Ireland in New Zealand- Summer Tour Review

I think Irish fans entered the Summer tour with a sense of cautious optimism. The backbone of the team (Leinster/Ulster) both reached the final of the Heineken Cup with Leinster emerging victorious.
While, this provincial success was quite amazing, we Irish fans knew that at international level, we have often struggled. Many speculate over the reasons, in reality its is somewhere in between having players who aren't good enough and the tactics of Director of Rugby Declan Kidney and his staff. With the All Blacks replacing former coach Graham Henry with Steve Hansen, I think the Irish faithful saw the first test as their best opportunity to finally notch a win.

So the first game came, the Irish forwards put in an outstanding performance, Sean O'Brien, Rory Best and Declan Fitzpatrick were stellar. Ireland were arguably superior at the breakdown and had some dominance in the scrum. The problems lay outside. The Irish backs have struggled throughout Kidney's tenure, their back play is somewhat archaic and while try scoring isn't a huge issue for Ireland their creativity is. Kidney surprisingly picked a relatively inexperienced team, Simon Zebo and Declan Fitzpatrick gaining their first caps, Peter O'Mahony only had one previous cap while Brian O'Driscoll took on a new role at inside centre. Wingers Fergus McFadden and Simon Zebo were exposed, a lack of communication also proved to be a problem. McFadden got drawn in at times but he and Earls didn't communicate effectively resulting in some terrible gaps in defence. New Zealand winger grabbed three tries on his debut which largely culminated from poor Irish defence. A final score of 42-10 in favour of the All Blacks meant a bleak outlook, yet Irish fans knew if their backs could front up in the tackle and offer something going forward the match would be a lot tighter.

So the second test was held in Christchurch. . Ireland gave the All Blacks an almighty shock, with the home side eventually winning out on a scoreline of 22-19. Ireland made 4 changes. The injured Keith Earls was replaced by Gordon D'Arcy. Andrew Trimble was favoured ahead of Simon Zebo, Mike Ross replaced Declan Fitzpatrick and Kevin McLaughlin replaced Peter O'Mahony. While Victor Vito replaced Adam Thomson in the All Blacks line-up. The Irish forwards picked up where they left out showing superiority at the breakdown and also putting in a decent effort come scrum time. The backs also stood up and brought intensity and physicality that was absent in the first test. At times they showed some intricate backplay but mainly they used physical and powerful runners and recycled quickly . The Irish kept the All Blacks in the game by giving away silly and needless penalties, as the shell-shocked Kiwis struggled to create try scoring opportunities. They managed one in the second half but Ireland managed to tie the game at 19-19, and after Israel Dagg's sin binning for an aerial challenge on Rob Kearney, Ireland were awarded a penalty. While it seemed that captain Brian O'Driscoll wanted to go down the line with the resulting penalty, Johnny Sexton opted for the posts and his effort ultimately fell short. After a penalty which caused consternation among some Irish fans, the All Blacks marched down the field with Dan Carter sinking the winning drop goal to break Irish hearts.

The third test is something most Irish fans have blanked from their memory. In the absence of Dan Carter and Kieran Read, the All Blacks turned in a superb performance, Aaron Cruden and Sam Cane deputising brilliantly for the absent duo. The Irish team of the second test failed to turn up , the lacked physicality, slipped off tackles stood off the All Blacks and looked like they wanted to catch the plane home at times. Some mind-boggling selections like playing Paddy Wallace who only arrived in NZ on the Thursday of the game were a bit odd but all round Ireland were awful and this lead to an embarrassing 60-0 loss.



Irish team Analysis


Coaching staff

Declan Kidney - 5/10
While he obviously missed key players like Tommy Bowe, Paul O'Connell and Stephen Ferris, as well as the versatility of Luke Fitzgerald, the performances of the first and final test were poor. Our tactics were awful and we persisted to kick ball to the All Blacks without a good kick chase. While he isn't directly in charge of our backplay you have to feel his ideas have some merit, it's somewhat strange because his Munster played with more panache then the current Ireland backline do. I think that some fans place a bit too much blame on Kidney but he does deserve a fair bit and I think it might be time to get some new ideas into the Irish team and setup. His marks mainly come from the 2nd test performance and the decent play by our forwards in the first 2 games


Gert Smal- 8/10


The Irish forwards coach deserves immense praise for the way the pack played in the first two tests, they were dominant at the breakdown, the scrum was solid with new cap Declan Fitzpatrick and as good with Mike Ross. If Fitzpatrick can work on some of his fitness/health issues, then there is a spot available for him in the Irish setup.


