HC round 2 - Munster vs Perpignan and Toulouse vs Connacht

by Artful_Dodger Sun 08 Dec 2013, 12:45 pm

First topic message reminder :

No thread, so thought I might as well make one.

Munster: Felix Jones; Keith Earls, Casey Laulala, James Downey, Johne Murphy; Ian Keatley, Conor Murray; Dave Kilcoyne, Damien Varley, Stephen Archer; Donncha O'Callaghan, Paul O'Connell; Peter O'Mahony (capt), Sean Dougall, James Coughlan.
Replacements: Duncan Casey , James Cronin, BJ Botha, Billy Holland, CJ Stander, Cathal Sheridan, JJ Hanrahan, Denis Hurley

Perpignan: James Hook (capt); Joffrey Michel, Tommaso Benvenuti, Watisoni Votu, Sofiane Guitoune; Camille Lopez, Tom Ecochard; Sebastien Taofifenua, Romain Terrain, Paulica Ion; Luke Charteris, Guillaume Vilaceca' Jean-Pierre Perez, Alasdair Strokosch, Justin Purll
Replacements: Maxime Delonca, Kisi Pulu, Jean Baptiste Custoja, Sebastien Vahaamahina, Dewaldt Duvenage, Tommy Allan, Richard Haughton, Dan Leo,

by Golden Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:14 pm

Ye I think in those situations the ref should go with his gut instinct. Too much time is taken up by the TMO. It seems like the majority of tries are been sent upstairs this season,

by The Saint Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:15 pm

Notch wrote:They do yeah, they each have their own individual CEO but they are beholden to the IRFU. The system is much more centralised than any other NH nation.

It's worked well- Munster, Leinster and Ulster are well run businesses now whilst the IRFU still have great access to players and support for the national team.

Yeah it's certainly worked well, results wise too. Most of this achievements surpassed with a majority of Irishmen in every team. A year or two after you guys went Provincial the results drastically changed and to this day the teams are still very successful.

by Rory_Gallagher Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:16 pm

The Saint wrote:Heaslip is the best back-row in Ireland...

Gonna be honest, I forgot about Heaslip there. He would be similar in terms of natural talent to O'Mahony I reckon. Very good footwork, very good awareness and could probably play in the backs in his heyday.

However, he also struggles with consistency.

by Golden Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:18 pm

Now for Connacht to make it 4 from 4............

by **profitius** Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:19 pm

SecretFly wrote:Okay...so I'm not sure how you could accurately compare the three Irish Provincial games so far. And ideally I wouldn't even want to as I'm delighted they all showed that they're up for the challenge. Nothing remotely close to being won yet, and still a long way to go. But the three of them are making a point that if other sides want to play rugby in this here HEC, then they'll have to play rugby with a capital R.

But just looking at how the three Provinces go about their business.

Ulster - in no mood give a sucker a break in their game against Treviso. Just how I like to see a team perform. It's not to insult the opponent (like some Irish sides seemed to have thought about these things in the past) but simply to ram home the idea that intensity lasts against any side - strong or weak.

Leinster - in no mood to let Saints back into their home game - again the importance of an 80 minute game attitude

..... and Munster - some heave ho! - a ciggie break...some more stuff - stop for sandwiches.... and *yawn* "yeah, let's go for another one" at the end.

And they get 36 without really having gotten too panicked or adrenalinised about it.

I really like the diversity of the Provinces styles, and I have a real soft spot for Munster's unique, almost apathetic, way of doing the business with perhaps less pomp and circumstance than the other two, but still lethargically signing in a performance that does enough for now.

I'm not saying I'd coach a side to play like them but I love their unique attitude and calm self belief - even through the fumbles.

A long way to go. Anything could and probably will happen; and it still could be a complete AP and Top14 show towards the closing stages. But for now - you couldn't be but happy at the levels the three Provinces got to this weekend.

Ulster and Leinster have far more talent in the backs (centers and back 3). Up front its a different story but its a big handicap overall for Munster.

by SecretFly Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:19 pm

Golden wrote:Now for Connacht to make it 4 from 4............

Now that would eclipse them all.........!

by **rodders** Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:20 pm

wow Connacht 6 -0 against Toulouse.

by wolfball Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:28 pm

We are absorbing Toulouse pretty well. Hens haw having a good game.

by Golden Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:31 pm

Do people see Henshaw ending up at 13? Hes always seemed better at fulback to me.

by **rodders** Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:35 pm

SecretFly wrote:Okay...so I'm not sure how you could accurately compare the three Irish Provincial games so far.

