Mourhino: Wenger is a specialist in failure

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

socal1976 wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:What are you on about that makes no sense at all. dear god you are stupid.

Good job, another one liner, containing nothing interesting to say. Keep it up at this rate you will make the record books.

So you therefore retort with a one liner containing nothing of interest, bravo.

Fernando wrote:

CFCNick wrote:

Fernando wrote:

CFCNick wrote:

socal1976 wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:I call you and Dior clowns, cretins etc. because you have yet to indicate to me or anybody else for that matter that you have a single shred of intelligence, certainly neither of you have a clue about football.

If you're going to blabber on about facts at least get them right. Arsenal since the arrival of Wenger have a net spend of £70mil however what that doesn't tell you is that until the money men came in you had the biggest wage bill in the premier league. Transfers are two fold they are fees and wage based not just fee based. Nor does it tell you anything about the squad he had at his disposal initially, players like Bergkamp, Adams, Dixon, Winterburn and Keown.

For a club to go from winning the premier league title and then win the fa cup the next year followed by 8 years of winning nothing is quite frankly failure. The remit of Arsenal isn't champions league qualification it is to win trophies.

I think you need to change your sanitary pad, it seems like you are experiencing an unnaturally heavy flow this menstrual cycle. Did mommy and daddy not give you enough attention?

Maybe you and the other Arsenal fans should change your sanitary pads. "Oh no. That manager said something nasty about my manager. I must go on the internet and list his achievements in his honour."

 Maybe you and the other Chelsea fans go Frak yourself?  Your manager gets in a hissy fit and makes personal comments over a comment not aimed at him but all managers that are denying their in the title race. That's being afraid of failure what kind of message does that put out to your side?  

   Dumbass

maybe leave the arguing to them Socal & HH and not bring people like me into it for no reason or can your tiny brain not comprehend that? I would try dumb it for you but i don't see how it would confuse you. So if you don't get it then their is no hope for you go back to your council estate and buy a dictionary you may learn something new.

I underlined the bit that you should take note of...

How did I bring you into it? Did I mention you personally? No. I mentioned Arsenal fans in the sense of the ones such as Socal and CS. Just because I mentioned "Arsenal fans" doesn't mean I meant you. You see? You know what happens when you assume?

The comment aimed at ALL managers was a slight against Jose because every man and his dog on the tele are saying we're gonna win the league and Jose just says he wants to guarantee top 4 first, he doesn't think we are favourites. We score the least goals of the current top 4.

Council estate? Are you Frak serious? I said you don't like, therefore I must be from a council estate.

"buy a dictionary you may learn something new." - last I checked dictionaries didn't hand out life lessons or knowledge about sport. And I'm the dumbass???    

           

That's the poorest comeback in the history of 606v2 Nick. I weren't assuming anything you're trying to cover up you being a Mr Winklechops if you were on about ones like Socal & CS why not name them?

Everyone man and his dog change their mind on a weekly basis? It's still no reason to underestimate your own squad. You have the best defense in the league if you can lock people out you only need 1 goal.

Council estate? Are you Frak serious? I said you don't like, therefore I must be from a council estate.  Well at least you can admit where you're from it must be a tough thing to do their i am surprised you want people knowing that    So how's life on the estate Nick?

I never mentioned life lessons or sport knowledge so i don't know where you got that from. it was more to help you understand what was being said which clearly you didn't. Maybe i should start doing my putting gaps in the words to help you understand so you can piece them together...

Im done here you can reply to your hearts content Nick im not going to read it because my the standard of that comeback it'll only be more Poopie anyway.

Duty281 wrote:

Fernando wrote:

CFCNick wrote:

Fernando wrote:

CFCNick wrote:

socal1976 wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:I call you and Dior clowns, cretins etc. because you have yet to indicate to me or anybody else for that matter that you have a single shred of intelligence, certainly neither of you have a clue about football.

If you're going to blabber on about facts at least get them right. Arsenal since the arrival of Wenger have a net spend of £70mil however what that doesn't tell you is that until the money men came in you had the biggest wage bill in the premier league. Transfers are two fold they are fees and wage based not just fee based. Nor does it tell you anything about the squad he had at his disposal initially, players like Bergkamp, Adams, Dixon, Winterburn and Keown.

For a club to go from winning the premier league title and then win the fa cup the next year followed by 8 years of winning nothing is quite frankly failure. The remit of Arsenal isn't champions league qualification it is to win trophies.

