Ulster 2013/2014

First topic message reminder :

It had to come eventually.

Squad

HOOKER
Rory Best, Rob Herring, Niall Annett
PROP
Tom Court, Callum Black, Paddy McAllister, Declan Fitzpatrick, John Afoa, Bronson Ross, Adam Macklin, Ricky Lutton
LOCK
Johann Muller (c), Dan Tuohy, Neil McComb, Lewis Stevenson
BACKROW
Iain Henderson, Stephen Ferris, Mike McComish, Sean Doyle, Chris Henry, Robbie Diack, Roger Wilson, Nick Williams
SCRUM-HALF
Ruan Pienaar, Michael Heaney, Paul Marshall
OUTHALF
Paddy Jackson, James McKinney
CENTRES
Stuart Olding, Luke Marshall, Paddy Wallace, Darren Cave, Michael Allen
WING
Tommy Bowe, Andrew Trimble, Craig Gilroy, Chris Cochrane
FULL BACK
Jared Payne, Peter Nelson, David McIlwaine

Confirmed Pre-Season Games
Ulster Rugby vs Leinster Rugby, 23rd August
Leicester Tigers vs Ulster Rugby, 31st August

Heineken Cup Pool 5
Ulster Rugby, Leicester Tigers, Montpellier, Treviso

Ulster Rugby vs Leicester Tigers, 11th October
Montpellier vs Ulster Rugby, 19th October
Ulster Rugby vs Treviso, 7th December
Treviso vs Ulster Rugby, 14th December
Ulster Rugby vs Montpellier, 10th-12th January
Leicester Tigers vs Ulster Rugby, 17th-19th January

RaboDirectPro12

First five games starting on the 6th September;

Newport Gwent Dragons vs Ulster Rugby    
Ulster Rugby vs Glasgow Warriors            
Connacht Rugby vs Ulster Rugby
Ulster Rugby vs Benetton Treviso
Ospreys vs Ulster Rugby

Full fixtures at http://www.ulsterrugby.com/rugby/results_1stxv.php

I think the management of our out-halves is spot on.

You wouldn't blame Marshy for possibly considering first choice rugby elsewhere (he has admitted to nearly leaving in the past), but With Pienaar being away in the autumn, sometimes being played at 10, and Marshall nearly always being used off the bench, he gets plenty of gametime. Enough to keep him happy it would seem.

I for one will be very happy to see him commit to playing second fiddle for three more years.

Also if I remember correctly there were a number of people saying he could not be considered for Ireland as he wasn't first choice when in fact he was getting more game time than Murray, Reddan, Boss etc

Standulstermen wrote:Yeah I saw that from a guy on Uafc who usually gets it right as well. I suppose young Paul isn't a bad backup at all. Gives us three years to get one of porter, heaney or shanahan (i think) up to scratch

Shanahan looked very good for the Ireland U20s, even outplaying McGrath in one or two games. Only problem is he is very small but so was Peter Stringer.

Makes me think Heaney and Porter are probably going to head to head for a spot next year

profitius wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:Yeah I saw that from a guy on Uafc who usually gets it right as well. I suppose young Paul isn't a bad backup at all. Gives us three years to get one of porter, heaney or shanahan (i think) up to scratch

Shanahan looked very good for the Ireland U20s, even outplaying McGrath in one or two games. Only problem is he is very small but so was Peter Stringer.

Know exactly who that is now. Jeez he was wild small. Nippy though. Time will tell I suppose

Heaney however is in an unusual situation. He's above the standard for third choice IMO.

Can't see him wanting to settle for a handful of games over the next four years.

Porter on the other hand may be more content to do so because he's a lesser player IMO.

clivemcl wrote:I think the management of our out-halves is spot on.

You wouldn't blame Marshy for possibly considering first choice rugby elsewhere (he has admitted to nearly leaving in the past), but With Pienaar being away in the autumn, sometimes being played at 10,  and Marshall nearly always being used off the bench, he gets plenty of gametime. Enough to keep him happy it would seem.

I for one will be very happy to see him commit to playing second fiddle for three more years.