Well at this stage I'd say 3 provinces look good for the QF - Based on the performances though Leinster I'd say look like a side likely to win it, Ulster a side with the potential to win it and Munster a side who I'd be very surprised to see win it.

I don't think there's much between the 3 main provinces but Leinster have raised the bar again. Mind you an away win against Toulouse might put Connacht at the top of the tree....

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:40 pm

Leicester following the example of some of the other big teams and thrashing Montpellier 24-6 - with 25 minutes gone.

Good to see that Saracens, Gloucester and Harlequins have all got good results this weekend and Leicester can hopefully join them.

That would be brilliant with all the uncertainty about the Heineken Cup. Really send out a strong message to the rest of Europe.

by SecretFly Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:45 pm

rodders wrote:
SecretFly wrote:Okay...so I'm not sure how you could accurately compare the three Irish Provincial games so far.
Well at this stage I'd say 3 provinces look good for the QF - Based on the performances though Leinster I'd say look like a side likely to win it, Ulster a side with the potential to win it and Munster a side who I'd be very surprised to see win it.

I don't think there's much between the 3 main provinces but Leinster have raised the bar again. Mind you an away win against Toulouse might put Connacht at the top of the tree....

Ah I'd agree with most of that Rodders ...except to say I'd still need to see what form Leinster are in next week before I'd do a reading on their potential yet.

Ulster for me feel a more safe bet for later stages. Not saying Leinster like yesterday wouldn't be a dangerous force but, like Ireland, it needs more consistency to prove it; and we're getting to the stage in the season where that consistency testing will now be done.

But Munster....................... my point about them was a roundabout coy way of saying I think they're the smartest team of all. They're beguiling and can hit you with a cannon-ball game when you least expect they have the ability to do so. They are past masters of coming in under the radar and being there or thereabouts at the end despite all media and gambling belief that they would be.

Beware Munster is the motto of HEC.

by SecretFly Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:49 pm

Pot Hale wrote:Leicester following the example of some of the other big teams and thrashing Montpellier 24-6 - with 25 minutes gone.

Good to see that Saracens, Gloucester and Harlequins have all got good results this weekend and Leicester can hopefully join them.

That would be brilliant with all the uncertainty about the Heineken Cup. Really send out a strong message to the rest of Europe.

Most especially to the PRL and McCafferty that English sides like being in Europe - playing rugby - not fretting about profit for profit's sake and voting rights. Players, coaches and fans want rugby............ that has been happening today and yesterday....and each of the six nations deserve places at the table.

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:51 pm

SecretFly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:Leicester following the example of some of the other big teams and thrashing Montpellier 24-6 - with 25 minutes gone.

Good to see that Saracens, Gloucester and Harlequins have all got good results this weekend and Leicester can hopefully join them.

That would be brilliant with all the uncertainty about the Heineken Cup. Really send out a strong message to the rest of Europe.
Most especially to the PRL and McCafferty that English sides like being in Europe - playing rugby - not fretting about profit for profit's sake and voting rights. Players, coaches and fans want rugby............ that has been happening today and yesterday....and each of the six nations deserve places at the table.

Indeed they do.

And now is the perfect time for the IRFU to take a lead and get the English teams back involved in the competition next year. That would be a worthwhile message to send out, as opposed to crowing and schadenfreude.

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 3:56 pm

Heartbreaker for Connacht just coming up half-time with the lead in Toulouse.

Jean Pascal Barrque goes through unimpeded to give the Rouge et Noirs a 7-6 half time lead.

by SecretFly Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:02 pm

If I was the IRFU, I'd ring Mccafferty and say "Enough. Just swallow your pride and lets continue this ERC thing for the next three to four years - just as it is - no changes to structures, no less auto places for some and the same number of auto places for others. The same HEC for the next three to four years, however long the Sky contract is for.

Then................... when that time is running out - ALL of us - as a unit - together - invite a bidding war for the TV rights to the next duration of European contest. Highest bidder wins - and if that's BT, so be it. Open transparent bidding, for all members to see - for the European contest, that includes all of us - not some of us.

That's what I'd say to McCafferty - and he'd tell me to go shove it up my ^&%!!!!!! Wink

by SecretFly Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:04 pm

Pot Hale wrote:Heartbreaker for Connacht just coming up half-time with the lead in Toulouse.

Jean Pascal Barrque goes through unimpeded to give the Rouge et Noirs a 7-6 half time lead.

Still... it's still okay. You couldn't disrespect Toulouse and say they don't have it in them to win easily. But all Connacht will want to do is make that statement untrue at the end. If they can manage that and keep Toulouse score down then they'll be unhappy they lost but tdelighted they competed.

