Scotland 6N lookahead

Fixtures

07/02 France V Scotland - 17:00
15/02 Scotland V Wales - 15:00

28/02 Scotland V Italy - 14:30

14/03 England V Scotland - 17:00
21/03 Scotland V Ireland - 14:30


6N standings last 10 years

2014 - 5th, 1 win
2013 - 3rd, 2 wins
2012 - 6th, 0 wins
2011 - 5th, 1 win
2010 - 5th, 1 win
2009 - 5th, 1 win
2008 - 5th, 1 win
2007 - 6th, 1 win
2006 - 3rd, 3 wins
2005 - 5th, 1 win

Squad

FORWARDS: Hugh Blake (Edinburgh Rugby), Fraser Brown (Glasgow Warriors), Blair Cowan, Geoff Cross (both London Irish), David Denton, Alasdair Dickinson (Edinburgh Rugby), Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors), Richie Gray (Castres), Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby), Jim Hamilton (Saracens), Rob Harley, Euan Murray, Gordon Reid (all Glasgow Warriors), Alasdair Strokosch (Perpignan), Ben Toolis, Hamish Watson (both Edinburgh Rugby), Jon Welsh (Glasgow Warriors).

BACKS: Mark Bennett (Glasgow Warriors), Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (Edinburgh Rugby), Alex Dunbar, (Glasgow Warriors) Dougie Fife (Edinburgh Rugby), Stuart Hogg, Peter Horne (both Glasgow Warriors) Greig Laidlaw CAPTAIN (Gloucester), Sean Lamont, Sean Maitland, Henry Pyrgos, Finn Russell (all Glasgow Warriors), Matt Scott (Edinburgh Rugby), Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors), Greig Tonks, Tim Visser (both Edinburgh Rugby).

Unavailable through injury: Adam Ashe (neck), Chris Fusaro (ankle), Grant Gilchrist (arm), Tyrone Holmes (face), Ruaridh Jackson (knee), Duncan Taylor (hamstring), Duncan Weir (arm).

Very good RDW.

Yes, we've improved a great deal and we should be delighted that we actually look like a coherent whole as a team, rather than a distracted squadron of gym monkeys who just met in the car park before the game.

As far as I'm concerned, we are the most improved team in the 6N. This is because we were so abject to start with. Cotter has a difficult job now - to keep the team optimistic, but at the same time remind everone that we are always optimistic heading from the AIs to the 6N, using culimating in us getting spanked.

Big concerns for me are our lack of tighthead options, our over-reliance on the battered frame of Sean Lamont, the apparent jettisoning of Kelly Brown, our midfield being two injuries away from having to start someone like Peter Horne or Dougie Fife who are not international quality centres yet and the lack of Fijians. I accept that there's not so much we can do about that last one.

Big pluses for me was the form of the Grays, the increased vitality of Laidlaw (proof that players need to move away from their home club at least once in a career), the mysterious competency of Ford and the fact the we scored 11 tries over three games - last year it was 6 and most of those against Japan.

I would say 7/10 for us. And then also add I am delighted with where we are now.

Just to clarify my score of 8, I'm not saying we're 2 points away from perfection - far from it - just think it's a fair reflection of how the series went compared to expectation.

Taking 6 as been average, I think a comfortable win over Argentina and Tonga and almost beating New Zealand is worthy of an 8!

I would say we are one or two TH props and a couple of midfield backs away from having a very solid team, In just about every other position we have a bit of depth. Sean Lamont, despite putting in a decent shifts against NZ, is not and never will be the answer at OC.

The back situation will improve with the return of Matt Scott and MB will be a better player for the experience of getting a couple of caps under the belt. I hope he is back for the 6N. 12 weeks for a hamstring is probably at the cautious end of the spectrum, Denton got back from his a lot earlier than expected so hopefully he will as well. Dunbar can move out to 13 if required but we are still only an injury or two away from big trouble in the midfield. On that basis I would have preferred to see Taylor get a bit of game time yesterday but it would have been hard to deny SL after his sterling performance against the blacks.

TH is the same situation, lack of options. I think personally that EM does have one last hurrah left in him up to and including the WC. He has played well for Glasgow and did a decent shift in the two games he played. He is injury prone though and won't play on sundays, so back up is most definitely required.