Delighted Marshall is staying, for the record he's the third best scrum half in the country behind Pienaar and Murray in my opinion. It always amazes me how some fairly average players get rated so highly, whereas a talent like Marshall is so under appreciated. I'd put him in the Jennings, Cullen, Keatley bracket of player - people seem to be fixated what he does wrong, rather than right.

rodders wrote:

clivemcl wrote:I think the management of our out-halves is spot on.

You wouldn't blame Marshy for possibly considering first choice rugby elsewhere (he has admitted to nearly leaving in the past), but With Pienaar being away in the autumn, sometimes being played at 10,  and Marshall nearly always being used off the bench, he gets plenty of gametime. Enough to keep him happy it would seem.

I for one will be very happy to see him commit to playing second fiddle for three more years.

Delighted Marshall is staying, for the record he's the third best scrum half in the country behind Pienaar and Murray in my opinion. It always amazes me how some fairly average players get rated so highly, whereas a talent like Marshall is so under appreciated. I'd put him in the Jennings, Cullen, Trimble, Earls bracket of player - people seem to be fixated what he does wrong, rather than right.

Fixed

St John The Enforcer wrote:

rodders wrote:

clivemcl wrote:I think the management of our out-halves is spot on.

You wouldn't blame Marshy for possibly considering first choice rugby elsewhere (he has admitted to nearly leaving in the past), but With Pienaar being away in the autumn, sometimes being played at 10,  and Marshall nearly always being used off the bench, he gets plenty of gametime. Enough to keep him happy it would seem.

I for one will be very happy to see him commit to playing second fiddle for three more years.

Delighted Marshall is staying, for the record he's the third best scrum half in the country behind Pienaar and Murray in my opinion. It always amazes me how some fairly average players get rated so highly, whereas a talent like Marshall is so under appreciated. I'd put him in the Jennings, Cullen, Trimble, Earls bracket of player - people seem to be fixated what he does wrong, rather than right.

Fixed

 

rodders wrote:

St John The Enforcer wrote:

rodders wrote:

clivemcl wrote:I think the management of our out-halves is spot on.

You wouldn't blame Marshy for possibly considering first choice rugby elsewhere (he has admitted to nearly leaving in the past), but With Pienaar being away in the autumn, sometimes being played at 10,  and Marshall nearly always being used off the bench, he gets plenty of gametime. Enough to keep him happy it would seem.

I for one will be very happy to see him commit to playing second fiddle for three more years.

Delighted Marshall is staying, for the record he's the third best scrum half in the country behind Pienaar and Murray in my opinion. It always amazes me how some fairly average players get rated so highly, whereas a talent like Marshall is so under appreciated. I'd put him in the Jennings, Cullen, Trimble, Earls bracket of player - people seem to be fixated what he does wrong, rather than right.

Fixed

 

 

Well people are defo fixated on what Earls does wrong. No?

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:Well people are defo fixated on what Earls does wrong. No?

Yea not much else to fixate on though, other than zebo's hair that is.

Zebo's hair is a crime. It must break some law somewhere.
I do think we all pick on Earls a bit, I am a fan of the guy but he is frustrating time and time again in that he shows us that he has a god-given gift for the game one game then fails to show why he ever wears red or green the next. He has been mismanaged his whole career IMO. School report....could do better

Pete330v2 wrote:Zebo's hair is a crime. It must break some law somewhere.

Jeez you rugby types are soooo conservative. I'd hate to see what you would have made of my hair 30 years ago.  Would have made Zebo look like the leader of the Tory party

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:Zebo's hair is a crime. It must break some law somewhere.

Jeez you rugby types are soooo conservative. I'd hate to see what you would have made of my hair 30 years ago.  Would have made Zebo look like the leader of the Tory party

Wanna bet Jen, you should see mine right now. I have a bit of an Ian Madigan going on upstairs. I should add that I am middle-aged and should know better

http://www.ulsterrugby.com/news/latest/2013/10/cornish-pirates-34-ulster-ravens-17/

Bad news on the result, but if you look it was a fairly patched together team- but the good news is Paddy McAllister got through 50 mins at loosehead! Hope he gets more gametime against Jersey next week, and then some minutes off the bench at home to Cardiff.

