Ten reasons Armstrong will always be a hero!!

by TRUSSMAN66 Fri 02 Nov 2012, 8:26 pm

First topic message reminder :

1. Anybody who wins the Tour de France once let alone seven times deserves huge respect..
2. He's American.
3. He had less than a 30% chance to live and went through hell and lived to tell the tale..
4. Number 1 again x100 after cancer!!
5. His team basically sacked him at his lowest ebb and in his darkest hour...
6. He dabbled in an age that was saturated by the stuff so it was hardly "cheating"
7. After the French stance before and during the Iraq war I'm glad someone screwed them over!!
8. He's saved lot's of lives and raised huge amounts for good causes...
9. He's the ultimate warrior!!!
10. It's a great film with Bo Derek in!! Cool

by TRUSSMAN66 Sat 05 Jan 2013, 12:57 pm

Still bothers me how this guy seems to be getting a lot of stick and is so sought after when other cheats don't have to pay prize money back...

Just seems like overkill...

by djlovesyou Sat 05 Jan 2013, 12:58 pm

Odds that the crazy gang will say that Lance is still innocent, but was forced to admit to doing all these things in order to carry on honestly competing in triathlons and the like.

by TRUSSMAN66 Sat 05 Jan 2013, 12:59 pm

Never failed a drugs test.....

Why should he spend millions defending himself....

Loser pays in UK........not so in USA...

by djlovesyou Sat 05 Jan 2013, 1:31 pm

'Never failed a drugs test..' never fails to amuse me.

You can play a game at guessing whether the person saying it is just clutching at the very last straw, or is genuinely that clueless.

by TRUSSMAN66 Sat 05 Jan 2013, 1:49 pm

"Never fails to amuse me...."

Stating a fact Mate...

you're obviously easily amused..

by djlovesyou Sat 05 Jan 2013, 1:54 pm

It's a fact and it's a funny one.

Marion Jones never failed a drug test. - See, hours of fun for all the family.

How is it relevant anyway? He's about to come out and admit to everything.

by TRUSSMAN66 Sat 05 Jan 2013, 1:59 pm

Marion Jones admitted doping!!!!!...and never had to pay sack loads of prize money back...

Easily rebutted aren't you!!!

by Mad for Chelsea Sat 05 Jan 2013, 2:08 pm

yes well according to the odd person Armstrong actually failed a drug test for EPO at the 2001 Tour of Switzerland...

Anyone read "The secret race" co-written by Tyler Hamilton? Excellent read, among other things explains just how easy it was to beat the testers...

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Sat 05 Jan 2013, 2:09 pm

According to numerous people he did fail one in Switzerland MFC, I heard that too

by TRUSSMAN66 Sat 05 Jan 2013, 2:37 pm

I'm sure you'll reveal the sources..

by djlovesyou Sat 05 Jan 2013, 2:42 pm

He'll tell you himself soon.

by TRUSSMAN66 Sat 05 Jan 2013, 2:47 pm

Hope not..

by JDizzle Sat 05 Jan 2013, 5:24 pm

Mad for Chelsea wrote:yes well according to the odd person Armstrong actually failed a drug test for EPO at the 2001 Tour of Switzerland...

Anyone read "The secret race" co-written by Tyler Hamilton? Excellent read, among other things explains just how easy it was to beat the testers...

Yes, just finished it. A very good read. The story about the tester who rung ahead to check the rider would be at home particularly amused me....

He also failed a test for cortisone at one point, but this was put down to it being medically prescribed.

by TRUSSMAN66 Sat 05 Jan 2013, 6:43 pm

Or you can just accidentally miss three tests in a row like your 400m girl...

easily done..

by djlovesyou Sat 05 Jan 2013, 7:08 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Or you can just accidentally miss three tests in a row like your 400m girl...

easily done..

What's that got to do with anything?

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Sat 05 Jan 2013, 8:59 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I'm sure you'll reveal the sources..

http://d3epuodzu3wuis.cloudfront.net/ReasonedDecision.pdf

Pages 50/51

by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 07 Jan 2013, 9:29 am

Fairplay..

by Mike Selig Mon 07 Jan 2013, 11:09 am

JDizzle wrote:
Mad for Chelsea wrote:yes well according to the odd person Armstrong actually failed a drug test for EPO at the 2001 Tour of Switzerland...

