Do people really hate Manchester United?

First topic message reminder :

Following the comments of Phil Jones today I wanted to ask you guys, is it true that people really hate Man UTD and want to see them fail?

I personally don't hate them, even as a Liverpool fan. However I think some of their fans that I know personally are as daft as a brush and have a belief that football started with the premier league and that anything before it didn't happen.

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:It's not jealousy. United are not the first successful British club.

certainly been the biggest in the current era, which will effect the most fans, also mr Ferguson has a good way of rubbing people up the wrong way

compelling and rich wrote:

Hibbz wrote:My personal dislike from Man Ure comes from their habit of continuously buying other teams best players. As a Forest fan through the 80's I can name Birtles, Davenport, and Webb. Then there was also Keane in the 90's but by then my interest in football had started to wane so it wasn't quite so painful.

I guess others I can think of include Robson from West Brom, Bruce from Norwich, Pallister from Middlesboro and Ince from West Ham.

Even now if I look at the team there's Van Persie, Rooney, Ferdinand, Young and Moses.

Not something you can particularly criticise them for for but it won't make fans of other clubs like you much if you pinch their favourite players.

I guess once you get less involved and passionate about the game you see it for the pantomime it is but at the time.............

first off young was a best player at a club   

and unless your talking about remi moses, victor went to chelsea

Yes he was talking about remi moses

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:

Hibbz wrote:My personal dislike from Man Ure comes from their habit of continuously buying other teams best players. As a Forest fan through the 80's I can name Birtles, Davenport, and Webb. Then there was also Keane in the 90's but by then my interest in football had started to wane so it wasn't quite so painful.

I guess others I can think of include Robson from West Brom, Bruce from Norwich, Pallister from Middlesboro and Ince from West Ham.

Even now if I look at the team there's Van Persie, Rooney, Ferdinand, Young and Moses.

Not something you can particularly criticise them for for but it won't make fans of other clubs like you much if you pinch their favourite players.

I guess once you get less involved and passionate about the game you see it for the pantomime it is but at the time.............

first off young was a best player at a club   

and unless your talking about remi moses, victor went to chelsea

Yes he was talking about remi moses

last time i checked remi wasnt in the current united squad

compelling and rich wrote:

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:

Hibbz wrote:My personal dislike from Man Ure comes from their habit of continuously buying other teams best players. As a Forest fan through the 80's I can name Birtles, Davenport, and Webb. Then there was also Keane in the 90's but by then my interest in football had started to wane so it wasn't quite so painful.

I guess others I can think of include Robson from West Brom, Bruce from Norwich, Pallister from Middlesboro and Ince from West Ham.

Even now if I look at the team there's Van Persie, Rooney, Ferdinand, Young and Moses.

Not something you can particularly criticise them for for but it won't make fans of other clubs like you much if you pinch their favourite players.

I guess once you get less involved and passionate about the game you see it for the pantomime it is but at the time.............

first off young was a best player at a club   

and unless your talking about remi moses, victor went to chelsea

Yes he was talking about remi moses

last time i checked remi wasnt in the current united squad

Are you sure?

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:

Hibbz wrote:My personal dislike from Man Ure comes from their habit of continuously buying other teams best players. As a Forest fan through the 80's I can name Birtles, Davenport, and Webb. Then there was also Keane in the 90's but by then my interest in football had started to wane so it wasn't quite so painful.

I guess others I can think of include Robson from West Brom, Bruce from Norwich, Pallister from Middlesboro and Ince from West Ham.

Even now if I look at the team there's Van Persie, Rooney, Ferdinand, Young and Moses.

Not something you can particularly criticise them for for but it won't make fans of other clubs like you much if you pinch their favourite players.

