Welsh regions double-header at the Millenium stadium this year

by gowales Tue 28 Aug 2012, 3:39 pm

First topic message reminder :

WALES'S regions are set to stage a double-header at the Millennium Stadium in the coming rugby season.

The Pro12 league matches will see the Blues taking on the Ospreys and the Dragons meeting the Scarlets.

Details of the games are likely to be announced at a press conference in Cardiff tomorrow, hosted jointly by Regional Rugby Wales and the Welsh Rugby Union.

A deal has reportedly been struck to guarantee that the double-header will be held annually over the next four years.

The regions will hope to emulate the success of leading sides in England, who have attracted crowds of more than 50,000 for bumper Twickenham encounters on the same day.

The professional sides in Wales are unlikely to take it in turns to act as hosts, with the Ospreys and the Scarlets apparently reluctant to ask their supporters to travel to Cardiff for home fixtures.

So the Millennium Stadium games are expected to count as home dates for the Blues and Dragons, with the pair sharing the gate receipts.

http://www.thisissouthwales.co.uk/Regions-battle-stadium-double-headers/story-16771150-detail/story.html

Good to see.

Can't see big crowds for the first few years though.
What are your opinions? Do you like this idea? Is it unfair on supporters to travel? Is there any point? Will the Welsh internationals even play in it?

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 11:14 am

HammerofThunor wrote:Why isn't it at the beginning of the season? If it's because the deal wasn't done in time then fine. Otherwise I don't see a reason. One given before was because the internationals may not be available at the start of the season due to the tour. But that's doesn't matter if the other option is during the 6 nations.

As a build up game to get the season off to a start it seems like a good idea.

PS Would the clubs get bar money? Wouldn't that go to the WRU with the ticket sales going to the home regions?

I def think it should be the 2nd/3rd week of the season (when the Scarlets are playing Ospreys - 21st and the Dragons are playing the Blues - 15th this season), most of the internationals should be playing, there will be a real hunger for rugby after the off season, new signings (except SH internationals) should be on show and the players should be fresh.

It makes a lot more sense than stuck between the 6Ns and HEC games, where most of the internationals will be rested, some injured, and the casual fans will have been sated by the 6Ns and or skint by paying out for Wales games.

Dreamer - I think the WRU said that they would pay the regions, but there has been said on here that the 'Home' regions would get a take of the bar/ticket receipts

by Luckless Pedestrian Wed 29 Aug 2012, 11:28 am

LordDowlais wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Dowlais, if the double-header had been arranged for the opening weekend of the season or for around Christmas time, I'd be much keener on it.

I understand you don't support any one region, so I'm sure it's great from your perspective; but we're losing out on a home game here.

Come on, you will probably pay the same for your home game as you would for two games here.

It's not the financial side of it I'm thinking about, more our chances of winning. We struggle enough at home against the Scarlets as it is.

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 11:38 am

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Dowlais, if the double-header had been arranged for the opening weekend of the season or for around Christmas time, I'd be much keener on it.

I understand you don't support any one region, so I'm sure it's great from your perspective; but we're losing out on a home game here.

Come on, you will probably pay the same for your home game as you would for two games here.

It's not the financial side of it I'm thinking about, more our chances of winning. We struggle enough at home against the Scarlets as it is.

You should just be glad to get a chance to play such a great side and the opportunity to tell the grandkids that YES you saw your team play the Scarlets (and lose) Very Happy

by XR Wed 29 Aug 2012, 11:41 am

rugbydreamer wrote:Hammer - I think any profit made goes to the wru, so not really sure what the regions get from it.

What if they buy the tickets through the region rather than through ticket master?

by Luckless Pedestrian Wed 29 Aug 2012, 11:47 am

Smirnoffpriest wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Dowlais, if the double-header had been arranged for the opening weekend of the season or for around Christmas time, I'd be much keener on it.

I understand you don't support any one region, so I'm sure it's great from your perspective; but we're losing out on a home game here.

Come on, you will probably pay the same for your home game as you would for two games here.

It's not the financial side of it I'm thinking about, more our chances of winning. We struggle enough at home against the Scarlets as it is.

You should just be glad to get a chance to play such a great side and the opportunity to tell the grandkids that YES you saw your team play the Scarlets (and lose)

I can say that already! Sad

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 11:49 am

gcBlues wrote:
rugbydreamer wrote:Hammer - I think any profit made goes to the wru, so not really sure what the regions get from it.

What if they buy the tickets through the region rather than through ticket master?

Ohh God that's a good point, if they sell the tickets through the MS then we'd need to go through TicketMasteroftheRIPOFF!

by Welshmushroom Wed 29 Aug 2012, 12:04 pm

To be honest I've been saying this event should be happening a long time ago. Kudos to the Regions for finally getting on the band wagon - better late than never.

The only problem is they didnt think this through.