I think you need to change your sanitary pad, it seems like you are experiencing an unnaturally heavy flow this menstrual cycle. Did mommy and daddy not give you enough attention?

Maybe you and the other Arsenal fans should change your sanitary pads. "Oh no. That manager said something nasty about my manager. I must go on the internet and list his achievements in his honour."

 Maybe you and the other Chelsea fans go Frak yourself?  Your manager gets in a hissy fit and makes personal comments over a comment not aimed at him but all managers that are denying their in the title race. That's being afraid of failure what kind of message does that put out to your side?  

   Dumbass

maybe leave the arguing to them Socal & HH and not bring people like me into it for no reason or can your tiny brain not comprehend that? I would try dumb it for you but i don't see how it would confuse you. So if you don't get it then their is no hope for you go back to your council estate and buy a dictionary you may learn something new.

I underlined the bit that you should take note of...

How did I bring you into it? Did I mention you personally? No. I mentioned Arsenal fans in the sense of the ones such as Socal and CS. Just because I mentioned "Arsenal fans" doesn't mean I meant you. You see? You know what happens when you assume?

The comment aimed at ALL managers was a slight against Jose because every man and his dog on the tele are saying we're gonna win the league and Jose just says he wants to guarantee top 4 first, he doesn't think we are favourites. We score the least goals of the current top 4.

Council estate? Are you Frak serious? I said you don't like, therefore I must be from a council estate.

"buy a dictionary you may learn something new." - last I checked dictionaries didn't hand out life lessons or knowledge about sport. And I'm the dumbass???    

           

That's the poorest comeback in the history of 606v2 Nick. I weren't assuming anything you're trying to cover up you being a Mr Winklechops if you were on about ones like Socal & CS why not name them?

Everyone man and his dog change their mind on a weekly basis? It's still no reason to underestimate your own squad. You have the best defense in the league if you can lock people out you only need 1 goal.

Council estate? Are you Frak serious? I said you don't like, therefore I must be from a council estate.  Well at least you can admit where you're from it must be a tough thing to do their i am surprised you want people knowing that    So how's life on the estate Nick?

I never mentioned life lessons or sport knowledge so i don't know where you got that from. it was more to help you understand what was being said which clearly you didn't. Maybe i should start doing my putting gaps in the words to help you understand so you can piece them together...

Im done here you can reply to your hearts content Nick im not going to read it because my the standard of that comeback it'll only be more Poopie anyway.

Starlight wrote:Hmm, no need to get rude people. To be fair to SoCal, I can see that he's not the one who started with more personal jibes. However like this manager saga, the war of words escalated.

Anyway some balanced thoughts from me:
-Pretty rude and blunt of Jose, irrelevant of whether he's right
-I think we can't translate it literally, ie even though Mourhino does not specify it, it's clear that he's talking about Arsene in respect to the stature of Arsenal being a big club. I don't think he's trying to say all managers who don't win trophies are failures.
-As to whether Jose is right, well firstly I think we can assume his words are clearly an exaggeration. What can be debated is whether Wenger lost his 'winning ruthless mentality' after 2005
-I think given their net spend, Arsenals consistency and league position of always top 4 is a fairly successful one.
-However the question raised is: Did Wenger spend less than he could have? Did he let his star players go too easily?
-If the answer to both these questions is yes, then it can still be argued he lost his winning mentality. I don't know in detail the financial position Arsenal were really in, the board have insisted funds were available.
-Overall, if we set aside the fact Jose was rude and clearly OTT, I think there may be some element of truth in what he was saying, if Arsenal did have greater funds. If what Arsenal fans are arguing is right, and Wenger did have a low budget, and did need to sell his best players for money, then Wenger has done a superb job.

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

Starlight wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

My point is we don't actually know that for certain.
If you're right, then yes, it is a criticism of Wenger and perhaps he has lost the winning mentality and instead taken the feeder club mentality (buy young and cheap, sell expensive).
But the Ozil transfer suggests differently.

Starlight wrote:Fair comment SoCal.

I do think though they should have got a top quality striker in January.

Let's say they did have to pay £10 million more than market price... if they win the PL it will have been worth that extra money, and they'd probably recuperate it with higher sales and merchandise. I mean Arsenal fans would all order the season DVD 10 times just to have 9 spare copies.

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

Starlight wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

My point is we don't actually know that for certain.
If you're right, then yes, it is a criticism of Wenger and perhaps he has lost the winning mentality and instead taken the feeder club mentality (buy young and cheap, sell expensive).
But the Ozil transfer suggests differently.