I guess once you get less involved and passionate about the game you see it for the pantomime it is but at the time.............

first off young was a best player at a club   

and unless your talking about remi moses, victor went to chelsea

Yes he was talking about remi moses

last time i checked remi wasnt in the current united squad

Are you sure?

yeah, i know giggs is ticking along a bit at a fairly old age but think remi would take the biscuit at the age of 53

compelling and rich wrote:

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:It's not jealousy. United are not the first successful British club.

certainly been the biggest in the current era, which will effect the most fans, also mr Ferguson has a good way of rubbing people up the wrong way

Quite obviously, but whereas Liverpool were reasonably popular in some quarters, United never have been the neutrals team. I think its different eras, but my dislike of United certainly wouldnt be considered jealousy.

I find the thought of that belies the arrogance of Manchester United that people dont like. I support West Ham, I have never been conditioned that success would be winning titles and trying to keep up with Europe's elite. We pride ourselves on different challenges. Manchester United fans will never understand the joys of supporting a club like West Ham.

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:It's not jealousy. United are not the first successful British club.

certainly been the biggest in the current era, which will effect the most fans, also mr Ferguson has a good way of rubbing people up the wrong way

Quite obviously, but whereas Liverpool were reasonably popular in some quarters, United never have been the neutrals team. I think its different eras, but my dislike of United certainly wouldnt be considered jealousy.

I find the thought of that belies the arrogance of Manchester United that people dont like. I support West Ham, I have never been conditioned that success would be winning titles and trying to keep up with Europe's elite. We pride ourselves on different challenges. Manchester United fans will never understand the joys of supporting a club like West Ham.

bit unfair to the older generations of united fans that dolph, they had to wait a fair bit untill fergies first title and we was always a well supported club back then. a lot like myself were born into a generation of united being the best, i was one when fergie took over and just getting to the age when you can fully appreciate football by the time of the first title

not sure i see too much "joy" in supporting west ham  

I wouldnt say its the older fans that are disliked. Its the younger group who have been in it since Fergie was in.

There isn't any perceivable joy, I guess most of it stands from those brief moments when it isnt a nightmare

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:

compelling and rich wrote:

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:It's not jealousy. United are not the first successful British club.

certainly been the biggest in the current era, which will effect the most fans, also mr Ferguson has a good way of rubbing people up the wrong way

Quite obviously, but whereas Liverpool were reasonably popular in some quarters, United never have been the neutrals team. I think its different eras, but my dislike of United certainly wouldnt be considered jealousy.

I find the thought of that belies the arrogance of Manchester United that people dont like. I support West Ham, I have never been conditioned that success would be winning titles and trying to keep up with Europe's elite. We pride ourselves on different challenges. Manchester United fans will never understand the joys of supporting a club like West Ham.

Well that's a load of twaddle, Liverpool weren't that popular in the 80s.

They too bought the best players, had the manager who made quips about other sides and the arrogance that came with being top dog. The Scandinavian day trippers.

Ask anyone who was around then and you will see.

You were around for cheslea, did people admire mourinho a ruthless winning machine, or were they constantly taunted about buying the title and having no history.

More crap about united, the club has record attendances for the second tier in the league and has always had a huge local following, developed a huge global following following Munich and around the fifth Beatle.

Just really ignorant to say you hate a club because of the younger fans who are used to success- and it is down to jealousy my friend- like I've already said all football clubs have undesirable traits and stupid fans.

It isnt jealousy, that exact train of thought is arrogance. I dont want to be a Man United fan. I dont really want that identity of success either.

Liverpool were more popular in their heyday than United are now. I know many an older fan who would have counted Liverpool as their second team. It was in a day where more fans actually wanted English clubs to do well in Europe for doing well in the country.

Chelsea is a different animal. I wouldnt suggest they have ever been popular. United used to have a base of popularity on the back of tragedy. But most clubs used to have more bases of popularity as it was a very different game.

Frankly, every club has an awful group to it, but Man United have a different identity to that. Theres the thugs and the fighters, those who will give out foul abuse too. But no other club has that tag along generation. United were the first English side to embrace the marketing world fully, and that has never stood well with many English fans either.

You are only confirming stereotypes now by claiming people are jealous. I dont think anyone really is, most fans dont have a diet of success so they dont really see it as their pinnacle. I did the glory hunting thing, and then I grew up.

