The bollix journo/coach spin thread : Lions (and Ashes)

[Portnoy's Complaint]

Now that we're on the precipice of the first game of the proper Lions game in Oz, maybe some of the more outrageous articles of the 4th Estate ought to be held for posterity.

The Western Farce selection is a good start:

Foley :

Western Force head coach Michael Foley says fears over “player welfare” forced him to select what is effectively a shadow side to face the British and Irish Lions in Perth.
Western Force coach Michael Foley (back) has must prepare for two games in four days
Hands tied: Western Force coach Michael Foley (back) has must prepare for two games in four days Photo: GETTY IMAGES
Gavin Mairs

Foley, the former Bath head coach, said that the decision to play the game just four days before his side were due to face the New South Wales Waratahs was “putting quantity over quality” and called for scheduling to be made “a lot simpler” the next time the British and Irish Lions tour Australia.

Foley’s frustration is heightened by the fact that he would have been able to field his strongest side to face the Lions last Saturday as Western Force had a bye in the Super Rugby competition

. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/britishandirishlionsrugby/10099284/Lions-2013-Western-Force-coach-blames-Lions-itinerary-for-weak-line-up.html

vs:

Woodward:

The British and Irish Lions will line up for their first warm-up match on Australian soil on Wednesday morning and face a Western Force squad that includes seven players who have never even played Super Rugby before.

It is unacceptable and disgraceful to cobble together a weakened, second-string club team to play against some of the best players in the world on one of the great rugby tours.

Having lived and worked in Australia for five years, there is no bigger supporter of Australian sport but what on earth is going on? Can you imagine Leicester inviting the All Blacks to Welford Road and putting out a second-string side? It simply would not happen. Treating the Lions with such contempt threatens to undermine their status in the global game.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/article-2335948/Sir-Clive-Woodward-says-Lions-treated-contempt-Australians.html#ixzz2VKNZJ0yD

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/article-2335948/Sir-Clive-Woodward-says-Lions-treated-contempt-Australians.html

The bollix, the spin and the bulllshit is part and parcel of modern political life, but need sport really be dragged down to this level?

[Bathman_in_London]

Arguably if they hadnt played in HK, they could have played a full strength Force team as they had a bye last week. But that might have upset HSBC.

Woodwards comment: 'Can you imagine Leicester inviting the All Blacks to Welford Road and putting out a second-string side? It simply would not happen.'

I'm fairly certain the Tiger team which played SA was a second string one.


But I'm hoping for some really good aggressive Aussie press comments soon, it can't be long before Farr-Jones and Campo start putting the boot in...

[Allty]

Didn't the Ospreys B team beat the Wallabies a few years back

[fa0019]

Bathman

It was a second string... but it had perhaps 7 first team players involved and they won the game and PDV sent Steenkamp and Du Plessis home in disgrace after their lackluster performance.

This WF team has 3 first choice players.

Leicester won the game.... do you fancy the WF to win the game??? I think if the margin is less than 50 then the Lions should all be sent home in disgrace ala Steenkamp and Du Plessis.

That SA side was a 2nd team true but they were the world champions, had just won a lions tour, a 3N title. Those bok players were very good.

This lions tour is also a mix of squad and first team players.

[thebluesmancometh]

Look in reality Woodward is trying to sell himself as he always has, he reminds me of the twot with his own youtube chanell that the Ospreys region gave to the world (I won't mention his name) and they are the masters of PR. What Woodward is doing is a UKIP/EDL style of 'saying it how it is to engage the masses' and little more.

You can see why the Force don't want to risk their best players because they have Aus duty coming up? Um they have a tough game on sunday tha they need to win for...?

Well the Force couldve fancied a famous win today, but they didn't so oh well.

For me though the selection will have written the team talk, words of 'respect' 'insult' etc will be thrown around, and the best way to respond to Deans claims that the lions will be 'taken apart limb by limb' will be a scoreline of which embarresses the Force, western, and Australian rugby!

[fa0019]

hear hear bluesman.

I can't wait to hear Foley's interview post match squirm/excuses.

[thebluesmancometh]

hear hear bluesman.

I can't wait to hear Foley's interview post match squirm/excuses.

I think he's already done that with his selection, anything less than a 50 pointer and he'll highlight how well his players did, anything more than that and he'll highlight the fixture list as forcing his hand to play a weakened team and he would have loved to play a stronger team but his hands were tied.

It is a pity because this lions team first up is a bit vulnerable, it'll be disjointed, and awkward like HK, and a settled club team couldve taken more advantage, got a lead and then would have fancied holding on late on.

I also think it's the wrong way to go for Aus, they will have had 3 weeks without competitive rugby, a large number of their players would prophet greatly from gametime, and against the lions it'd take away the shock of test rubgy come game 1. Beale, Cummins, Davies, JOC, Folau, AAC would all benefit from gametime as their fitness/form or unproven at test level would answer certain questions before game 1.

[aucklandlaurie]

With the Force lying last in the Superxvs Australian conference, their game next Sunday is most vital for Foley and the players.

[fa0019]

Take BOD for instance... if he gets involved in too many physical confrontations he will probably will not make the tests given his body is a near train wreck already..... I'm not saying AUS should take him out but at least put in some physical boys up against him... thats what I would do.