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:07 pm

SecretFly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:Heartbreaker for Connacht just coming up half-time with the lead in Toulouse.

Jean Pascal Barrque goes through unimpeded to give the Rouge et Noirs a 7-6 half time lead.
Still... it's still okay. You couldn't disrespect Toulouse and say they don't have it in them to win easily. But all Connacht will want to do is make that statement untrue at the end. If they can manage that and keep Toulouse score down then they'll be unhappy they lost but tdelighted they competed.

And Connacht knock that on the head by defending brilliantly in the opening of the second half and take it up the other end and win a penalty.

Toulouse 7-9 Connacht.

by Golden Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:08 pm

Connacht back in the lead 7-9

by wolfball Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:11 pm

Back in front! We butchered an overlap though. I know we're brining the thread off topic but prob not enough conn fans to justify another thread.

by wolfball Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:11 pm

by Rory_Gallagher Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:12 pm

CONNACHT SCORE A TRY! Yahoo

Some great play by Robbie Henshaw leading up to it. He does look very talented.

by Golden Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:13 pm

Great stuff 7-16

by wolfball Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:14 pm

Our line speed in defense has been great

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:14 pm

And another brilliant back line run up the touchline by Henshaw and Carr sees them power it over and after consultation with TMO for possible forward pass and proper grounding, Connacht get the try.

Toulouse 7-16 Connacht at 48 minutes.

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:15 pm

Yet another French team looking bewildered at what's happening to them this weekend.

Yet you have to figure Toulouse will know how to get themselves out of this…..

by Golden Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:15 pm

Griffins putting in a great shift

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:17 pm

Penalty kick to Toulouse.

And they miss - a relatively straightforward one.

Still 7-16 at 53 minutes.

by wolfball Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:17 pm

Toulouse miss! This ref has been very strict on both sides for holding on

by **profitius** Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:18 pm

G'wan the wesht!!!

by **Rugby Fan** Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:18 pm

Did I hear the commentators say there were some outrageously long odds against Connacht winning?

by Rory_Gallagher Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:21 pm

TRY FOR ROBBIE HENSHAW!!!

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:22 pm

And Connacht give away another one in the middle of the park.

Toulouse kick for touch this time. They take their time walking up.

Safe throw and they attack.

Connacht defend strongly. Toulouse keep coming.

Ref is very poor at using the Use it rule. Toulouse being allowed to hold it at the back for a lot of time.

Connacht steal at the next breakdown and Parks kicks but doesn't find touch. Another attack but toulouse fumble and Connacht breakaway and a run the length of the field gives them another try!!

The West is in heaven.

by wolfball Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:22 pm

TRY!!!!!

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:23 pm

Uh oh.

Ref going back to TMO for forward pass to Henshaw.

Looks ok.

Another pass being checked.

Waiting.

by asoreleftshoulder Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:24 pm

Oh what a sickener.

by LeinsterFan4life Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:24 pm

TMO is a joke. Another great try ruined by a marginal call.

by Rory_Gallagher Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:25 pm

???

What the flip?

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:25 pm

And it's been turned down. Knock-on against Connacht called earlier in the move.

by wolfball Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:25 pm

I'm watching it without audio why was that disallowed???

by asoreleftshoulder Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:26 pm

wolfball wrote:I'm watching it without audio why was that disallowed???

A knock on at the very start of the move when the Connacht player tapped the ball sideways it went slightly forward.

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:26 pm

Toulouse are blessed.

by asoreleftshoulder Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:27 pm

Parks is killing Connacht,really disappointing form a player of his experience.

by wolfball Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:27 pm

They would never ever check so early in the move if it wasn't a minnow playing a big team

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:28 pm

Leicester back in romping home mode with another try to make it 32-18 and the bonus point.
60 minutes gone.

by Feckless Rogue Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:28 pm

Jaysus, I''ve never seen a TMO spend so long searching for a reason to disallow a try.

by asoreleftshoulder Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:29 pm

Connacht are really playing with belief here,the upset of the year is on.

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:29 pm

You suspect the quality on the benches is going to make the difference in the Connacht match. Tired legs are going to tell.

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:30 pm

Guy Noves is down on one knee watching intently from the sidelines.

Maybe he's praying…...

by Pot Hale Sun 08 Dec 2013, 4:32 pm

Jeez this ref is pedantic. He stood watching a Toulouse player holding on and a Connacht player frantically trying to get the ball of him. He eventually reluctantly almost blew for the penalty.

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