Ireland's November Series and Beyond...

by RugbyFan182 Wed Oct 16, 2013 1:31 am

First topic message reminder :

Right boys, I want you give realistic guess of how Ireland will do in the November tests. I want you to separate your hearts from your heads. How do you predict Ireland will do and how will this set them up for the Six nations based on your poll prediction for the Autumn tests.

Do you believe in Schmidt? Do you believe he is the catalyst for consistent success or will we yet again disappoint by firing hot and cold like recent championships have dictated. Is there cause for quite confidence or should we be holding are cards close to our chest.

Feel free to throw out your wildest aspirations on the table or to throw caution to the wind.

The rest is up to you....

Sat 9th Ireland vs Samoa - Autumn
Sat 16th Ireland vs Australia - Autumn
Sun 24th Ireland vs New Zealand

by Gibson Fri Nov 08, 2013 11:26 pm

Golden wrote:McFadden is now a winger who can cover centre. not the other way around.

I think its the other way around. Thats how good he is. Even Deccie saw it.

by Don Alfonso Fri Nov 08, 2013 11:27 pm

Gibson wrote:
Don Alfonso wrote:
Gibson wrote:Oh ye fools for ye cannot see. McFadden is one player Joe will pencil in 1st. Deal with it.

Darcys time is almost up at Leinster and McFadden is already gelled into the Irish squad. Its just a matter of time. He moves inside continually and affects things as it is. That's why Joe plays him. Wants to see Bowe do the same thing. Go figure de math.
Letting go is hard, Gibbo, isn't it?
Ja.I never let go Don. Never.

I like a man what holds his ground.

by Artful_Dodger Fri Nov 08, 2013 11:29 pm

Gibson - I think what you are doing is looking at where gaps are going to appear in the Leinster squad (12 and 13) then looking at the Leinster players that might come into those positions. Then hyping up these players as the next best thing for Ireland ie; McFadden at 12. The reality is all the best centres coming through for Ireland are coming through at Ulster (Marshall, Olding, Payne).

by Standulstermen Fri Nov 08, 2013 11:31 pm

I would be very surprised if the likes of Tom Daly wasn't seen. The next Leinster 12 before McFadden is considered Gibbo. Thomas farrell is in there too but Daly has the size. I'm not sure he is going to make it but I think he has shown enough to want to ease him in at least during next season.

by Golden Fri Nov 08, 2013 11:31 pm

Gibson wrote:
Golden wrote:McFadden is now a winger who can cover centre. not the other way around.
I think its the other way around. Thats how good he is. Even Deccie saw it.

And played him on the wing.........

by Gibson Fri Nov 08, 2013 11:32 pm

Look lads, a new era begins tomorrow. The squad is picked. Its a fresh start. Some untested players to taste this level yet, but I believe in them. And Schmidt wont take mediocrity. Are we ready or wha?

Believe.

by ME-109 Fri Nov 08, 2013 11:33 pm

rodders wrote:
ME-109 wrote:
rodders wrote:
ME-109 wrote:
rodders wrote:
Notch wrote:Philip Matthews is a good guy. Don't be an ass rodders.
And one with a sense of humour too I'm told.
Maybe he said something good about ROG as well rodders is that the problem?
Sure its would take a man with a sense of humour to say something nice about ROG....
Or maybe just someone with a little bit of knowledge of the game Rodders...something you certainly can't be accused of...
Very kind of you ME, I'd be quite upset if people said I'd only a little knowledge of the game....

Absolutely rodders..old Matthews hasn't a clue

by The Great Aukster Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:29 am

McFadden is mistaken is he thinks playing in one position increases his Ireland chances. He isn't quick enough for wing and not physical enough for centre - in short he is a utility player, a conservative but solid option for consideration for the 23 shirt.

by Sin é Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:38 am

The Great Aukster wrote:McFadden is mistaken is he thinks playing in one position increases his Ireland chances. He isn't quick enough for wing and not physical enough for centre - in short he is a utility player, a conservative but solid option for consideration for the 23 shirt.

Placekicking is a skill in short supply in the Irish team.

by Golden Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:46 am

The Great Aukster wrote:McFadden is mistaken is he thinks playing in one position increases his Ireland chances. He isn't quick enough for wing and not physical enough for centre - in short he is a utility player, a conservative but solid option for consideration for the 23 shirt.

