Osprey George Stowers cited over tackle in win against Scarlets

First topic message reminder :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/19697872 wrote:Ospreys back-row forward George Stowers has been cited for an alleged high tackle during their Pro12 win over the Scarlets on Friday.

Samoan Stowers' challenge came as Scarlets wing Andy Fenby was in the process of crossing the Ospreys' line.

Fenby dropped the ball and video referee Derek Bevan ruled no try could be awarded.

The teams were level 6-6 at that point and the visitors went on to win.

A date, time and venue for the hearing at which Stowers will answer the charge has yet to be set.

I am uncertain whether the incident was deliberate or not, but I htink his track record may go against him here.

Fifteen thousand? I thought you at least knew the capacity of our stadium!

Ohh and Cyril - don't forget "every Scarlets players always amazing" to Scarlets fans as well (apparently)

Preist - the best one is the 'every scarlets fan believes that every scarlets player is the best player in their position' nonesence that Morg (or was it maes, sorry i am gettingthe wrong one, but they both begin with m) comes out with when anyone dares say Knoyle is even on a par with Gareth Davies

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Preist - the best one is the 'every scarlets fan believes that every scarlets player is the best player in their position' nonesence that Morg (or was it maes, sorry i am gettingthe wrong one, but they both begin with m) comes out with when anyone dares say Knoyle is even on a par with Gareth Davies

I know that's the one I was thinking about - it's like any Scarlets (or anyone else who becomes a Scarlet fan just by thinking the thought) is immediately wrong and biased by thinking Knoyle is better than Davies [replace with Aled Davies or any other scrum half in the league]. It's classic

I agree that it was not a Red card offence but I believe that the disciplinary commitee could have issued a retrospective yellow. Which in most supporters minds would have fitted the crime.

However if they had issued a retrospective yellow, it would have opened up a can of worms as to why one of the WRU top officials, with the benefit of endless slow motion replays chose to ignore the offence. Another case of the WRU closing ranks to sweep an issue under the carpet!

The Ospreys were the better side and deserved to win, but this incident has been a total embaressment for the so called professional game in Wales. The Welsh make fun of the "Old Farts in Blazers" but can you imajine the RFU making such a pigs ear as the WRU have in this instance?

Seagultaf wrote:I agree that it was not a Red card offence but I believe that the disciplinary commitee could have issued a retrospective yellow. Which in most supporters minds would have fitted the crime.

However if they had issued a retrospective yellow, it would have opened up a can of worms as to why one of the WRU top officials, with the benefit of endless slow motion replays chose to ignore the offence. Another case of the WRU closing ranks to sweep an issue under the carpet!

The Ospreys were the better side and deserved to win, but this incident has been a total embaressment for the so called professional game in Wales. The Welsh make fun of the "Old Farts in Blazers" but can you imajine the RFU making such a pigs ear as the WRU have in this instance?

This is a good point. Same with IRFU from time to time.

Seagultaf wrote:I agree that it was not a Red card offence but I believe that the disciplinary commitee could have issued a retrospective yellow. Which in most supporters minds would have fitted the crime.

However if they had issued a retrospective yellow, it would have opened up a can of worms as to why one of the WRU top officials, with the benefit of endless slow motion replays chose to ignore the offence. Another case of the WRU closing ranks to sweep an issue under the carpet!

The Ospreys were the better side and deserved to win, but this incident has been a total embaressment for the so called professional game in Wales. The Welsh make fun of the "Old Farts in Blazers" but can you imajine the RFU making such a pigs ear as the WRU have in this instance?

What on earth is that?

Does it exist?

What would be the point?

It's so that if the player picks up another x amount of yellows they get suspended (I think), it also effects the teams fair play rating and could lead to them getting cards, suspensions, conduct warnings easier in the future - plus it sends out a message to all teams/managers/players that this action isn't acceptable and will be carded in the future.

Something like that

Smirnoffpriest wrote:It's so that if the player picks up another x amount of yellows they get suspended (I think), it also effects the teams fair play rating and could lead to them getting cards, suspensions, conduct warnings easier in the future - plus it sends out a message to all teams/managers/players that this action isn't acceptable and will be carded in the future.

Something like that

Exactly makes a lot of sense.

I would hope that no ref would ever "card" any player on his previous record.

I also doubt the number of Yellow Cards is considered much when deciding the length of bans.

Granted, the fair play points would be worse but does anyone actually pay much heed to those?

I think that is like asking the disciplinary panel to re ref the game. Not sure it is a good thing.

Would they have to retrospectively cancel George North's 'try' too - on account of the massive knock-on clearly shown on the replays?

Most confusing.

Seagultaf wrote:I agree that it was not a Red card offence but I believe that the disciplinary commitee could have issued a retrospective yellow. Which in most supporters minds would have fitted the crime.

However if they had issued a retrospective yellow, it would have opened up a can of worms as to why one of the WRU top officials, with the benefit of endless slow motion replays chose to ignore the offence. Another case of the WRU closing ranks to sweep an issue under the carpet!

