Lions Supporters! What a Joke

First topic message reminder :

I am frankly disgusted at the attitude of many posting here today. The vitriol espoused regarding the composition of the LIONS team picked for Saturday is disappointing in the extreme.

I have followed Lions tours in person since 1993 regardless of who was picked. In the second test in 93 there were 11English players, didn't bother me and I shouted and celebrated the victory as eagerly as any Englishman on tour. In 97 there were only 2 Welsh players, in 2001 3 in 2005 4-5. IT DOESN'T MATTER.

Wales are the dominant side in NH results speak for themselves. There was no outrage when English players dominated squads and teams, England were at the time the dominant force in the NH. The team is as it should be. For what its worth I would have given BOD his swansong, if the test is ultimately won on desire and sheer will then I doubt even now he has many peers.

So I would ask those who have gone way over the top to calm down and get behind the team. Especially if you are in Aus:hug: 

I've been looking online at some of the Aussie press.  One eye-catching headline is "Lion King's selfless nod to usurper".  In the accompanying article it's clear that the 'Lion King' is O'Driscoll and the 'usurper' is Roberts.

We shouldn't be helping Wallaby sports writers to rubbish our team.  I don't care what the national composition of the side is.  If they win on Saturday it will be correctly reported as a series victory for the British and Irish Lions.  It's all that matters.

The problem with that headline is that BOD hasnt been dropped for Roberts. He has been dropped for Davies. Why do people keep getting this wrong?

GunsGerms wrote:The problem with that headline is that BOD hasnt been dropped for Roberts. He has been dropped for Davies. Why do people keep getting this wrong?

They get it wrong because it evades the truth. Better to compare a 'misfiring' BOD with a player who might give something more (Roberts), than to compare him to.................... well, there's been enough mud slinging at individual players. Gatland is conscious of his partnerships into an important future.

optimist wrote:  It's all that matters.

Wrong. It's not all that matters. To win against Australia united with some wonderful rugby, that is all that matters. Winning at all costs is a 6N thing.

This was a chance for Gatland to use the strengths of all the home nations to beat Australia. He has instead chosen to go with the tried, tested and FAILED Welsh method of playing rugby.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

optimist wrote:  It's all that matters.

Wrong. It's not all that matters. To win against Australia united with some wonderful rugby, that is all that matters. Winning at all costs is a 6N thing.

This was a chance for Gatland to use the strengths of all the home nations to beat Australia. He has instead chosen to go with the tried, tested and FAILED Welsh method of playing rugby.

Just to be clear - it has failed against Australia. Repeatedly. But it has worked well in the 6N. Didn't work for 6 or 7 games prior to the 6N.

The teams it works against it works well, the ones it doesn't it nearly works against. I think that is Gatlands frustration.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

optimist wrote:  It's all that matters.

Wrong. It's not all that matters. To win against Australia united with some wonderful rugby, that is all that matters. Winning at all costs is a 6N thing.

This was a chance for Gatland to use the strengths of all the home nations to beat Australia. He has instead chosen to go with the tried, tested and FAILED Welsh method of playing rugby.

This is how I feel, to me The Lions is a chance to beat these SH teams playing a hard but positve style of rugby which we (NH) don't always do when we face them in RWCs or AIs, this tour win or lose won't be one to remember. Still hope we win btw.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

optimist wrote:  It's all that matters.

Wrong. It's not all that matters. To win against Australia united with some wonderful rugby, that is all that matters. Winning at all costs is a 6N thing.

This was a chance for Gatland to use the strengths of all the home nations to beat Australia. He has instead chosen to go with the tried, tested and FAILED Welsh method of playing rugby.

Here we go -  declaring that the head coach has missed a chance by adopting a FAILED approach, talking about theoretical "wonderful rugby" which is "all that matters".  You're wrong.

As far as the Lions are concerned, all that matters on Saturday is the win.  Do you really suppose that the winning teams of '71, '74' '89 and '97 felt any different?  Even more to the point, do you believe that the Wallabies feel any different?

Winning at all costs is what the Lions have always been about.  Without that mindset a team will lose. A good example was the "99 Call" of the '74 Lions - an illegal but effective answer to attempted intimidation on the pitch - remember JPR running 40 yards to punch a Springbok forward?  Yet the '74 Lions probably played the most "wonderful rugby" of any side to leave these shores.

 Yeah it's a shame we haven't seen the likes of Scott, Barritt, Lamont, Turner-Hall, Darcy, Earls, McFadden, Brown, Ashton, Visser and the rest of the dynamic backs that Britain and Ireland have at their disposal - All that scintillating rugby during the 6 Nations, what a waste of talent eh !!!

optimist wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

optimist wrote:  It's all that matters.

Wrong. It's not all that matters. To win against Australia united with some wonderful rugby, that is all that matters. Winning at all costs is a 6N thing.