Les Kiss- 4/10
The rating is admittedly harsh and I don't think it's all his fault, more the IRFU who seem to be insisting on Kiss working two jobs. When Kiss was solely our defensive coach, we had a very reliable defensive unit, conceding the least amount of points in the 2011 6 Nations (tied with England) and had the second best defence in 2009. Yet after the departure of Alan Gaffney, Kiss was also asked to take up the role of backs coach, our defence suffered a sharp decline, dropping from tied first to 4th overall. Our backplay hasn't been great either, at times we put some moves together but overall we seem to just go through the middle and hope gaps appear. Similar tactics work for the Welsh, but they have far more big target runners than Ireland have. I think Kiss could still do a very good job as our defence coach but I don't think he has what is takes to be a backs coach.


Players that enhanced their Reputations


Sean O'Brien- It might seem odd that a former ERC European Player of the year could do much more to enhance his reputation but "SOB" did. O'Brien confirmed that he is a superb backrow operator. While I think the Irish aren't in need of the classic "7" so many claim we need, O'Brien was a menace at the breakdown and arguably outshined Richie McCaw over the first two tests. O'Brien showed he has the ability to play all 3 backrow positions effectively at the highest level having seen him play 6 and 8 for his province and country.

Declan Fitzpatrick- While the Ulster man deputised for John Afoa in the Heineken Cup Semi final and played extremely well, I'm sure I wasn't the only Irish fan worried when I heard Mike Ross was definitely out of the first test. Fitzpatrick and his front partners Rory best and Cian Healy marshalled the All Blacks scrum, and enjoyed a bit of dominance at times but parity for the large part. Most of us expected trouble from the New Zealand scrum but credit to Fitzpatrick he was imperious. There's a spot in the Irish setup if he can work on his fitness and injury problems.


Cian Healy - At times, Healy has struggled in the international arena but over the tour he did a very good job on Owen Franks. He was used sparingly by the Irish in terms of ball carrying but we all know what he can do there and he was effective when used.


Donnacha Ryan- In the absence of Paul O'Connell, Ryan was very effective in the lineout while also disrupting at the breakdown and hitting tackles with incredible ferocity. He should partner O'Connell in the Autumn Internationals with Dan Tuohy, who performed solidly on the bench.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Do you not find it disrespectful how you talk about Sexton, Sin E? Or does this only apply to Munster folks (again)?

So far, not one person on these forums apart from yourself has expressed a real hatred for a certain player/coach. That is the only real evidence we have, and using fan boy sites (which would be the same for all provinces or clubs) are not really the best sources. Sure the Saints' fans on their supporter's website were standing up for Callum Clarke and his actions! Yet on here it was a different story, and nobody supported his actions and many claimed he deserved a much longer ban.

Sin é wrote:

On the same thread you criticised a poster for using wikipedia as a source yet when it suits you a single anonymous quote on the internet represents the feelings of the majority of Leinster fans.

I didn't criticise the poster. I criticised the information that he got from wiki which is known to be wrong on occasion and for something like what the name of a state is, it is best to go to the government website of that country or check out the UN/EU list of countries.

I do use wiki, but I'd be careful about some of the information it gives out.

That doesn't make my point any less relevant,if wiki is known to be wrong on occasion then anonymous quotes are wrong frequently yet you have no problem putting this forward as valid proof of your wild theory.

I don't need to go searching forums for posts that support your theory,I know it's wrong because I am a Leinster fan and have been attending games for over ten years.In that time I've never heard any criticism of either player from the crowd or from other Leinster fans who I've met.

Delighted you have met all 20K of Leinster fans and know exactly what they think and say. Leinsterfans will give you a different picture - you obviously must not have met anyone who posts there then!