Wenger always spends when the money is available eg Arshavin, Ozil, Walcott. problem is the money has not always been available and so Wenger cannot spend.

socal1976 wrote:

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

Starlight wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

My point is we don't actually know that for certain.
If you're right, then yes, it is a criticism of Wenger and perhaps he has lost the winning mentality and instead taken the feeder club mentality (buy young and cheap, sell expensive).
But the Ozil transfer suggests differently.

Wenger always spends when the money is available eg Arshavin, Ozil, Walcott. problem is the money has not always been available and so Wenger cannot spend.

CS, I agree with you on most things. But let me ask you a question. Right now with the new commercial deals Arsenal has signed in the last few months  the word is that they are sitting on 120 million pounds in cash reserves (80 million of which is available, 40 million in reserve) . If they don't win the title or the FA cup would it be fair to criticize Wenger if they don't get some real quality with cash on hand in the next window? I for one respect what the man has done for the club and the way he develops young players. But to get over on City and Chelsea I think we need some spending in the next window. I don't think there was much worth buying in January and what was out there was overpriced. But in the summer I can't see how Arsenal doesn't go for lets say Benzema, Costa, or Balotelli.

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

socal1976 wrote:

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

Starlight wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

My point is we don't actually know that for certain.
If you're right, then yes, it is a criticism of Wenger and perhaps he has lost the winning mentality and instead taken the feeder club mentality (buy young and cheap, sell expensive).
But the Ozil transfer suggests differently.

Wenger always spends when the money is available eg Arshavin, Ozil, Walcott. problem is the money has not always been available and so Wenger cannot spend.

CS, I agree with you on most things. But let me ask you a question. Right now with the new commercial deals Arsenal has signed in the last few months  the word is that they are sitting on 120 million pounds in cash reserves (80 million of which is available, 40 million in reserve) . If they don't win the title or the FA cup would it be fair to criticize Wenger if they don't get some real quality with cash on hand in the next window? I for one respect what the man has done for the club and the way he develops young players. But to get over on City and Chelsea I think we need some spending in the next window. I don't think there was much worth buying in January and what was out there was overpriced. But in the summer I can't see how Arsenal doesn't go for lets say Benzema, Costa, or Balotelli.

my take on why we never bought a striker is because 1) no great strikers available and 2) it looks like Puma will fund a move for balotelli to go to Arsenal in the summer.

We can't bash wenger for not spending when he broke the transfer record and bought Ozil for £42 million only a few months ago.

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

Starlight wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

My point is we don't actually know that for certain.
If you're right, then yes, it is a criticism of Wenger and perhaps he has lost the winning mentality and instead taken the feeder club mentality (buy young and cheap, sell expensive).
But the Ozil transfer suggests differently.

Wenger always spends when the money is available eg Arshavin, Ozil, Walcott. problem is the money has not always been available and so Wenger cannot spend.

Starlight wrote:

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

Starlight wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

My point is we don't actually know that for certain.
If you're right, then yes, it is a criticism of Wenger and perhaps he has lost the winning mentality and instead taken the feeder club mentality (buy young and cheap, sell expensive).
But the Ozil transfer suggests differently.

Wenger always spends when the money is available eg Arshavin, Ozil, Walcott. problem is the money has not always been available and so Wenger cannot spend.

If we're talking about net spend, we have to talk about sales, and these are the players Arsenal sold while being in first XI:
1/ Fabregas
2/ RVP
3/ Hleb
4/ Song
5/ Nasri
6/ Adebayor

Imagine this attack:
Nasri Fabregas Ozil Cazorla
RVP Podolski

I mean that would be the best attacking force in the world.

Starlight wrote:

Champagne_Socialist wrote:

Starlight wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Wenger doesn't have a low budget, rather, he neglects to spend heavily because he's stubborn.*

The two should not be confused.

*Apart from when he gets desperate, as was the case with Mesut Ozil.

My point is we don't actually know that for certain.
If you're right, then yes, it is a criticism of Wenger and perhaps he has lost the winning mentality and instead taken the feeder club mentality (buy young and cheap, sell expensive).
But the Ozil transfer suggests differently.

Wenger always spends when the money is available eg Arshavin, Ozil, Walcott. problem is the money has not always been available and so Wenger cannot spend.

