French T14 Players Wages...!

Recently Published Monthly Earnings of players in the Top 14.

Jonny Wilkinson (Toulon) - €56,000 (£48,155)
Jonathan Sexton (Racing Metro) - €52,000 (£44,711)
Bryan Habana (Toulon) - €50,000 (£42,991)
Morgan Parra (Clermont Auvergne) - €46,000 (£39,555)
Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse) - €43,000 (£36,975)
Dimitri Szarzewski (Racing Metro) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Carl Hayman (Toulon) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Bakkies Botha (Toulon) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Jamie Roberts (Racing Metro) - €40,000 (£34,394)
Matt Giteau (Toulon) - €40,000 (£34,394)


Source http://www.lejdd.fr/Sport/Rugby/Actualite/Top-14-les-salaires-chutent-623512

It staggering how little they get paid compared to their football counterparts isn't it?

Jonny's on about £15,000 a week according to that which probably compares to an average Championship (old div 2) player.

poor Wilko had a salary cut of 30%...tough times.
seriously if the top players are still earning good money, the average salary is under pressure (-10/-15% around 11k€) and the number of pro players without clubs on the rise.
you dont want to play wing in france as you face competition from some very good fidjian who is earning 5000€ a month or flanker where you have ample supply coming from SA. global market eh...

For comparison what are the top players in the Jeff or Pro12 earning? Anyone know?

Cyril wrote:It staggering how little they get paid compared to their football counterparts isn't it?

Jonny's on about £15,000 a week according to that which probably compares to an average Championship (old div 2) player.

I think it's a common misconception that all footballers are paid crazy amounts of money. A report from less than 2 years ago gave the following weekly averages:

Premiership: £22,353
Championship: £4,059
L2: £747

I'm mystified to see both Parra and Habana up there. I can understand Fly Halves making top dollar but I would have thought that at least half in the top 10 would have been tighthead props.

Habana is going to have to score a silly amount of tries to justify that pay day. Given the team Toulon have as well my gran could score at a good ratio so unless he's scoring 3 a match I cant see that pay day really being earned.

Parra is a good scrum half, no question but given the sheer amount of talent available in this position he must have had a good agent to secure that pay deal.

Its all a bit bizarre if you ask me, the French clearly don't know how to spend their money.

Welshmushroom wrote:I'm mystified to see both Parra and Habana up there.  I can understand Fly Halves making top dollar but I would have thought that at least half in the top 10 would have been tighthead props.

Habana is going to have to score a silly amount of tries to justify that pay day.  Given the team Toulon have as well my gran could score at a good ratio so unless he's scoring 3 a match I cant see that pay day really being earned.

Parra is a good scrum half, no question but given the sheer amount of talent available in this position he must have had a good agent to secure that pay deal.  

Its all a bit bizarre if you ask me, the French clearly don't know how to spend their money.  

It is not just about Point scoring, which likely justifies Parra's inclusion, it is more about Shirt/Ticket sales... Habana doesn't have to score a lot of tries, just a few worth watching to keep the fans buying tickets and merchandise.

Little surprised Nicolas Mas isn't on that list. Thought he'd be on big cash after a summer move to Montpellier.

Parra is seen as a bit of a talisman for Clermont, is tactically central to how they play and is a very good points kicker. Hence he is retained on a very lucrative contract.

Roberts is the real surprise! How many line breaks will he have to make to justify that money?! Hope they weren't watching how many knock-ons he produces as well...

"So Jamie when you get the ball we'd like you to either run, pass or take contact but recycle quickly"...

..."No problem you'll be stunned by how fast I can get that ball to the opposition!"...  

Anyone know who the biggest earners are in the pro12, premiership or super Xv?

maestegmafia wrote:Recently Published Monthly Earnings of players in the Top 14.

Jonny Wilkinson (Toulon) - €56,000 (£48,155)
Jonathan Sexton (Racing Metro) - €52,000 (£44,711)
Bryan Habana (Toulon) - €50,000 (£42,991)
Morgan Parra (Clermont Auvergne) - €46,000 (£39,555)
Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse) - €43,000 (£36,975)
Dimitri Szarzewski (Racing Metro) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Carl Hayman (Toulon) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Bakkies Botha (Toulon) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Jamie Roberts (Racing Metro) - €40,000 (£34,394)
Matt Giteau (Toulon) - €40,000 (£34,394)


Source http://www.lejdd.fr/Sport/Rugby/Actualite/Top-14-les-salaires-chutent-623512

is this per month

dragon4life wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Recently Published Monthly Earnings of players in the Top 14.