Well if he was still getting shifted around the backline he probably wouldnt be in the team, so it already has paid off.

Hes also probably the quickest player in the squad after maybe Kearney.

He wont ever be 1st choice but hes a very handy guy to have in the squads

by Sin é Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:55 am

ROG's take on McFadden (and Jackson).

Paddy Jackson may not play against Australia, so this is a huge opportunity for him against Samoa, even if my gut says that Fergus McFadden will be handed the kicking duties. It’s the perennial struggle for an international out-half who doesn’t kick — more latitude and less pressure to run the game or a kick the solar plexus? Jackson won’t like Schmidt’s call — if it be thus — but he may still get kicking responsibilities at some stage of the afternoon.

The coach knows McFadden well from Leinster and he may prefer to hand him the kicking tee in the first instance.

McFadden has an interesting style, a kind of snappy technique, but it’s accurate nonetheless. He practises hard, he doesn’t dip in and out of kicking and is very consistent in his performance. When he does routines, he is always with the kickers in Carton House, certainly as long as I can remember. It’s a nice reward for him too, to be one of the players given a major responsibility tomorrow.

I discussed the Sexton-Halfpenny kicking dynamic on the Lions tour before and there’s no question but that you take something from an out-half’s self-worth when he doesn’t kick the goals. It’s his raison d’etre you are messing with, but Paddy must think big picture here — he has a long career ahead and, all progressing at it should, he has plenty of time to take permanent ownership of the kicking tee.

It seems that McFadden is a Schmidt pet (Quinny was slagging him saying that the Leinster lads say he is in IRFU interview).

I can see why - he is a real grafter. Comes across as a really nice bloke as well and very popular.

I'm still laughing at him having a go on twitter at Jerry Flannery about looking like Ellen Degenerets (sp?). It was very funny and he was well able to hold his own with Fla which is quite a feat.

by geoff999rugby Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:45 am

Notch wrote:I like O'Mahony. Like many of our players he is not as good as his supporters make him out to be and absolutely nowhere near as bad as his detractors make him out to be! Similar to Heaslip. I've been a bit baffled by the idea that Kevin McLaughlin will displace O'Mahony for instance, even if he is a good grafter who complements SOB and Heaslip well and I don't get why the people who think moving O'Brien to 8 and dropping Heaslip think thats a good idea.

I think O'Mahony has all the attributes of a test class backrow and hopefully now he will put them all together at last.

I agree with all of that EXCEPT Heaslip should not be beyond replacing i.e his place is not safe.

Going forward (next three years or so) we have SOB, POM, Heaslip, Henry, Henderson, Ferris (BIG maybe)
That is the pool for selecting our backrow.
If there is no Ferris and Henderson is required in the second row (due to the fact no one under 30 is true test class.
For me Tuohy is a maybe and that's it

The other 4 are all going to be needed a lot and working out a backrow combination without any one of them will be key

by geoff999rugby Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:47 am

Engine#4 wrote:
Notch wrote: I've been a bit baffled by the idea that Kevin McLaughlin will displace O'Mahony for instance, even if he is a good grafter who complements SOB and Heaslip
Because McLaughlin, SOB and Heaslip have impressed as a unit at the highest level and POM, SOB and Heaslip have yet to do the same? If they do then well and good and I'm not saying "O'Mahony should be dropped" but I think the jury is out on the backrow as an entity.

Playing for Leinster is not the highest level - Internationals are.
McLaughlin is just short of test class

by geoff999rugby Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:52 am

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
Don Alfonso wrote:Kevin McLaughlin? McFadden at centre?

Lordy lord.
ye players that have won multiple HC's, they must be awful right?

News Flash every player in a HC winning side (even Toulon) is Test class.
The McFadden to 12 ship has long sailed - Marshall is already in the frame and Olding will be soon.
Schmidt never had much faith of McFadden as a 12, for Leinster, , even without Darcy, why would he now Headscratch

by geoff999rugby Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:55 am

Don Alfonso wrote:Just hope Olding delivers. You never can tell.

