The Klits - The smart move is to retire now!!!

by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 10 Sep 2012, 7:49 pm

My father in law always likes to say.. it's always good manners to know when to leave a party!! He certainly felt I would have shown good manners If I'd disapperared 30 seconds after he'd met me!!...... Alas we don't all smell the coffee!! Cool

Which brings me to the Klits......Legacies assured.......getting older and slower...more money than they can spend......and great futures in the media or politics beckon!!

Let's be honest a victory over Price or Fury means diddly at this stage....both will be green or overrated If vanquished....If Vit beats Haye... well bro beat haye easy so what!!!

Nothing out there to improve their legacies and the longer they go on the more beatable they will become..

Guys you're smart.................................and the smart move is.........

To go now!!!!!!!

by Rodney Mon 10 Sep 2012, 7:56 pm

30 seconds a very patient man mate.

I see your point Truss, but put yourself in their shoes, beating every one in sight at a canter earning umpteen amount of euros and having the most prestige title in the world.

I agree bar Haye for Vitali no one is going to improve their legacy, it's difficult but I wouldn't if I was them especially Wlad.

Cheers

Rodders

by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 10 Sep 2012, 7:58 pm

Sooner or later they'll lose to some chump and their legacy will be harmed!!

Had Holmes gone before 175er Spinks.....he'd no doubt be higher!!

Why risk it...they don't need the money!!

by Rodney Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:03 pm

It could happen and I agree, but can't see it In the foreseeable.

People always need the money mate regardless how riche they are.

Look at Ronaldo he wants 500k a week !!!! He'll nearly have more than your father in law.

Cheers

Rodders

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:05 pm

They are seriously harming the division by fighting mostly German based tomoto cans. Who the hell was Charr??? that guy did not deserve a crack at the H/W title.

by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:06 pm

Hagler didn't come back, Tunney, Marciano.........you're generalising!!

Thing is when you reach a certain age ...as you'd know no doubt!! Cool

You can lose it overnight..

That's If you ever had it!! Nice to see you back on here by the way!!! drumroll

by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:09 pm

You're right in one respect onetwo...never seen the heavy division in such a pathetic waste...

However it's Germany or nowhere..

They won't sell anywhere else..

by Rodney Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:10 pm

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:They are seriously harming the division by fighting mostly German based tomoto cans. Who the hell was Charr??? that guy did not deserve a crack at the H/W title.

Who do you want them to fight ? I hadn't heard of Charr, but bar us Brits no one will have heard of Fury and Price.

Povetkin doesn't want to know, and I can't name anyone else worth it.

Rodders

by manos de piedra Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:11 pm

Charr appeared Germanys answer to Fury

by Rodney Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:12 pm

I never had it mate however if i did like Wlad id be milking it.

cheers Truss good to see you're out and about on here.

Rodders

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:17 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:You're right in one respect onetwo...never seen the heavy division in such a pathetic waste...

However it's Germany or nowhere..

They won't sell anywhere else..

Then they must go.

by WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:21 pm

Vitali should retire, he is the slowest I've ever seen him, is having recurring injuries to his shoulder and is looking tired after 1 round throwing merely jabs.

Wlad shouldn't retire, why should he, he's in his prime atm and has another 4 years in him with a guaranteed £5mil+ purse every fight regardless of the opposition. He doesn't take a lot of punishment as he grapples and clinches when in trouble. He is an athlete and lives a disciplined and healthy life so should be able to carry on easily enough

by Rodney Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:24 pm

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:You're right in one respect onetwo...never seen the heavy division in such a pathetic waste...

However it's Germany or nowhere..

They won't sell anywhere else..

Then they must go.

Who will we have then, it only gets worse.

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:25 pm

I respect that they are active champions but I question their love or passion for the sport because these no name bandits they put infront of us every 3 - 4 months are not, can not be motivating the Klits.

Wlad was pressured into fighting Haye who git in his face. Wlad looked unsure in the lead up and in the fight itself. Alas Haye was not able to really bother Wlad that night but at least he rattled him to an extent. Wlad trained hard for that fight I am willing to bet he did not train as hard for Thompson.

Did Vitali work his butt of for Charr????
I doubt it so where is the drive and passion? I doubt it exists anymore and they are in this on a purley financial basis.

They need to go.

by manos de piedra Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:32 pm

The issue for me is with the challengers, not the champions. Cant understand why the Klitschkos get the flack for the chasing pack not being good enough or interested enough in challenging them.

I think Vitali should call it a day. If not now then t least after his next fight. He is old now and visibly slowing down and ageing.

