Munster V Edinburgh

First topic message reminder :

No one has created a thread on this (probably because no one cares!) so thought I might as well!

If things aren't bad enough for us Scottish rugby fans, likely to be drowning our sorrows on Saturday night, those that are Edinburgh fans are faced with their team playing games again!

We played Munster 2s at the start of the season and lost to them, so suspect this will be the same again considering we've only won 4 games all season.

Edinburgh

Edinburgh Rugby team v Munster (kick-off 7.45pm)

15 Greig Tonks

14 Dougie Fife
13 Ben Cairns
12 Ben Atiga
11 Tom Brown

10 Piers Francis
9 Richie Rees

1 John Yapp
2 Andy Titterrell
3 Willem Nel
4 Perry Parker
5 Izak van der Westhuizen
6 Sean Cox CAPTAIN
7 Stuart McInally
8 Netani Talei

Substitutes
16 Steven Lawrie
17 Allan Jacobsen
18 Alex Allan
19 Grant Gilchrist
20 Hamish Watson
21 Chris Leck
22 Gregor Hunter
23 Lee Jones

On paper that is a strong pack and a bit of an experimental backline to say the least but you just don'w know what will happen with this team anymore. Gutting that Ross Rennie still isn't fit (When will the SRU ever tell us when he is going to play again??) and we are starting to look short at 7 with Roddy Grant ruled out for the season. Very young tighthead on the bench too.

Munster

01 Marcus Horan
02 Damien Varley
03 BJ Botha
04 Ian Nagle
05 Billy Holland
06 CJ Stander
07 Sean Dougall
08 James Coughlan
09 Duncan Williams
10 Ian Keatley
11 Danny Barnes
12 JJ Hanrahan
13 Ivan Dineen
14 Johne Murphy
15 Denis Hurley

16 Mike Sherry
17 Wian du Preez
18 John Ryan
19 Dave Foley
20 Tommy O'Donnell
21 Paddy Butler
22 Cathal Sheridan
23 Scott Deasy

valjester wrote:JJ really looks a class act, even off limited ball, the sooner he starts for Munster the better for Ireland. I think he
has the most potential out of all the young pretenders behind Sexton.

He is the only one that looks like creating a try. Would love to see him the first team

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

valjester wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:There musn't be a team in world rugby that has made as many unforced mistakes as Edinburgh have this season.

The end of the season couldn't come closer for us!

I presume Bradley is being shown the door at the end of the season? Letting him go was one of the biggest reasons for Connacht's revival over the past two years.

I wouldnt mind if he came to coach the Wolfhounds. His record at A level is impressive to say the least.

I would rather someone else, but he would not be the worst choice in the world.

westisbest wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:It's alright ASBO - Lee Jones is on the bench to come and fix everything that goes wrong...

Was'nt Lee Jones in Scotland's 6 Nations team last year, played well?

Or am I confused(which is normally quite alot).

Just put this game on. Looking to see JJ Hanrahan in action.

You are correct - however he has suffered the worst ever case of 2nd season syndrome ever known! He's been truly woeful this year - much like Edinburgh.

RDW_Scotland wrote:O'Sullivan has been mentioned a few times with the Edinburgh lot on here - has he done much at club level? International management is quite different from day to day club coaching.

I've personally still never forgiven him for his handling of the Hines-O'gara incident!

He was involved with Connacht before his time with Ireland. He has burnt all his bridges with the IRFU, but I think he still has a lot to offer.

The Hines Rog incident was terribly mismanged alright.

valjester wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

valjester wrote:JJ really looks a class act, even off limited ball, the sooner he starts for Munster the better for Ireland. I think he
has the most potential out of all the young pretenders behind Sexton.

Ive been wanting JJ to get games for Munster for some time now. Paddy Jackson was now where near as good as JJ at 20s imo but PJ is ahead of JJ because he is getting more gametime.

Hmm Jackson has a lot of talent, obviously being a bit biased here, he is capable of running a backline, kicking his goals and running a backline. But, JJ on the other hand has that spark of being able to create something from nothing when no other player would even think of trying. I honestly think he has the attributes to be a better player than Sexton, which is quite a high target I know, but hopefully Munster manage him well.

Thats what Im saying. JJ should be well ahead of Jackson but Penny wont play him.

FFS take Keatley off and let JJ take over....except for his kicking at goal he is useless....

