Ireland v France - The 6N decider

First topic message reminder :

With such a strong points advantage if Ireland can just win in Paris then the Championship is there's. Now it's never been a happy hunting ground for Ireland - can they do it?

I think it's there year and I'm going to say yes.

Worth adding that Ross was class this tournament. We really missed him when he came off today.

Superb tense game and quality increased as the tournament went on.

Next year anyone of wales, england, ireland and france to win it. Anyone know when home/away draw is made for next season?

Gloucester rugby ? Tell Teague he wasn't posh enough. Or Vickery.

Is it not set in stone?

If you were home this season you are away against the same opposition next sesaon.

The only draw there is for the order of the fixtures. Ireland will have England and France in Dublin next year!

The only 2 pro rugby players from here came from the local public school. But with 2 pro rugby league sides and a premiership football team in an city of 250k is probably pushing it. 2 union sides in league 1 and league 2 North. And the stoke rugby team play in a field outside the village I grew up in (I didn't even know it was there until after I left). West Country and East Midlands are probably the main areas where it's played by all sorts.

We'll beat you in Dublin

littlejohn wrote:Worth adding that Ross was class this tournament. We really missed him when he came off today.

Superb tense game and quality increased as the tournament went on.

Next year anyone of wales, england, ireland and france to win it. Anyone know when home/away draw is made for next season?

Draw already made All fixtures next season are in the reverse order of this season. so Ireland play France, Italy, England, wales, Scotland.

KiaRose wrote:

littlejohn wrote:Worth adding that Ross was class this tournament. We really missed him when he came off today.

Superb tense game and quality increased as the tournament went on.

Next year anyone of wales, england, ireland and france to win it. Anyone know when home/away draw is made for next season?

Draw already made  All fixtures next season are in the reverse order of this season.  so Ireland play France, Italy, England, wales, Scotland.

Not quite it seems:

2015 RBS Six Nations Fixtures

Wales also begin the 2015 Six Nations on home soil, entertaining England on the evening of Friday, 6 February.

Friday, 6 February – Wales v England 8.05pm

Saturday, 7 February – Italy v Ireland 2.30pm; France v Scotland 5pm

Saturday, 14 February – England v Italy 2.30pm; Ireland v France 5pm

Sunday, 15 February – Scotland v Wales 3pm

Saturday, 28 February – Scotland v Italy 2.30pm, France v Wales 5pm

Sunday, 1 March – Ireland v England 3pm

Saturday, 14 March – Wales v Ireland 2.30pm; England v Scotland 5pm

Sunday, 15 March – Italy v France 3pm

Saturday, 21 March – Italy v Wales 12.30pm; Scotland v Ireland 2.30pm; England v France 5pm

Beating Wales in Cardiff will make for a satisfying start

whocares wrote:

KiaRose wrote:

littlejohn wrote:Worth adding that Ross was class this tournament. We really missed him when he came off today.

Superb tense game and quality increased as the tournament went on.

Next year anyone of wales, england, ireland and france to win it. Anyone know when home/away draw is made for next season?

Draw already made  All fixtures next season are in the reverse order of this season.  so Ireland play France, Italy, England, wales, Scotland.

Not quite it seems:

2015 RBS Six Nations Fixtures

Wales also begin the 2015 Six Nations on home soil, entertaining England on the evening of Friday, 6 February.

Friday, 6 February – Wales v England 8.05pm

Saturday, 7 February – Italy v Ireland 2.30pm; France v Scotland 5pm

Saturday, 14 February – England v Italy 2.30pm; Ireland v France 5pm

Sunday, 15 February – Scotland v Wales 3pm

Saturday, 28 February – Scotland v Italy 2.30pm, France v Wales 5pm

Sunday, 1 March – Ireland v England 3pm

Saturday, 14 March – Wales v Ireland 2.30pm; England v Scotland 5pm

Sunday, 15 March – Italy v France 3pm

Saturday, 21 March – Italy v Wales 12.30pm; Scotland v Ireland 2.30pm; England v France 5pm

Yep, sorry for misleading. I thought I had seen a fixture list for the two seasons and one was simply a reverse of the other.

Poor Italy....seems they are going to be the favourite victims for points scoring again within a week by first Ireland, then England.

England v france right at the end. Who knows maybe next year ireland will be praying for france to beat england to retain the crown. Its a funny ol tournament. Win ur first 2 games and u have a great chance to be in with a chance on the last weekend.

SecretFly wrote:Poor Italy....seems they are going to be the favourite victims for points scoring again within a week by first Ireland, then England.