Jonny Wilkinson (Toulon) - €56,000 (£48,155)
Jonathan Sexton (Racing Metro) - €52,000 (£44,711)
Bryan Habana (Toulon) - €50,000 (£42,991)
Morgan Parra (Clermont Auvergne) - €46,000 (£39,555)
Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse) - €43,000 (£36,975)
Dimitri Szarzewski (Racing Metro) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Carl Hayman (Toulon) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Bakkies Botha (Toulon) - €41,000 (£35,254)
Jamie Roberts (Racing Metro) - €40,000 (£34,394)
Matt Giteau (Toulon) - €40,000 (£34,394)


Source http://www.lejdd.fr/Sport/Rugby/Actualite/Top-14-les-salaires-chutent-623512

is this per month

Yes

Welshmushroom wrote:I'm mystified to see both Parra and Habana up there.  I can understand Fly Halves making top dollar but I would have thought that at least half in the top 10 would have been tighthead props.

Habana is going to have to score a silly amount of tries to justify that pay day.  Given the team Toulon have as well my gran could score at a good ratio so unless he's scoring 3 a match I cant see that pay day really being earned.

Parra is a good scrum half, no question but given the sheer amount of talent available in this position he must have had a good agent to secure that pay deal.  

Its all a bit bizarre if you ask me, the French clearly don't know how to spend their money.  

Totally agree, Mushroom. I was talking to one of Glasgow's coaches a good while ago and he said that THs are the most valuable player in any team. Even the third choice TH was, to paraphrase him, on a very healthy salary although, understandably, no numbers were mentioned.
Interestingly, there were only 3 French guys in the list

A friend plays TH for team in the league below the Championship here in England and still earns enough to live pretty well (especially for a 25y/o).

As mentioned though top level rugby is about so much more then actual in-game talent. All of those players on the list are very good, but the real benefit they bring to their clubs are in the extra shirt/ticket/shop sales and media coverage that their names pull in.

Haven't found any published figures on UK wages

You're unlikely to Maes. I believe Dan Cole and Toby Flood are the big earners at Tigers with Cole the marquee player, Quins have Evans as there marquee signing. I'd expect those two to be on 300k plus. North probably just under 300k at Saints. Exact figures won't be available.

I'm fairly sure Evans salary was mentioned as 250k. James Johnston was the other player on a big wage so i'd be curious to see just what he was offered at Sarries, other then IPad, holidays, KFC etc

Do France have a salary cap? And if they do, how can Toulon stay under it with their squad when 5 of their players make it into this list?

yappysnap wrote:I'm fairly sure Evans salary was mentioned as 250k. James Johnston was the other player on a big wage so i'd be curious to see just what he was offered at Sarries, other then IPad, holidays, KFC etc

KFC is a bit of a stereotype mate... But made me laugh all the same...!

maestegmafia wrote:

yappysnap wrote:I'm fairly sure Evans salary was mentioned as 250k. James Johnston was the other player on a big wage so i'd be curious to see just what he was offered at Sarries, other then IPad, holidays, KFC etc

KFC is a bit of a stereotype mate... But made me laugh all the same...!

I thought Sarries were changing their sponsor from Domino's to KFC just to accomodate him?

Bathman_in_London wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

yappysnap wrote:I'm fairly sure Evans salary was mentioned as 250k. James Johnston was the other player on a big wage so i'd be curious to see just what he was offered at Sarries, other then IPad, holidays, KFC etc

KFC is a bit of a stereotype mate... But made me laugh all the same...!

I thought Sarries were changing their sponsor from Domino's to KFC just to accomodate him?

