biltong and hersh on here saying its sour grapes. But it's been laid bare for all to see. Hope England win.

Yep, I have a million reasons to hate the Welsh, they cuddled in a bad way my homeland, stole our talent and compete with our men. Is it that obvious?

[Janecory]

Maybe Peel and Richie Rees still have something to offer?

Both still has something to offer, especially Rees, after the way he stuffed Brynmors boy for Barbarians v Wales 2 weeks ago.

[Irishhoneymonster]

A few welsh posters furthering a stereothpe and letting the side down. Its a little bit Boy Who Cried.Wolf at this.stage

Exactly what I was thinking when I first started reading this thread after the match Red stag.

I come on here to find two witchhunts, one for Priestland and one for the ref. But at end of the day I shouldn't be surprised. It seems every time I read a thread after Wales have been beaten the Welsh posters on this forum are full of the same old tripe....we was robbed! Am actually kind of impressed that that some have now decided to place ALL the blame on one of your players as well. I know alot of Welsh fans and they aren't like the eejits on here spouting cr@p. Also I might have some sympathy for the Welsh posters here if 1. I didn't read this 'oh the ref lost it for us' stuff almost every time Wales lose...and 2. If I hadnt seen the game myself.

I know most Welsh supporters in general are not bad losers, but the Welsh posters here are starting to take the biscuit. And to make matters worse, the Welsh posters here seem to be bad winners too. I have an awful feeling that if Wales had won this series then the next thing from posters here would be about targeting the world No1 spot. Give me a break!

In order to do something like that you need to perform consistenly well over a period of time beating the SH teams, so please try and remember this for future reference when Wales actually do start winning test series in the SH. And they will sooner rather than later as they are a very good side, and IMO are good enough now to beat Australia in Australia, they ust haven't performed to their best I guess.

Am finding it hard to find something redeeming here and I am trying believe me but not easy when reading these boards. But to be fair there are a few posters who are level headed with their feet on the ground. You know who you are as does everyone else here.

Final summation, dry your eyes!

[Guest]

Irishhoneymonster - with that post, you've just proven you haven't actually read all of this thread. I would say over 80% of Welsh posters on here haven't blamed the ref, and have been looking more to our own performance. Well done on embarrassing yourself a bit

[Irishhoneymonster]

RD, I didn't say I'd read all of it. I said I'd started reading sometime after the game. And let's be fair it isn't much different from threads after alot (not all to be fair) of other Welsh losses.

So you'd say most of the talk hasn't been focused on how the ref and/or Priestland lost Wales the game? Are we reading different threads?

[Guest]

Yep. We've focused on the lineout, the kick chase and our tactics mainly. Yes Priestland has come in for some stick ( a lot unwarranted imo) but that's been the main part of it.

Some posters have also commented on the ref saying they weren't happy with him, but also stating they didn't think he had an influence on the result of the match (you seem to have missed this also).

it's been all in all a very reasonable debate. Am quite disappointed at the fact that a few Irish posters have felt the need to come on here and make such innacurate comments to be fair

[The Bachelor]

I think the silly penalty given up compounded Priestland's decision to kick the ball away. Oz were the better side though, which just goes to show we can't even sneak an unjust win at the moment.

[wales606]

The lineout was abysmal and Warburton had his worst game for Wales - that is what cost us the game more than anything.

Tipuric should have been on at 40.

On the plus side, Halfpenny is my new favourite player ever, what a trooper.

[Guest]

Warbs was never right after the blow to the back of the head. Tips should have come on if not at HT then certainly at the 60min mark for me.

And 1/2p is fantastic isn't he? really carrying his 6N's form on well. Amazed at how he composed himself for that kick after he'd just been upended.

[wales606]

Yep. We've focused on the lineout, the kick chase and our tactics mainly. Yes Priestland has come in for some stick ( a lot unwarranted imo) but that's been the main part of it.

Some posters have also commented on the ref saying they weren't happy with him, but also stating they didn't think he had an influence on the result of the match (you seem to have missed this also).

it's been all in all a very reasonable debate. Am quite disappointed at the fact that a few Irish posters have felt the need to come on here and make such innacurate comments to be fair

Walesonline gave Preistland a 7, Phillips a 5 and most of the forwards 6s - That a reflection of where the game was lost.

Seriously, did nobody see Preistland running quickly out of the line and close down Aus's 3 or 4 man overlap and stop a certain try?