Italy away first... Been there... And happy not to go there anymore

Wales, Italy, Ireland, Scotland, France   

A win in Cardiff would be massive. Two home games to end it. But two very tricky away games.

Ireland v England in Dublin will be interesting. And Wales will be better next year. A little bit of Lions fatigue I think. Although England and Ireland have improved hugely and were well worth their victories over Wales.

Wales will have to put up a sterner fight... Gatland's job might, and certainly his post-WC plans will, depend on it.

England?  Big conundrum for me because I think they've arrived at the level they would like to be at, or very close to it, a little early perhaps - in that they're already a punishing, ruthless and lethal paced side.  I don't see much room for improvement but more a struggle now to sustain what they have without performance fall off.  They're giving so much info to their opponents in the WC pools without getting much corresponding info back yet

Ireland have the desire now to play rugby again under a coach that enthuses them.  But they are still plenty rough around some edges and could do with a real clean up before the next 6N season.

Scotland?  Well who knows.  It can't get any worse so you have to expect that under a coach like Cotter, it probably will get better.

Italy, well you can't have much hope for them.  They hop on sides that are having bad periods (Ireland and France last year) but can't respond to sides in form.

France - habitual instinctive deceivers who will go on deceiving right through the next 6N, right through the pool stages of the WC and even - who knows? - another final where they show up displaying their genuine selves?  The fun is that next year will be the same again.  France can't play and look awful and most people will believe it, all over again

England have no room for improvement? I :cussing hope so. The number of butchered opportunities in all 5 games is unacceptable. They can get away with it for now because of the inexperience of the backs. But they better buck their ideas up.

mystiroakey wrote:It was deffo forward and awarded as forward.. Thank goodness , otherwise people would have been banging on about it for ever..

can't wait to hear englandglory4ever on the forward pass  

SecretFly wrote:Wales will have to put up a sterner fight... Gatland's job might, and certainly his post-WC plans will, depend on it.

England?  Big conundrum for me because I think they've arrived at the level they would like to be at, or very close to it, a little early perhaps - in that they're already a punishing, ruthless and lethal paced side.  I don't see much room for improvement but more a struggle now to sustain what they have without performance fall off.  They're giving so much info to their opponents in the WC pools without getting much corresponding info back yet

Ireland have the desire now to play rugby again under a coach that enthuses them.  But they are still plenty rough around some edges and could do with a real clean up before the next 6N season.

Scotland?  Well who knows.  It can't get any worse so you have to expect that under a coach like Cotter, it probably will get better.

Italy, well you can't have much hope for them.  They hop on sides that are having bad periods (Ireland and France last year) but can't respond to sides in form.

France - habitual instinctive deceivers who will go on deceiving right through the next 6N, right through the pool stages of the WC and even - who knows? - another final where they show up displaying their genuine selves?  The fun is that next year will be the same again.  France can't play and look awful and most people will believe it, all over again

Congrats to Ireland, I couldn't help myself cheering them on in the end. Sometimes a fairy tale ending is way better than nationalist pride! Thoroughly deserved, you guys were the most consistent throughout, and great to see BOD leave on a high.

Slightly disagree with your post though. I think England have HUGE areas for improvement, whether this coaching team gets the best from them is another question. But it's hard to not think that if Corbisiero, Cole, maybe Tuilagi as a supersub etc. were there the team could improve further. The scrum for one is an area we can and will need to improve on.

Ireland - You'll lose the Master but gain SOB and maybe Ferris (would be great to see him back). You'll be challenging no doubt.

Wales - They'll keep doing what they're doing. If they execute perfectly, they'll be fine, if not, they're screwed. It's a big ask, especially if they get injuries. I can't see them being capable of beating Ireland, England and France.

France - Are hopeless. They only turned up for today's game but I really have no faith in them making the right selections or achieving anything at all in the near future.

Scotland - Will improve, their players are better than they've shown. But probably still a notch down from the top teams.

Italy - Will maintain their mediocrity.

Its not very often we win a championship (12 only I think) and to do it on an even year (when we play France and Ingerland away) is even rarer. So I have to say this is almost as good as the grandslam in 2009. When you look back at the whole series we left the english game behind us and should really have won it but winning in france and claiming the championship outright against a very focused french team just goes to show how well Joe schmidt has done with this team. In real terms the best team won the 6ns by a wider margin than the table shows. I think next year with both France and Ingerland in Dublin we have a real chance to kick on....