Anyone read "The secret race" co-written by Tyler Hamilton? Excellent read, among other things explains just how easy it was to beat the testers...

Yes, just finished it. A very good read. The story about the tester who rung ahead to check the rider would be at home particularly amused me....

He also failed a test for cortisone at one point, but this was put down to it being medically prescribed.

I'm in the middle of it. Recommended for anyone who uses the ridiculous line that doping is ok because everyone does it.

Cortisone was after the 99 Tour prologue I think, and excused through a back-dated medical prescription. To be fair to Armstrong, this wasn't the only time a back-dated medical prescription had been accepted (way to go UCI, although surely would be different nowadays), but we don't have a first hand account of the other cases telling us it was bogus.

by **superflyweight** Mon 07 Jan 2013, 1:25 pm

Also halfway through the Tyler Hamilton book. Yes, others beside Armstrong were doping but its clear that he was first amongst equals in terms of the lengths he would go to ensure that his doping programme was the best and that he held all the aces. The bit in the book where Hamilton describes Armstrong's reaction to losing to Hamilton on Mont Ventoux in the Dauphine race and the resulting trip to Valencia is most revealing.

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 08 Jan 2013, 1:21 pm

I watch a documentary about this whole saga and the evidence is very damming against him.

Lots of eye witnesses saying they have seen him using and heard him admitting to his doctor about using.. Positive test in 2000 Tour which came to light with new testing. The fact he is not going to contest his stripped titles, probably due to the truth bound to be coming out.

I feel he is a disgrace to the sport and how anyone can hold him in high regard for his cycling exploits is beyond. Unless your some patriotic hick (not you Truss, just some of the people I've seen interviewed in the doc) who are blind to the truth.

by Il Gialloblu Wed 09 Jan 2013, 4:08 am

djlovesyou wrote:He'll tell you himself soon.

He's going to be on Oprah Winfrey's show later this month.

I rather doubt he's going on there just to say the same things he's always said.

by bogbrush Wed 09 Jan 2013, 9:58 am

The main interest will be seeing how some spin this as evidence he didn't do it.

I expect it'll be said he's only one it to get to do triathlons and its confession under duress. Sounds incredible, but I'm sure it'll be said.

by Il Gialloblu Wed 09 Jan 2013, 10:37 am

Really hope it's not going to be 90 minutes of cloying faux regret. Seeing as it's a show like Oprah and not a sports program though I'm guessing he is going to be in full on please forgive me, I'm famous mode. Rolling Eyes

Maybe see some tears. Maybe hugging his kids on stage at the end. You know, all the cheap tricks.

I'm actually hoping that he's going on there to announce an OJ Simpson style If I Did It book. That would be amazing. I'd watch (a repeat of) that.

by bogbrush Mon 14 Jan 2013, 5:52 pm

I hope it's as false as self-serving as everyone fears. It would be consistent with the man and serve to bury him further (as well as shaming the stupid programme for stupid people he's appearing on).

by djlovesyou Mon 14 Jan 2013, 6:04 pm

"You get a Trek, you get a Trek, you get a Trek"

by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 14 Jan 2013, 9:22 pm

If it's Oprah Winfrey it will be deep!!!!!

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Mon 14 Jan 2013, 9:25 pm

by GunsGerms Tue 15 Jan 2013, 2:21 pm

Il Gialloblu wrote:
djlovesyou wrote:He'll tell you himself soon.

He's going to be on Oprah Winfrey's show later this month.

I rather doubt he's going on there just to say the same things he's always said.

he has already done the interview on Monday. It will be aired on thursday:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/15/oprah-lance-armstrong-interview-doping_n_2478581.html

Aparently Oprah said Lance didnt come clean in the manner she expected. Whatever that means.

Liestrong Lance, liestrong.

by Dave. Tue 15 Jan 2013, 8:34 pm

I expect a weepie. The needles were probably forced into him.

(Aye, I know he prob won't say this. But it's an Oprah interview.....)

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 15 Jan 2013, 9:10 pm

There will be a lot of references to the bad days no doubt.....recounting his struggles.....

If Lance wasn't American I think he'd get more sympathy..

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Tue 15 Jan 2013, 9:14 pm

For me with Lance it's not so much that he lied about the doping, its how he victimised the people who accused him of it back in the day.