Wlad has never looked better in my view. He could easily hang around and maybe target being the undisputed champ for a few years. I dont see the need for him to go.

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:39 pm

manos de piedra wrote:The issue for me is with the challengers, not the champions. Cant understand why the Klitschkos get the flack for the chasing pack not being good enough or interested enough in challenging them.

I think Vitali should call it a day. If not now then t least after his next fight. He is old now and visibly slowing down and ageing.

Wlad has never looked better in my view. He could easily hang around and maybe target being the undisputed champ for a few years. I dont see the need for him to go.

Have to disagree with you manos.

The champions make the challengers better. Mostly due to their marketability.

Ali made the 70's heavies. He had the limelight and they ALL wanted a peice of it and him.

When Tyson was dominating and becoming the face of boxing BOOM! up come Holy, Lewis and Bowe all because the champion was the driving force of the division and the sport.

The K brothers are as dull as dish water. It does have an effect.

by Rodney Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:41 pm

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:I respect that they are active champions but I question their love or passion for the sport because these no name bandits they put infront of us every 3 - 4 months are not, can not be motivating the Klits.

Wlad was pressured into fighting Haye who git in his face. Wlad looked unsure in the lead up and in the fight itself. Alas Haye was not able to really bother Wlad that night but at least he rattled him to an extent. Wlad trained hard for that fight I am willing to bet he did not train as hard for Thompson.

Did Vitali work his butt of for Charr????
I doubt it so where is the drive and passion? I doubt it exists anymore and they are in this on a purley financial basis.

They need to go.

They need to go yet they're hammering everyone in sight, two extremely personable guys I can't see your issue.

Okay if both walked out of the sport tomorrow who will we have as the torch bearer for the division, and please don't say David Haye

Cheers

Rodders

by eddyfightfan Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:48 pm

they should either retire or make serious efforts to get better fights. its easy to say there fighting the best availible but i don think are, i wont list all the worthy challenges but theres at least 10-15 heavys who deserve a shot and would give at least a half decent match up.

they need to offer a bigger payday to opponents, get on the road and stop with the rematch clauses if they want to actually improve their legacys, but thompson, charr, morcomeck are pointless money spinners.

also credit to wlad he is taking on wach next which is his best opponent since haye.

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:50 pm

Cheers

Rodders

Look at it this way. The baton will be picked up by lesser names who have not the expeariance but it will at least freahen things up like David Haye did to an extent.

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:51 pm

eddyfightfan wrote:they should either retire or make serious efforts to get better fights. its easy to say there fighting the best availible but i don think are, i wont list all the worthy challenges but theres at least 10-15 heavys who deserve a shot and would give at least a half decent match up.

they need to offer a bigger payday to opponents, get on the road and stop with the rematch clauses if they want to actually improve their legacys, but thompson, charr, morcomeck are pointless money spinners.

also credit to wlad he is taking on wach next which is his best opponent since haye.

Agreed but Wach is rubbish.

by manos de piedra Mon 10 Sep 2012, 8:57 pm

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:
manos de piedra wrote:The issue for me is with the challengers, not the champions. Cant understand why the Klitschkos get the flack for the chasing pack not being good enough or interested enough in challenging them.

I think Vitali should call it a day. If not now then t least after his next fight. He is old now and visibly slowing down and ageing.

Wlad has never looked better in my view. He could easily hang around and maybe target being the undisputed champ for a few years. I dont see the need for him to go.

Have to disagree with you manos.

The champions make the challengers better. Mostly due to their marketability.

Ali made the 70's heavies. He had the limelight and they ALL wanted a peice of it and him.

When Tyson was dominating and becoming the face of boxing BOOM! up come Holy, Lewis and Bowe all because the champion was the driving force of the division and the sport.

The K brothers are as dull as dish water. It does have an effect.

So are you holding the Klitschkos personally responsible because the calibre of heavyweight challengers out there at the moment is poor?

I really dont see how Ali or Tyson had any bearing on the fact Frazier, Foreman, Bowe, Holy, Lewis etc were top class fighters. They just happened to exist in the same era's. When you have two guys on top of a division for the best part of a decade then its always likely to thin out the ranks. Even moreso now because of the giant size of the Klitschkos making it so difficult for smaller weight class fighters to step up.

Klitschko fights are also big events. Boxing is obviously not the powerhouse it was in the 1970s but as things go today there are very few boxers that can boast Klitschko viewers or attendances.