Zebo slam

Ireland won the championships without some of their best players imo, Bowe, Zebo (although Trimble was awesome), Donncha Ryan, SOB, Ferris and i don't think D'arcy is the best option anymore so it shows the strenght in depth they have.

ME-109 wrote:Its not very often we win a championship (12 only I think) and to do it on an even year (when we play France and  Ingerland away) is even rarer. So I have to say this is almost as good as the grandslam in 2009. When you look back at the whole series we left the english game behind us and should really have won it but winning in france and claiming the championship outright against a very focused french team just goes to show how well Joe schmidt has done with this team. In real terms the best team won the 6ns by a wider margin than the table shows. I think next year with both France and Ingerland in Dublin we have a real chance to kick on....

  

I would like to say a very well done to Ireland, they was the best team in this years 6ns,

Right at the end though i thought France was going too do England aa big favour by winning right at the death. I would just like to say that yesterday's game was one of the best i have seen for long time.

The enormous hits that was going in from both sides, the amount of blood on the players faces, batterd bodies, bodies on the lines stuff yesterday.

Bod finaly got the send off that ALL of Ireland wanted him too have.

He ( BOD) Has been a fantastic player for Ireland and for Rugby in general.

Absolutely massive for Ireland to win the championship. It was a great close match and the French finally showed some quality. Aside from about 20mins against England, France were pish the whole tournament until yesterday.

ME-109 wrote:Its not very often we win a championship (12 only I think) and to do it on an even year (when we play France and  Ingerland away) is even rarer. So I have to say this is almost as good as the grandslam in 2009. When you look back at the whole series we left the english game behind us and should really have won it but winning in france and claiming the championship outright against a very focused french team just goes to show how well Joe schmidt has done with this team. In real terms the best team won the 6ns by a wider margin than the table shows. I think next year with both France and Ingerland in Dublin we have a real chance to kick on....

This was a high quality tourny to win..

France may have been a bit rubbish for a few games- but they were still infinently better than the year before. Wales were goodish. England were the best they have been for almost a decade imo.. Ireland were also on fire and playing a much better brand of hardcore rugby that will test any team in the world.

This for my money was the best 6 nations for yonks- so Ireland need to realise sometimes it really isnt about a GS. Sometimes its just about the win, which you got

Totally agree MrOakey - this was a fantastic 6N, one of the best and most competitive that I've seen.

Delighted that we've won this and not too concerned about not getting the slam and Triple crown, although that would have been nice. I don't think we did a lot wrong over the course of the tournament. When we needed to put scores on teams we did it and when we had to dig in and get the results we showed real steel and hunger, especially in this game but only losing by 1 score at Twickenham was vital too. For me this is the best achievement by Ireland in the pro era, by a long way.

Was it just me or did the backplay resort to more classic "Schmidt" in the last two games? Would have to re-watch the games but it seemed that we kind of went back to the Randwick Loop move and a lot of pop and flick passes in narrow spaces to take advantage of defensive errors. First few games we just seemed to go wide and well that won't work with BOD and D'Arcy.


Savage win, France brought their A game and we beat them pretty amazing.

After the two landslide games before it, the Championship itself really needed an epic to end on to give it back the genuine bite that it really has had through many of the weeks.

Even before the game I said to the people I was watching it with that this will be better for us as a team and better for the tournament if it's a tough Mother****** of a game.

Little did I know how tough it would be - both as a game and on my shattered nerves!!!  Because there was a real prize at the end of it, because it was the end of truly my favourite player ever to walk the field, because the players were clinging on to belief even as they must have been dreading at the same time another mental collapse - because it had so many meanings, it think it was Ireland's biggest, most emotional game to date - surpassing the close call against New Zealand.

I know the neutrals enjoyed it (Wales/Italy/Scotland) and I know the English and French must have suffered with us through each minute (for different reasons perhaps! ) - so I think it was very much a fitting game to end this year's oh-so-close to the bone Championship

What a performance from Andrew Trimble. Always rated him really highly and he really has proven what a great player he really is. Possibly Irelands player of the tournament maybe after Brown the player of the tournament outright.

SecretFly wrote:England?  Big conundrum for me because I think they've arrived at the level they would like to be at, or very close to it, a little early perhaps - in that they're already a punishing, ruthless and lethal paced side.  I don't see much room for improvement but more a struggle now to sustain what they have without performance fall off.  They're giving so much info to their opponents in the WC pools without getting much corresponding info back yet

Weird. I've seen you post this a few times and just don't get your thinking.

