India v England, Second Test, Wankhede Stadium Mumbai

First topic message reminder :

So the 2nd test of the 4 match series between India and England is getting underway at Mumbai's Wankhede stadium from tomorrow. The hosts are leading the series after their win in the first test at Ahmedabad.
The track is expected to have assistance for spinners, but the possible bounce from the track and proximity to the sea might offer something for the seamers as well. The pitch was previously used in a Ranji match where Sachin Tendulkar and Ajinkya Rahane had scored hundreds.
The weather is expected to stay good.
Both sides have injury concerns going into the match. Fast bowler Umesh Yadav is unlikely to be risked as he's not fully recovered from the back problems that necessitated calling up Ashok Dinda as cover for the 2nd match in a row. However Dinda, who had covered for Ishant Sharma is unlikely to make it to the playing side, Ishant should be the prefered option. This will be Virender Sehwag's hundredth test. India probable side.
Virender Sehwag
Gautam Gambhir
Cheteshwar Pujara
Sachin Tendulkar
Virat Kohli
Yuvraj Singh
Mahendra Singh Dhoni
Ravichandran Ashwin
Zaheer Khan
Ishant Sharma
Pragyan Ojha.
As for England Ian Bell is unavailable for selection as he's on paternity leave. Stuart Broad has some fitness concerns. Tim Bresnan had a shocker of a match last time round, continuing a prolonged form slump. Steven Finn continues to be unfit. Cricinfo seems to think that Eoin Morgan, and Jonny Bairstow is likely to make it to the side in place of Bell.
England probable
Alastair Cook
Nick Compton
Jonathan Trott
Kevin Pietersen
Eoin Morgan/Jonny Bairstow
Samit Patel
Matt Prior
Stuart Broad?
Graeme Swann
James Anderson
Monty Panesar.
In 2006 England won at Mumbai on the back of an all-round performance from captain Andrew Flintoff and good bowling performances from James Anderson and Shaun Udal. The last test at the venue produced a very exciting match that finished as a draw with the scores leveled.

Don't think they would have gone for the 3 spinner option had Umesh been fit.

msp83 wrote:

Gerry SA wrote:Question to MSP, by selecting three spinners are India putting to much workload on the injury prone, brittle Zaheer Khan?

Gerry, I didn't like the balance or lack of it in this Indian bowling lineup. But if the pitch continue to offer the kind of help for the spinners, Zak may not have to do a lot of toil.

I found it pretty strange, didn't they call up Dinda?

If they where going to play 3 spinners then what was the point in making Dinda travel to Mumbai?

msp83 wrote:Don't think they would have gone for the 3 spinner option had Umesh been fit.

Could india not play 5 bowlers?

Ashwin looks like a decent batsman, score 60 odd in Australia last year. Average isn't too bad either.

Do India need to play 5 bowlers? They have plenty of good part time support, unlike England.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Do India need to play 5 bowlers? They have plenty of good part time support, unlike England.

Wouldn't say they've got plenty of good part timers.

Yuvraj is decent. Sehwag doesn't bowl anymore.

ashwin a very lucky boy there, that was plumb.

yet again India getting away with lack of DRS...

Mad for Chelsea wrote:ashwin a very lucky boy there, that was plumb.

yet again India getting away with lack of DRS...

England got plenty go their way in T1. It balances itself out.

is that a moment of good fortune at long last for England?

nope, Pujara escapes, again...

Oh, That would have been an absolutely unfortunate way for Pujara to go. The ball smashed into the short leg fieldr and then was taken at mid-wicket, but it just bounced, thankfully for him and India.

hmph, and Pujara escapes a couple of balls later, again, when a bat-pad lobs straight up in front of him instead of to one of the close catchers. No luck at all for England today, but they need to keep working...

hopefully we are saving our luck for when we bat. Looks like we will need it.

Gerry SA wrote:

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Do India need to play 5 bowlers? They have plenty of good part time support, unlike England.

Wouldn't say they've got plenty of good part timers.

Yuvraj is decent. Sehwag doesn't bowl anymore.