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 9:00 pm

manos de piedra wrote:
ONETWOFOREVER wrote:
manos de piedra wrote:The issue for me is with the challengers, not the champions. Cant understand why the Klitschkos get the flack for the chasing pack not being good enough or interested enough in challenging them.

I think Vitali should call it a day. If not now then t least after his next fight. He is old now and visibly slowing down and ageing.

Wlad has never looked better in my view. He could easily hang around and maybe target being the undisputed champ for a few years. I dont see the need for him to go.

Have to disagree with you manos.

The champions make the challengers better. Mostly due to their marketability.

Ali made the 70's heavies. He had the limelight and they ALL wanted a peice of it and him.

When Tyson was dominating and becoming the face of boxing BOOM! up come Holy, Lewis and Bowe all because the champion was the driving force of the division and the sport.

The K brothers are as dull as dish water. It does have an effect.

So are you holding the Klitschkos personally responsible because the calibre of heavyweight challengers out there at the moment is poor?

I really dont see how Ali or Tyson had any bearing on the fact Frazier, Foreman, Bowe, Holy, Lewis etc were top class fighters. They just happened to exist in the same era's. When you have two guys on top of a division for the best part of a decade then its always likely to thin out the ranks. Even moreso now because of the giant size of the Klitschkos making it so difficult for smaller weight class fighters to step up.

Klitschko fights are also big events. Boxing is obviously not the powerhouse it was in the 1970s but as things go today there are very few boxers that can boast Klitschko viewers or attendances.

Wrong I have to say. Ali made the 70's division what it was because he was box office. It galvanises the rest of the division to have such a well known, marketable, genuine champion.

by Lance Mon 10 Sep 2012, 9:00 pm

if the klits were primarily concerned with their legacy then yes they might aswell retire now. they have proven all they can and dont want to end up on the losing end to a guy they could have beaten easily a few years earlier. however, they like to see themselves as business men aswell as sportsmen and they are doing as well as ever on that side of things. vitali earning a decent pay cheque for fighting charr proves that business is good.

by eddyfightfan Mon 10 Sep 2012, 9:05 pm

if the klits went the division would prosper, the belts would be in circulation again and i think the would be spread out and change hands often, bringing money into the play everybody else (therefore improving motivation), i also think the level of remaining competition would be more even and hopefully that would increase the excitment of fight and get the division in the limelight again.

wlad could come back in 2-3 years once the puluevs, furys, prices, mitchels etc have had time to mature and flurish into actual world class fighters, and giving greater meaning to any further accomplishments.

by manos de piedra Mon 10 Sep 2012, 9:15 pm

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:
manos de piedra wrote:
ONETWOFOREVER wrote:
manos de piedra wrote:The issue for me is with the challengers, not the champions. Cant understand why the Klitschkos get the flack for the chasing pack not being good enough or interested enough in challenging them.

I think Vitali should call it a day. If not now then t least after his next fight. He is old now and visibly slowing down and ageing.

Wlad has never looked better in my view. He could easily hang around and maybe target being the undisputed champ for a few years. I dont see the need for him to go.

Have to disagree with you manos.

The champions make the challengers better. Mostly due to their marketability.

Ali made the 70's heavies. He had the limelight and they ALL wanted a peice of it and him.

When Tyson was dominating and becoming the face of boxing BOOM! up come Holy, Lewis and Bowe all because the champion was the driving force of the division and the sport.

The K brothers are as dull as dish water. It does have an effect.

So are you holding the Klitschkos personally responsible because the calibre of heavyweight challengers out there at the moment is poor?

I really dont see how Ali or Tyson had any bearing on the fact Frazier, Foreman, Bowe, Holy, Lewis etc were top class fighters. They just happened to exist in the same era's. When you have two guys on top of a division for the best part of a decade then its always likely to thin out the ranks. Even moreso now because of the giant size of the Klitschkos making it so difficult for smaller weight class fighters to step up.

Klitschko fights are also big events. Boxing is obviously not the powerhouse it was in the 1970s but as things go today there are very few boxers that can boast Klitschko viewers or attendances.

Wrong I have to say. Ali made the 70's division what it was because he was box office. It galvanises the rest of the division to have such a well known, marketable, genuine champion.

Ali, good as he was, Im pretty sure was not able make quality fighters appear. He was a larger than life champion at a time when boxing was more in the mainstream. I dont think theres any dispute about that. But he couldnt account for the actual quality of his competition.

You might find the Klitschkos boring, thats fine but I think it should be recognised that they are probably two of the biggest names in the sport right now. They have more or less beaten the majority of the challengers out there. There is a newish generation coming through thats in no rush to face them, which I can understand. They are actually very popular fighters as things are today most things considered and I would hesitate to use Tyson or Ali as benchmark.