The Ospreys were the better side and deserved to win, but this incident has been a total embaressment for the so called professional game in Wales. The Welsh make fun of the "Old Farts in Blazers" but can you imajine the RFU making such a pigs ear as the WRU have in this instance?

This is a load of crap, a former Welsh International referee either missed or deemed it not worthy of a yellow card, the match Citing officer a Welshman deemed it necessary to cite the player, then the Citing committee of 3 Irishmen deemed it not worthy of any further action, in what way has the WRU been negligent in this affair.

I can't understand these references to a knock on in Norths try - the ball hit his chest - hence no knock on...

MrsP wrote:I would hope that no ref would ever "card" any player on his previous record.

I also doubt the number of Yellow Cards is considered much when deciding the length of bans.

Granted, the fair play points would be worse but does anyone actually pay much heed to those?

I think that is like asking the disciplinary panel to re ref the game. Not sure it is a good thing.

Definately in citings a players past behaviour is taken into account when deciding the severity of the punishment - also I feel sometimes refs will keep and eye on players for reputations for certain types of foul play and may help them decide if an offence was accidental or deliberate (such as collapsing a scrum, late tackle or lying on the ball).

Smirnoff,

Disciplinary panels do indeed look at past records but I would be very surprised if a retrospective yellow card would make George Stowers' past look any worse than it already does!

Smirnoffpriest wrote:I can't understand these references to a knock on in Norths try - the ball hit his chest - hence no knock on...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01mymm7/Scrum_V_Live_2012_2013_Scarlets_v_Ospreys/

Freeze frame it at 1:59:08 on the slo-mo;

Ball hits North's hand and forearm then falls forward. Hand and forearm then falls forward ...

following the kick that Priestland made from the grassy knoll.

I still can't believe those commentators don't know the Laws!

MrsP wrote:I would hope that no ref would ever "card" any player on his previous record.

I also doubt the number of Yellow Cards is considered much when deciding the length of bans.

Granted, the fair play points would be worse but does anyone actually pay much heed to those?

I think that is like asking the disciplinary panel to re ref the game. Not sure it is a good thing.

Personally i think it happens quite often. If you think about props for example, they get a rep for being good Adam Jones, Gethin Jenkins) and when they do collapse it tends to the oppostion prop that takes the blame, and also take some props who are meant to be poor, and are known to be poor, even whent hey are stuffing the opposition they take the blame for most scrum failures, and cards result from constant collapses.

Also it does work with players who are known for being firey, they tend to get carded for lesser offences because they have a tendancy to pick up cards. And the reverse is players like Stephen Jones can get away with a bit more than most as they are known to be such good and clean players, if they have a tackle that is a bit high, they tend to get away with it where as a player with a history of it, like Morgan Stoddart, would get sent for ten mins.

We are all human and make decisions based on what we have decided has happened, and the history of the player, the team and the ref all count towards whethere he delves in his pocket or not.

I get what you're saying Spidey but I would hope that most refs are able to decide guilt or innocence on the pitch without taking the players rep into account. They are only human though.

I also doubt many refs will have changed their impression of Stowers on the basis of no card in that game.

I just think the whole "retrospective card" thing could get very very messy with no real benefit. The disciplinary panels would be meeting non stop to go over every game on video and to what end? Let the ref make the decisions with the help of his assistants and the TMO and deal with any "red card" offences after if need be.

MrsP wrote:I get what you're saying Spidey but I would hope that most refs are able to decide guilt or innocence on the pitch without taking the players rep into account. They are only human though.

I also doubt many refs will have changed their impression of Stowers on the basis of no card in that game.

I just think the whole "retrospective card" thing could get very very messy with no real benefit. The disciplinary panels would be meeting non stop to go over every game on video and to what end? Let the ref make the decisions with the help of his assistants and the TMO and deal with any "red card" offences after if need be.

N'ah i think most refs know he is an islander and prone to thinking that decapitation is a good tackling method.

The post game card seems like a bit of a farce, and IMO is a waste. I appreciate it will mess up someones track record if they get cited again, but it does seem unnecessary.

MrsP wrote:I get what you're saying Spidey but I would hope that most refs are able to decide guilt or innocence on the pitch without taking the players rep into account. They are only human though.

I also doubt many refs will have changed their impression of Stowers on the basis of no card in that game.

I just think the whole "retrospective card" thing could get very very messy with no real benefit. The disciplinary panels would be meeting non stop to go over every game on video and to what end? Let the ref make the decisions with the help of his assistants and the TMO and deal with any "red card" offences after if need be.

I should have added...

That's what this place is for!

MrsP wrote:

MrsP wrote:I get what you're saying Spidey but I would hope that most refs are able to decide guilt or innocence on the pitch without taking the players rep into account. They are only human though.

I also doubt many refs will have changed their impression of Stowers on the basis of no card in that game.

I just think the whole "retrospective card" thing could get very very messy with no real benefit. The disciplinary panels would be meeting non stop to go over every game on video and to what end? Let the ref make the decisions with the help of his assistants and the TMO and deal with any "red card" offences after if need be.

I should have added...

That's what this place is for!