I'll use the real world to judge and like I've told you 10 years going to matches and talking rugby with Leinster fans shows me that you're wrong.
Also there far more than 20K Leinster fans and if I need to have met them all and know exactly what they're thinking to justify my point then so do you.
Get out in the real world Sin and maybe you'll learn something about what real Leinster fans are like.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

On the same thread you criticised a poster for using wikipedia as a source yet when it suits you a single anonymous quote on the internet represents the feelings of the majority of Leinster fans.

I didn't criticise the poster. I criticised the information that he got from wiki which is known to be wrong on occasion and for something like what the name of a state is, it is best to go to the government website of that country or check out the UN/EU list of countries.

I do use wiki, but I'd be careful about some of the information it gives out.

That doesn't make my point any less relevant,if wiki is known to be wrong on occasion then anonymous quotes are wrong frequently yet you have no problem putting this forward as valid proof of your wild theory.

I don't need to go searching forums for posts that support your theory,I know it's wrong because I am a Leinster fan and have been attending games for over ten years.In that time I've never heard any criticism of either player from the crowd or from other Leinster fans who I've met.

Delighted you have met all 20K of Leinster fans and know exactly what they think and say. Leinsterfans will give you a different picture - you obviously must not have met anyone who posts there then!

I'll use the real world to judge and like I've told you 10 years going to matches and talking rugby with Leinster fans shows me that you're wrong.
Also there far more than 20K Leinster fans and if I need to have met them all and know exactly what they're thinking to justify my point then so do you.
Get out in the real world Sin and maybe you'll learn something about what real Leinster fans are like.

eh, I mentioned 20K because thats about what you fit in the RDS and you would have a chance to know what is going on. In a bigger stadium you can miss a lot of what happens.

Sin é wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Do you not find it disrespectful how you talk about Sexton, Sin E? Or does this only apply to Munster folks (again)?

So far, not one person on these forums apart from yourself has expressed a real hatred for a certain player/coach. That is the only real evidence we have, and using fan boy sites (which would be the same for all provinces or clubs) are not really the best sources. Sure the Saints' fans on their supporter's website were standing up for Callum Clarke and his actions! Yet on here it was a different story, and nobody supported his actions and many claimed he deserved a much longer ban.

eh, I don't have any time or respect Sexton and have never pretended otherwise. I've explained why. Still, you won't find threads peppered by me making snide comments about him as one finds with ROG & Kidney - all in the name of 'critique' and wanting the best for Irish rugby

Sexton is also the only Irish player I have no time for whatsoever.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Do you not find it disrespectful how you talk about Sexton, Sin E? Or does this only apply to Munster folks (again)?

So far, not one person on these forums apart from yourself has expressed a real hatred for a certain player/coach. That is the only real evidence we have, and using fan boy sites (which would be the same for all provinces or clubs) are not really the best sources. Sure the Saints' fans on their supporter's website were standing up for Callum Clarke and his actions! Yet on here it was a different story, and nobody supported his actions and many claimed he deserved a much longer ban.

eh, I don't have any time or respect Sexton and have never pretended otherwise. I've explained why. Still, you won't find threads peppered by me making snide comments about him as one finds with ROG & Kidney - all in the name of 'critique' and wanting the best for Irish rugby

Sexton is also the only Irish player I have no time for whatsoever.

Sorry, what??

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Do you not find it disrespectful how you talk about Sexton, Sin E? Or does this only apply to Munster folks (again)?

So far, not one person on these forums apart from yourself has expressed a real hatred for a certain player/coach. That is the only real evidence we have, and using fan boy sites (which would be the same for all provinces or clubs) are not really the best sources. Sure the Saints' fans on their supporter's website were standing up for Callum Clarke and his actions! Yet on here it was a different story, and nobody supported his actions and many claimed he deserved a much longer ban.

eh, I don't have any time or respect Sexton and have never pretended otherwise. I've explained why. Still, you won't find threads peppered by me making snide comments about him as one finds with ROG & Kidney - all in the name of 'critique' and wanting the best for Irish rugby

Sexton is also the only Irish player I have no time for whatsoever.