Wasn't their previous sponsor Biltong, accommodating all the South Africans? (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1366&bih=768&q=biltong&oq=biltong&gs_l=img.3..0l10.1482.2326.0.2964.7.6.0.1.1.0.166.589.5j1.6.0....0...1ac.1.25.img..0.7.606.x34H6X7RRSI#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=xud-17RQvdmwuM%3A%3B5HV5st0l9cC0IM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.exoticmeats.co.uk%252Fimages%252Fuploads%252Foriginal_biltong_strips.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.exoticmeats.co.uk%252Fbeef-biltong-strips.html%3B390%3B260).

thebandwagonsociety wrote:Do France have a salary cap? And if they do, how can Toulon stay under it with their squad when 5 of their players make it into this list?

I think it was around €8m but is rising to €10m for this season. Thats roughly £8m and pretty much double what anyone else has as their salary cap.

€10m  Wow that is huge.  And is that for senior players, all players or overall club spend?

If you take the above, Toulon sink €2,736,000 on a tighthead, lock, outhalf, centre and wing.  If they have a squad of say 56 players (which is huge considering Leinster only have 39 according to another thread) then that still lets them drop €142,000 on average for each of the other players (which is close to €12,000 per month!).

thebandwagonsociety wrote:€10m  Wow that is huge.  And is that for senior players, all players or overall club spend?

If you take the above, Toulon sink €2,736,000 on a tighthead, lock, outhalf, centre and wing.  If they have a squad of say 56 players (which is huge considering Leinster only have 39 according to another thread) then that still lets them drop €142,000 on average for each of the other players (which is close to €12,000 per month!).

It is massive.

No rugby economy in the world outside of France can support that wage bill.

I'm not totally convinced that French rugby can support it. I reckon that the millionaire (well, possibly ex-millionaire) owners are having to pump more and more money in hence why the want more home games per season to maximise gate money
My biggest concern is that French rugby will go the way of English football where there are a high percentage of overseas players all warning big bucks and the international game will be of secondary importance

thebandwagonsociety wrote:€10m  Wow that is huge.  And is that for senior players, all players or overall club spend?

If you take the above, Toulon sink €2,736,000 on a tighthead, lock, outhalf, centre and wing.  If they have a squad of say 56 players (which is huge considering Leinster only have 39 according to another thread) then that still lets them drop €142,000 on average for each of the other players (which is close to €12,000 per month!).

2.8 million euro is merely what toulon gets from the local tax payer through council and region incentives. They dont really pay for the stadium too. The current salary cap apply to the squad (40 players in average) and there is a way around it for the likes of toulon as some players earn direct money from sponsors or even royalties on merchandising or media appearance. Thats how perpignan financed Dan Carter back in the day. Transfer bonuses are also excluded from such cap so its pretty pointless anyway. They might change that and thats why toulon chief was recently unhappy.
For all the bad things said about toulon its one the few clubs that dont lose money in france (mourad hasnt been investing his own personal cash for a year now). They spend a lot on players yes but the rest of their expenses is pretty low and the guy know how to take care of a business, look for sponsors and cut costs. I dont like him but I respect that hard work. ambition and dedication.

whocares, any idea how the loses are shared out? So Toulon make a profit. What about Toulouse and Clermont? Are they big losers or pretty even? In England Leicester and Saints are in profit out of the big guns. Gloucester and Exeter are in profit out of the chasing pack. Saracens are big loses out of the top runners and Quins not quite in profit but not that much. Bath are big losers out of the chasing pack as well. Worcester and Wasps aren't great but Irish aren't too bad (smaller loses than Quins. This is based on the 2010 figures which are last I've seen.

So there's a huge range in how the clubs are performing financially.

Regarding English salaries. I remember some talk that Nick Evans was one of the best payed players on around £300k (no references, think it was from someone here so iffy). Didn't Castro have to pay out £250k to buy out his last year? Suggests he was on about that.

4 clubs made a loss : toulouse (?), stade francais (6Million), perpignan and biarritz (2millions each). For toulouse its not a big deal, stade francais owner will have to spend some of his own fortune , perpignan found a new investor while biarritz is still in trouble.

Welshmushroom wrote:I'm mystified to see both Parra and Habana up there.  I can understand Fly Halves making top dollar but I would have thought that at least half in the top 10 would have been tighthead props.