That really makes my blood boil

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Wed 16 Jan 2013, 7:56 am

I know, like it was a big conspiracy to tarnish his name. They number of dreams he has shattered by taking those Tour titles away from clean athletes. Names he dragged throw the mud and called them liars after they dared to give evidence against him. Selfish despicable human being, done good work for charity but has wrecked the lives of others in so many different ways.

And the fact is if he'd have only won one or two Tours aswell he'd probably gotten away with it. But getting greedy Major Charles Ingram style and winning 7 Tours raised alot a suspicions’ and rightly so.

And in answer to the ten points above

1. Anybody who wins the Tour de France once let alone seven times deserves huge respect.. (they do through if they are clean! Arise Sir Bradley)
2. He's American. (Resorting to this at point 2 is a worry)
3. He had less than a 30% chance to live and went through hell and lived to tell the tale..(Like so many other Cancer sufferers??)
4. Number 1 again x100 after cancer!! (Maybe cos of all the EPO he was taking?)
5. His team basically sacked him at his lowest ebb and in his darkest hour...(I dont think he was going to be in good use whislt battling cancer)
6. He dabbled in an age that was saturated by the stuff so it was hardly "cheating"(I done it cos everyone else did is a pathetic excuse, am sure most were clean)
7. After the French stance before and during the Iraq war I'm glad someone screwed them over!! (Oh dear)
8. He's saved lot's of lives and raised huge amounts for good causes...(The only good thing that has come of this and even that is tarnished now)
9. He's the ultimate warrior!!! ( Ten reasons Armstrong will always be a hero!! - Page 2 57983

Ten reasons Armstrong will always be a hero!! - Page 2 57983

is this you clutching)
10. It's a great film with Bo Derek in!! Cool

(

Ten reasons Armstrong will always be a hero!! - Page 2 56390

)

by GunsGerms Wed 16 Jan 2013, 8:43 am

How do you know Wiggins is clean? Took years to find Lance guilty. You think cycling has become clean over night? Naive.

by GunsGerms Wed 16 Jan 2013, 8:44 am

Didnt one of team skys cyclists admit doping?

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Wed 16 Jan 2013, 9:31 am

GunsGerms wrote:How do you know Wiggins is clean? Took years to find Lance guilty. You think cycling has become clean over night? Naive.

Where did I type that? And this is my point! Lance has not only tarnished his own name but also entire sport. So far I have not seen any accusations towards Wiggins regarding drug use, no eye witnesses who have see him using or hear him admitting performance enhancing drug and so far not failed a drug test!

So just to tarnish his name for the sake of how ‘do you know he's clean’ is a joke! I for one has got faith in the current drug testing and its now more advance then 10 years ago hence how a originally clean test for Lance has now revealed he was using EPO. I will not let the actions of one man question other athletes’ achievements.

by jbeadlesbigrighthand Wed 16 Jan 2013, 9:58 am

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Or you can just accidentally miss three tests in a row like your 400m girl...

easily done..

Are you referring to Christine Ohuruogu? The 400m runner who missed three out-of-competition tests in two years, then received a year ban and a lifetime Olympic ban (subsequently overturned on appeal). I'm not sure why her case is relevant to Armstrong's? In fact, it only highlights the extent to which people are willing to forgive his misdemeanours. Even despite the fact that there was really no suggestion that Ohuruogu had taken drugs, many people supported her ban, and were unhappy when her Olympic ban was overturned.

In truth, there are a great number of reasons (excuses) that can be offered as to why Armstrong's achievements can still be viewed in a positive light, many of which you point out. But none of them change the fact that he's a cheat. That fact ultimately brings his career achievements into question.

by GunsGerms Wed 16 Jan 2013, 1:44 pm

Soldier_Of_Fortune wrote:
GunsGerms wrote:How do you know Wiggins is clean? Took years to find Lance guilty. You think cycling has become clean over night? Naive.

Where did I type that? And this is my point! Lance has not only tarnished his own name but also entire sport. So far I have not seen any accusations towards Wiggins regarding drug use, no eye witnesses who have see him using or hear him admitting performance enhancing drug and so far not failed a drug test!

So just to tarnish his name for the sake of how ‘do you know he's clean’ is a joke! I for one has got faith in the current drug testing and its now more advance then 10 years ago hence how a originally clean test for Lance has now revealed he was using EPO. I will not let the actions of one man question other athletes’ achievements.