I remeber Liverpool's heyday pretty well, and whilst not being disliked, I can't recall anyone having them as their second team.
In truth many many fans felt aggrieved with their fans after Heysel. The team though were great to watch.

I know plenty who would have. They had their detractors too, but it's not like they were unique for misbehaving.

But they were definitely more popular in success than Man United of this era have been

Fergie is probably the biggest reason as to why Utd are despised by some. His big mouth, watch watching, and manner will always rub a few up the wrong way. Even so, I still respect and admire the man.

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:I know plenty who would have. They had their detractors too, but it's not like they were unique for misbehaving.

'misbehaving' is a very generous under-selling of the Heysel disaster that set English football back about 2 decades.

Anybody who says they aren't jealous of the success to a degree is a liar in my opinion. I've met plenty of other supporters over my time who have said whilst they're happy supporting their team, they do wish they'd won what United have won.

But I guess it comes down to how you're bought into football.

compelling and rich wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I don't think anybody hates Manchester United.........I think it's more the fans peopl e have a problem with.......

One of the reasons I support City is because of the arrogance of the Utd fans when I first came here.....

Even now the stock answer for everything is "How many premierships have you won"...

Very hard to have a "conversation" with a Utd fan without them shoving Champion leagues and premierships in your face......

Better to just smile and leave it........

not arrogant just better  

well were for  while anyway!! and lets face it you only started supporting city when they got good plastic, never saw you on old 606 on any of the football boards or talking about football in general

Supported city since 1990...........After having to put up with a load of wallies at Keele ...............I must have posted maybe 30 posts on here in three or so years so the fact I don't post much shouldn't tell you any more than the fact I prefer other sports...

But I'm not a plastic fan..............Went to the old Maine road.......with my small boy as he was then...........and have been to the Etihad..

Unfortunately though you get comments like "Bought the premiership"..........Whereas Utd never bought any top players...............and "Plastic fans" whereas Utd don't have any of them..

Another reason why it's the fans and not the club people can't stand.

Tbh, that post just emphasises the jealousy point. If fans can't differentiate between a billionaire taking a nothing club, spending a couple of hundred million a season on a wholesale squad replacement at grossly inflated wages, and a club that grew organically and self-financed its transfer activities whilst keeping its wage bill under much better control than most other clubs in the league, then that's blind ignorance born out of misplaced hatred and jealousy.

Hatred and jealousy are strong words..

Utd's success is built on buying............Keane,Ronaldo, Cantona, Pallister, Bruce, Schmeichel...Sure they had a few home grown players.........But the vast majority were imports..

No harm to point that out............Hardly ned to be jealous now City have all the aces....

Just think all this plastic fan stuff and buying the prem is a bit silly........

EVERYBODY does it and everybody has them!!

Based on buying?? No offence mate, but that sounds terribly ignorant.

Ever heard of the Class of '92? There's a film all about them just about to come out, maybe have a watch.

That was the basis of United's success, purchases filled in around that and the success that team brought helped generate the revenues that funded the post-2000s purchases once the homegrown players impact's lessened.

The class of 92 included Keane, Schmeichel, Bruce, Pallister, Cantona, Yorke, Cole, Sheringham did it..

You are on the wind up.............With stupid words like Ignorant, Jealousy, Hatred....

I don't think you qre a Utd fan but you are making a good impression of one..

Have no doubt also you'd make a good impression of a City fan If I offered the alternate view..

Utd bought success...............Regardless of having some home grown players.........

It's a tiresome subject, really, isn't it?

As a United fan, I do have to say that some of the so called 'fans' of the club sicken me. Some of them do fall under the glory hunter tag, and it's people like me that make the effort to go and see them and put my money into the club that also get tarred with the same brush.

However, I think this 'hate' is also bred from ignorance of supporters of other clubs also. Should put more effort into their own team than slinging mud at another. Simple.

I agree...........They should be more like Utd fans...........Who sing songs about hillsborough and never sling mud...

Geez............. 

The arrogance..

Like I said you can talk to other supporters from different clubs..........But with Utd it's "When you win as many premierships and champions leagues as us"..