Habana is going to have to score a silly amount of tries to justify that pay day.  Given the team Toulon have as well my gran could score at a good ratio so unless he's scoring 3 a match I cant see that pay day really being earned.

Parra is a good scrum half, no question but given the sheer amount of talent available in this position he must have had a good agent to secure that pay deal.  

Its all a bit bizarre if you ask me, the French clearly don't know how to spend their money.  

Parra is the 2nd best scrum half in the world by some distance and IMO the only one anywhere near Genia... Would waltz into a World 23

Welshmushroom wrote:I'm mystified to see both Parra and Habana up there.  I can understand Fly Halves making top dollar but I would have thought that at least half in the top 10 would have been tighthead props.

Habana is going to have to score a silly amount of tries to justify that pay day.  Given the team Toulon have as well my gran could score at a good ratio so unless he's scoring 3 a match I cant see that pay day really being earned.

Parra is a good scrum half, no question but given the sheer amount of talent available in this position he must have had a good agent to secure that pay deal.  

Its all a bit bizarre if you ask me, the French clearly don't know how to spend their money.  

Parra is the 2nd best scrum half in the world by some distance and IMO the only one anywhere near Genia... Would waltz into a World 23

Edit: forgot about Fotuali. Wouldn't waltz it then but by Maesteg's definition of World Class he's still clearly World Class and I'd stil have him ahead of Kahn

So all the fuss about the French system being unstable and propped up by wealthy backers is largely bull?

Only 4 English clubs made profit. All Irish Provinces have extra cash from IRFU (as in more than generated by TV, etc). The Regions get extra money from the WRU and at least the Scarlets are making a loss (not sure about the others). Not sure about the Scottish teams but pretty sure the SRU give them some.

So considering the FFR don't give them anything they're doing pretty well.

Out of interest, do those AP figures account for the club in the UK alone or do they encompass sister franchises in other countries, like Quins' Abu Dhabi and Kenyan branches that I've only recently learnt about?

HammerofThunor wrote:So all the fuss about the French system being unstable and propped up by wealthy backers is largely bull?

Only 4 English clubs made profit. All Irish Provinces have extra cash from IRFU (as in more than generated by TV, etc). The Regions get extra money from the WRU and at least the Scarlets are making a loss (not sure about the others). Not sure about the Scottish teams but pretty sure the SRU give them some.

So considering the FFR don't give them anything they're doing pretty well.

Sometimes the wealthy backers are hidden behind big sponsorships like in Castres (pierre fabre pharmaceutical empire) and to a lower extent clermont (michelin). So it's not always clear who is sort of financially sustainable. One thing is for sure is that they are mainly all dependent of the local economy so they are probably more affected by the recession than uk and ireland clubs (ok it might not show right now but pro rugby went from double digit growth figures in the previous 10 years to flatish in the last year)

Cyril wrote:It staggering how little they get paid compared to their football counterparts isn't it?

Jonny's on about £15,000 a week according to that which probably compares to an average Championship (old div 2) player.

I remember way back in around 1994/95 when Roy Keane was moving from Notts Forest. I think Blackburn were offering about £12,000 per week but he went to Man Utd for about £8,000 - £10,000 per week.


That was the top wage in English soccer then! It makes you wonder what way rugby will be in 10 - 20 years IF the game goes global.

Soccer had years of infancy in professionalism to grow the game globally, unfortunately rugby lost that chance. We already have huge investors like BT and Sky etc etc pumping TV money in raising the value of the game.

That will stop the sport becoming global beyond its current parameters. Unless the IRB stand in the way the poorer countries will lose all their players to the rich countries.

I dont think rugby will ever catch up with football/soccer in France at club level let alone in the rest of the world. Main reasons are that there is less games (14 teams vs 20) and that the teams are not spread throughout the country so the media exposure and advertisment revenue will never be the same. at global level its in even worst given none of the big markets (US, China, Brazil etc) are serious about rugby.

its a shame as at test level, rugby is already almost as popular as football in terms of tv viewing numbers (at least in france).

whocares wrote:I dont think rugby will ever catch up with football/soccer in France at club level let alone in the rest of the world. Main reasons are that there is less games (14 teams vs 20) and that the teams are not spread throughout the country so the media exposure and advertisment revenue will never be the same. at global level its in even worst given none of the big markets (US, China, Brazil etc) are serious about rugby.

its a shame as at test level, rugby is already almost as popular as football in terms of tv viewing numbers (at least in france).