Don as I have posted elsewhere Ulster believe Olding, Henderson and Jackson are the real deal and will be outstanding test players
By comparison Marshall and Gilroy are merely considered good test players

One thing is for sure we are truly blest with the talent coming through

by geoff999rugby Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:00 am

Anyone I'm off in a couple of hours. Coach leaving at lunchtime

Lets cheer the boys to a victory and the start of a new era Yahoo

by **Notch** Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:03 am

Geoff I was more making the point that I can't understand why people would move O'Brien to 8 to replace Heaslip. Heaslip is undoubtedly a better technical 8 whilst SOB is an out and out flanker.

I wouldn't be expecting McFadden to start with the kicking duties- I can see him getting them later in the game if Jackson has an off day but I think we'll start with Jackson. Seems like that was contradicted by Kiss here;

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/rugby/jackson-backed-to-kick-on-249093.html

by asoreleftshoulder Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:20 am

ME-109 wrote:
asoreleftshoulder wrote:
ME-109 wrote:As with his tenure at leinster and similar to DK I believe old Joe will be quite conservative in his selections and not very experimental.
Well Schmidt has already shown a degree of experimentation that Kidney never did.O'Connell,Healy and SoB all on the bench against a team ranked ahead of us.

In the interest of balance however Kidney never had to experiment against a team ranked higher as we always had one relatively soft game in the AI's before this,I'm sure Schmidt would have used a soft game in that manner too if he had one.
Except that you conveniently ignore that both POC and SOB are still recuperating and did not train fully and Sexton/Earls/Zebo are not available. If all were fully fit they would be playing.

As Fly and Notch said it's more about how they play..

This is only my opinion but I believe Kidney would have started PoC,SoB and Healy.If they are fit enough to bench then they can't be too far off being fit enough to start and Kidney never in my memory (Scotland game in 09 being the exception that proves the rule) had a 1st team player on the bench for a Test match that was expected to be competitive.

by asoreleftshoulder Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:26 am

Notch wrote:It's true. You're going a wee bit overboard now.

He's an okay winger for Ireland. I'm happy now when he's selected he won't let us down and he's a hard worker with a nose for the tryline. Not sure I'd have him in the 23 when Zebo, Earls and Gilroy are all fit and he'll struggle to be a regular in the same way Bowe and Kearney are. He's a good player for Leinster, very consistent, and a good squad player for Ireland. I also like the fact he offers another place kicking option.

He's not getting gametime at centre for Leinster and hasn't for a while so it's a wee bit of a moot point as to whether he can play that role, I'd suggest he's not being thought of as a centre at this stage in his career.

I've seen a few people mention this but McFadden hasn't kicked for Leinster in over a year (I think),if we're struggling and Jackson is missing his kicks (which I don't expect to happen,I really rate Jackson) I want Madigan on instead of handing over the kicking duties to a guy who hasn't kicked in a competitive match since early 2012.

by **rodders** Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:38 am

Well I'm excited...and reasonably positive. Performance matters to me than the results and will hold fire to after the 6N to judge were things are going ... here's hoping for a good start, the end of the rot that's set in over the past few seasons...

by ME-109 Sat Nov 09, 2013 11:44 am

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
ME-109 wrote:
asoreleftshoulder wrote:
ME-109 wrote:As with his tenure at leinster and similar to DK I believe old Joe will be quite conservative in his selections and not very experimental.
Well Schmidt has already shown a degree of experimentation that Kidney never did.O'Connell,Healy and SoB all on the bench against a team ranked ahead of us.

In the interest of balance however Kidney never had to experiment against a team ranked higher as we always had one relatively soft game in the AI's before this,I'm sure Schmidt would have used a soft game in that manner too if he had one.
Except that you conveniently ignore that both POC and SOB are still recuperating and did not train fully and Sexton/Earls/Zebo are not available. If all were fully fit they would be playing.

As Fly and Notch said it's more about how they play..
This is only my opinion but I believe Kidney would have started PoC,SoB and Healy.If they are fit enough to bench then they can't be too far off being fit enough to start and Kidney never in my memory (Scotland game in 09 being the exception that proves the rule) had a 1st team player on the bench for a Test match that was expected to be competitive.

That is true but I would imagine he has an eye on the Australian and NZ games with regards to selection...

by asoreleftshoulder Sat Nov 09, 2013 11:54 am

ME-109 wrote:
asoreleftshoulder wrote:
ME-109 wrote:
asoreleftshoulder wrote:
ME-109 wrote:As with his tenure at leinster and similar to DK I believe old Joe will be quite conservative in his selections and not very experimental.
Well Schmidt has already shown a degree of experimentation that Kidney never did.O'Connell,Healy and SoB all on the bench against a team ranked ahead of us.