England have a LONG way to go. Plenty of areas for improvement. I'd say they left a lot on the field against France, Ireland and Wales. England have more to areas to improve than any other 6 Nations side.

It'll be interesting how Ireland replace the old guard and bring in some young players now the golden generation is about to disband. Last hurrah?

SF mate is that one of your wums mate. There is a lot of room for improvement in this England team- still on that upward curve pal. Ireland deserved this win big time- but you know have the conundrum of finding replacements for the older guard.

Cyril wrote:

SecretFly wrote:England?  Big conundrum for me because I think they've arrived at the level they would like to be at, or very close to it, a little early perhaps - in that they're already a punishing, ruthless and lethal paced side.  I don't see much room for improvement but more a struggle now to sustain what they have without performance fall off.  They're giving so much info to their opponents in the WC pools without getting much corresponding info back yet

Weird. I've seen you post this a few times and just don't get your thinking.

England have a LONG way to go. Plenty of areas for improvement. I'd say they left a lot on the field against France, Ireland and Wales. England have more to areas to improve than any other 6 Nations side.

It'll be interesting how Ireland replace the old guard and bring in some young players now the golden generation is about to disband. Last hurrah?

Perhaps last hurrah, Cyril.

O'Driscoll won't be around - big hole to fill - possibly Bowe, Cave, Payne, Henshaw (although the latter two v inexperienced for a WC year.)
Darcy gave one last great season but the likes of McFadden, J Marshall, Madigan need to come in for the Summer and Autumn Internationals.

Kearney x 2, Zebo, Trimble, Earls, Henshaw are all young enough in the back three.

Murray needs a younger back-up than Reddan or Boss - P Marshall or Marmion or the youngfla at Munster are all promising snipers.

Sexton has Jackson and Madigan on his heels

With Ferris and O'Brien coming back into the fray, that gives a number of options in the back row to Henry, O'Mahony and Heaslip, with Jordi Murphy and Tommy O'Donnell making waves.

O'Connell may last until RWC but it's probably the weakest position with Toner, McCarthy, Henderson, or Ryan adequate but not putting fear and doubt into opposition hearts.

Ross, Best and Healy have readymade replacements in Moore, Cronin and Healy - who all got good game time this Championship.

Totally agree on Andy Trimble. He wasn't even in the original 44, if I remember? He fought his way back  to where he is, against the odds,  and Schmidt loves him for it. Shaggy and ROG were raving about him (and to him), yesterday. The smile on his face said it all. MOTM by a mile. It proves a graphic point to the rest. Do what is asked of you and you get a shot. It generates a buzz of expectancy throughout the squad. All 23 men play and are used as a weapon - within the game-plan, The bench is not a stop-gap or backup anymore. With the level of players on it now, its a weapon. Huge difference

Just goes to show what can happen when a coach puts his total faith in you. Same with Toner. They both grew enormously in this comp.

Patience sometimes chaps.  Patience.

Henry, Trimble, Henderson - all in Schmidts squad now. O' Mahony is a revelation at this level.  Toner has grown up and was in the thick of everything yesterday. Unmissable at the lineout, he has now added the grunt in the loose  to go with it.

I know there is mumbling about 15 Leinster players in the 23, but Id have to say most of them were best-in-position and knew what was expected of them, without re-training.  For now.

This will change between now and the RWC. As the mantra expands to other players in the provinces, the 23 will reduce in blue reps and Im grand with that. Phhok the provinces, this is our country and I want us to have a realistic tilt at the WC. Im sick of the usual QF  mediocrity. No more. If it takes a main mix of Ulster & Munster players,  plus a few token Leinster players,  to get us to the WC SF's (at least), I'll vote for it now.  

1st comp won and more players with experience at this level. Well done Joe Schmidt. And a huge clap on the back for the man who made all the differ to our set-pieces,  Plumtree. The stats are amazing.

We now have us a complete team to take on the best. The coaching staff being the strongest part of it. This will only improve as more players on the provincial fringes, buy into what the coaches are looking for. Which is grand. The template is there for them to fit into now. Not the other way round.  

Add a fit SOB, Ferris, Fitzgerald, Bowe and Zebo into the pot and we are suckin even more diesel.

Believe.

Cyril wrote:

SecretFly wrote:England?  Big conundrum for me because I think they've arrived at the level they would like to be at, or very close to it, a little early perhaps - in that they're already a punishing, ruthless and lethal paced side.  I don't see much room for improvement but more a struggle now to sustain what they have without performance fall off.  They're giving so much info to their opponents in the WC pools without getting much corresponding info back yet

Weird. I've seen you post this a few times and just don't get your thinking.