Cornish Pirates away was always going to be our hardest game - Jersey will be nowhere near as good

Three more years for Marshall.

http://www.ulsterrugby.com/news/latest/2013/10/paul-marshall-signs-new-3-year-deal/

Much derided and underestimated in my opinion. Still - three years is a long time. I would hope that by then Heaney has bypassed him. Does this mean Porter gets a pat on the back and shown the door? Was that always the plan?

As expected - been the world's worst kept secret over the weekend

Wasn't this announced last week? Great news - the most underrated player in Ireland right now. For me the second best Irish scrum half by a distance and 3rd best in the country.

Paddy Jackson also plays much better along side Marshall than Pienaar.

Rumoured last week but not official.

Being suggest it might be a central contract - in the Irish press at least.

Is there anyone else we're trying to tie down in the coming weeks?

Yep but reasonably confident they are just formalities

Tuohy, Henry, Court, Best
There are others lower down the pecking order but they are the only main stays

The biggy is whether or not Muller retires - we know Afoa will go
The odds are stacked on him going but he may just fancy one more year

Banners need printing for the rest of the season then Geoff?
"One more year Johann???"

Personally I think he would have it in him but you couldn't blame him if he rods into the sunset.

34 next June.

I believe a coaching roll at the Sharks beckons so a chat with them would be good

I'd love to see him take a coaching / player coach role with us ... personally I'm not convinced he has another year as a full time player - although he rolled back the years at the weekend.

I know his abilities will be diminishing unfortunately faster as time plods on but even as a talismanic force to bring out on occasion is never a bad thing. The leadership, the coaching, the mentoring and professionalism that he could bring along with some playing time would be utterly invalueable. A player/coaching role would be ideal.

rodders wrote:Wasn't this announced last week? Great news - the most underrated player in Ireland right now. For me the second best Irish scrum half by a distance and 3rd best in the country.

Paddy Jackson also plays much better along side Marshall than Pienaar.

I know we don't have serious depth at SH but hauld on there Rodders.  

geoff998rugby wrote:34 next June.

I believe a coaching roll at the Sharks beckons so a chat with them would be good

Ah lads. We have Centres older than that!

Simon Shaw nearly made 40. Brad Thorn etc etc. Fecker was born in the 1980s ffs. I could be his Da!

Well not so silly Stringer, Reddan and Boss have all reached the old man stage so who else is there.

Doesn't make them bad player of course - infact Stringer in particular is playing very well but thinking 2 years down the line Murray, Marmion and Marshall will be the main men

Infact the announcement on his contract, as announced by the southern press, indicated a central contract. That would surprise me but that is what they said.

geoff998rugby wrote:Well not so silly Stringer, Reddan and Boss have all reached the old man stage so who else is there.

Doesn't make them bad player of course - infact Stringer in particular is playing very well but thinking 2 years down the line Murray, Marmion and Marshall will be the main men

Infact the announcement on his contract, as announced by the southern press, indicated a central contract. That would surprise me but that is what they said.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/paul-marshall-signs-ulster-extension-1.1560487

Don't see how you can read that into the announcement. Central contracts are always worded differently.

rodders wrote:Wasn't this announced last week? Great news - the most underrated player in Ireland right now. For me the second best Irish scrum half by a distance and 3rd best in the country.

Paddy Jackson also plays much better along side Marshall than Pienaar.

That is all pretty wild-eyed and untrue rodders. I like Marshall a lot but he's at his level as an impact sub for Ulster, probably wouldn't be happy with him as our first choice 9, and I wouldn't say Jackson plays better or worse depending on his halfback partner.

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

geoff998rugby wrote:Well not so silly Stringer, Reddan and Boss have all reached the old man stage so who else is there.

Doesn't make them bad player of course - infact Stringer in particular is playing very well but thinking 2 years down the line Murray, Marmion and Marshall will be the main men

Infact the announcement on his contract, as announced by the southern press, indicated a central contract. That would surprise me but that is what they said.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/paul-marshall-signs-ulster-extension-1.1560487

Don't see how you can read that into the announcement. Central contracts are always worded differently.

Jenifer this press release states IRFU and Ulster - never seen that except when a Central contract is involved

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/29884.php and this is the 'official' press release.

geoff998rugby wrote:Jenifer this press release states IRFU and Ulster - never seen that except when a Central contract is involved

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/29884.php and this is the 'official' press release.