Two main points of concern:-

The date - had they played this over the Christmas period when people are off work (and as boxing day matches go down a treat) this would have been more logical. To include this in the middle of the 6 Nations when people will already be skint is a bit silly. Surely keeping these away from International windows should have been paramount.

The price - £25 quid seems reasonable enough but to be honest they should have put a £15-£20 marker on it to make it even more appealing. Once you get the regular punters you can always move the price once demand growns but I would make it a real financial alternative for people who cant afford 6 Nations tickets.

by HammerofThunor Wed 29 Aug 2012, 12:27 pm

The original post suggested that the Blues and Dragons would share the gate receipts. I doubt very much they would get any of the bar sales and I'm not sure if there is some sort of hire fee to the WRU.

by Casartelli Wed 29 Aug 2012, 12:36 pm

Load of nonsense.

One of the fundamental principles of regionalisation is that our boys get to play all home league games at PYS, Library, CCS/Arms Park and RP.

To tear that bedrock to pieces and take games elsewhere just to encourage bigger crowds and popular support from the pink cowboy hat masses?

Complete sellout. Outrageous disgrace.

by ScarletSpiderman Wed 29 Aug 2012, 12:42 pm

Sorry if it has been asked before, but what about the season ticket holders? Say your seat is in a prime location at Dave Parade, right in the atmosphere, with loyal die hard Dragons fans around you. WOuld you be located in a similar location, and the same for the Blues.

Also is this going to end up being rotated as the Scarlets and Ospreys home games in the coming seasons?

by ScarletSpiderman Wed 29 Aug 2012, 12:45 pm

Casartelli wrote:Load of nonsense.

One of the fundamental principles of regionalisation is that our boys get to play all home league games at PYS, Library, CCS/Arms Park and RP.

To tear that bedrock to pieces and take games elsewhere just to encourage bigger crowds and popular support from the pink cowboy hat masses?

Complete sellout. Outrageous disgrace.

As a marketing tool it is working pretty well, some of the TV fans at work are talking about it as a good idea, and probably a cracking day out on the pop. I guess it all depends on if the suits start to turn up or not to whether it is a success or not.

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:02 pm

Casartelli wrote:Load of nonsense.

One of the fundamental principles of regionalisation is that our boys get to play all home league games at PYS, Library, CCS/Arms Park and RP.

To tear that bedrock to pieces and take games elsewhere just to encourage bigger crowds and popular support from the pink cowboy hat masses?

Complete sellout. Outrageous disgrace.

Cyril aren't you the one whose been advocating the regions play games away from PyS, CCS, RP, Liberty as that (apparently) is the only way to prove a team represents the region - even wanting the Scarlets to play at the Church Bank Playing Fields in Llandovery and Carmarthen Park even though neither meet the WRUs A* standards, and aren't suitable. Or advocating that the Dragons play at Ebbw (even though Ebbw won't buy half of the Dragons to have an equal say in the region).

It's such a tired post...

by munkian Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:03 pm

Open seating as far as I know. I'm just going to try and sit with other Dragons fans.

by GavinDragon Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:10 pm

according to the dragons spokesperson on their site, the region will be given blocks of tickets for their season ticket holders, whether or not that expands to non season ticket holders i dont know, but at least regulars will be able to sit together

i understnad concerns about the date but I am all for this and in the western fail today it has been confirmed that it is being underwritten by the WRU for four years and that the date is nt set in stone so could be changed.

as for dragons fans moaning, we havent had the best record against the turks at home in recent years anyway maybe a change of venue will bring us more luck

by Guest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:26 pm

It's not Dragons fans moaning is it. It's Dragons fans saying that it's a shame to lose our home advantage (ie the terracing), but also generally saying a venue change could be the change of luck we need.

I'm seeing it pop up in a few places now, that next season's games will be Dragons v Ospreys and Blues v Scarlets (well more the Dragons v Ospreys match, but obviously that makes the B v S game so).

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:27 pm

£25 to watch 2nd/3rds strength teams in the RABO!!!!! Laugh

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:30 pm

munkian wrote:Open seating as far as I know. I'm just going to try and sit with other Dragons fans.

Can I sit next to you Munk?

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:39 pm

go away hersh

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:49 pm

That’s not very nice!

It's a great idea, it's just such a shame that the timing of it is all wrong, wasn't it down to two of the four Regions not wanting to lose home games?

Seems a bit selfish IMO

by LordDowlais Wed 29 Aug 2012, 1:56 pm

Well we have got to look at something to boost our income now that the HC is under threat, I know what about another international game squeezed in somewhere.

by Guest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 2:03 pm

HERSH wrote:That’s not very nice!

It's a great idea, it's just such a shame that the timing of it is all wrong, wasn't it down to two of the four Regions not wanting to lose home games?