England have a LONG way to go. Plenty of areas for improvement. I'd say they left a lot on the field against France, Ireland and Wales. England have more to areas to improve than any other 6 Nations side.

It'll be interesting how Ireland replace the old guard and bring in some young players now the golden generation is about to disband. Last hurrah?

Yep. We are much better than we were coming the same position last year. Then we were hard to beat. Now I feel we can go out and beat sides from the off. And this side will keep improving, have lots of space to improve and a series of games coming up against the very best where the younger players will learn a lot. Still less than 400 caps in the starting 15, and most of our players on an upward trajectory not a plateau (and any win in our next 5 - or even 6 depending on how Aus look- matches will be significant and against a superior side). I'm very happy with where we are

No guys, not wumming.  And I don't think my comments about England already being close to being there and needing to ensure the levels now remain high are a negative assessment.

From day one of this competition I've said England look the most complete side - even after the loss in France (look it up if you don't believe I said so) and I've continued that consistent line all the way through.  And even now would say England are the most complete NH side in that they have structures bedded down that players can come in and out of without any much fall-off in performance.  Performance levels themselves are second to none in the Championship.  Stamina and pace for sustained periods put most NH sides to shame.  Wisdom with the ball - high.  Athletic ability 1 to 15/athletic ability 1 to 23 - impressive.

No side will ever be perfect - even the ABs.  So no matter how good England could be, they'll never get everything perfect and their fans will never be totally satisfied.  It just never happens.  So you guys talk about decision making needs to improve and handling issues in tight spaces might need honing but you're looking at faults not system errors.  You're looking at faults in a game and there will always be five, six, nine or ten noted faults in any game that might have been tries had one player done this or might have been points on a board had a player passed instead of holding on.

Yes... England can become probably smoother but they, more than any NH side, after two years of Lancaster planning, are much closer to where they need to be than the rest of us are to where we need to be - and I include Ireland in that.  I don't see that as a negative or indeed insulting assessment (I think one or to of you might think it's insulting?).  It's what I see.  England are a dangerous team for any side including all tri-Nations ones. Ireland and the rest have a good way to go yet.

We are at the level(style) we need to be at SF. there is a mobility about england that looks close to complete. But we are still not clinical enough..

Players like Manu coming back will seriously help that out- he has that ability to beat the last men with tiny gaps. but then we have the problem of where to play the players- 36 has given us a problem by performing right up there last two games. Burrell is also immense.

Secret, I don't think your a WUM at all. Pretty fair observations which are close to my own thoughts. I do however believe England have a bunch more upside to come:

Key players to return from injury(look for e.g. Manu in just 20 mins of England outing in about a year) Corbs Cole
Younger ones gaining and growing: L&L Burrell Brown Marler maturing
Wings queuing up to get picked.

Handling errors - surely room for improvement there.

Etc. The future is a Rose one.

PS I did congratulate Ireland on a great series and say it again. And a fitting sendoff for BOD.  

gregortree wrote:PS I did congratulate Ireland on a great series and say it again. And a fitting sendoff for BOD.  

Oh I know that Gregor I spot these things and alluded to it on another thread. The English have been........... em....well gents

I've got such a massive amount of resentment for this current England side Fly. Don't they know they are meant to be the Pantomime Villains?! They go around, being all level-headed and humble... makes me sick to be honest, how likeable the coaches and players all are. Going around, earning deserved victories by playing positive rugby within the rules of the game.

What a shower of Bastareauds.

I agree Notch. I'm just trying to humour them at the moment. They are despicable cheats for playing nice. We've all been side-stepped by the tactic and they're in for a try before you know it with a "Thank you, sir" on their lips! And I personally will never forgive them for it.

Bomber is a cunning Englishman, hiding away the Celts favourite juju pin dolly toy. Such a bounder to do that.

Did England just win the 6ns or did I miss something...  

They have come 2nd three years in a row and Lancaster has never won the 6n.

Darcy shaved his beard. Shame. I liked it.

GunsGerms wrote:They have come 2nd three years in a row and Lancaster has never won the 6n.

They'll win it next year. With a Slam.

That is why England are so loved. Plucky 2nds.

I was waiting for an English player to throw a dwarf at a sick Irish child. Or arrogantly claim in the media that he doesn't really like potatoes. Anything to make our lads angry. But it never came.

It was touching how England celebrated so wildly after a three point win at home against us....