International rugby has a far bigger market. It is what we should nurture and cherish, trouble is there is less money to be made from it for outside investors. Hense the rise in the rugby economy in France, England and Japan, high wages and massive funding from TV, advertisers and private investment.

maestegmafia wrote:Anyone know who the biggest earners are in the pro12, premiership or super Xv?

Its not published, but QC is talked about here as the highest paid at $850aud. $11k euro.

maestegmafia wrote:Anyone know who the biggest earners are in the pro12, premiership or super Xv?

Its not published, but QC is talked about here as the highest paid (just here) at $850aud. $11k euro.

Edit: Thats wrong isn't it. $11 pw which is 44-48 per month? If true, he won't get that again.

Shows what a high regard Wilko is held in despite the ramblings of a few on this board that continue to run him down.

Thankfully, there doesn't seem to be the same "prestige" attached to owning a rugby club which, hopefully, will ensure that Sheikh Mahand and others won't come in and buy up clubs left, right and centre like they have in soccerball.
I do still worry about the relative power that French clubs seem to have.

InjuredYetAgain wrote:I'm not totally convinced that French rugby can support it. I reckon that the millionaire (well, possibly ex-millionaire) owners are having to pump more and more money in hence why the want more home games per season to maximise gate money
My biggest concern is that French rugby will go the way of English football where there are a high percentage of overseas players all warning big bucks and the international game will be of secondary importance

The tv money in France increased again. Stations are competing to show rugby and it is increasing in popularity with viewers every year.

The salary cap was increased and the quota for French trained players was not increased as initially agreed so although the quota exists it is not as high as it should be and does not include how many of the 22 should be trained in France. But it does exist.

What surprises me about France is that the less wealthy clubs have not voted to keep the salary cap lower. There might be some dodgy dealing going on here.

InjuredYetAgain wrote:
I do still worry about the relative power that French clubs seem to have.

I share your concern. I don't understand what they have to gain by raising the cost of the game so high...! I don't think there have been any bidding wars for players that were heavily publicised, thus escalating figures so dramatically in a decade.

I certainly can't see the benefit of making the game so expensive either. It reduces the competition and more so the entertainment.

From memory there are six clubs in the top 14 who have the funds to meet this salary cap (€9.2 million I think) which although is a lot is still not the majority so it may be with tv money and advertising funds increasing year on year, the other clubs may think that they'll be there soon.

Having the highest wages in the world brings in the big names which brings in advertising revenue so I imagine that those with the funds to get these players they see it as a good investment.

wrfc1980 wrote:Shows what a high regard Wilko is held in despite the ramblings of a few on this board that continue to run him down.

I guess there's a few things that go into the salary calculations though part of it is playing power and part of it is punter pulling power.
JW has both. Anyway most running JW down are not saying he's no good, they're just saying he's not the greatest anymore. Anyway just because he might be paid more than others it doesn't necessarily mean he would be the better player just that overall the owners decided he is worth more.

Look at Cruden vs Carter. Probably not much difference in their playing power nowdays but where Carter is a some kind of make girls drool adonis Cruden is a short pimply kid.

Interestingly Carter was offered something like 4 mill over 3 years by Racing Metro in 2011. That would make it something like 110,000 per month. Not NZ peanut dollars too but the might pound.

ngan wrote:Look at Cruden vs Carter. Probably not much difference in their playing power nowdays but where Carter is a some kind of make girls drool adonis Cruden is a short pimply kid.

Indeed. Beckham wasn't paid megabucks solely for his footballing skills but also for his pretty boy image and other 'perfect' qualities.

Reputation sells shirts and tickets...

[quote="Portnoy's Complaint"]

ngan wrote:Look at Cruden vs Carter. Probably not much difference in their playing power nowdays but where Carter is a some kind of make girls drool adonis
Indeed. Beckham wasn't paid megabucks solely for his footballing skills but also for his pretty boy image and other 'perfect' qualities.

Guess Leo Cullen won't be standing by his phone waiting for a call then