Tendulkar still bowls and has a better test avergae than any of the English support bowlers (including fatel)
Sehawag might not bowl anymore but he did in the first test so Im not sure when his retirement came into force
Kholi can turn his arm at a push

PSW, Tendulkar and Sehwag do not bowl as much as they used to do in the past. But Yuvraj's bowling has improved a lot over the last year or so, and although he wasn't needed to do a lot of work in the last match, he can be trusted to deliver 10-12 overs a day and even pick up the odd wicket or 2. He has become a quality ODI all-rounder.

Patel hasn't bowled too badly in his2 overs. Cook shouldn't over bowl him give him may another couple more overs and then bring his regular spinner back on.

Aleem Dar having an appalling series. Ashwin was absolutely plumbers earlier and the useless little toad gave it not out.

The ICC need to grow a pair and enforce use of the DRS across all Tests.

But again like England in the PostFredye days, India don't prefer to go in with 5 bowlers. The number 6 position has to be fixed and Pujara and Kohli are only finding their feet in test cricket. If Yuvraj doesn't take his chance( I hope he really doese), then I think India should consider someone like Irfan Pathan or Ravindra Jadeja also for that number 6 positon, if they continue to show all-round consistency in domestic cricket.

Aleem Dar used to be a brave umpire always willing to give LBW to spinners even on the front foot, but in this series he has not been at his best.

I think the absence of DRS is hurting the umpires confidence, they're used to having it to back up their decisions, and without it (or hawkeye) they seem less willing to give LBWs?

basically a case of the ICC ignoring the best course of action for the interest of a chosen few. nothing new there then...

msp83 wrote:PSW, Tendulkar and Sehwag do not bowl as much as they used to do in the past. But Yuvraj's bowling has improved a lot over the last year or so, and although he wasn't needed to do a lot of work in the last match, he can be trusted to deliver 10-12 overs a day and even pick up the odd wicket or 2. He has become a quality ODI all-rounder.

Ture but they are still options, and theres no evidence that they require a proper 5th bowler at all. As a unit, with Yuraj, theres more than enough there. The only argument would be tha they lack seamers, but thats a problem full stop...if you dont have seamers worth picking...Like SA with spinners, it would be ridiculous for them to rock up with three in the side when they cant even find one worth a spot.

Checking Sehwgs bowling...he got through a lot of overs in Aus this winte, and genrraly in the last couple of years no less than he does at other times in his career. Its only 2008 that he was almost a front line bowler.
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/35263.html?class=1;template=results;type=bowling;view=innings

Precisely, MFC.

Monty to Ashwin was taking out middle two thirds of the way up...you cannot get any more plumb than that. It is just incompetence on behalf of Dar to give it not out, and if DRS is having this effect then it is a sad state of affairs for the game. The ICC need to just smack the BCCI back in to line and enforce its use or we will continue to be given false cricket matches pretty much...players batting, breaking records etc that perhaps shouldn't even be there.

England need a breakthrough quick. This is a damaging partnership.

On the subject of the umpires, I wonder if psychologically they are more cautious due to the absence of drs. It can't be easy for them having to switch from using to not using it depending on where they umpire. One might say it shouldn't make a difference as drs is used after their decision, but I think they will feel less pressure when they know that drs can rectify a mistake they make. In fact it might be interesting to study the accuracy levels of umpires when drs is being used and when it is not. I would expect to find that the umpires are more accurate when drs is being used.

England have taken the 2nd new ball and its James Anderson back into the attack.

Hundred for Cheteshwar Pujara, and brought up in fine style too!!!.

Well played, I guess. Great concentration and technique. Should have been out, though, and yet again England rue their mistakes.

Panesar from the other end with the hard new ball.

Well done cook choosing monty to share the new ball. But what has happened to broad in the last year?

Ashwin's played some good shots, He should be careful, shouldn't get carried away.

well bowling them out for 250 seems to have gone up in smoke.

Harsha and Sunny are talking up Ashwin's batting here, think they should just shut up!.