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 9:30 pm

manos de piedra wrote:
ONETWOFOREVER wrote:
manos de piedra wrote:The issue for me is with the challengers, not the champions. Cant understand why the Klitschkos get the flack for the chasing pack not being good enough or interested enough in challenging them.

I think Vitali should call it a day. If not now then t least after his next fight. He is old now and visibly slowing down and ageing.

Wlad has never looked better in my view. He could easily hang around and maybe target being the undisputed champ for a few years. I dont see the need for him to go.

Have to disagree with you manos.

The champions make the challengers better. Mostly due to their marketability.

Ali made the 70's heavies. He had the limelight and they ALL wanted a peice of it and him.

When Tyson was dominating and becoming the face of boxing BOOM! up come Holy, Lewis and Bowe all because the champion was the driving force of the division and the sport.

The K brothers are as dull as dish water. It does have an effect.

So are you holding the Klitschkos personally responsible because the calibre of heavyweight challengers out there at the moment is poor?

I really dont see how Ali or Tyson had any bearing on the fact Frazier, Foreman, Bowe, Holy, Lewis etc were top class fighters. They just happened to exist in the same era's. When you have two guys on top of a division for the best part of a decade then its always likely to thin out the ranks. Even moreso now because of the giant size of the Klitschkos making it so difficult for smaller weight class fighters to step up.

Klitschko fights are also big events. Boxing is obviously not the powerhouse it was in the 1970s but as things go today there are very few boxers that can boast Klitschko viewers or attendances.

by manos de piedra Mon 10 Sep 2012, 9:36 pm

Fair enough, but I doubt the new crop of heavyweights coming through are going to measure up with Ali and the 70s bunch. I fear you may be waiting some time for the division to hit those heights again.

by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 10 Sep 2012, 9:41 pm

It just takes 1 champ who EVERYONE knows to liven things up a bit.

by **ShahenshahG** Mon 10 Sep 2012, 10:28 pm

I think it'll be weird if one of the chasing pack dominates and becomes a global star who beats everyone before him in the post - klitschko era. No matter how good they'll be i'll always remember that this lot was afraid to peer out from under the rock they were hiding lest Wlad or Vitali should catch their eye.

by eddyfightfan Mon 10 Sep 2012, 10:55 pm

most of the prospects are 4-5 fights away from proving anything near greatness, obviously a few will be exposed but the top 5 would be very interesting in a years time if the klits went. and whoever became the top guy would make a huge fight for wlad to come back.

by manos de piedra Mon 10 Sep 2012, 11:02 pm

I still think its would take at least two years or maybe more for a suitable candidate to emerge even in the abscence of the Klitschkos. I can see the division just falling into alphabet soup with a bunch of average champions each trying to hold onto their own portion of the title. In a years time the top heavyweights without the Klitschkos would still most likely be Povetkin, Haye, Adamek etc that either wouldnt want to fight the Klitschkos or have already lost to them.

by Super D Boon Mon 10 Sep 2012, 11:06 pm

Have to agree with the premis of the article. I should hate it if Haye were to beat Vitali. An excellent if under fulfilled heavyweight champion gets too old and slow and loses to gobby trash who lacks class and stinks of new money!

Wlad is in a different position. His best bet to become a real legend is to play the numbers game. I aint sure how far he is off Louis without checking Boxrec but he could hang around another 4/5 years and do another 12 /15 defences and there won't be anyone that can beat him by the looks of it. Even so wouldn't mind seeing him retire too.

Even though they're not regarded very highly on here I think history will end up being very kind to them if they go now. Okay so heavyweight bros sharing the title aint ideal but it's not likely to happen again but they are something different in that they're european, highly educated and display class and are know for their philanthropy.

by Super D Boon Mon 10 Sep 2012, 11:08 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Sooner or later they'll lose to some chump and their legacy will be harmed!!

Had Holmes gone before 175er Spinks.....he'd no doubt be higher!!

Why risk it...they don't need the money!!

Yeah, despite how good Spinks was as a Light Heavy those losses do the Easton Assassin no good at all!

by quentins_monkey Tue 11 Sep 2012, 9:02 am

I can see the argument for Vitali to retire but really can't see any reason why Wlad should consider it - he's at the top of his game, earning lots of money for fighting people that he shouldn't really have any trouble defeating so why retire? I'm sure if I was in the position of being able to pretty much print money then I would keep on going as long as I could... Smile

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