Sorry, what??

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Nice way to avoid the point,if I need to have met them all personally to know what they're thinking then does this not also apply to you?

Feckless Rogue wrote:Part of the fun of the Leinster v Munster rivalry is that it's supposedly the brash, arrogant capital city slickers versus the backward country bumpkins. But these are just caricatures Sin. I think you take it all to seriously. In reality every single team in the world has a small minority of horrible fans and a large majority of really quite pleasant sports lovers. And it's just as true in Cork or Tipperary as it is in Dublin or anywhere else. Just let go of the hatred man.

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Nice way to avoid the point,if I need to have met them all personally to know what they're thinking then does this not also apply to you?

No, you don't have to have met them all. If you are observant at a match you will pick up on these things (which is where I picked up on it in the first instance).

On the terrace under the Anglesea Stand is the pulse of Leinster rugby fans

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Nice way to avoid the point,if I need to have met them all personally to know what they're thinking then does this not also apply to you?

No, you don't have to have met them all. If you are observant at a match you will pick up on these things (which is where I picked up on it in the first instance).

On the terrace under the Anglesea Stand is the pulse of Leinster rugby fans

Sin é wrote:

Feckless Rogue wrote:Part of the fun of the Leinster v Munster rivalry is that it's supposedly the brash, arrogant capital city slickers versus the backward country bumpkins. But these are just caricatures Sin. I think you take it all to seriously. In reality every single team in the world has a small minority of horrible fans and a large majority of really quite pleasant sports lovers. And it's just as true in Cork or Tipperary as it is in Dublin or anywhere else. Just let go of the hatred man.

A fair bit of Leinster is rural FK, which is where Dowling & Ronan come from - Kilkenny & Meath Is that just the 'arrogant city slickers versus the backward country bumpkins' rivalry then?

Feckless Rogue wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Feckless Rogue wrote:Part of the fun of the Leinster v Munster rivalry is that it's supposedly the brash, arrogant capital city slickers versus the backward country bumpkins. But these are just caricatures Sin. I think you take it all to seriously. In reality every single team in the world has a small minority of horrible fans and a large majority of really quite pleasant sports lovers. And it's just as true in Cork or Tipperary as it is in Dublin or anywhere else. Just let go of the hatred man.

A fair bit of Leinster is rural FK, which is where Dowling & Ronan come from - Kilkenny & Meath Is that just the 'arrogant city slickers versus the backward country bumpkins' rivalry then?

No, I was saying that is the caricature. I did say supposedly. I'm not even from Dublin myself. I am a Leinsterman. But I know where your dislike of Leinster comes from. It's an ingrained dislike of Dublin which isn't uncommon in rural Ireland. In fact it's not uncommon for the humble, salt of the earth rural folk to despise the big city slickers in every country. That's why I bring it up. I think you've grown up with this anti-Dublin attitude and this is where all the hostility towards Leinster is coming from. The constant antagonism. It's you who believes Leinster only represents D4 and not the rest of the province. Because you want to believe it. Now you're trying to convince us that Leinster fans are horrible people. But we all know they're not. Like most rugby fans they're very well behaved. It often sounds like you're trying to convince yourself that your own hostility is justified.

Sin é wrote:I think you have watched too many psychology programmes on the tv.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Nice way to avoid the point,if I need to have met them all personally to know what they're thinking then does this not also apply to you?

No, you don't have to have met them all. If you are observant at a match you will pick up on these things (which is where I picked up on it in the first instance).

On the terrace under the Anglesea Stand is the pulse of Leinster rugby fans

Then why did you ask the question in the 1st place?

I've been to plenty of matches and I've never noticed this,in fact if what you are saying were true surely some of the other Munster fans on here would back you up.However none of them have weighed in saying they've heard similar things so the most likely answer is you're wrong.

Sin é wrote:I think you have watched too many psychology programmes on the tv.

And since when did Sexton become Leinster?

(and for the record, I don't think Leinster fans are horrible fans - just a bit precious for their own and everyone else good - automatic mode is denial).