I have been a critic of Geoff Cross and can see why Edinburgh let him go. He has limitations as VC has apparently pointed out to him. Going to LI was the chance for him to push on and resurrect his career but that has not happened yet. In my opinion if he can't hold down a starting sot with the Not Nots, who are hardly the strongest team in the league, then he is in no way an international standard prop. Having said that, yesterday was his best performance in a Scotland shirt for a long time, if not in all time. Getting the starting shirt seemed to galvinise him. He does need to take that form back to his club though. If he goes back there to rot on the bench and in the reserves, then he is not the answer for Scotland.

In the background we have Welsh who will now have the chance to show us what he can do in a Glasgow shirt. It is hard to see how they will not play him at TH with the amount of good loosie's they possess. Cussack remains a very outside bet, if he can get fit again, which is still a very big if and then there is Nel, who would have no international experience if picked for the WC, but might be worth a punt if non of the others put their hands up convincingly.

On the whole though we should be very pleased with the AI series and look forward to the 6N, which will of course be a completely different kettle of fish. It I going to be intensively competitive this year, no easy games and there is no reason not to hope that we can compete. That is not to say we will win the grand slam, we have to be realistic, two wins would be good, three amazing and anything else a bonus. It is still a very young and inexperienced team that is still under development. From what we have seen thought, the basics in terms of skills and performance and there and the spirit is back. There is no reason not to be optimistic.

Cautious optimism - a strange concept to a Scotland fan - might be the order of the day. while we do not have a full squad to challenge for titles - we have the foundation of a good team now playing with spirit and a couple of very special players. Jonny Gray has shown just how good he s and Finn Russell grabbed the ten shirt with both hands.

Two questions for me:

1. What will happen with gilchrist? Can one of the grays be dropped to bring him back in???
2. When will the phrase "6ns dark horses" start being thrown about?

tigertattie wrote:Two questions for me:  

1. What will happen with gilchrist? Can one of the grays be dropped to bring him back in???
2. When will the phrase "6ns dark horses" start being thrown about?

1.No, bench for him
2. No, at least not by any sane Scottish fan. 2 wins will be a result, anything over that a bonus. Lets not get ahead of ourselves

Gilchrist was desperately unlucky to get crocked when he did but Cotter has very few matches to establish continuity and based on the one-in/one-out approach VC has adopted in the Ai campaign, I cannot see Gilchrist being dropped straight into the XV. He will need to be content with a 20 shirt at the moment. His time will come, however - he's a great big lad to have on the bench as an impact sub.

I didn't see too much of the Scottish team this month as the games overlapped and it means you inevitably miss halves here and there.

The one aspect of their game that impressed me a lot was their attitude in defence, they have stepped up their physicality big time.

Biltong wrote:I didn't see too much of the Scottish team this month as the games overlapped and it means you inevitably miss halves here and there.

The one aspect of their game that impressed me a lot was their attitude in defence, they have stepped up their physicality big time.

You're just relieved you didn't have to play us. Scaredeybok.

Really pleased with the progress so far under Cotter. I've been moaning\constructively criticising for years that first and foremost we need to get the form players on the pitch, in the right positions doing what they do best. In three games Cotter has shown more selection capability that all his predecessors since Telfer in 1999, and even he got lucky with that injury to Hodge at 10 in the first game against Wales.

It may sound trite, but at long last we seem to know what we're about. Solid set piece, dogged defence and spirit in attack. Plus we have players who know how to score tries. Cautious optimism sums it up nicely.

funnyExiledScot wrote:

Biltong wrote:I didn't see too much of the Scottish team this month as the games overlapped and it means you inevitably miss halves here and there.

The one aspect of their game that impressed me a lot was their attitude in defence, they have stepped up their physicality big time.

You're just relieved you didn't have to play us. Scaredeybok.

True

BigGee wrote:

tigertattie wrote:Two questions for me:  

1. What will happen with gilchrist? Can one of the grays be dropped to bring him back in???
2. When will the phrase "6ns dark horses" start being thrown about?

1.No, bench for him
2. No, at least not by any sane Scottish fan. 2 wins will be a result, anything over that a bonus. Lets not get ahead of ourselves

A successful 6N must mean at least 3 wins - for any team

TJ wrote:

BigGee wrote:

tigertattie wrote:Two questions for me:  

1. What will happen with gilchrist? Can one of the grays be dropped to bring him back in???
2. When will the phrase "6ns dark horses" start being thrown about?