You're wonderful..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:The class of 92 included Keane, Schmeichel, Bruce, Pallister, Cantona, Yorke, Cole, Sheringham did it..

You are on the wind up.............With stupid words like Ignorant, Jealousy, Hatred....

I don't think you qre a Utd fan but you are making a good impression of one..

Have no doubt also you'd make a good impression of a City fan If I offered the alternate view..

Utd bought success...............Regardless of having some home grown players.........

How many home-grown players have aided Chelskie or Citeh's success? None.

United's "you can't win anything with kids" title winning side included Giggs, Becks, Butt, Scholes, G Nev, P Nev. That's 60% of the outfield players and includes the greatest midfielder this country has produced in 20 yrs, another Top5er, the best RB in 20 years and a winger who's played at the top for over 20 years and has more records that most Chelsea/Citeh players can count.

Keane, Cole and B Rob were the only record transfers, the rest were much of a muchness and not remotely comparable to Citeh or Chelski paying £30m+ for squad players.

United built success, Chelsea and especially City bought it. There's a difference, whether you choose to be blind to it or not.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I agree...........They should be more like Utd fans...........Who sing songs about hillsborough and never sling mud...

Geez............. 

The arrogance..

Like I said you can talk to other supporters from different clubs..........But with Utd it's "When you win as many premierships and champions leagues as us"..
You're wonderful..

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, now where have we heard that phrase before?? Rings a bell I just can't suss why.........

Pretty much as I thought..

You criticise Utd...You're jealous and a hater............

The fans are a paragon of virtue...

they didn't buy the premiership like everyone else does..........

Veron, Cantona, Van persie, Ronaldo, Keane, Pallister, Bruce, Schmeichel, Ferdinand, Rooney, Vidic, Nani, Valencia, Yorke, Cole, DeGea, Rafael, Evra, Berbatov, Young, ......etc etc..

they are all home grown.......

Let's just leave it.............Didn't expect any better.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I agree...........They should be more like Utd fans...........Who sing songs about hillsborough and never sling mud...

Geez............. 

The arrogance..

Like I said you can talk to other supporters from different clubs..........But with Utd it's "When you win as many premierships and champions leagues as us"..

You're wonderful..

That's not quite what I said pal, but if you want to twist everyone's opinion to aid your own point then go ahead flower, you're doing a cracking job of making yourself look like a moron!

I don't endorse United fans singing about Hillsborough, I disagree with that like I disagree with other clubs singing about Munich. That isn't being a football fan, that's just being a nonsensical thug.

Funny thing is that's just more evidence of the same.

You're not reading what is written but what you want to perceive is written in order to sustain your dislike.

Never said United fans were a paragon of virtue, very clear they're as bad and as good as any other.

Of all those players listed only a couple are pre-2000s (after which I said United relied more on spending than homegrown), which is the era upon which United's recent success has been built, and only 2 you've listed were a record transfer.

Basically what you're trying to say, or at least it's what you're suggesting, is that any club that spends any more than 1p on any player in their entire history can be said to have 'bought' their success as there's no difference between paying £30m+ for a squad player and paying a market (not high) price for a first XI player, therefore the whole 'buying success' concept is redundant.

So if Carlos Slim bought my beloved Oxford United tomorrow and spent £1bn over 5 seasons to take us to an EPL title we'd be able to say we did it all of our own back.

Wonderful stuff.

United are rich through being successful

City are successful through being rich

compelling and rich wrote:United are rich through being successful

City are successful through being rich

Exactly, well put.

compelling and rich wrote:

The Fourth Lion wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Sorry that's a BS excuse fourth lion, so you can't be offended by something if you weren't born at the time?

I'll start to change my views on life so that slavery, wars and anything in history doesn't offend, what complete and utter nonsense.

I'm glad you're sorry.  You should be.  And your comments are.

Your apology is accepted.


Yes, you can be offended by something that isn't within your life experience, but significantly less so than with things that actually affected you personally.  When something touches your own personal life for real, it matters more.