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Nice way to avoid the point,if I need to have met them all personally to know what they're thinking then does this not also apply to you?

No, you don't have to have met them all. If you are observant at a match you will pick up on these things (which is where I picked up on it in the first instance).

On the terrace under the Anglesea Stand is the pulse of Leinster rugby fans

Then why did you ask the question in the 1st place?

I've been to plenty of matches and I've never noticed this,in fact if what you are saying were true surely some of the other Munster fans on here would back you up.However none of them have weighed in saying they've heard similar things so the most likely answer is you're wrong.

I made the mistake of thinking that you were observant.

I fail to see how that would inspire such a question,are you now claiming I'm not observant.You don't know me well enough to make that judgement.

Its amazing that no Munster fan has made any comment one way or the other about Dowling or Ronan. Maybe they thought they just better stay out of it.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
Maybe they haven't ever heard any Leinster fans making negative comments about Dowling or Ronan.

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
Maybe they haven't ever heard any Leinster fans making negative comments about Dowling or Ronan.

https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/16/53/77/41/thelad10.png

rodders wrote:

Sin é wrote:I think you have watched too many psychology programmes on the tv.

And since when did Sexton become Leinster?

(and for the record, I don't think Leinster fans are horrible fans - just a bit precious for their own and everyone else good - automatic mode is denial).

Sin you are a genius man

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
Maybe they haven't ever heard any Leinster fans making negative comments about Dowling or Ronan.

https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/16/53/77/41/thelad10.png

You'll have to spell it out for me,the firewall at work blocks images so all I get is 404 - Not Found

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
Maybe they haven't ever heard any Leinster fans making negative comments about Dowling or Ronan.

https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/16/53/77/41/thelad10.png

You'll have to spell it out for me,the firewall at work blocks images so all I get is 404 - Not Found

try this http://www.google.ie/imgres?imgurl=http://us.123rf.com/400wm/400/400/moodboard/moodboard1203/moodboard120302254/12736433-see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.123rf.com/photo_12736433_see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.html&usg=__tfePh4BasGkNqSSgt2H2dSMZXBo=&h=801&w=1200&sz=112&hl=en&start=133&zoom=1&tbnid=OKeTG0GnijJhKM:&tbnh=100&tbnw=150&ei=Wn8ZULyYO4y4hAf2jYGoDw&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dsee%2Bno%2Bevil%2Bhear%2Bno%2Bevil%26start%3D120%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26gbv%3D2%26tbm%3Disch%26prmd%3Divns&itbs=1

I'd prefer to leave it as a surprise until you get home. Nothing bad about the image - its definately work safe.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
Maybe they haven't ever heard any Leinster fans making negative comments about Dowling or Ronan.

https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/16/53/77/41/thelad10.png

You'll have to spell it out for me,the firewall at work blocks images so all I get is 404 - Not Found

try this http://www.google.ie/imgres?imgurl=http://us.123rf.com/400wm/400/400/moodboard/moodboard1203/moodboard120302254/12736433-see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.123rf.com/photo_12736433_see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.html&usg=__tfePh4BasGkNqSSgt2H2dSMZXBo=&h=801&w=1200&sz=112&hl=en&start=133&zoom=1&tbnid=OKeTG0GnijJhKM:&tbnh=100&tbnw=150&ei=Wn8ZULyYO4y4hAf2jYGoDw&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dsee%2Bno%2Bevil%2Bhear%2Bno%2Bevil%26start%3D120%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26gbv%3D2%26tbm%3Disch%26prmd%3Divns&itbs=1

I'd prefer to leave it as a surprise until you get home. Nothing bad about the image - its definately work safe.

That one worked,I don't get what you're trying to say.Why are you say being so cryptic?