Nice try...

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

valjester wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

valjester wrote:JJ really looks a class act, even off limited ball, the sooner he starts for Munster the better for Ireland. I think he
has the most potential out of all the young pretenders behind Sexton.

Ive been wanting JJ to get games for Munster for some time now. Paddy Jackson was now where near as good as JJ at 20s imo but PJ is ahead of JJ because he is getting more gametime.

Hmm Jackson has a lot of talent, obviously being a bit biased here, he is capable of running a backline, kicking his goals and running a backline. But, JJ on the other hand has that spark of being able to create something from nothing when no other player would even think of trying. I honestly think he has the attributes to be a better player than Sexton, which is quite a high target I know, but hopefully Munster manage him well.

Thats what Im saying. JJ should be well ahead of Jackson but Penny wont play him.

I'm not sure if he has a choice in the matter tbh. I think ROG is being forced on him.


JJ's pass makes the try. It really is a thing of beauty. I cannot wait to see him starting for Munster.

Great pass by JJ. Dineen lovely kick inside as well. CJ you beauty

Nothing like watching Edinburgh to give you a bump down to earth after such a good day at Murrayfield!

Can we just forfeit every game for the rest of the season?

RDW_Scotland wrote:Nothing like watching Edinburgh to give you a bump down to earth after such a good day at Murrayfield!

Can we just forfeit every game for the rest of the season?

I thought that was what you were doing?

valjester wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

valjester wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

valjester wrote:JJ really looks a class act, even off limited ball, the sooner he starts for Munster the better for Ireland. I think he
has the most potential out of all the young pretenders behind Sexton.

Ive been wanting JJ to get games for Munster for some time now. Paddy Jackson was now where near as good as JJ at 20s imo but PJ is ahead of JJ because he is getting more gametime.

Hmm Jackson has a lot of talent, obviously being a bit biased here, he is capable of running a backline, kicking his goals and running a backline. But, JJ on the other hand has that spark of being able to create something from nothing when no other player would even think of trying. I honestly think he has the attributes to be a better player than Sexton, which is quite a high target I know, but hopefully Munster manage him well.

Thats what Im saying. JJ should be well ahead of Jackson but Penny wont play him.

I'm not sure if he has a choice in the matter tbh. I think ROG is being forced on him.


JJ's pass makes the try. It really is a thing of beauty. I cannot wait to see him starting for Munster.

How would you even know something like that...how would ROG be forced upon him...maybe because Keatley is rubbish....???

valjester wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:Nothing like watching Edinburgh to give you a bump down to earth after such a good day at Murrayfield!

Can we just forfeit every game for the rest of the season?

I thought that was what you were doing?

DOD wrote:

valjester wrote:


JJ's pass makes the try. It really is a thing of beauty. I cannot wait to see him starting for Munster.

How would you even know something like that...how would ROG be forced upon him...maybe because Keatley is rubbish....???

Because I refuse to believe that Penney can think Rog's form this season has been better than Keatleys.

Sheridan is such a huge improvement on Williams, he was excellent in viewing his options there while the ball was held up and then a quick pass away as soon as the ball is free.

Yep I really think williams is absolute useless. Wouldnt have him on the Waterpark team....

JJ created the try again with his chip through

Also JJ was excellent again in that try. He is brilliant at committing the defenders and then releasing the ball at the last possible second to those outside him. I think he is playing at ten now, Keatley at fullback?

That right there along with not throwing straight into the lineout annoys me so much. He fed the ball into the scrum under the secondrows with the ref looking straight at him ffs.

valjester wrote:

DOD wrote:

valjester wrote:


JJ's pass makes the try. It really is a thing of beauty. I cannot wait to see him starting for Munster.

How would you even know something like that...how would ROG be forced upon him...maybe because Keatley is rubbish....???

Because I refuse to believe that Penney can think Rog's form this season has been better than Keatleys.

Sorry Val Keatley has been very ordinary this season. Wouldnt trust him in front of ROG in the big games...too flakey. Dont think we would be in the QFs except for ROG....even against a third string Racing side Keatley was not very influential and was kept out of the way by his teammates thankfully.

DOD wrote:

valjester wrote:

DOD wrote:

valjester wrote:


JJ's pass makes the try. It really is a thing of beauty. I cannot wait to see him starting for Munster.

