2013 Summer Transfer Window Thread....Continued.....CONTINUED

[Crimey]

First topic message reminder :

Want a couple more big deals before it closes.

Rooney
Lewandowski
Bale
Suarez

May all still be leaving.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

So now because he didnt get Fabregas its just a desperate signing, rather than having options?

Think it would be a good signing. Likely to play two deeper midfielders as part of a 4-2-3-1 anyway and Fellaini can join attacks and add real presence across the park.

I listened to TalkSport today and remembered why I used to hate it so much. Durham was moaning about how he was never a deep player and only played there in big games against better sides. Ignoring that he has played plenty of games deeper, his preferred role, and that if he can "dominate" in that role against United then surely it shows he can play there?

Clearly Fellaini is the backup option to Fabregas, like every club has a backup option in case they don't get who they want. If we didn't get Hooper, we were in for Barnes from Brighton. We haven't got Toivonen, so we've gone in for Quagliarella. It's how transfers work.

Fellaini has only played a small amount of games further forward, because it was needs must for Everton having lost Cahill, and Jelavic losing form and who would you rather have playing that role, Anichebe or Fellaini? Obviously Fellaini.

[Hulking_up]

Luis Suarez's contract does not have a clause obliging Liverpool to sell him for a fee in excess of £40m, says players' union chief Gordon Taylor.

"If there is a minimum offer of £40m then the parties will discuss things but it does not say the club has to sell," said Taylor, boss of the Professional Footballers' Association.

"There is a 'good faith' clause in relation to serious discussions, but I can't say it is a cast-iron buy-out clause."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/23610289

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Teams try to live within their means. It means they can come up and try compete with teams who have had the Premier League cash cow for years, rather than fear that if they do then they will die if its a failure. 

In fact, I'd say both Norwich and WBA are probably more stable due to former parachute payments, which help clubs to really transform much inside their own club.

Norwich were in League 1 when the last PP ended for them, and according to Olly have only just paid off all the debt.

Id have to say I know little about it, but they would either have had debt beforehand or Frak up with it afterwards because they should have been able to parachute their way down softly back into the Championship with the use of these payments.

We were in deep financial trouble when we went into League 1, we were almost on the verge of going into administration at one point.

If it wasn't for David McNally and Paul Lambert, we'd be in a position I don't wanna think about today.

We are debt free as of this summer I believe, thus why we are now spending more cash, as with the new TV deal, we can afford to push the boat out more.

Also you don't need to spend bucket loads when you first come up, ala WBA/Us/Swansea. I doubt Swansea and us spent much more than 25m between us when we came up in 2011

There's probably more examples of clubs who didnt compete though, and even now you'd probably say this was the first season where 17th wouldn't be enough to keep you happy.

Whilst I'd also imagine it was ridiculous financial mismahement that got you in real debt (and a lot of clubs have manageable debt) rather than, something that would have just as or more likely have happened premier league in the Ashton and Green days or not

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Both of those are things I said Olly (on Fellaini), thanks for backing me up

 

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Both of those are things I said Olly (on Fellaini), thanks for backing me up

 

Well you are right in what you say.

So I'd be fairly stupid not to back you up

[The Special Juan]

When Fellaini shreds everyone I'll be the one laughing.  Who's to say he won't fit in at Utd?  Do you think Moyes isn't going to implement his own brand of football?  I think Fellaini could be lethal alongside Xavi Carrick in the midfield, bombing forward and laying the ball off for Kagawa and van Persie.  He's the type of player I think Utd need.  Ok he's not Keane but he's a physical presence.  I don't understand you naysayers, I really don't.

 
I always said I'd accept Fellaini as long as another midfielder come in as well. But just signing him is more adding depth to the squad as opposed to improving the starting 11. Given some of the names we have been linked with and the public courting of Fabregas I just find this a huge comedown and although he might keep us going domestically I don't say many European clubs losing sleep over us signing him

I think he'd sit beside Carrick with those two as the "2" in the 4-2-3-1. I think he'd really improve the team in the way Yaya Toure drives City forward. Fellaini has the potential to be that type of player, or so I feel anyway. He sort of is already.