Every run Ashwin scores could be important for the team, particularly in these conditions, but it has to be a bonus, he's India's led spinner and his primary job is to get wickets. We know what happened to Irfan and even Harbhajan Singh. Would rather like him to be on the lines of Anil Kumble, who scored important runs when the team needed him to and won matches with the ball regularly.
Well done Ashwin, that's his 50.

This has been a superb partnership. Really dug India out of a potentially big hole.

bring spin back on from both ends

Thanks Aleem Dar, your incompetence has taken a great chance away from us and left India in a position of strength at the end of the first day.

Not bad from England today (except Broad...who is garbage and should never have been picked). Should have taken Pujara at slip earlier, and these are mistakes you cannot afford to make, but if Dar gives Ashwin, who was absolutely plumb early on, then we are well in to the tail and en route to bowling India out for a below par score.

Alas. I'm heading off to sulk.

That's it, stumps on day one. India 266-6. Pujara and Ashwin turned around a day that was getting away from India.
On a spinning, turning, bouncing track which is expected to continue to assist the spinners, this has to be a good day's work.

So this pitch already is turning into yet another typical featherbed subcontinent wicket. No surprise there!

At this rate, Test match cricket will be extinct by 2018.

Damn disgraceful collusion between the Wankhede curator and the BCCI yet again!

Haven't seen any play yet, but impressions are:

- Overall, much better
- Poor looking figures again from Broad
- Are we heading for SL terrirtory (i.e. making early breakthroughs and then 4-man 2 spinner attack failing to wrap up the lower order)? Ashwin can bat but its disappointing that they are now in territory where we have to put a strong batting effort together to get a lead.

Linebreaker wrote:So this pitch already is turning into yet another typical featherbed subcontinent wicket. No surprise there!

At this rate, Test match cricket will be extinct by 2018.

Damn disgraceful collusion between the Wankhede curator and the BCCI yet again!

Didn't really get you there, LB.
In my view it looks a very good wicket. Plenty of life for the bowlers, and good, quality batting is rewareed.

Just reminding you how the complexion of a match can change, msp.
I was being tongue in cheek, of course. In case you hadn't noticed. No need to get all touchy about it

We saw some life extracted from it by Monty and Swann, who both bowled remarkably well especially in that middle session - but then in that last session it was the batsmen (led by Pujara and assisted by Ashwin) who had the clear ascendancy. That's cricket I guess.

England will be disappointed in the end I think.

Only watched the final session, thought they bowled pretty well (even the much maligned Broad could have had Ashwin a couple of times late on) without much luck. Pujara batted very well.

To blame the umpire is cheap though, particularly if you don't take your chances. Sure it was a poor call, but we all make mistakes. Seems like Dar, a fantastic umpire, is going through a bit of a rough patch - it happens to players (and coaches) but is tougher for umpires because they're always in the spotlight.

Having said that claims that umpiring errors even themselves out are pure nonsense. They may do in pure numerical terms, but in terms of impact on the game? Say Ohja has Panesar blatantly caught at short-leg but given not out, but cleans him up next ball. Do we think that error is equivalent to the Ashwin one today?

Anyway, DRS rears its head again, and it really is time for the other major boards to simply say to India "use it or we won't play you, and we won't allow our players to play IPL". That would chance India's stance immediately. I blame these boards as much as the BCCI.

The pitch is turning a lot, but the bounce seems fairly consistent at the moment.

Heard an interesting segment on TMS this morning, where Rahul Dravid was answering questions.

One of them was "Is it the board or the players that are opposed to DRS? What is your view on it?"

Given that he is employed by the BCCI (on the TV coverage), I suspect he was towing the line somewhat but he still said he thinks technology will certainly be a part of the game in years to come, and that its mostly the board that are opposed. He also said that he thought it was wrong that some technology (i.e. Hot Spot) is part of the DRS in some countries but not others.

The problem is that whilst its only the BCCI that oppose DRS per se, it isn't used in every other Test series for financial reasons - I'm pretty certain it isn't in use in Sri Lanka or Bangladesh in the ongoing series. Therefore, to make it uniform really requires the ICC to seek sponsorship for us - and even then there is an issue I think that there are only so many Hot Spot Units worldwide: I don't think there are enough to cover 4 Tests at the same time currently.