That's fair enough. Hadn't seen that. It is a bit like Ian Madigan's though. He is not on a central despite similar wording. In fact the IRFU took issue with a press article that said he was signed by Leinster.

Truth is, they are trying to muddy the waters, so we find it harder to tell, by using the fact that ALL contracts (even those signed by the likes of Pienaar who are NIE) are signed with the IRFU.

ALL contracts are with the IRFU anyway.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/clarification-29538559.html

It seems that central contracts are just contracts which the provinces do not have to reimburse the IRFU for at the end of the season. In theory these are the contracts of the biggest stars, but there's also a lot of politics and balancing the budget involved so I question whether they actually mean anything in the grand scheme of things.

Anyway, delighted to see Paul Marshall sign on for the next three seasons after this- whoever is ultimately paying his wages, hope to see him in Ulster colours more than Irish ones.

Notch wrote:

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/clarification-29538559.html

Yep. That's the article I was referring to. (or the reply from the IRFU to the article)

True Notch but in previous years they have not been announced in that manner.

Certainly a change of policy by the IRFU to 'muddy the waters' seems like a more likely explanation

Another article to stir some debate, the Independent talking about Afoa being fit for Montpellier said

'Providing there are no repercussions from an intense scrummaging session, All Black tight-head John Afoa, another key player Ulster are trying to secure to a new contract, should get his first run-out of the season from the bench after recovering from arm and calf problems.'

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/pienaar-ulster-are-turning-into-a-european-force-29663767.html

Maybe its just a case of the reporter putting a top players contract running out equals an automatic attempt to resign or maybe Ulster are hoping to persuade him to resign?

Sounds like the former to me Marty, tbh.

Notch wrote:Sounds like the former to me Marty, tbh.

Thinking the same myself Notch but you never know, Mrs Afoa could have suddenly taken a liking to the Belfast rain:goodluck: 

I would be surprised!

Actually I wouldn't be too sure I'd want him on new contract. He doesn't seem to be fully committed to being available every week (mainly due to the aforementioned wife and family) and thats not what you want from a guy on a big salary.

Can't see that being something Ulster would want to have to maintain and can't see him accepting a pay cut along with the cost of flying back and forth constantly when he can earn good money back home

With Kaino going back to the Blues I can see that being an extra draw for Afoa too

Never in a million years - David Kelly clearly belongs to the growing list of clueless idiots claiming to be professional journalists

I cant remember but elsewhere I may have mixed up Dan , Darren and Chris

The former two are signed till the end of 2015, Chris Henrys contract ends this year.
There have ben Aviva team sniffing around but don't worry, you can ignore them, he has decided to stay with us

  Looks like Chris Henry is signed till 2017

geoff998rugby wrote:  Looks like Chris Henry is signed till 2017

The bad news though is Sean O'Brien is playing like a man possessed at the minute so Chris Henry still not going to get the international recognition he deserves

Great news indeed, surely Henry is the man who will take on the club captaincy from Muller when he leaves.

No shame in playing second fiddle to O'Brien - most players in the NH would be in the same boat.

Henry is quality - an uber-important player.

rodders couldn't agree more about being second to SOB but Henrys been one of the best opensides in the NH in the last few years yet most seem to accept that his natural position is behind SOB irregardless of form

His game going up a level was one of the biggest factors in Ulsters upturn in recent years along with the SA contingent coming in

This is great news, I think he has been one of Ulsters most important players over the last few years. Its not only in the quality he brings but the drop down in quality between him and the available cover - I mean no offence to Willie Faloon who went off the boil a bit (although he has been playing well at Connacht), or Sean Doyle (who looks to have potential - in the few games he has played). We have been fortunate that he has stayed relatively injury free over this time, also a tip of the hat to Brian McLaughlin for moving him to openside flanker.

marty2086 wrote:rodders couldn't agree more about being second to SOB but Henrys been one of the best opensides in the NH in the last few years yet most seem to accept that his natural position is behind SOB irregardless of form

His game going up a level was one of the biggest factors in Ulsters upturn in recent years along with the SA contingent coming in

Steady! One of the best opensides in his house for sure.  Outside of Ulster he is not in the top 10 in the NH

Though he is a very good player indeed.