This was a chance for Gatland to use the strengths of all the home nations to beat Australia. He has instead chosen to go with the tried, tested and FAILED Welsh method of playing rugby.

Here we go -  declaring that the head coach has missed a chance by adopting a FAILED approach, talking about theoretical "wonderful rugby" which is "all that matters".  You're wrong.

As far as the Lions are concerned, all that matters on Saturday is the win.  Do you really suppose that the winning teams of '71, '74' '89 and '97 felt any different?  Even more to the point, do you believe that the Wallabies feel any different?

Winning at all costs is what the Lions have always been about.  Without that mindset a team will lose. A good example was the "99 Call" of the '74 Lions - an illegal but effective answer to attempted intimidation on the pitch - remember JPR running 40 yards to punch a Springbok forward?  Yet the '74 Lions probably played the most "wonderful rugby" of any side to leave these shores.

Funny - when England played pure power rugby and were successful, the cries from the Welsh contingent of "boring rugby" were commonplace.

 "Funny - when England played pure power rugby and were successful, the cries from the Welsh contingent of "boring rugby" were commonplace."



And if you think about it, those cries had nothing to do with the so called power rugby, it was to do with the fact that some fans can't cope with the opposition winning. I'll take an ugly 1 point penalty ridden win any day of the week. However, winnning 30-3 with a couple of scintilating trys is hardly pwoer rugby is it. Even in the first test we scored 2 great trys.

Don't be deceived by others thinking its about Gatlands style, its about the fact that their players aren't included - Simples

Not 1 Lions fan had a problem with us being outscored by SA in trys but winning the test by kicking - they are all now heros - its the fact that their chosen players are not playing

 

optimist wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

optimist wrote:  It's all that matters.

Wrong. It's not all that matters. To win against Australia united with some wonderful rugby, that is all that matters. Winning at all costs is a 6N thing.

This was a chance for Gatland to use the strengths of all the home nations to beat Australia. He has instead chosen to go with the tried, tested and FAILED Welsh method of playing rugby.

Here we go -  declaring that the head coach has missed a chance by adopting a FAILED approach, talking about theoretical "wonderful rugby" which is "all that matters".  You're wrong.

As far as the Lions are concerned, all that matters on Saturday is the win.  Do you really suppose that the winning teams of '71, '74' '89 and '97 felt any different?  Even more to the point, do you believe that the Wallabies feel any different?

Winning at all costs is what the Lions have always been about.  Without that mindset a team will lose. A good example was the "99 Call" of the '74 Lions - an illegal but effective answer to attempted intimidation on the pitch - remember JPR running 40 yards to punch a Springbok forward?  Yet the '74 Lions probably played the most "wonderful rugby" of any side to leave these shores.

You can't compare the classes of 74, 89 and 97 in particular to this year's shambles.

In those years every single nation had a test starter and they were all there on merit.

JPR, Irvine, WJM, Brown, Cotton, Moore, Young, Davies, Bennet, Guscott, Gayglow, Wood, Calder, Hastings, Back, Sole, Hill, Johnson, Williams.... names that make the heart sing and yearn for a time when the best guys were picked to play the best rugby.

compare that to this year. Some there on merit, others there because Gatland likes them and he is "familiar" with them.

RubyGuby wrote: Yeah it's a shame we haven't seen the likes of  Scott, Barritt, Lamont, Turner-Hall, Darcy, Earls, McFadden, Brown, Ashton, Visser and the rest of the dynamic backs that Britain and Ireland have at their disposal - All that scintillating rugby during the 6 Nations, what a waste of talent eh !!!

Ruby, not sure why we need to see (m)any of those guys, there's plenty of talent (arguably 12 aside) in the backs that are on the tour - it's how they play that matters, surely (in addition to who's picked for the XXIII)?

When Gatland fell off the ladder it wasn't because he lost his footing it was because the rotten rickety ladder used to be his great great Granddads but what the hell he was familiar with it!

RuggerRadge2611 wrote: 

optimist wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

optimist wrote:  It's all that matters.

Wrong. It's not all that matters. To win against Australia united with some wonderful rugby, that is all that matters. Winning at all costs is a 6N thing.

This was a chance for Gatland to use the strengths of all the home nations to beat Australia. He has instead chosen to go with the tried, tested and FAILED Welsh method of playing rugby.

Here we go -  declaring that the head coach has missed a chance by adopting a FAILED approach, talking about theoretical "wonderful rugby" which is "all that matters".  You're wrong.

As far as the Lions are concerned, all that matters on Saturday is the win.  Do you really suppose that the winning teams of '71, '74' '89 and '97 felt any different?  Even more to the point, do you believe that the Wallabies feel any different?

Winning at all costs is what the Lions have always been about.  Without that mindset a team will lose. A good example was the "99 Call" of the '74 Lions - an illegal but effective answer to attempted intimidation on the pitch - remember JPR running 40 yards to punch a Springbok forward?  Yet the '74 Lions probably played the most "wonderful rugby" of any side to leave these shores.