[Irishhoneymonster]

I know a few posters have given a reasonable viewpoint. I said so myself in my first post on this thread, but alot of the posters with counter arguments aren't actually Welsh and an awful lot of posters are going down the same old ref witch hunt path.

Also, if it wasn't the same story after just about every (not all but alot) Welsh loss I might have more sympathy (also mentioned in my first post).

Is almost at the point where I can tell you that after Wales' next big loss the conversation will be centred around the ref. I look forward to the day I can find a 'We lost it fair and square' thread

[Guest]

The majority of Welsh posters have been saying that we lost it fair and square, seems to me you're just picking out posts to focus on and not looking at what the majority are saying, to suit your own perceptions. You're also not the only poster to be doing so. It's getting quite tiresome now

Wales606 - yeah, I think we did lose it in the forwards again unfortunately. Not sure Phillips warranted a 5 mind, I'd have given him a 6 or 7.

[Ospreydragon]

From the Australian press:

Tim Horan's comments on the 1st test:

"I thought the Welsh kicked too much ball away last week...
But what concerns me about the Welsh is they were down 20-6 and got back to 20-19 and it looked effortless..."

Source:

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/rugby-gold/horan-deans-delivers-for-wallabies/story-fn8tkhjf-1226395950635

On the second test:

"Pocock admitted he thought things were gone until Wales kicked their last possession out a decision the Welsh later admitted was a stuff-up..."

Source:

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/rugby-gold/live-wallabies-v-wales-at-etihad-stadium/story-fn8ti7yn-1226397635177

If Wales are to learn anything from these tests, they should concentrate on improving 3 areas:

1) Lineout
2) Tactical kicking and the kick/chase
3) Decision-making under pressure, game management, and how to close out a game

From all the Aus press I've seen, Wales were respected by Aus, but the truth is that the greatest respect is only won when you beat them.

[Irishhoneymonster]

Fair enough RD but this does not feel like a 'we lost it fair and square' thread. Perhaps I need to read over it again but it certainly doesn't feel like that sort of thread. To me it sounds like a blame game, the ref or Priestland, but if I am wrong fair enough.

The only thing that is shaping my view apart from this thread btw is the reaction from alot of Welsh posters after other Welsh losses, and after Welsh wins come to think of it!

[Guest]

I think you need to go and read it again

Some posters like to blame the ref, they are perfectly entitled to, on occassions they have perfectly valid points. And honestly I can't understand why posters from another nation feel the need to come on to a thread and moan about how posters from a losing team react. Has a bit of a holier then thou feel to it that I myself don't like. Not saying that's what you're like, but I just don't see the need for it

[Irishhoneymonster]

To be fair not sure I do need to go read it again, i have read through most comments after the game and I have already outlined my impression of it. I stand by that impression but will perhaps read the thread again when I am sober at some point.

You may not see a need to post on another nations thread after a game, but if the majority of a nations after game threads go pretty much in the same direction then sometimes it is difficult to stop the compulsion to post your own opinion. Especially if you've been drinking

[Guest]

ha yes well drinking will do that to you!

speaking of which, am off to drink some before gearing myself up to re-watch the match.

[mystiroakey]

rugbydreamer- there is football on and golf as well.. no need to watch a rugby game again!!

[glamorganalun]

Just watched the game again and just as frustrated the way we played, I Evans commenatry on Sky said it all during the game, in the last two minutes he said we need someone to take control of the game, Preistland kicked aimlessly in the air making it easy to run back (again), he must take responsibility with the Captain. Priestland should not have started and how he was still on at the end is worrying, everytime he kicked I thought he was going to get charged down. I don't blame the guys not chasing because there is little point as the kicks were easy to take and too long.

Halfpenny deserves a pat on the back, took all the catches under pressure from GOOD kicks, kicked all the kicks at goal the only fault was not passing to Cuthbert quickly enough, great game.

Some on here having a go at Beck for the Aust try, he made a lot of good tackles and he created the try for JD2, I think the centre went well today.

I agree with Bedford Hook has to be 10, Ian Evans must come in for Bradley, Hibbard to start and give Tip half a game at least replacing Warburton who is not up to the pace of the game.

[Guest]

To be fair not sure I do need to go read it again, i have read through most comments after the game and I have already outlined my impression of it. I stand by that impression but will perhaps read the thread again when I am sober at some point.

You may not see a need to post on another nations thread after a game, but if the majority of a nations after game threads go pretty much in the same direction then sometimes it is difficult to stop the compulsion to post your own opinion. Especially if you've been drinking

Great way to form an opinion, drunk and without reading the thread... Honestly you Irish are all the same, uninformed drunkards.





