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
Maybe they haven't ever heard any Leinster fans making negative comments about Dowling or Ronan.

https://i.servimg.com/u/f43/16/53/77/41/thelad10.png

You'll have to spell it out for me,the firewall at work blocks images so all I get is 404 - Not Found

try this http://www.google.ie/imgres?imgurl=http://us.123rf.com/400wm/400/400/moodboard/moodboard1203/moodboard120302254/12736433-see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.123rf.com/photo_12736433_see-no-evil-hear-no-evil-speak-no-evil.html&usg=__tfePh4BasGkNqSSgt2H2dSMZXBo=&h=801&w=1200&sz=112&hl=en&start=133&zoom=1&tbnid=OKeTG0GnijJhKM:&tbnh=100&tbnw=150&ei=Wn8ZULyYO4y4hAf2jYGoDw&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dsee%2Bno%2Bevil%2Bhear%2Bno%2Bevil%26start%3D120%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26gbv%3D2%26tbm%3Disch%26prmd%3Divns&itbs=1

I'd prefer to leave it as a surprise until you get home. Nothing bad about the image - its definately work safe.

That one worked,I don't get what you're trying to say.Why are you say being so cryptic?

The image symbolises Leinster fans (boys dressed in blue) who "See No Evil Hear No Evil Speak No Evil" about themselves.

Thomond wrote:It appears I have started another civil war!

dublin_dave wrote:absolutely, zebo, gilroy and dave kearney are exciting young players.

zebo is an out and out winger and has a massive boot. he is a natural finisher with genuine speed. defense needs a bit of work but he is young for the love of god and coming off his first full season.

gilroy is a fraction ahead of him at the moment based on what i have seen as he has a better all round game and defense to add to his attacking ability at the moment.

kearney is a very good player also but will struggle to make real headway until he becomes a regular at leinster or elsewhere.

delighted all 3 are irish three more exciting backs coming through the ranks..

rodders wrote:

Thomond wrote:It appears I have started another civil war!

I don't think you are the culprit Thomond.....

KiaRose wrote:
Are we content to be competitive at HEC level?
Do we want International success?
Why have we no Sevens team worthy of wearing green and preparing for Rio 2016?
Is Ireland in the same godawful rut that the RFU has been in since 2003?
Is there anyone in the IRFU, or anywhere in the game in Ireland, who has the guts to shake up the top tier administrators and produce a vision for rugby in Ireland which all four provinces and every semi-professional and amateur team and all the fans can buy in to?

rodders wrote:

KiaRose wrote:
Are we content to be competitive at HEC level?
Do we want International success?
Why have we no Sevens team worthy of wearing green and preparing for Rio 2016?
Is Ireland in the same godawful rut that the RFU has been in since 2003?
Is there anyone in the IRFU, or anywhere in the game in Ireland, who has the guts to shake up the top tier administrators and produce a vision for rugby in Ireland which all four provinces and every semi-professional and amateur team and all the fans can buy in to?

No.
Yes.
The IRFU.
Worse.
Probably not.

KiaRose wrote:
Why have we no Sevens team worthy of wearing green and preparing for Rio 2016?
Is Ireland in the same godawful rut that the RFU has been in since 2003?
Is there anyone in the IRFU, or anywhere in the game in Ireland, who has the guts to shake up the top tier administrators and produce a vision for rugby in Ireland which all four provinces and every semi-professional and amateur team and all the fans can buy in to?

valjester wrote:

KiaRose wrote:
Why have we no Sevens team worthy of wearing green and preparing for Rio 2016?
Is Ireland in the same godawful rut that the RFU has been in since 2003?
Is there anyone in the IRFU, or anywhere in the game in Ireland, who has the guts to shake up the top tier administrators and produce a vision for rugby in Ireland which all four provinces and every semi-professional and amateur team and all the fans can buy in to?

The reason we don't have a sevens team is because the Irfu had to make a decision on whether the cost of it was worth the benefits and they decided that it was not. I think in the end it came down to a choice between keeping four provinces or having a sevens team, imo they made the right call. Although it would be great for us to compete in the competition, it is an expensive tour to be involved with and the actual benefits towards the national team are very small. sevens to full international The number of players who graduate from s are very slim.
The situation with the RFU was very different, and thankfully it is unlikely that the IRFU will get stuck in that type of rut.