In the interest of balance however Kidney never had to experiment against a team ranked higher as we always had one relatively soft game in the AI's before this,I'm sure Schmidt would have used a soft game in that manner too if he had one.
Except that you conveniently ignore that both POC and SOB are still recuperating and did not train fully and Sexton/Earls/Zebo are not available. If all were fully fit they would be playing.

As Fly and Notch said it's more about how they play..
This is only my opinion but I believe Kidney would have started PoC,SoB and Healy.If they are fit enough to bench then they can't be too far off being fit enough to start and Kidney never in my memory (Scotland game in 09 being the exception that proves the rule) had a 1st team player on the bench for a Test match that was expected to be competitive.
That is true but I would imagine he has an eye on the Australian and NZ games with regards to selection...

I'd hope so,Marshall should get a start next week too.I think D'Arcy is playing well so far this season but Marshall just offers a strike threat he's no longer capable of and it would be nice to have at least one centre with real pace over 20 or 30 yards.

by geoff999rugby Sat Nov 09, 2013 11:58 am

Notch wrote:Geoff I was more making the point that I can't understand why people would move O'Brien to 8 to replace Heaslip. Heaslip is undoubtedly a better technical 8 whilst SOB is an out and out flanker.

I wouldn't be expecting McFadden to start with the kicking duties- I can see him getting them later in the game if Jackson has an off day but I think we'll start with Jackson. Seems like that was contradicted by Kiss here;

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/rugby/jackson-backed-to-kick-on-249093.html

Agree with that it would be POM rather than SOB who challenge Heaslip.
It wont happen though until Munster play him there - till then Heaslip is pretty safe

I agree Jackson to start with McFadden as insurance

by Rory_Gallagher Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:17 pm

Notch wrote:Geoff I was more making the point that I can't understand why people would move O'Brien to 8 to replace Heaslip. Heaslip is undoubtedly a better technical 8 whilst SOB is an out and out flanker.

I wouldn't be expecting McFadden to start with the kicking duties- I can see him getting them later in the game if Jackson has an off day but I think we'll start with Jackson. Seems like that was contradicted by Kiss here;

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/rugby/jackson-backed-to-kick-on-249093.html

The best number 8 in the world was once a specialist blindside, until he was around 25. The reason SOB moving to 8 in the future could be a good idea is that he has played very well there in the past (no problem with control at the base either) and he is able to cover all 3 positions. We have a luxury there in that if we do find a good 6/7/8 to play alongside him, he can shift and very quickly adjust. Nobody seems sure of his best position anymore because he has played so well in all 3 back row positions. He obviously plays flanker mostly.

The best flanking partnership I have seen in Ireland recently is O'Mahony and O'Donnell. For Munster, Stander will likely play 8 alongside these players and replace Coughlan. For Ireland, SOB at 8 is pretty like for like in that sense.

by Rory_Gallagher Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:20 pm

Another thing to note is that SOB will not always play at 7 for Leinster if Dan Leavy is as good as everyone makes him out to be. So he will be moved to 6 or 8 depending on where Heaslip/McLaughlin is at then, and the development of Ruddock or Ryan.

by Engine#4 Sat Nov 09, 2013 12:21 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:
Engine#4 wrote:
Notch wrote: I've been a bit baffled by the idea that Kevin McLaughlin will displace O'Mahony for instance, even if he is a good grafter who complements SOB and Heaslip
Because McLaughlin, SOB and Heaslip have impressed as a unit at the highest level and POM, SOB and Heaslip have yet to do the same? If they do then well and good and I'm not saying "O'Mahony should be dropped" but I think the jury is out on the backrow as an entity.
Playing for Leinster is not the highest level - Internationals are.
McLaughlin is just short of test class

I have not implied that playing for Leinster is the highest level. I have, however, accepted the Notch argument that 1 test (even if it was away to the All Blacks) does not a backrow make. I do think it's reason enough for the idea not to be discounted. But enough of that enjoy the match thumbsup

Could have sworn I saw McFadden kick a penalty recently (Munster?) but I hope Jackson takes the duties. He's kicking well and I think taking the responsibility to bang them over for Ireland will see him grow.

by Gibson Sat Nov 09, 2013 1:22 pm

I am looking forward to seeing possibly Ireland's key new component operate in a new era today. Plumtree.