How would you even know something like that...how would ROG be forced upon him...maybe because Keatley is rubbish....???

Because I refuse to believe that Penney can think Rog's form this season has been better than Keatleys.

Sorry Val Keatley has been very ordinary this season. Wouldnt trust him in front of ROG in the big games...too flakey. Dont think we would be in the QFs except for ROG....even against a third string Racing side Keatley was not very influential and was kept out of the way by his teammates thankfully.

FFS if Rog hadn't been so awful against Saracens in two matches you would have topped the group. Of course then you would have to face us coming down and beating you in your home for the second year in a row, so maybe you're better off having ROG as the ten to avoid that humiliation.

ah well fair play Munster - you've given us a pumping 4 times this year now!

I thought Edinburgh's performances couldn't get worse - I was wrong.

Edinburgh are truly rank, this has become a massive problem for Scottish rugby now, some serious changes required at the club asap.

I'm in a good mood after the game at Murrayfield so I'll be as nice as possible.

Edinburgh are the pits. Lineout once again a complete shambles (with 3 locks in the pack!), scrum a total mess, no line speed in the 2nd half, missed tackles galore, Piers Francis awful......I could go on but it's pointless. Edinburgh are pointless. This season has been a total calamity.

P45 for Bradley on Monday morning. Let's not wait until the end of the season to get the formality out of the way. Let's fire him now and let Lineen and Mercer sort us out between now and the end of the season. It's a shame we've driven Chalmers away, surely he couldn't have done a worse job than Bradley.

On paper I thought Edinburgh could win this. But I'd forgotten that Munster are a well drilled professional team through and through, and do basic things well. Edinburgh are amateur in all but name.....

Grrr.....

Going to need to watch Stuart Hogg's 14 point intercept again just to calm down!

Only interesting part of watching that game was that the commentator said that Munster's No7 Sean Dougall was born in Perth.

I thought John Ryan was good in the scrums when he came on. Could be a good prospect.

funnyExiledScot wrote:I'm in a good mood after the game at Murrayfield so I'll be as nice as possible.

Edinburgh are the pits. Lineout once again a complete shambles (with 3 locks in the pack!), scrum a total mess, no line speed in the 2nd half, missed tackles galore, Piers Francis awful......I could go on but it's pointless. Edinburgh are pointless. This season has been a total calamity.

P45 for Bradley on Monday morning. Let's not wait until the end of the season to get the formality out of the way. Let's fire him now and let Lineen and Mercer sort us out between now and the end of the season. It's a shame we've driven Chalmers away, surely he couldn't have done a worse job than Bradley.

On paper I thought Edinburgh could win this. But I'd forgotten that Munster are a well drilled professional team through and through, and do basic things well. Edinburgh are amateur in all but name.....

Grrr.....

Going to need to watch Stuart Hogg's 14 point intercept again just to calm down!

Love it, fES!

funnyExiledScot wrote:I'm in a good mood after the game at Murrayfield so I'll be as nice as possible.

Edinburgh are the pits. Lineout once again a complete shambles (with 3 locks in the pack!), scrum a total mess, no line speed in the 2nd half, missed tackles galore, Piers Francis awful......I could go on but it's pointless. Edinburgh are pointless. This season has been a total calamity.

P45 for Bradley on Monday morning. Let's not wait until the end of the season to get the formality out of the way. Let's fire him now and let Lineen and Mercer sort us out between now and the end of the season. It's a shame we've driven Chalmers away, surely he couldn't have done a worse job than Bradley.

On paper I thought Edinburgh could win this. But I'd forgotten that Munster are a well drilled professional team through and through, and do basic things well. Edinburgh are amateur in all but name.....

Grrr.....

Going to need to watch Stuart Hogg's 14 point intercept again just to calm down!

fES old son,

get yer erse on a train through to Scotstoun in the tree lined west end of Glasgow a week on Friday and see us take on Ulster if you want to see professional rugby players at work ! Tune into Alba today at 2 and watch us take on the Zebras.

Dineen had a good game. It was his first for Munster this season which is a shame and a waste of talent. Nagle was good in the lose but didn't do much in the tight. John Ryan was solid in the scrums. He is a good prospect and many people think Munster backed the wrong horse by given Archer all the opportunities. Its early days yet.