Seems a bit selfish IMO

Well if it is true about the fixtures ie, as follows;

2012-13 season

Dragons v Scarlets
Blues v Ospreys

2013-14 season

Dragons v Ospreys
Blues v Scarlets

It's pretty obvious who wouldn't give up home games (if true). So if it is true, I again don't see the benefit from a Dragons point of view. We are the only ones who get stung for it (seeing as Blues play next door and Ospreys and Scarlets would have to travel as far, or slightly further anyway).

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 2:17 pm

It's true. Very Happy

by glamorganalun Wed 29 Aug 2012, 2:42 pm

I think it is a great idea, it will get supporter like me to the game. The Dragons and the Blues will split the proceeds from the additional supporters and so they should as they are losing their "home" games. I think good on them for coming up with the plan (maybe 5 years late) to improve revenues. In their interests I would play the double header twice if possible, one over the Xmas period (the Blues and the Dragons don't have under soil heating), as crowds tend to be good over the Xmas period, the other double header should be played either the first game of the RABO or last i.e., in good conditions. This could be a good earner for the Dragons but it could be a plan by the pieman/WRU to get them used to travelling to Cardiff i.e., if the WRU knock the Dragons on the head.

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 2:51 pm

I def think it should be played at the start of the season, my one problem with a xmas game is that public transport is terrible in the winter, and bad weather can make travelling long distances a big problem.

But other than that it is a very good idea and I'm looking forward to it

by Luckless Pedestrian Wed 29 Aug 2012, 2:53 pm

glamorganalun wrote:It could be a plan by the pieman/WRU to get them used to travelling to Cardiff i.e., if the WRU knock the Dragons on the head.

Can you keep your w@nk fantasies to yourself, please?

by ScarletSpiderman Wed 29 Aug 2012, 2:53 pm

glamorganalun wrote:I think it is a great idea, it will get supporter like me to the game. The Dragons and the Blues will split the proceeds from the additional supporters and so they should as they are losing their "home" games. I think good on them for coming up with the plan (maybe 5 years late) to improve revenues. In their interests I would play the double header twice if possible, one over the Xmas period (the Blues and the Dragons don't have under soil heating), as crowds tend to be good over the Xmas period, the other double header should be played either the first game of the RABO or last i.e., in good conditions. This could be a good earner for the Dragons but it could be a plan by the pieman/WRU to get them used to travelling to Cardiff i.e., if the WRU knock the Dragons on the head.

I agree that a double header is a good idea, but not at Xmas. We have our proper derby matches then, and they are always sell outs. I would be more than a little miffed if instead of having a home game every other boxing day (and a local away match every other one) that I was expected to travel up to Cardiff when public transport will have an extra price on it, and the roads will possibly not be in the best conditions (snow, ice, drunks etc).

by ScarletSpiderman Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:00 pm

Cas - more like taking a home game out of the region. I can understand their issues.

by Casartelli Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:00 pm

[quote="glamorganalun"]I think it is a great idea, it will get supporter like me to the game. The Dragons and the Blues will split the proceeds from the additional supporters and so they should as they are losing their "home" games. I think good on them for coming up with the plan (maybe 5 years late) to improve revenues. In their interests I would play the double header twice if possible, one over the Xmas period (the Blues and the Dragons don't have under soil heating), as crowds tend to be good over the Xmas period, the other double header should be played either the first game of the RABO or last i.e., in good conditions. This could be a good earner for the Dragons but it could be a plan by the pieman/WRU to get them used to travelling to Cardiff i.e., if the WRU knock the Dragons on the head.[/quote]

Subtle, Alun. As if this thread hasn't got the Dragons fans spitting feathers already, at the thought have having to take a game away from Rodney Parade....

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:02 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Cas - more like taking a home game out of the region. I can understand their issues.

Especially when they'd be the only team to do that

(though I suppose what can they expect with the WRU owning Ebbw Vales half of the Dragons...)

by ScarletSpiderman Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:02 pm

Casartelli wrote:Subtle, Alun. As if this thread hasn't got the Dragons fans spitting feathers already, at the thought have having to take a game away from Rodney Parade....

I think the problem is not moving from Dave Parade, but moving the game from Gwent, and from the region to Cardiff and into the Blues region.

That said maybe the Blues should be kicking off as it is encoraging people from the city and surrounding area, who are TV fans of a rival region to turn up and cheer the rival region on (Be it the Dragons, Scarlets or Ospreys).

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:04 pm

I used to hate playing at Rodney Parade, it's a dump, the fans aren't great!

Pull it down and do away with the Dragons

by Morgannwg Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:04 pm

Just out of curiousity, as this viscious rumour has been murmoured on here for a while now, why would the WRU knock the Dragons on the head? What signs are there that it will happen within say, a decade? Bearing in mind the WRU are fully committed to keeping 4 Regions and the City where that Region is based is now expanding.