The IRFU administration is actually doing a good job from managing the finances and the future of Irish rugby. No, we are not playing to our potential on the international stage at the moment but the provinces are being well run and unlike in every other country, the chances of an Irish province running up insurmountable debts are nonexistent. Leinster, Munster and Ulster are among the best supported rugby sides in the world. Leinster are playing a brand of rugby that every side in the world should be looking to replicate, and although they are not there yet the other provinces are improving. Connacht have made huge strides forward, they are selling out most games and this season, thanks to a kind draw, will be hoping to win at least three games in the Hec.

The only real problem, and it is a big problem, is the national side. Someone needs to tell Kidney to get it together. He has one year left to get the side firing and if he doesn't, the IRFU need to have the balls to let him go.

aucklandlaurie wrote:

valjester wrote:

KiaRose wrote:
Why have we no Sevens team worthy of wearing green and preparing for Rio 2016?
Is Ireland in the same godawful rut that the RFU has been in since 2003?
Is there anyone in the IRFU, or anywhere in the game in Ireland, who has the guts to shake up the top tier administrators and produce a vision for rugby in Ireland which all four provinces and every semi-professional and amateur team and all the fans can buy in to?

The reason we don't have a sevens team is because the Irfu had to make a decision on whether the cost of it was worth the benefits and they decided that it was not. I think in the end it came down to a choice between keeping four provinces or having a sevens team, imo they made the right call. Although it would be great for us to compete in the competition, it is an expensive tour to be involved with and the actual benefits towards the national team are very small. sevens to full international The number of players who graduate from s are very slim.
The situation with the RFU was very different, and thankfully it is unlikely that the IRFU will get stuck in that type of rut.

The IRFU administration is actually doing a good job from managing the finances and the future of Irish rugby. No, we are not playing to our potential on the international stage at the moment but the provinces are being well run and unlike in every other country, the chances of an Irish province running up insurmountable debts are nonexistent. Leinster, Munster and Ulster are among the best supported rugby sides in the world. Leinster are playing a brand of rugby that every side in the world should be looking to replicate, and although they are not there yet the other provinces are improving. Connacht have made huge strides forward, they are selling out most games and this season, thanks to a kind draw, will be hoping to win at least three games in the Hec.

The only real problem, and it is a big problem, is the national side. Someone needs to tell Kidney to get it together. He has one year left to get the side firing and if he doesn't, the IRFU need to have the balls to let him go.

Gordon Teitjens , who is the coach of the New Zealand sevens team, has spotted and developed 39 sevens players who have gone on to be All Blacks.

aucklandlaurie wrote:
Maybe thats a reason why you dont produce so many rugby players?.. Its just a question...

You seem to have no problem finding money to pay foreign coaches and players money that they would probably never get in their home countries. so is money really a problem.

aucklandlaurie wrote:
What im talking about is having an alternate route to the top team which develops and promotes different speed and fitness skills, I truely dont know if Ireland would produce More rugby players if they got on board with sevens, but Im more than confident that they would produce players with wider skill sets and fitness work ethics.

aucklandlaurie wrote:
yes, players are graded by age and weight up to school First xv level, however all players at all ages are given and encouraged to undertake further skills development , one of those avenues being the playing of sevens.

Most New Zealand sevens players, play sevens before they make selection for their provinces, not after.

aucklandlaurie wrote:
Maybe thats a reason why you dont produce so many rugby players?.. Its just a question...

You seem to have no problem finding money to pay foreign coaches and players money that they would probably never get in their home countries. so is money really a problem.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:
Maybe thats a reason why you dont produce so many rugby players?.. Its just a question...

You seem to have no problem finding money to pay foreign coaches and players money that they would probably never get in their home countries. so is money really a problem.

We don't produce so many rugby players because the game just hasn't been popular here for very long.I've used this example before but I live in county Meath and the order of field sports is gaelic football,soccer then a distant 3rd is hurling and an even more distant 4th is rugby.To put it into context there are over 50 gaelic football clubs,about 26 hurling clubs in Meath and only 5 rugby clubs 2 of which 2 are less than 5 years old.

This is a county with a population of over 180,000 people,that works out at 1 rugby club for every 36,000 people.There are similar stories in a lot of counties throughout Ireland and while things are improving it will take time before the game is truly available to large parts of the country.