But it is somewhat telling when I can amuse myself at the expense of the ignorant who have almost absolutely no knowledge of what happened, save for the fact that an airplane with some footballers in it crashed once, a long time ago.  

Watching the United v Liverpool match in a pub last season, when a plea for respect was made by both managers before the game, one loudmouth started going on about Heysel.  I said to him that it was a shame about Munich, and how, at the time, Bayern Munich offered to forfeit the second leg of the tie out of respect.  "Yeah, mate.  Class that was." he replied.  

Having established that this clown didn't know the first thing that he was talking about, I then proceeded to reel him in, saying how sad it was that Matt Busby died from his injuries, but at least Duncan Edwards went on to play a hundred times for England.   "Yeah, mate.  Us United supporters have got a lot to be proud of".  And so it went on while those standing around sniggered behind their hands at the total eejit he was making of himself.  I don't know how I kept a straight face.

Faux indignation.  There's a lot of it about.

im glad you take such amusement from the deaths of 23 people, showing your true colors there

i would also suggest it wouldnt be clever to do the same in any of the pubs in manchester that i go in as you wouldn't get away with it, always few idiots for any club in pubs spouting nonsense its hardly damming to the rest of the knowledgeable fans

for someone who claims to be a ex ref, you show a complete and utter lack of compassion and understanding of the munich air disaster

Au contraire, old chap.  I remember the Munich runway disaster very well, from when it happened and I wasn't showing a lack of compassion to those who died in my comments, I was expressing my amusement at the shallow, bandwagon jumping of younger <ahem> "fans" who clearly haven't the faintest clue of what happened at the time, but rather treat it in a vain and shallow way.  I'm not disgusted by them because they don't merit strong emotions.  They are just laughable.

As for being scared to do things in Mancs pubs, well, the trick to taking the mickey and not getting a glass in your face is to do it to loudmouths who are too thick to realise that they're being mocked.  I'd be fairly confident of walking out of most Manchester pubs with my features intact.

I wasn't aware that being a former referee bestowed any especial human feelings or sentiments. Rather, it can have a tendency to make one rather world-weary.   I'd estimate that I'm no more or less humane and compassionate than most.  

So, having debunked your comments, let's get back on topic, shall we..?

The antipathy towards Manchester United is something that the supporters could do something about if they took the trouble.

There is a belief  (whether it's justified or not is a matter of perception) that Manchester United fans in general, are shallow, vain, arrogant and triumphalist.  Plenty of unpleasant characteristics there.  Take your pick.  On the other hand, United fans may argue that when you're the best, you have every right to be that way.  There are two sides to every argument.

Perhaps this frisson adds to the spice of the game.  Wouldn't it be a dull old world without something to get us all going, eh..?  

I personally do not hate Manchester United.  I admire the club, their history and achievements.  I wish a bit of sniping was all that Portsmouth had to worry about, and if that was the price of 20 Premiership titles and 3 European Cups, not to mention all the other pots that litter the Old Trafford mantelpiece, I'd settle for that and gladly.  

So, there is a clear choice on offer here..... United fans can become nicer people.  They can be less unpleasant towards fans of other clubs and even perhaps learn to show a little humility (and stop making fatuous arguments to justify execrable behaviour), or they can just man up and stop complaining when other supporters bitch about them and accept that it goes with the territory.

Your choice.




PS added some time later: It has just occurred to me.... You quoted the number of people who died at Munich in your response to me. I presume that was because you care deeply about them all. I wonder how you would feel about the inclusion of Manchester City in the Munich commemorations. After all, one of those among the dead was Frank Swift. But then, you knew that. Of course you did.

Frank Swift was working as a journalist on the trip, but as he was a former goalkeeper for Manchester City, would it not be humane and compassionate for Manchester United to include City in a formal and prominent way..?

Everton fans are often included by Liverpool in the Hillsborough commemorations and that speaks volumes for the people of that city and the decency of the two club's rivalry.

How do you feel about including City in the Munich memorials...?