1.No, bench for him
2. No, at least not by any sane Scottish fan. 2 wins will be a result, anything over that a bonus. Lets not get ahead of ourselves

A successful 6N must mean at least 3 wins - for any team

Not too sure about that TJ - to win two games we will have to beat one of the following

A team we haven't beaten since 2006 (Wales)

Current 6N champions and 3rd best team in the world (Ireland)

England or France away from home


I think a win against any of the above, a comfortable win over italy and being competitive in each game would be a success - we've got to be realistic here.

Its just you can never be satisfied with losing more than half your games.

Gents, I had the pleasure of taking senior Junior Anglo to Rugby Park yesterday, and many thanks to Kilmarnock FC for providing a good venue.
Biltong is right in talking about attitude, but it's not just the defence where this manifested itself, it is across a number of areas:
Lineout - Seeing the Gray bros first hand managing, controlling and executing the supremacy of the line out was a joy to behold. Not only were they in complete control, but you could see them enjoying this facet. Hats off to Rob Harley, who played a magnificent third jumper role so much so that he is almost the third Gray bother.
Defence - Already highlighted by Biltong, but, keeping a clean sheet in the second half on top of not conceding a try was a magnificent almost un-noticed effort. It's not often that we don't concede a try against a decent team, but on top of that Tonga never really looked much like getting a score, so credit to Scotland defence team.
Composure - Even though we had the upper hand in the first ten minutes in the corner at the Tonga line, we didn't balloon this and turned it into a score (despite the blatant repeated infringements and the tardy approach of Mr Doyle). Elsewhere, we re-grouped and "got on with it". This is tribute to the uncompromising and pragmatic approach of Mr Cotter.
Teamwork - You can just see the body language, camaraderie, togetherness and spirit of the boys. All squad members have got it, first 15, subs, support team. Great team ethics and a certain amount of belligerence emanating from the younger squad members and ably supported by the more established team members.
FGFFeel Good Factor - Finn Russell dancing!! FFS (young fellas stuff, but great to see) plus, the fact that we appear to have found a genuine No 10.
Ewan Murray, still being grumpily proud and forthright. (NZ game)
Gray bros running the line out and relishing it.
Tommy Seymour with his cheeky grin on his face as he goes in for yet another poachers steal.
Greig Laidaw, like Ford, Hogg and Lamont, re-finding best form and playing well for team and themselves.
Back row - There is a balance there now, with a genuine fetcher at 7, an unsung GRAFTING superstar at 6 (for me, Harley has been the Scottish player of the AI's) and two solid lumps at 8 in Ashe and Beattie (both great options). We have a great compliment of styles and cohesion.

So yeah, PLENTY of attitude, but also PLENTY to work on. I would cite the following as areas of concern:
Penalty count. Though I think in yesterday's game Mr Doyle was far too hasty with his whistle for both sides at the breakdown, stifling the game and making it a game about him, rather than a game about the players.
More clinical attacking required. Yesterday we had two give-aways (Hogg and Seymour) two rumbling forward tries (Cowan and Cross) and only really one open play try (Dunbar). We need to be more incisive in open play (hopefully this will come).
Fitness Levels (yes, I know we appear to be greatly improved) but we need to have NZ as the yardstick. Just look at how they came back at us to steal the game in the last few minutes, when we were out of steam. And also how they withheld England with their one-man advantage. And how NZ completely blew Wales away in the last 10 last night. THIS is what WE need to be aiming to achieve.
Strength in depth. With Bennett and Scott missing, we are a bit thin on the ground (we need these guys fit and firing). If we lose Russell........ we have a loss of impetus on our progression, that the other candidates won't be able to fulfil.

All that aside;
We have strength in depth (better than we have had for as long as I can remember)
We have a 10
We have the Gray Bros
We have a progressing team
We have a dedicated, pragmatic, focussed and delivering coach
We have great confidence
We have ability
We have plenty of room for improvement
We have the capability to improve
We have a lot to look forward to. Ireland in the semi-final of RWC2015 anyone??

RDW_Scotland wrote:

TJ wrote:

BigGee wrote:

tigertattie wrote:Two questions for me:  

1. What will happen with gilchrist? Can one of the grays be dropped to bring him back in???
2. When will the phrase "6ns dark horses" start being thrown about?

1.No, bench for him
2. No, at least not by any sane Scottish fan. 2 wins will be a result, anything over that a bonus. Lets not get ahead of ourselves

A successful 6N must mean at least 3 wins - for any team

Not too sure about that TJ - to win two games we will have to beat one of the following

A team we haven't beaten since 2006 (Wales)

Current 6N champions and 3rd best team in the world     (Ireland)

England or France away from home


I think a win against any of the above, a comfortable win over Italy and being competitive in each game would be a success - we've got to be realistic here.