However, as you say, he might not terrify Europe's elite. Utd with Fergie were always there or thereabouts (if only Nani hadn't been sent off.......) but I think they're lagging behind a few clubs now. Bayern are ahead of everyone for the time being, then it's Real, Barcelona and Dortmund. I think Utd are the level below that with the other English clubs, Juventus and PSG, plus maybe Shakhtar.

[Liam]

As a United fan I would be dissapointed with Fellaini. Assuming we sign him, we'd be playing him cm. He hasn't played there in a long time, playing more as a CF for Everton. He's a good player, but we need to be bringing someone in who will deliver us success in the champions league. We've won the league, Europe should be our priority. Fabregas fits the bill, should have got Ozil and Modric before Real. Can't afford to keep missing these players. I'm still hopeful on Fabregas mind.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Utd fans priority may be Europe, but wasn't Fergie's priority always winning the league?!

Doubt that would have changed...

[Guest]

When Fellaini shreds everyone I'll be the one laughing.  Who's to say he won't fit in at Utd?  Do you think Moyes isn't going to implement his own brand of football?  I think Fellaini could be lethal alongside Xavi Carrick in the midfield, bombing forward and laying the ball off for Kagawa and van Persie.  He's the type of player I think Utd need.  Ok he's not Keane but he's a physical presence.  I don't understand you naysayers, I really don't.

 
I always said I'd accept Fellaini as long as another midfielder come in as well. But just signing him is more adding depth to the squad as opposed to improving the starting 11. Given some of the names we have been linked with and the public courting of Fabregas I just find this a huge comedown and although he might keep us going domestically I don't say many European clubs losing sleep over us signing him

I think he'd sit beside Carrick with those two as the "2" in the 4-2-3-1.  I think he'd really improve the team in the way Yaya Toure drives City forward.  Fellaini has the potential to be that type of player, or so I feel anyway.  He sort of is already.

However, as you say, he might not terrify Europe's elite.  Utd with Fergie were always there or thereabouts (if only Nani hadn't been sent off.......) but I think they're lagging behind a few clubs now.  Bayern are ahead of everyone for the time being, then it's Real, Barcelona and Dortmund.  I think Utd are the level below that with the other English clubs, Juventus and PSG, plus maybe Shakhtar.

Happy to be proven wrong though. I was against the Valencia deal initially , and last season aside he's been immense. Maybe we should take the number 7 off him and make him earn it again haha

[Guest]

Don't get me wrong Olly, will always have the league as the priority but United should also be one of the powers in Europe as well and I hate, despise, mega loathe that Liverpool have won that 5 times

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

In other news I've seen Agger to Barca as a rumor today

Surely Liverpool wouldn't sell?

[The Special Juan]

Utd fans priority may be Europe, but wasn't Fergie's priority always winning the league?!

Doubt that would have changed...

It's what I prefer.  I know the CL is near enough the biggest trophy in world football now depending on one's viewpoint but there's something rather satisfying about beating your rivals season after season.  Hell I'd take the FA Cup over the CL this season purely so Vidic and co can complete their trophy set.

[Ent]

I don't know why fellani gets credit for tearing it up against us at goodison when he was playing as a centre forward and his average position was just behind jelavic (courtesy of espn soccer net) and we had 69% possession in the game, bizarre this is used to promote his credentials as a midfielder.

He'd also be terrible in a 4231 as it wouldn't pls to any of his strengths.

[compelling and rich]

League is always the priority, were behind in europe but even if not you still need alot of luck on your side if your going to win the champions league. The best team wins the league

Dont get all the negativity surrounding fellani, he's clearly a better cm than anything we've got bar carrick

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

I can see United slipping down badly this season. Rooney > Chelsea, Bale > Real and Suarez > Arsenal would leave my PL table like this:

Man City
Chelsea
Arsenal
Man Utd
Tottenham
Everton
Norwich
WBA
Newcastle
Liverpool

Don't see us getting to 7th, but top half is certainly not out of the equation.

I have it like this

Man City
Man Utd
Chelsea
Spurs
Arsenal
Swansea
Liverpool
Everton

The rest is just a lottery. Really fancy Swansea to do something special this year.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Both of those are things I said Olly (on Fellaini), thanks for backing me up

 

Well you are right in what you say.