You can't compare the classes of 74, 89 and 97 in particular to this year's shambles.

In those years every single nation had a test starter and they were all there on merit.

JPR, Irvine, WJM, Brown, Cotton, Moore, Young, Davies, Bennet, Guscott, Gayglow, Wood, Calder, Hastings, Back, Sole, Hill, Johnson, Williams.... names that make the heart sing and yearn for a time when the best guys were picked to play the best rugby.

compare that to this year. Some there on merit, others there because Gatland likes them and he is "familiar" with them.

You seem to be changing the subject. I wasn't comparing the playing skills or thrill value of the 2013 Lions with those you mention. Most of the 2013 bunch don't compare in those terms with the greatest players of the past, of whom I've possibly seen more than you e.g. Cliff Morgan.  As a Cardiff RFC supporter since the mid-'50s (now the much-less distinguished Cardiff Blues) I've watched many very fine players, most certainly not all Welsh. The first Lions tour I recall in detail was in 1955.

My point was the shared mindset - win at all costs - which the Lions have carried abroad ever since I've watched them.  It goes with being a touring side playing only away games. My experience of following the game for nearly 60 years is that, the bigger the game, the stronger that mindset gets and needs to get.  The only game bigger than a decisive test in a Lions series is a World Cup Final.  For both sides on Saturday, a 1 point win in a boring match will do.  Every previous Lions side, at least since 1955, would have taken a 1 point win over a glorious defeat.  These lads are no different and they deserve to be supported.

Ruby mentioning 30-3 in a post shocker!

As well as the '71 and '74 Lions played, we wouldn't be talking about them if they hadn't won the Test series.

Can't help but point out, all the successful tours had a starter from each of the 4 nations in their lineups... just sayin'.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Can't help but point out, all the successful tours had a starter from each of the 4 nations in their lineups... just sayin'.

Surely the starters from Tonga, USA etc... will make up for that stat?  

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Can't help but point out, all the successful tours had a starter from each of the 4 nations in their lineups... just sayin'.

That stat is down the Swanny.Good of you to bring it up mind.Couldnt help but point it out....just sayin.

Taffineastbourne wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Can't help but point out, all the successful tours had a starter from each of the 4 nations in their lineups... just sayin'.

That stat is down the Swanny.Good of you to bring it up mind.Couldnt help but point it out....just sayin.

So mature. Radge has apologised several times today regarding selection for the final test. Was this really necessary Taff?

Sigh....

thanks for sticking up for me bsando. Although I was careful NOT to apologise. I did admit I was wrong but I would never apologise for debating rugby.

my opinion was wrong and I'm happy it was proven to be. Classless stuff from Taffineastbourne though.

I have been reading the posts on here prior to the game mainly from certain bitter posters, they should go back and read the rubbish they have written they are not Lions supporters, I suspect they are disappointed the Lions won so they could say not enough Scots etc, wrong.

Great win by the team, roll on the next tour

bsando wrote:

Taffineastbourne wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Can't help but point out, all the successful tours had a starter from each of the 4 nations in their lineups... just sayin'.

That stat is down the Swanny.Good of you to bring it up mind.Couldnt help but point it out....just sayin.

So mature. Radge has apologised several times today regarding selection for the final test. Was this really necessary Taff?

Radge was a pain but has manned up as best he can.Patersonmyhero,Tattiescones etc were more rabid and have headed for the glens.
Bsando,if you look at the trash posted by certain individuals from the time of selection right up to today you may see that the scales are way out of kilter.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Sigh....

thanks for sticking up for me bsando. Although I was careful NOT to apologise. I did admit I was wrong but I would never apologise for debating rugby.

my opinion was wrong and I'm happy it was proven to be. Classless stuff from Taffineastbourne though.

You know all about classlessness.Really liked your tw@tineastbourne stunt.Captured your true spirit rather nicely I feel.

I still love you radge.   Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

Taffineastbourne wrote:

bsando wrote:

Taffineastbourne wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Can't help but point out, all the successful tours had a starter from each of the 4 nations in their lineups... just sayin'.

That stat is down the Swanny.Good of you to bring it up mind.Couldnt help but point it out....just sayin.

So mature. Radge has apologised several times today regarding selection for the final test. Was this really necessary Taff?

Radge was a pain but has manned up as best he can.Patersonmyhero,Tattiescones etc were more rabid and have headed for the glens.
Bsando,if you look at the trash posted by certain individuals from the time of selection right up to today you may see that the scales are way out of kilter.

Rabid? Hardly.

Haven't headed for the glens as you so elegantly put it, just had more important family stuff on this weekend rather than posting on this board.

Fair play to the Lions though - totally unexpected from my point of view but a good win nonetheless.

I also still think Gatland is a cretin.