If we're talking about net spend, we have to talk about sales, and these are the players Arsenal sold while being in first XI:
1/ Fabregas
2/ RVP
3/ Hleb
4/ Song
5/ Nasri
6/ Adebayor

Imagine this attack:
Nasri Fabregas Ozil Cazorla
RVP Podolski

I mean that would be the best attacking force in the world.
Ok unrealistic. But still, my point is that he let his best players go too often.
Did he need to, due to financial restraints? Or has his mentality changed to one where top 4 is good enough?
Certainly the Ozil signing was a step in the right direction.

Starlight wrote:Did they invest the money from those losses in equally good players?

Their 8-2 drubbing was a huge blessing, as they signed many more players.
But could they not have done so earlier?

Again I am playing devils advocate, it is entirely possible Wenger spent as much as he could, in which case he's done a fantastic job.

Ent wrote:They've riled up the arsenal fans and everyone under the sun is discussing his comments rather than his teams limp performances. No mention of a lack of creativity if hazard is well marshalled etc etc

Love him or loathe him he knows what he is doing.

Fernando wrote:

CFCNick wrote:

Fernando wrote:

CFCNick wrote:

socal1976 wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:I call you and Dior clowns, cretins etc. because you have yet to indicate to me or anybody else for that matter that you have a single shred of intelligence, certainly neither of you have a clue about football.

If you're going to blabber on about facts at least get them right. Arsenal since the arrival of Wenger have a net spend of £70mil however what that doesn't tell you is that until the money men came in you had the biggest wage bill in the premier league. Transfers are two fold they are fees and wage based not just fee based. Nor does it tell you anything about the squad he had at his disposal initially, players like Bergkamp, Adams, Dixon, Winterburn and Keown.

For a club to go from winning the premier league title and then win the fa cup the next year followed by 8 years of winning nothing is quite frankly failure. The remit of Arsenal isn't champions league qualification it is to win trophies.

I think you need to change your sanitary pad, it seems like you are experiencing an unnaturally heavy flow this menstrual cycle. Did mommy and daddy not give you enough attention?

Maybe you and the other Arsenal fans should change your sanitary pads. "Oh no. That manager said something nasty about my manager. I must go on the internet and list his achievements in his honour."

 Maybe you and the other Chelsea fans go Frak yourself?  Your manager gets in a hissy fit and makes personal comments over a comment not aimed at him but all managers that are denying their in the title race. That's being afraid of failure what kind of message does that put out to your side?  

   Dumbass

maybe leave the arguing to them Socal & HH and not bring people like me into it for no reason or can your tiny brain not comprehend that? I would try dumb it for you but i don't see how it would confuse you. So if you don't get it then their is no hope for you go back to your council estate and buy a dictionary you may learn something new.

I underlined the bit that you should take note of...

How did I bring you into it? Did I mention you personally? No. I mentioned Arsenal fans in the sense of the ones such as Socal and CS. Just because I mentioned "Arsenal fans" doesn't mean I meant you. You see? You know what happens when you assume?

The comment aimed at ALL managers was a slight against Jose because every man and his dog on the tele are saying we're gonna win the league and Jose just says he wants to guarantee top 4 first, he doesn't think we are favourites. We score the least goals of the current top 4.

Council estate? Are you Frak serious? I said you don't like, therefore I must be from a council estate.

"buy a dictionary you may learn something new." - last I checked dictionaries didn't hand out life lessons or knowledge about sport. And I'm the dumbass???    

           

That's the poorest comeback in the history of 606v2 Nick. I weren't assuming anything you're trying to cover up you being a Mr Winklechops if you were on about ones like Socal & CS why not name them?

Everyone man and his dog change their mind on a weekly basis? It's still no reason to underestimate your own squad. You have the best defense in the league if you can lock people out you only need 1 goal.

Council estate? Are you Frak serious? I said you don't like, therefore I must be from a council estate.  Well at least you can admit where you're from it must be a tough thing to do their i am surprised you want people knowing that    So how's life on the estate Nick?

I never mentioned life lessons or sport knowledge so i don't know where you got that from. it was more to help you understand what was being said which clearly you didn't. Maybe i should start doing my putting gaps in the words to help you understand so you can piece them together...

Im done here you can reply to your hearts content Nick im not going to read it because my the standard of that comeback it'll only be more Poopie anyway.

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:New question:

If this gives Chelsea an edge in the title race is it worth doing? Would you want your manager to do it if it could give you an extra few %? Putting aside whether it does gain you anything, work with me hypothetically.