So I'd be fairly stupid not to back you up

I was winding you up babe xoxo

[Dolphin Ziggler]

I'd be wary of the Europa league derailing Swansea.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Fellaini made a huge difference in a game United didnt win when leading at home. Shock horror that you had a high percentage of possession in a home tie against a team you were better than whilst desperately chasing the title. Fellaini isn't even naturally a player in that role and was pivotal in that game.

Fellaini is a deeper midfielder who was such an asset to Everton in a higher role because of a combination of style and certain skill sets. The quality around him is raised at Man United, he can do his specific job far more confidently.

[GSC]

Fellaini is about as much use as a man sausage flavoured lollipop to Nick

[Liam]

Fellaini wouldn't be a bad signing but as a utd fan i want to be challenging in Europe. Fellaini isn't really going to take us into the category of Real/Barca/Dortmund/Munich. Fabregas would take us there and adding Baines would really give us a chance this season.

[Liam]

On Fellaini, he had a good season last year with 12 goals and 7 assists.

[Ent]

It was the away game I refer to- though seriously is throwing a game away in comical fashion is evidence fellani is a great midfielder?

Our right back crossed to our left back to hit the post at 4-2 up in that game - we were ridiculous.

Fellani won't be a focus at united he'd have to change his game not have a team based round him.

He'll be a disaster he's very limited, but sure he is a big lump and scored a few goals as a centre forward he is clearly going to be a dominating centre midfielder...

[GSC]

Forest agree a deal for Kelvin Wilson.

I'll be back...later

[Liam]

Tell you what, if United want Fabregas, they should just go in with a 42m offer. That should tempt Barca, and they can possibly put that money towards Gundongan at Dortmund or someone like that. No point edging up from 30-35-38 or whatever, go over 40 and get your man if we want him so much!!

[Guest]

I'm surprised nobody has gone in for Eriksson

That kid looks pretty special. People might have reservations over whether he's ready but I reckon you can add another 10 million if you wait till next summer, phenomenal talent in the next year or two, he's good now

[Liam]

Heard allot about Eriksson but hasn't really justified the sort of price Ajax reportedly want for him. Maybe in the 2-3 years time yes, but not right now. Heard Dortmund were close to a deal for him but that's gone quiet.

[Marky]

Man U never replaced Roy Keane. Funny how that type of player was pivotal to their success, okay they may have done fine without that sort of player recently, but to see so much Fellaini bashing considering he would be your next Keane style CM is ridiculous.

Fellaini to Carrick would be what Keane was to Scholes. The midfield enforcer. The fact Everton used him as a battering ram going forward is irrelevent.

[Afro]

Oh dear



Some people clearly have 3 minute MOTD opinions of Fellaini. United didn't throw the game away in the 4-4, they weren't good enough to defend against our passing game that day. Including Fellaini. Whoever, said he can't pass is clearly a WUM or just a bit dull

And Fellaini has dominated from centre midfield, playing box to box, against teams like Chelsea, City, United and Arsenal over the previous 3 seasons. Makes me laugh when people think he is just a big lump. That's fine as we will just keep him as he has been superb playing box to box for us

[Guest]

Everton were excellent that game, I remember it well, and Fellaini was totally unstoppable. He's far more than a 'target man'/'lump it forward option', he has a good range of passing, never stops running, tackles like a stormtrooper, and has an actual footballing brain, unlike Cleverley, Anderson, Nani and Valencia. He'd be a huge improvement on United's current first XI.

[Guest]

Tell you what, if United want Fabregas, they should just go in with a 42m offer. That should tempt Barca, and they can possibly put that money towards Gundongan at Dortmund or someone like that. No point edging up from 30-35-38 or whatever, go over 40 and get your man if we want him so much!!

I expect this will be put to bed one way or another in the Fabregas Press Conference today

[Guest]

If I'm Barca, £42m doesn't make me sell Fabregas. And I don't think they need Gundogan as they already have Busquets.