As for Keatley vs ROG. The simple fact is Munster play way better with Keatley at 10. He suits the way Penney wants to play. When it comes to tactical kicking ROG is several levels above him but overall Keatley is far more effective this season. Its not even a close at this stage.

JJ looked very solid with the ball he got, wouldn't have gone for one of the grubbers he went for but the lad has stones. As for Keatley and ROG, Keats wasn't great yesterday but to suggest we play ROG ahead of him is just ridiculous.


With ROG we play with 10 players, Keatley the 15. JJ will probably be better than Keatley (I wouldn't mind them playing 10/12 in some fashion though) but if it's a case of Kealey and ROG it's no contest. The central contract and the IRFU play a big part in selecting ROG. The way Penney wants to play it makes no sense to have a guy who doesn't run a backline.


Agree with you on Dineen, Prof. I think he has been here for around 3 seasons and in that time has had the likes of Mafi, Tuitupou,Earls, Downey and Laulala ahead of him. Anytiem he has palyed I have thought he has looked very good, there are not many 13s in Ireland with the pace he has. A superb kick, shows he has a brain, kicked it infield as opposed to down the line.

Lot of Communions in Cork yesterday for the brave and the faithful?

Didn't see much of the game as I was at the Legends game in Donnybrook.

From a selfish pov I'm glad They didn't get the bonus point.

No one turned up to welcome Mick Bradley back to his hometown.

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:Lot of Communions in Cork yesterday for the brave and the faithful?

Didn't see much of the game as I was at the Legends game in Donnybrook.

From a selfish pov I'm glad They didn't get the bonus point.

No one turned up to welcome Mick Bradley back to his hometown.

There are a lot of reasons why thecrowds in Cork are poor. First, by and large rugby isn't incredibly massive in Cork. Second is we tend to get the Poopie games (that's mainly as we have proven we can't get big crowds). Third we get poor crowds, as no one wants to pay 20 quid to see a third string Munster side play against Edinburgh, in the pishing rain on a Saturday night when the game is on the box.

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:I'm in a good mood after the game at Murrayfield so I'll be as nice as possible.

Edinburgh are the pits. Lineout once again a complete shambles (with 3 locks in the pack!), scrum a total mess, no line speed in the 2nd half, missed tackles galore, Piers Francis awful......I could go on but it's pointless. Edinburgh are pointless. This season has been a total calamity.

P45 for Bradley on Monday morning. Let's not wait until the end of the season to get the formality out of the way. Let's fire him now and let Lineen and Mercer sort us out between now and the end of the season. It's a shame we've driven Chalmers away, surely he couldn't have done a worse job than Bradley.

On paper I thought Edinburgh could win this. But I'd forgotten that Munster are a well drilled professional team through and through, and do basic things well. Edinburgh are amateur in all but name.....

Grrr.....

Going to need to watch Stuart Hogg's 14 point intercept again just to calm down!

fES old son,

get yer erse on a train through to Scotstoun in the tree lined west end of Glasgow a week on Friday and see us take on Ulster if you want to see professional rugby players at work ! Tune into Alba today at 2 and watch us take on the Zebras.

Well I'll be at Murrayfield on Friday for the Cardiff game. If we don't get anything from that I could well be at Scotstoun next season!

Edinburgh are just awful. I felt sorry for Roddy Grant as a pundit yesterday - he really wanted to just say that the Edinburgh players were rubbish, but obviously couldn't. Were they all in the pub yesterday afternoon watching the Scotland game or something?? I think Piers Francis might have been drunk.

Who knows you might get to see The Messiah ?

Only if Glasgow give him a game. No sign of that so far.

Well I know where he ain't going - 43 miles East of Glasgow

I said it before the game, Piers Francis will get 80 minutes regardless of how badly he plays and Hunter wont come off the bench. Lo and behold!

Its not funny anymore, he is ruining the careers of Hunter and Leonard.

He, Bradley, is obviously an Irish sleeper for 2 weeks today !!!!!

Not much to say really except can we get #bradleyout trending?

Imperialbigdave wrote:I said it before the game, Piers Francis will get 80 minutes regardless of how badly he plays and Hunter wont come off the bench. Lo and behold!

Its not funny anymore, he is ruining the careers of Hunter and Leonard.