RDW, mathematically, it's a win against two of the above, plus the win against Italy. But, that's just the pedant in me.
I would love to think that we could be in the position of a GS decider against Ireland at the last game of the season (and, we could quite easily be, given how tight games now are in the top 10 fixtures). But, we could also be playing to avoid the wooden spoon.
My optimist in me will always be there (and has been even over the last 12 years, despite our performances!!!!) however, I do think we will be erring towards a GS decider come 21 March 2015.

I've just twigged.
It could be  Scotland v Ireland GS/6N decider AND RWC Semi Final next year..............WOW!

TJ wrote:Its just you can never be satisfied with losing more than half your games.

I'm not saying be satisfied, but we've got to be realistic - the 6N this year is going to be more competitive than ever, we are ranked as the second bottom team, so winning more than one game will be a turn up for the books anyway

And given the description of each other team above, it will be a difficult task to beat any of them. So I think even just beating one team plus Italy would be a good building block for this young team looking to the world cup warm ups and then the world cup.

I actually fancy us to beat that squadron of barking lunatics France in the first game.

To further put things into perspective, out of 16 6N championships we have won 1 game or less 10 times.

We have only ever won 3 games once.

Since we won those 3 games (2006) we have only won more than 1 game once.

Scotland doesn't do well in the 6N, which is why I'd be pretty happy with 2 wins this year and good performances with each game!

Excellent article and some good contributions as well already.

I largely agree with a number of posters here, but I think the positives outweigh the negatives, which I suspect is largely the case for most folk.

I don’t think we are as light in midfield as we are suggesting.  Now Matt Scott(12) is back we have 3 key players able to play there whom most of us would be happy with in Dunbar, Scott and Bennett.  Yes some more depth would be nice, but Lamont has done ok recently at 13 (we scored 5 tries with him there against Tonga), and Taylor is still on the radar.

I agree that TH is a problem for us.  We do however have a few youngun’s coming through who could in a few years potentially make the step up.  Fagerson, despite not having a great game against the Scarlets, does look to have potential.  Dell can play either side, and could be decent (not really seen much of him).  Then of course we have Nel and if he ever regains fitness Cusack, as well as Welsh of course.  So whilst we are short this time round (granted not ideal with a WC coming up), I think we have future options.  Plus it’s entirely possible that one of the players I’ve just mentioned could go on to have an amazing season and nail their slot during the 6 nations.

Also I think it’s a bit harsh to call out Bennett as a negative.  Yes he didn’t have a great game on his debut (didn’t necessarily have a  bad game either) against the Pumas, but that was really the only game he played given he went off injured very early in the all blacks game.  I think it’s too early to class his performance as a negative.

With regards to the 6 nations, I think we will do well to win more than the game against Italy.  Whilst we have undoubtedly improved, sadly so has everyone else.  I do however think we will be far more competitive this time around.  I think our game against Italy should be won a bit more convincingly than it has in the past.  

Whilst this would be an improvement, I can’t say that I would be happy with just winning one game.  I think that is potentially part of the problem the national team has had in the past as well.  We seem to have been happy enough with losing, but being plucky about it.  I think anything other than winning the 6 nations has to be regarded as a disappointment.  Don’t get me wrong I realise that chances are we’re not going to win the 6 nations, but we need to start having the mind-set that we’re going to win, rather than just wanting to be half decent.  Yes, half decent would be a good starting point considering some of the performances/results we’ve had in recent years, but we need to move on from that.  We have a coach we all believe in, we have arguably the best set of players we’ve had in years, we need to believe this is our time, and stop beating ourselves in our head before we’ve even started.

RDW_Scotland wrote:To further put things into perspective, out of 16 6N championships we have won 1 game or less 10 times.

We have only ever won 3 games once.

Since we won those 3 games (2006) we have only won more than 1 game once.

Scotland doesn't do well in the 6N, which is why I'd be pretty happy with 2 wins this year and good performances with each game!

Yeah but during most of that time we had:
Williams
Hadden
Johnson

If we want to compete then we need to be aiming high, realistically high I agree, but high non the less!

Being realistic:

Game one: We could beat France in the first game. We're playing well, France run hot and cold. If they are cold here, we could get one over them

Game two: Our performance vs Wales's performance this AI series would have me thinking, that at home, we should be beating the sheep worriers!