[Crimey]

Man U never replaced Roy Keane. Funny how that type of player was pivotal to their success, okay they may have done fine without that sort of player recently, but to see so much Fellaini bashing considering he would be your next Keane style CM is ridiculous.

Fellaini to Carrick would be what Keane was to Scholes. The midfield enforcer. The fact Everton used him as a battering ram going forward is irrelevent.

1. I don't think Fellaini is the Roy Keane type at all, not according to Manchester United fans who see him as a box to box midfielder in the mould of Yaya Toure, rather than a defensive midfielder like Keane. I don't think Fellaini is a midfielder like Keane at all.

2. Most top European sides don't have an enforcer in their midfield these days, they have three passing midfielders. The only top European side that uses a traditional midfield enforcer that I can think of is Juventus and Vidal, but they can really afford to have that as they use about 6 midfielders.

[Duty281]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/23610289

If Suarez is training alone, that'll be that then. Wonder if Arsenal will be able to stump up enough cash?

[Guest]

Arsenal will probably wait until the end of the window to save spending on Suarez's wages until then.

[GSC]

Actually, that raises an interesting point. Arsenal can happily let the clock tick down to the end of the window, Suarez won't be available anyway

[GSC]

On top of that Liverpool play an extra COC game due to no European football

[LastDamnation]

He'd be available for the CL playoffs though. And bringing him in helps to lure other targets

[Guest]

Fellaini being United`s Yaya Toure is laughable. He doesn't have the engine or the pace to dominate a midfield through his running or work rate like Yaya does. Fellaini is all about bullying, being aggressive and using his physical size to dominate the opposition aerially, something which Everton tactically played on. United don't play that style or attempt to play long ball football. Yaya & Fellaini are world`s apart in my opinion. Also, football has changed since Keane`s days. Yeah, his style suited the EPL but United need to compete in Europe, where players like Fabregas or a Modric would have a bigger effect than tall, physical type players, who essentially get the run around by the technically gifted, low centre of gravity players you see today.

Moyes signing Fellaini is desperation in my opinion. The failure to negotiate deals and agree fees, has led the to the easy option of going for a backup player with a clause where a deal can be done. Fellaini is a good player domestically but doesn't drastically improve the first XI, however a Fabregas type would of enhanced United domestically & in Europe and bought them closer to the leading pack of Bayern/Madrid/Barcelona.

[Guest]

Theres the confirmation from fabregas anyway

his dream was to play at barca. Hes happy and has never thought of leaving

if moyes tries another hes a moron

[Hero]

Yeah, his style suited the EPL but United need to compete in Europe, where players like Fabregas or a Modric would have a bigger effect than tall, physical type players, who essentially get the run around by the technically gifted, low centre of gravity players you see today.

 That 6'ft 3in Martinez at Bayern Munich seemed to do alright in assisting them win the Champions League last season...

[Afro]

Fellaini being United`s Yaya Toure is laughable. He doesn't have the engine or the pace to dominate a midfield through his running or work rate like Yaya does. Fellaini is all about bullying, being aggressive and using his physical size to dominate the opposition aerially, something which Everton tactically played on.

Completely blinded by last season with that opinion IMO. He was used up front for his physicality last season as that is what we needed and he did a job for the team.

In the seasons before, in midfield, he was exactly the type of player you are saying he isn't. His height had very little impact on his game in midfield, other than it brought him a lot of bookings.

[Afro]

I'm actually hoping United sign him now , so the doubting United fans can come back on and say "my god we were wrong, this boy can actually play"

[sodhat]

Man U never replaced Roy Keane. Funny how that type of player was pivotal to their success, okay they may have done fine without that sort of player recently, but to see so much Fellaini bashing considering he would be your next Keane style CM is ridiculous.

Fellaini to Carrick would be what Keane was to Scholes. The midfield enforcer. The fact Everton used him as a battering ram going forward is irrelevent.

1. I don't think Fellaini is the Roy Keane type at all, not according to Manchester United fans who see him as a box to box midfielder in the mould of Yaya Toure, rather than a defensive midfielder like Keane. I don't think Fellaini is a midfielder like Keane at all.