I dont have faith in the current drug testing system. A lot will be revealed hopefully after Lance's interview as no doubt he will have to rat out a lot of names. So time will tell how deep this issue runs. However, while my countryman Pat McQuaid is still in office at UCI and until we know the full story I would have doubts as to how clean the sport really is even now.

by GunsGerms Wed 16 Jan 2013, 1:58 pm

I certainly wouldnt start throwing accusations at Wiggins however, I wouldnt give him a knighthood just yet. Although I think its too late for that?

In all fairness Wiggins' team team sky has recently lost a number of members due to their zero tollerance stance on drugs. One rider Sean Yeates and team manger Steven de Jongh left because they couldnt confirm that they havent been involved in drug taking. At the very least we know that Wiggins has been around drugs cheats. Then again Id imagine everyone in cycling has which is why I am not sure how clean it is yet.

by djlovesyou Wed 16 Jan 2013, 3:38 pm

Sean Yates was a directeur sportif at Team SKY. He left, I'm presuming, because of his time spent at US Postal/Discovery.

by TRUSSMAN66 Wed 16 Jan 2013, 5:25 pm

Beadle...I'll tell you why it's relevant because no one highlights her forgetfulness...

Armstrong took all his tests....

by djlovesyou Wed 16 Jan 2013, 5:33 pm

He took all of his tests, sometimes making the testers wait while Bruyneel stood at the door and he 'took a shower'. He also failed at least one.

I know we've been here before Truss, but you're clearly not really in the know when it comes to anything besides boxing. CO is probably the most underappreciated Olympic athletics champion Britain has ever produced, and it's clearly because of the doping cloud.

The fact that she's served this ban is very often mentioned.

by TRUSSMAN66 Wed 16 Jan 2013, 5:57 pm

Don't patronise me...

I've taken peds and the effects carry on for years after...

Easy to miss three tests and take a year out..

by djlovesyou Wed 16 Jan 2013, 6:05 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Don't patronise me...

I've taken peds and the effects carry on for years after...

Easy to miss three tests and take a year out..

Again, completely irrelevant. Your point was that CO has a chequered past when it comes to drug tests and she gets away with it.

This is untrue. The BBC will do their best to ignore it, but she's lost a great deal in terms of popularity and sponsorship because of this.

It's perhaps harsh because she never actually failed a drug test, although she was either on something and avoiding or she didn't take the whereabouts system seriously enough and payed the price. It's something we'll perhaps never know.

(You do realise that she's weren't scheduled tests, yep, they were random tests, if you miss a scheduled test it's an automatic 2 year ban)

by TRUSSMAN66 Wed 16 Jan 2013, 6:24 pm

They weren't ignoring it after she won gold in Beijing and silver in London.....

Harsh my butt...........It's her livelihood...she has a phone and at least one Coach to remind her...

Amazing how you can fail to show three times......

Armstrong managed to show up..

by djlovesyou Wed 16 Jan 2013, 6:58 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Amazing how you can fail to show three times......

Armstrong managed to show up..

Oh oops. It's hard to have a conversation about missed tests, etc, when they don't understand the system.

by Leff Fri 18 Jan 2013, 1:24 am

DEEP THROAT first episode starts in half hour.

by **Biltong** Fri 18 Jan 2013, 4:38 am

I don't follow cycling, but from what I have read his story is typical of someone who will do anyhting for fame and fortune, doesn't matter who he step on to reach his goals.

Ruthless, egotistycal and dishonesty ruled his life.

Kinda negates anything else he did.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Fri 18 Jan 2013, 9:14 am

Have read the transcript and whilst it's good to see he admitted it finally, I don't think enough has come out about it for the sport of cycling to move on.

Cycling needs more details of how it was run and names. I hope there is a follow case by the UCI in which Lance cooperates to help cycling finally get all the details and answers.

by TRUSSMAN66 Fri 18 Jan 2013, 9:30 am

Surely to be good at anything..you have to be egotistical and ruthless...

Dishonest...............well .none of us are perfect!!

However other cyclists won titles at the same time in the epo era and other former olympians have been found to be dopers and still kept their medal/medals...

It's a bear bait..

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Fri 18 Jan 2013, 9:34 am

It's not the doping that's the problem Truss, everybody knows how bad it was back then and quite frankly it was the norm.

It is bullying of anybody who even dared to say he was doping, the suing and making other people's lives a living hell over something he knew deep down they were right about about.

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