Game three: With our progress and Italy stuttering to improve any, we should be targetting this as a win by 20+

Game four: As much as I'd love to say we can turn over England, i think they will jsut be too powerful and squeeze the life out of us down at twickers! I would say we should lose this one

Game five: We're at home again but I think Ireland will just be that much more all rounded. With home advantage I think we could win this one but it won't be easy. I actually think it will come down to how the other four games have panned out.

If I was in charge of evaluating Scotlands success at the 6ns. I'd be looking for three wins. Wins over Italy and wales and a win over either France or Ireland

So much depends on whether Glasgow can get back into the groove and start amassing a decent run of wins (especially TBP wins).

That AIs campaign has got to have given everyone confidence. If you're Adam Ashe or Jonny Gray, what he hell have you got to worry about now playing the likes of Dragons? I really am expecting Glasgow to motor on now and the national team can only benefit. If Glasgow manages to put away Toulouse at home and can get out of their RCC group, what a boost that is going to be.  

I will also be very interested to see whether the likes of Ford (I think we all agree that he surprised everyone this campaign) can kick on with Edinburgh. Getting Scott, Fife and Brown back is really massive for them and lots of rugby fans might get interested in their team again. Gilchrist has got to get well soon, as does Du Preez.

George Carlin wrote:So much depends on whether Glasgow can get back into the groove and start amassing a decent run of wins (especially TBP wins).

That AIs campaign has got to have given everyone confidence. If you're Adam Ashe or Jonny Gray, what he hell have you got to worry about now playing the likes of Dragons? I really am expecting Glasgow to motor on now and the national team can only benefit. If Glasgow manages to put away Toulouse at home and can get out of their RCC group, what a boost that is going to be.
I will also be very interested to see whether the likes of Ford (I think we all agree that he surprised everyone this campaign) can kick on with Edinburgh. Getting Scott, Fife and Brown back is really massive for them and lots of rugby fans might get interested in their team again. Gilchrist has got to get well soon, as does Du Preez.

I agree that this is probably the single most important thing for Scottish National Team to maintain/build on the progress we seem to have made. I'll be rooting for Glasgow all the way. Also, I feel if Edinburgh can get through their Challenge cup group - particularly if we can secure a home QF, the confidence gained for the players and fans will really help create a real buzz going into the 6 nations.

Ok, now that the dust has settle, the hangovers have passed and the thoughts are moving to Christmas drinks - i thought I would provide my thoughts as well

Overall a bit of a strange one for me - some flashing highlights, but some deep concern still raising its head

Highlights

Positive attitude - lost for so many years and great to see - will it last though as a new coach has a window
Positive play and style - nice to see us trying to win, rather than trying not lose - a dangerous way to play, but I fully support it - long may it continue
Player v2 - like to the old 606 - 606v2 rose from its ashes - and are we seeing that with some of our players- Ford - I doth my hat to you - laidlaw you brought it -
Hamilton.... well maybe not all - good to see- and let it continue
2 shades of Gray - good to see younger come in and look at home, and also older take up the mantle to not be outdone - all round warmness here - great line out all round
Defence - rocks - like of old
Plan B - YES WE HAD ONE - WOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOO - one of the biggest positives for me - when Plan A (first half Tonga) was failing, a new play arrived and it worked - I was shocked and happy and then had to check it was Scotland playing


Negatives

There are still a few

Hogg - still not convinced - defence weak - high ball - school boy level and really not bringing enough yet going forward - at least his attitude is better
Scrum - we are going to suffer with this scrum in the 6n. We will be bullied and have no platform. Think it will lose us games
Constructing tries - still not really there. We are a defence and huff and puff team - need to turn the puff into real chances - on the right path, but still a way to go
Handling still an issue - one match out of 3 where we had good handling - NZ and tonga - very poor

The old / real (delete and appropriate) Scotland is still just under the surface.

The Tonga match encapsulated exactly where I am at the moment -

first half - shocking, terrible Old Scotland - bereft of ability and ideas - an example of all that has been wrong in Scotland rugby for the last 10 years - a step back to the dark ages - a highlight that one game does not make a summer - poor, bad and rubbish

Second half - a plan B, going to a tactic, making it work, better skills, better decisions - keeping it tight, pressure, more control - taking it to the man - showing skill and passion - good, better and exciting

So where are we with this Scotland- I really do not know - we have an opportunity - the young players to not fear playing and a coach that has a plan B - there are foundations - can we build on them?