2. Most top European sides don't have an enforcer in their midfield these days, they have three passing midfielders. The only top European side that uses a traditional midfield enforcer that I can think of is Juventus and Vidal, but they can really afford to have that as they use about 6 midfielders.

Vidal can't be pigeon-holed as an enforcer, it suggests his game is limited and defensive and it isn't the case at all. He's a box to box player with a lot of energy and he does everything well in attack and defence. He gets plenty of goals from midfield too.

I don't think people no longer use "enforcers" though, I just think the criteria is different. All midfields are balanced out with a defensive minded player - Busquets for example. Just because he isn't getting his shorts dirty and kicking players up in the air doesn't mean he isn't performing the same basic role of smother attacks and reading danger.

[compelling and rich]

I'm actually hoping United sign him now , so the doubting United fans can come back on and say "my god we were wrong, this boy can actually play"

id quite happily take him, dont get me wrong id prefer fabregas but have seen fellani dominate games from the deeper position and feel people are just remembering him from cahill went when he was pushed forward. lets face it fellani is 10x better than anderson!!!

[Afro]

Man U never replaced Roy Keane. Funny how that type of player was pivotal to their success, okay they may have done fine without that sort of player recently, but to see so much Fellaini bashing considering he would be your next Keane style CM is ridiculous.

Fellaini to Carrick would be what Keane was to Scholes. The midfield enforcer. The fact Everton used him as a battering ram going forward is irrelevent.

1. I don't think Fellaini is the Roy Keane type at all, not according to Manchester United fans who see him as a box to box midfielder in the mould of Yaya Toure, rather than a defensive midfielder like Keane. I don't think Fellaini is a midfielder like Keane at all.

2. Most top European sides don't have an enforcer in their midfield these days, they have three passing midfielders. The only top European side that uses a traditional midfield enforcer that I can think of is Juventus and Vidal, but they can really afford to have that as they use about 6 midfielders.

Vidal can't be pigeon-holed as an enforcer, it suggests his game is limited and defensive and it isn't the case at all. He's a box to box player with a lot of energy and he does everything well in attack and defence. He gets plenty of goals from midfield too.

I don't think people no longer use "enforcers" though, I just think the criteria is different. All midfields are balanced out with a defensive minded player - Busquets for example. Just because he isn't getting his shorts dirty and kicking players up in the air doesn't mean he isn't performing the same basic role of smother attacks and reading danger.

Vidal is anything but an enforcer. He is your typical box to box midfielder

[sodhat]

I'm actually hoping United sign him now , so the doubting United fans can come back on and say "my god we were wrong, this boy can actually play"

id quite happily take him, dont get me wrong id prefer fabregas but have seen fellani dominate games from the deeper position and feel people are just remembering him from cahill went when he was pushed forward. lets face it fellani is 10x better than anderson!!!

 Probably weighs a few stones less too.

[Afro]

I'm actually hoping United sign him now , so the doubting United fans can come back on and say "my god we were wrong, this boy can actually play"

id quite happily take him, dont get me wrong id prefer fabregas but have seen fellani dominate games from the deeper position and feel people are just remembering him from cahill went when he was pushed forward. lets face it fellani is 10x better than anderson!!!

I don't blame you. Fabregas is a much higher quality player than Fellaini, but with Fellaini, in midfield, you would get a box to box midfielder with a strong engine, a good range of passing (he is never going to give you your Gerrard hollywood passes), equally capable in attack and defence AND you will get a physical presence as well

[Afro]

I'm actually hoping United sign him now , so the doubting United fans can come back on and say "my god we were wrong, this boy can actually play"

id quite happily take him, dont get me wrong id prefer fabregas but have seen fellani dominate games from the deeper position and feel people are just remembering him from cahill went when he was pushed forward. lets face it fellani is 10x better than anderson!!!

 Probably weighs a few stones less too.

How heavy is hair?

[The Special Juan]

I'd like to add I don't think Utd are signing Fellaini instead of Fabregas. If the opportunity to sign Cesc comes up I think they'll do it. Kagawa > Fabregas though

[Crimey]

Luis Suarez has been pictured crying when leaving Melwood.

I think he's getting a culture shock of not getting everything he wants. I want to see him apologise for how he has treated the club.

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