Nice to see Broad justify his selection again and show how effective swingless military medium pace can be on Indian pitches and that picking a quick bowler like Meaker would've been such a "knee jerk"...... Oh Wait!

Monty was fantastic thougi Swann bowled well. Jimmy was okay but clearly a shadow of the bowler he was in Sri Lanka 6 months ago.

Overall, a decent day but maybe not if you look at the pitch.

One positive is that at the end the new ball was starting to grip and spin again, meaning that from the off tomorrow morning panesar and swann should be dangerous. We can still hope to polish them off for 300.

broad was brilliant to start with shanky- very unlucky not to pick up wickets and put the pressure on which helped our spinners out big time..

Linebreaker wrote:Just reminding you how the complexion of a match can change, msp.
I was being tongue in cheek, of course. In case you hadn't noticed. No need to get all touchy about it

We saw some life extracted from it by Monty and Swann, who both bowled remarkably well especially in that middle session - but then in that last session it was the batsmen (led by Pujara and assisted by Ashwin) who had the clear ascendancy. That's cricket I guess.

Thought it indeed was a tongue in cheek remark, but just wanted to confirm, as it seemed to come from nowhere!.

I'm going to say England's day. This is a 350 pitch, at least if you're batting first it is. After 2 brilliant sessions for England it was 167/5 and that soon became 169/6. Then Ashwin lended brilliant support to Pujara and it ended 266/6 at stumps.

England need to shoot India out for below 330 and then pile a minimum of 375. Make no mistake, 375 is achievable as the bounce and carry will soon die on this pitch. Ojha is the only real threat, Khan may be with the new ball and if he gets it to reverse swing. England don't want to chase more than 130 so getting a first innings lead of 50 could be crucial. Polish them off early and then make the batting count - the middle order have to stand up and be counted.

Mike Selig wrote:England will be disappointed in the end I think.

I think the same. Certainly not too bad a position for England but still disappointing given how much the upper hand appeared to be held when India were 119-5 and then 169-6. In what looks like being a low scoring match on a turning wicket, the ongoing stand between Pujura and Ahwin is already a concern.

That said and as shown, one good score and one good partnership should get us about level if we can pick up the remaining 4 wickets in the morning. Realistically now, we should be aiming to get India all out for no more than 310 ....

From an Indian point of view, they would need Pujara and Ashwin to carry on as much as possible. Harbhajan Singh, even if hasn't been taking too many wickets of late, can bat, and has to be among the better number 9s going around with the bat. Hopefully few of Zaheer's slogs would connect well and India could get to 350. It is going to be dificult, as all that England would need is an early wicket tomorrow morning, but it can be done. Then the 3 spinners will have to get their act together, stay calm and patient, toss it up and make use of every bit of help available against a batting lineup suspect against spin. Think Dhoni should attack Cook at the start of his innings with Zaheer's pace, he has really mastered the spinning conditions, and if he gets set, it could be tricky to move him.

Duty281 wrote:

msp83 wrote:Pakistan 3-0 who? This year?

Losing 8 tests away in a row is worse.

OMG 8 tests? I knew they lost to Pak badly but had no clue they are running this streak, should compete with India's one before this series started.

Ennd of D1:

--Eng replace one notional bowler with a real one...and they had India gasping for their life....until their other notional bowler released presure periodically and substantially to the extent that the No.8 cracked a 60 worth a 120 putting the match already potentially beyond England's reach.

--Stuart Broad looked every bit as pedestrian as he is ( or has become for a long long time).
By the time they get rid of him finally...this series might also be gone.

--And much as many would hate to hear....just like in UAE...Monty looked a more threatening spinner by a mile on these type of turning and jumping pitches of subcontinet...then Swann.

But wait....under the flower-favorites-preservation policy Monty would be dropped at the drop of a hat for dropping a catch...and replaced with Bresnan....while anderson gets to drop one per ining and not be dropped for such misdemenours.

Well as I said yesterday......I would love a contest...but wouldn't mind England selectorial misfirings making it one sided.