Rather they are giving him so easy matches so he's ready to play. Big Mistake.

AucklandLaurie

What is the difference for the Force in coming last or second last?

A win vs the very best in the NH could turn these players into real believers, memories which will stay with them for longer than a conference win vs. the Tahs.... when Leicester beat SA in 09 we saw big performances from 2 hardly known youngsters in Ben Youngs and Manu Tuilagi... I wonder how much that experience put fire into their bellies. A win vs. a 2nd Waratahs team (AUS players withheld) will do very little... it won't even put them 4th in their conference.. they'll still be last.

[Notch]

In the past number of years teams like Munster and Leicester have put out weakened sides in midweek games versus SH tourists due to fixture congestion. We're in danger of being a wee bit hypocritical.

After all, if Western Force finish dead last in Super Rugby its Foleys job on the line.

[thebluesmancometh]

In the past number of years teams like Munster and Leicester have put out weakened sides in midweek games versus SH tourists due to fixture congestion. We're in danger of being a wee bit hypocritical.

After all, if Western Force finish dead last in Super Rugby its Foleys job on the line.

Will he stay in the job by pipping Rebels by a point or 2 though?

[aucklandlaurie]

fa0019
The Aussies see a big difference between coming last and second to last, plus if they win next sunday cant they at least equal the Rebels?
Is it not a case of putting at risk a whole season for the sake of one game?

[fa0019]

Notch...

Munster lost by 2 vs. the ABs.

Leicester beat SA as did Saracens.

They may have been half 1st team half 2nd team but they were never joke squads like this WF team is with 3 first team squad players and the rest journeymen.

Those were against say the AB and SA 2nd teams.... teams that are usually better than a Lions 2nd team (given historical series success rates).

Those results were close.... how close do you think today's match will be? Anything less than a 50 point margin and Gatland will beast those selected players.. i.e. have each player doing 1 lap around the pitch for every point below that margin for example. (slight exaggeration in fine but not points margin )

[Portnoy's Complaint]

Clearly spin is being played out not only by the journos and coaches but by the v2 apparatchiks.

[fa0019]

fa0019
The Aussies see a big difference between coming last and second to last, plus if they win next sunday cant they at least equal the Rebels?
Is it not a case of putting at risk a whole season for the sake of one game?

Perhaps, will take your word for it. I remember reading about Richard Cockerill (Leicester coach) in 09 talking about the benefits this match could give his players in terms of belief... way beyond a standard match. I would tend to agree with him. If you can beat the boks, why can't you go to the very top.

[thebluesmancometh]

fa0019
The Aussies see a big difference between coming last and second to last, plus if they win next sunday cant they at least equal the Rebels?
Is it not a case of putting at risk a whole season for the sake of one game?

Perhaps, will take your word for it. I remember reading about Richard Cockerill (Leicester coach) in 09 talking about the benefits this match could give his players in terms of belief... way beyond a standard match. I would tend to agree with him. If you can beat the boks, why can't you go to the very top.

I think we might be overestimating the Force first team as well though, they have been poor this season, with some very limited players in the team constantly.

[fa0019]

beat the crusaders Bluesman

[aucklandlaurie]

FA
The lions will win tonight by 70 points.

[Biltong]

Bathman

It was a second string... but it had perhaps 7 first team players involved and they won the game and PDV sent Steenkamp and Du Plessis home in disgrace after their lackluster performance.

This WF team has 3 first choice players.

Leicester won the game.... do you fancy the WF to win the game??? I think if the margin is less than 50 then the Lions should all be sent home in disgrace ala Steenkamp and Du Plessis.

That SA side was a 2nd team true but they were the world champions, had just won a lions tour, a 3N title. Those bok players were very good.

This lions tour is also a mix of squad and first team players.

Individually they were all good, but have never played as a combination and the second stringer under PDV saw little to no game time, they were underdone, and played very poorly.

Not taking anything away from Tigers, but that is the reality when your coach only focuses on his starting XV during his tenure.

[thebluesmancometh]

beat the crusaders Bluesman

their performances against the best have been pretty good, thats why I thought they would be a great start to a tour, but some of the perfromances also...

Lets be honest the Saders were hardly at their best too!

A full strong Force team wouldve been a test I think, but having to succombe to the pressure late on, this side I have no idea of some players capabilities, and if they rely on SNK at 10, and a few of the backline players who look smaller and weak options of their non top class counterparts... I don't know.

I see both sides has having an argument, Foleys job is on the line with a last place finish (and can be overtaken from behind) and he'll want to beat a weakened Tah's side come Sunday.

But he is denying certain players of a lifetime experience

[Notch]

I think we could all be in for a surprise; just seen the Lions teamsheet. Experimental

https://twitter.com/msnsport/status/342214808952786945/photo/1

[Portnoy's Complaint]

FA
The lions will win tonight by 70 points.

The test will be to be good enough to win by 70+ but to nil the Farce.

[fa0019]

I remember watching Brad Barritt smash Olivier time and time again in the Sarries match and thinking... how could they continue to cap this fellow and let the other go.... perhaps SARU had a responsibility to their female market... wasn't Maisiekind voted top male sportsstar by Pretoria women or something (perhaps those on tik at least).

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