Of course I don't mean that, but it's not nice to be the subject of some ill-conceived slur on your nationality is it?

Suggest you also read the thread for the NZ Ire 2nd test match to see that blaming the ref is more common than you may care to admit.

[Irishhoneymonster]

Ha don't do that Dreamer! you might start to blame the ref or Priestland

[Irishhoneymonster]

Red Dragon, I have read that thread, and blaming the ref does not make up close to what it does on this thread. That thread is mainly about having played well but being unable to close out the game in general. It doesn't centre on one player or the ref the way this thread has

[Guest]

Point is, to varying degrees, it is and will continue to happen. No need to come on and slate a nation regardless?

[Guest]

Regardless of how well Priestland was doing up until the final minute of the match, he still messed up big at a very crucial time which unfortunately is going to undo most of the good he had done previously. And its those little things that count in international rugby.

I'm sure we'll all be over it soon, but bloudy hell if his current form is the best Wales have at flyhalf we are in serious trouble and are no in position to be beating SH teams.

[bedfordwelsh]

Mike,

On current form the best Welsh flyhalf is back home or on holiday somewhere

[Guest]

Stag I suspect is on the wum a bit. Regardless, I'd have thought the logical thing would be for a non Welsh poster to not read a Welsh match thread (if their team aren't involved), given the alleged mass ref bashing etc.

Got to love the Irish though. Them giving out about the Welsh moaning about the ref is a lot like the hypocrisy they used to show over booing supporters in the Millennium Stadium.

Was really gutted by the result. I think the only change I'd definitely make next week is Ken Owens back in and Rees out of the 22 all together. I don't really trust Hibbard in the lineout either, but Rees' lineout performance doesn't warrant a squad place next week. Maybe have a change in the engine room too if Ianto is fit. I was disappointed by Priestland kicking that ball away, but I can accept that his hand was forced. I'd like to see it again, but I'd have preferred the forwards to have played "slow ball" moves from the base of the ruck.

[Irishhoneymonster]

Fair enough and my intention is not to slate anyone.

I am not suggesting it is unreasonable to question decisions by the ref, the scrum decision in Ireland match could easily have gone Ireland's way with a different ref. It is not unreasonable to bring this point up. But that point doesn't make up close to the majority of chat on the Ireland thread.

Whereas here talk about the ref/one player has been pretty regular, and like I have said IMO the ref seems to be a prominent fixture in a fair few Welsh threads. Therefore when I came on today to read the same old story I found it difficult to stop myself from posting. I have bitten my tongue on a good few other threads! No offence intended tho

[glamorganalun]

Robinson, Tovey, Biggar they are all better than Priestland.

[Irishhoneymonster]

Risca I read most threads on here regardless of what nation they are for, and normally I bite my tongue and don't get involved. But yes you're prob right Stag's post was prob a WUM

[Guest]

Its interesting that fans, media, pundits can single a player out for the positives and award MOM's. Yet when a player is rightly or wrongly singled out for a poor performance (or incident) then we should be quiet about it?

Lineouts first half let us down badly, we may have been more than a point ahead going into the last minutes and this whole blame game could have been avoided. We showed what we could do with possession in the first 4 minutes.... says it all really

[Guest]

Robinson, Tovey, Biggar they are all better than Priestland.

Tovey will need a BIG season at the Blues for both the Blues sake and his own ambitions for Wales, he has that potential but he spends too much time injured, I full expect by the Autumn International's Biggar, Morgan or Tovey will have put their hands up for selection.

That is of course unless Priestland has a great start to the season, in which case I'm sure he'll get the nod.

[Guest]

Stag I suspect is on the wum a bit. Regardless, I'd have thought the logical thing would be for a non Welsh poster to not read a Welsh match thread (if their team aren't involved), given the alleged mass ref bashing etc.

Suspect it was about a yellow not red in reference to the tackle on 1/2p v the SF red shown. I.E now us welsh are being hypocritical!

[Irishhoneymonster]

IMV the MOM award is a sideshow and not worth much really, it is the sort of thing that should prob only be handed out on the occasion when someone really stands out.

Point is it doesn't really mean alot, trying to blame one person for a single incident and the loss after a whole 80 mins is a big thing tho. And as you have pointed out Red Dragon, others were at fault too.

The try in the first 4 mins? Was that the one with the double movement? Only kidding....kind of lol

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