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:05 pm

by Guest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:09 pm

HERSH wrote:I used to hate playing at Rodney Parade, it's a dump, the fans aren't great!

Pull it down and do away with the Dragons

Did a bit of busking did you?

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:11 pm

Risca Rev wrote:
HERSH wrote:I used to hate playing at Rodney Parade, it's a dump, the fans aren't great!

Pull it down and do away with the Dragons

Did a bit of busking did you?

Probably all the fans threw insults at him instead of loose change, so he doesn't like them (or Wales) anymore ...

by LordDowlais Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:18 pm

Well I am going to this double header anyway so you lot can keep grizzling if you want, or as you Scarlets supporters are always saying, you can get of you behinds and actually go and support your region. Run

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:21 pm

LordDowlais wrote:Well I am going to this double header anyway so you lot can keep grizzling if you want, or as you Scarlets supporters are always saying, you can get of you behinds and actually go and support your region.

Yup even though my behind is of the larger variety I'll be there, though as I can see the stadium from my house (well the white 'spikes' on the roof) it's not too taxing for me.

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:23 pm

LordDowlais wrote:Well I am going to this double header anyway so you lot can keep grizzling if you want, or as you Scarlets supporters are always saying, you can get of you behinds and actually go and support your region.

by LordDowlais Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:24 pm

Smirnoffpriest wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Well I am going to this double header anyway so you lot can keep grizzling if you want, or as you Scarlets supporters are always saying, you can get of you behinds and actually go and support your region.

Yup even though my behind is of the larger variety I'll be there, though as I can see the stadium from my house (well the white 'spikes' on the roof) it's not too taxing for me.

Thats the spirit smirnoff. Get it spirit/smirnoff. drumroll

Anyway, lets all try to get behind something here in Wales for a change instead of writing it off before a dye has been cast. Yahoo

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:30 pm

I agree, get behind it and enjoy a greast day out in Cardiff.

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 3:32 pm

HERSH wrote:I agree, get behind it and enjoy a greast day out in Cardiff.

You agree? even though you want the Dragons disbanded?

Or do you want a 3 way round robin compettition between the Ospreys, Scarlets and Blues instead? Might cause problems with the league tho...

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 4:02 pm

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 4:09 pm

HERSH wrote:

My thoughts exactly

by glamorganalun Wed 29 Aug 2012, 4:56 pm

Scarletspiderman:

There have been games lost over Xmas due to freezing weather such as the Ospreys toilets, Dragons and the Blues grounds freezing (at CCS, heating not set to work). At the MS the roof and under soil heating would ensure games go ahead, also the transport links are good. I used to go to Ponty V Cardiff games over Xmas coming "home" from where I lived in Surrey, I think it is a good time for the games. This scheme will bring in supporters that watch rugby but not tied to a region and more likely to watch both matches. It may turn out the event may attract more attendees that don't attend regional games over time (just like the Wales matches).

The loss of the derby matches over the Xmas period tend to be an expensive loss to the clubs as the crowds tend to be much lower for the rescheduled game. I think it is win win for the Dragons and Blues, when ever the games are played as they should share the takings and the WRU the concession income.

by Feckless Rogue Wed 29 Aug 2012, 5:23 pm

I'd like to see Ireland and Wales have these double Headers in Lansdowne and the Millenium. During the Christmas holidays. With full strength teams. It would be great for the league.

by glamorganalun Wed 29 Aug 2012, 5:28 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
glamorganalun wrote:It could be a plan by the pieman/WRU to get them used to travelling to Cardiff i.e., if the WRU knock the Dragons on the head.

Can you keep your w@nk fantasies to yourself, please?

This is a partnership between the Blues and the Dragons in losing their home games, I can see the Dragons gaining revenue but I can't see what the Blues get from the double header as they could play next door as they have in the past. The only gain I can see is the bar takings in the club house. Don't get me wrong, I think it is a positive but I admit I am a cynic and nervous getting close to the Cardiff based club with their relationship with the WRU. I would be more comfortable if all four regions gave up their home games.

There is a positive for the Dragons in that the WRU have committed to support these double headers for 4 years, does this mean the Valleys/North Wales regions are dead?

by Luckless Pedestrian Wed 29 Aug 2012, 5:40 pm

The Blues are losing a home game? Come off it!

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 7:08 pm

Nothings changed with the NW region - it's going to continue to grow slowly, enter the Premiership, see how it goes, continue to grow and improve and then enter the Rabo when the time is right.

The Valleys, correction All Wales region, from Neath to Cross Keys, from Tongwynlais to Bangor, err I mean the Ponty region has been dead since the Warriors left town because of lack of support/investment

by HERSH Wed 29 Aug 2012, 7:10 pm

by Smirnoffpriest Wed 29 Aug 2012, 7:35 pm

HERSH wrote:

why didn't I think of that remark! DOH

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