Of course I knew about the city player, I explain it to all the thick city fans who call us Munich all the time.  I also have no problems if city or any other club want to mourn the perished of the disaster, in fact I think they all should they were all human at the end if the day it shouldn't matter what club they played for.

Generally city are not as bad as the likes of Leeds and Liverpool though  they showed that on the anniversary of munich derby game

Some of the younger generation may jump on the bandwagon and don't understand fully about munich, I certainly havent met anyone as stupid as your example and I can hazard a guess I know a lot more united fans than you. But even if they are they are still trying to support the diaster. Rather take that than people mocking it

You also talk about those traits of united fans like its solely us, there are elements to every single club with fans like that not just united and united are hardly the worse when it comes to needing to be nicer to other set of fans

compelling and rich wrote:You also talk about those traits of united fans like its solely us, there are elements to every single club with fans like that not just united and united are hardly the worse when it comes to needing to be nicer to other set of fans

You are quite right that it is not only Manchester United supporters who have that kind of element. Most large clubs have their fair share of fools and hangers-on and it is fair comment to point that out.

However..... this thread is specifically about Manchester United so as much as I agree with you on the one hand, on the other I would have to say that the foolish element of other clubs is an irrelevance in this particular discussion.

With regard to Munich, I think we have both had our fair say on that issue so I would consider it an exhausted sub-topic now.

It cannot be denied that there is a significant amount of antipathy towards Manchester United, some of which is justified by the behaviour of their supporters and former manager, and some is just plain jealousy at United's remarkable level of success.

I doubt very much that we could ever get to the root cause of it all and find any sort of solution. Football fans, after all, are tribal mammals. At the end of the day, it is what it is and United supporters have to do something about it or just learn to cope with it. We had a saying in the Navy.... 'Put up or shut up'.

As for those who have been eagerly anticipating the demise of Manchester United, post Sralex, there could be no better riposte to them than to win the league title. Again. But please.... try to do it graciously.

You never know..... It may just win you a few friends, too.

I have never bought into the hate. But yes plenty do hate them.

United do have a record of being populated with some of the least appealing personalities in the football.

Rooney with his snarling, swearing and prostitutes; Keane with his snarling, swearing and attempted leg breaks; Super Injunction Giggsy; Winking Ronaldo; Paul "Guv'nor" Ince; Kung Fu Cantona; all led by Ferguson with his watch tapping, berating of referees and bans on the media.

It's not all bad of course. I respect how they develop local talent and I doubt any club contributes more to the national team. And I can't forget that they've produced some pretty good football along the way!

But they're very easy to dislike.

'Winky Ronaldo' pretty much sums up the point and supports the ignorance and jealousy arguments perfectly. As do pretty much all those other examples. Especially funny that the majority of that list make up some of the greatest players to have ever graced the EPL.

TopHat24/7 wrote:'Winky Ronaldo' pretty much sums up the point and supports the ignorance and jealousy arguments perfectly.  As do pretty much all those other examples.  Especially funny that the majority of that list make up some of the greatest players to have ever graced the EPL.

The quality of their football is irrelevant to how likeable they are as personalities. Can we only dislike players who aren't very good?

As for "ignorance", what am I ignorant of? Enlighten me.

The way you choose minimal indiscretions by United players in order to justify hatred of the entire club.

What a racist Terry? Bar-brawler Gerrard? All worse than winking when a result/decision goes your way or reacting to a barrage of racism being screamed in your face.

Gerrard has also benefitted from super-injuctions. Ashley Cole's numerous indiscretions too.

There's bad eggs all over the place. The reality is bitter jealousy causes people to create reasons to justify their hate.

Tophat, it's all down to jealousy and some people are just too stupid to realise - why bother?

If we had been mid table for 20 years no one would care.

to turn it around i have only really had big rivalry with opposite teams when they have been a challenge to us. i don't know many united fans who hate the likes of wigan, WBA etc (no offence to those fans). but the likes of mourinho's chelsea team, wengers invincibles, even when liverpool were trying to challenge it stokes up the rivalry even more and now city. i couldnt care less about teams we beat week in week out

Well, I'm not sure that trying to break another player's leg or kicking a fan or sleeping with your brother's wife or banning the media whom you are contractually obliged to speak to are strictly "minimal indiscretions".