Completely agree. He is mind-bogglingly useless. There were 7 NSQs starting in that pack, with 3 in the backs. 10 from 15. To a man they were useless. How on earth can Scottish rugby progress with this clown in charge. The basics, things that can be coached, were awful and have been awful all season.

Line speed, lineouts, first up tackles - all hopeless. Not just hopeless as in bad, hopeless as in school 3rd XV hopeless. I haven't even discussed our attacking game plan yet. What was it? Recycle until we run out of number then kick the ball away, either on the full or straight to the opposition. Kicks weren't chased, the scrum was beaten - apart from a bit of grit and determination in the first half I'm struggling for positives.

These are the games where we need to be bringing through young Scottish players and giving them a chance. Why were Lawrie and Gilchrist not starting? It's not like Edinburgh have any defensive systems or have been practicing anything in the last couple of weeks, so why not use these guys? 10 out of 15 NSQ really is a disaster for Scottish rugby. If they were any good I'd live with it, but the word journeyman is too kind in some cases.

Scrumhalf is a concern for Munster.

I thought our new look centre pairing did very well.

Agree that Keatley is the better option over O'Gara now.

I keep checking the Edinburgh website every day in the hope that Brladley has the good grace to quit.

Surely if he's not getting his contract renewed (which he obviously isn't) he might as well step aside and let the new lot come in?

What a difference a year makes. This time last year Bradley was a saviour of Scottish rugby.

RDW_Scotland wrote:I keep checking the Edinburgh website every day in the hope that Brladley has the good grace to quit.

Surely if he's not getting his contract renewed (which he obviously isn't) he might as well step aside and let the new lot come in?

Nobody is going to make themselves unemployed. Thats just an unrealistic way to think.

Perhaps he doesn't want to steal the headlines from the Pope.

Best he waits until tomorrow.

Truth is he probably has resigned. It's just that there's no-one left to care or bother even reporting it.

red_stag wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:I keep checking the Edinburgh website every day in the hope that Brladley has the good grace to quit.

Surely if he's not getting his contract renewed (which he obviously isn't) he might as well step aside and let the new lot come in?

Nobody is going to make themselves unemployed. Thats just an unrealistic way to think.

Andy Robinson did...

Funny Exiled Scot,

If he does leave it will be by "mutual agreement".

He gets a payoff by Edinburgh and walks rather than being pushed.

If he was to just step aside he'd be giving up all his income which nobody would ever do.

Will Irish rugby take him back Stag?

RDW_Scotland wrote:

red_stag wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:I keep checking the Edinburgh website every day in the hope that Brladley has the good grace to quit.

Surely if he's not getting his contract renewed (which he obviously isn't) he might as well step aside and let the new lot come in?

Nobody is going to make themselves unemployed. Thats just an unrealistic way to think.

Andy Robinson did...

Thats true but my general rule of thumb is "Don't do what Andy Robinson does"!

red_stag wrote:What a difference a year makes. This time last year Bradley was a saviour of Scottish rugby.

No he wasn't. Certainly not in my eyes. I said at the time that the HC run had papered over the cracks, we were awful in the league last season. When presented with a tricky HC group, the Edinburgh side folded like a cheap suit, whilst maintaining the eye-wateringly bad league form from last season.

He is a poor coach, a poor man manager and a poor selector. He has no vision and no strategy. It's like he picks the team each week with a blindfold and some darts, and decided long ago that defence, tactics and lineout practice were all massively overrated.

I agree, he won't resign. Why would he? There isn't a rugby team likely to touch him with a barge pole - except possibly the SRU, who will probably promote him to the Scotland top job and triple his salary.

We won 5 league games last year and are on 4 this year - I'm not overly confident we're going to find one mroe win at this rate. Even against the Blues on Friday!

RDW_Scotland wrote:Will Irish rugby take him back Stag?

Its hard to say.

I should think not but he has always been liked by IRFU.

Coached Connacht
Coached Ireland U21
Coached Ireland A
Coached Ireland National Team (briefly)

The only thing is where would he coach?

Ulster, Munster and Connacht have all seen new coaching teams come in over last 12 months. Leinster wouldn't take him. Ireland A could do with a coach but it isn't a full time gig. The U21s have got Mike Ruddock as coach.

If he boxed clever he could look at something like Ireland Womens or Ireland 7s - two areas where we are likely to see more recognition and funding over the next few years. It could be a good chance to get involved again.