Want to see him rebuild our lineout and scrum and turn them into weapons instead of weaknesses, as they have been recently. That will go a long way to us winning today and help us build a platform for the next 2 huge Tests and the future.

We don't need sexy rugby today, we need a win. If we get that, get our set-pieces right and show signs of our attacking potential during the game, I'll be a happy camper.

Really want to see Paddy J, McGrath and Toner have stormers under Schmidt & Co.

Ok lads, its All for One and One for All. No more bitchin...

Believe.

by Standulstermen Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:18 pm

Lads I didn't realise but this is on the beeb. I thought Sky bought the rights to our AIs and rte were scrambling their signal up here but it's advertised. Am I an idiot or is this great news?

by Gibson Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:25 pm

Hi Stand mate. guinness

Ja, its on RTE 2 and BBC 2 Norn Iron.

And yer not an eejit bro. Far prefer the fun and coverage of RTE and BBC to SKY.

by Gibson Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:26 pm

Oi Stand, what don't you open up a Match Day post mate?

This one is ready to blow.

by The Saint Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:29 pm

Standulstermen wrote:Lads I didn't realise but this is on the beeb. I thought Sky bought the rights to our AIs and rte were scrambling their signal up here but it's advertised. Am I an idiot or is this great news?

It's on the same time as Wales vs SA so obviously it's bad news.

by asoreleftshoulder Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:32 pm

Standulstermen wrote:Lads I didn't realise but this is on the beeb. I thought Sky bought the rights to our AIs and rte were scrambling their signal up here but it's advertised. Am I an idiot or is this great news?

That's good,it was a disgraceful move to sell out our NI fans like that.Unfortunately it looks like the block will come into effect next year.

by **Notch** Sat Nov 09, 2013 3:02 pm

The Saint wrote:
Standulstermen wrote:Lads I didn't realise but this is on the beeb. I thought Sky bought the rights to our AIs and rte were scrambling their signal up here but it's advertised. Am I an idiot or is this great news?
It's on the same time as Wales vs SA so obviously it's bad news.

It's on BBC NI.

by **profitius** Sat Nov 09, 2013 4:44 pm

Its a bit annoying that the Wales v SA game is on at the same time!

by Guest Sat Nov 09, 2013 4:55 pm

profitius wrote:Its a bit annoying that the Wales v SA game is on at the same time!

Yep, it's disappointing. Would like to have watched the Wales game live. Excited to see the Schmidt effect Very Happy

C'mon Ireland!!!

by Gibson Sat Nov 09, 2013 4:55 pm

Like goys, Stand set up a thread for the game. This thread will blow in a few posts.

Man I cant wait to see us kick off the New Era.

https://www.606v2.com/t49516-ireland-v-samoa-545pm

by **profitius** Sat Nov 09, 2013 6:25 pm

Not a great performance from Ireland so far. The backs have done nothing only kicking away possession.

by **profitius** Sat Nov 09, 2013 6:36 pm

BOD blows the try there. Shocked

by **profitius** Sat Nov 09, 2013 6:40 pm

Ireland 14 - 6 Samoa at half time.

by RugbyFan182 Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:13 pm

Think ingot to hard lads. 40 - 9 is a good result.

by RugbyFan182 Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:15 pm

Your thinking too hard lads I meant. Disregard bad spelling above its ipad autocorrect

by Gibson Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:42 pm

RugbyFan182 wrote:Think ingot to hard lads. 40 - 9 is a good result.

I reckon so mo chara. I really reckon so. The newbies showed up. Joe stamped his mark with a win. Big boys to come back.

The New Era is up and running. Albeit 15 years later...

All good.

by mystiroakey Sun Nov 10, 2013 2:59 am

Good score by you lot. Samoa are no mugs!!

Didn't watch the game mind. But that is encouraging/

by **profitius** Tue Nov 12, 2013 11:36 pm

Analysis on POM's display against Samoa

http://thescore.thejournal.ie/peter-omahony-analysis-1171482-Nov2013/?utm_source=shortlink

by toml Thu Nov 14, 2013 9:51 pm

What is big Rodney ah you like for Connacht? Just noticed he is Irish Qualified. Maybe he will usurp mike ross

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