And what have Terry or Cole got to do with it? Totally unappealing characters but the thread is about not liking Man U.

Bitter jealousy? I don't care enough to get anywhere near that.

Ent wrote:Tophat, it's all down to jealousy and some people are just too stupid to realise - why bother?

If we had been mid table for 20 years no one would care.

Yes, there is no reason to dislike United apart from jealousy. What a daft argument.

HM Murdoch wrote:

Ent wrote:Tophat, it's all down to jealousy and some people are just too stupid to realise - why bother?

If we had been mid table for 20 years no one would care.

Yes, there is no reason to dislike United apart from jealousy. What a daft argument.

Well you've failed to prove otherwise so far....

TopHat24/7 wrote:

HM Murdoch wrote:

Ent wrote:Tophat, it's all down to jealousy and some people are just too stupid to realise - why bother?

If we had been mid table for 20 years no one would care.

Yes, there is no reason to dislike United apart from jealousy. What a daft argument.

Well you've failed to prove otherwise so far....

Yes, I've normally got a lot of time for people who sleep with their brother's wife, or who tell courts that women are trying to blackmail them when they're not, or who try to break people's legs etc etc.

But the fact these guys play for Man U is beyond the Pale. I have standards!

They 'happen' to play for United. The fact they do is totally irrelevant to their indiscretions.

Unless you're consistent and also hate every other football club that happens to have the occasional naughty naughty boy playing for them??

Leeds, Liverpool, Chelsea all being immediate write-offs from memory. Possibly Arsenal too.

TopHat24/7 wrote:They 'happen' to play for United.  The fact they do is totally irrelevant to their indiscretions.

Only if you judge whether you like a team purely on their style of football and ignore the personalities of the players. Does anyone really do that?

Since you raise them:

Chelsea: Post-Abramovic, they are probably the least likeable team of the last decade.

Liverpool: Not keen on Suarez or Dalglish. Gerrard is not the demi-god he's presented as. I've forgiven them for the white suits now though.

Leeds: The Bowyer-era team was a rogues gallery but, beyond that, the reputation seems to be based on the 70s.

Arsenal: Wenger's "I didn't see it" became ludicrous, Vieira seemed a bit of a berk but they don't annoy me too much.

But you keep coming back to this "hate". All I ever said was they've had some of the least appealing players and that they are easy to dislike.

Ok then, let's switch 'hate' for 'dislike'.

You must 'dislike' a large number of the clubs active today as they've all had or have a number of dislikeable donuts play for them.

I dont understand the hating other clubs mentality.

We have talked about rivalry's which I dont buy into but I do understand.

If you are a citeh or Liverpool fan a bit of united hate is justified, if you are a palace or stoke fan- I dont get it!

BUt this hate wont last forever United fans, and its because you are slip sliding away!

You are only hated because you have been successful.

Rarely to you find as much hate for Chelsea due to Terry, Liverpool because of Suarez or any team with Joey Barton!!!!

people don't like winners, Mystir. You and palace will be loved  

Wife supports Utd, I support Liverpool. She is gracious enough to say a few complimentary things about LFC when they play well and tries not to rub it in when we lose. I'm learning to keep quiet and feign sadness although I have no doubt that she was as secretly delighted we drew with Everton as I was when Cardiff equalised but we'd rather die that admit it to each other.

I'm supposed to hate Man City because she tells me I have to and yet I'm a huge admirer of Sergio Aguero (him and Suarez would be lethal but let's not give City any ideas). Also got a lot of time for Juan Mata. For whatever reason I probably dislike Arsenal and Spurs more than Utd.

I'm sure Yoda outs in better than everyone else when he talks about fear leading to hate. Perhaps the hatred comes from the fear that one team is likely to beat yours whenever & wherever they play.

Do I hate Utd? No. I just feel a bit sad when they win and more cheerful when they play badly (I've been quite happy of late!)