The Risky officechatrugby'ometre is swinging from 'Embarrassed that we call this rugby' to 'mildly happy to discuss rugby in the office' - I really hope to get to 'yes, it is I Risky starting a conversation about Rugby' or even 'where is that Kiwi in the office - time we talked rugby'

The 6 nations will be Key -

Win target
4 should be our target (We have to go into each game thinking we will win) -
3 will be good day at the office -
2 treading water -
1 a failure -
zero - I give up

I'd give the series a 7.

There was plenty to be happy with:
- Scoring a bundle of tries
- Laidlaw and Ford's comeback (R Gray to a certain extent)
- Settled 2, 4-15

But there's still plenty to work on:
- Shirts 1 & 3 are up for grabs in my book
- A full 80 minute performance lacking
- Would have liked to have seen some drop goals, just to keep the scoreboard ticking vs ABs.


Player of the tour contenders:

Ford, J Gray, Laidlaw

Players worth praise:

Ashe, Russell, Seymour, Harley

Players who maybe weren't at their best:

- Poor scrummaging all round.
- Hogg: Was good enough, but still not at his best. Perhaps a few games at centre would do him good (at Glasgow) to get him on the ball more. Also, where have his great touch-finding kicks gone?
- Hamilton & Strokosch. Time to retire from intl rugby?

One last point, I think Mark Bennett did ok, but hark back to Matt Scott when he started out. I remember vs Ireland him knocking on and maybe not being his absolute best. He just needs time.

So, based on what we now know, what do we think the XV will look like in the 6 Nations?

Injuries permitting, here's my stab at what we'll see (and pretty much what I want to see as well):

1.Dickinson 2.Ford 3.Murray 4.J Gray 5.R Gray 6.Harley 7.Cowan 8.Beattie 9.Laidlaw(c) 10.Russell 11.Seymour 12.Scott 13.Dunbar 14.Maitland 15.Hogg

16.Grant 17.F Brown 18.Cross 19.Gilchrist 20.Denton 21.Cusiter 22.Weir 23.Bennett

Pretty much spot on for me, with the only real debating point being the 8 shirt and sub.

Still think Kelly should be on the bench.

Hopefully Fraser Brown gets some gametime for Glasgow - he's similar in stature to Ford and seems to be fairly dynamic.

I'm delighted with the way its gone this autumn. Its such a long time since our guys have looked like they've been enjoying playing for Scotland. Finn's jigs, the beaming smile the Beeb captured on Fordy's face on the lap of honour and the back slapping after each score on Saturday said it all for me.

There is a definitely a feel good factor in Scottish rugby at the moment and I hope we can hang onto that for as long as possible. Crikey, Edinburgh even looked like they were buzzing yesterday afternoon. Like you say, if Glasgow push on and get out of their Champions Cup group and Edinburgh push on it will really help come February.

My player of the series has been Rob Harley. I think Ross Ford also deserves a mention for pushing through some really testing times to gain some sustained form. The pack in general looks rejuvenated. The Grays, quite rightly, have been attracting the armchair plaudits, but I think the front rows and back rows have also been key. Yes, there is room for improvement, most notably in the front row, but it looks like we are building in confidence, team ethic and form.

We are even developing some reasonable depth when you consider Reid, Grant, Allan, MacArthur, Gilchrist, Swinson, Hamilton, Brown, Denton, Rennie, Barclay, Fusaro and Brown are getting (or are due to get) significant game time but can't get into the team. Strauss and Nel will be useful additions to the playing pool too, as will Hardie (if he comes).

I love the energy we generating in the backs. Scotland back play has been stodgy for far too long and the fact that the players that we've been talking about for so long on this forum are now playing (in their correct positions) has been a joy to behold. They are all so young too. There is so much potential there its unbelievable. They could develop into a truly awesome unit.

Again there is reasonable depth when you consider Fife, Scott, Jackson and Hart have been unfit and Pygos and Heathcote look like they are coming into form. But I think our starting 15 and bench for the French will be pretty similar to what we've seen this Autumn:

1.Grant 2.Ford 3.Murray 4.J Gray 5.R Gray 6.Harley 7.Cowan 8.Denton 9.Laidlaw(c) 10.Russell 11.Seymour 12.Scott 13.Dunbar 14.Maitland 15.Hogg

16.Dickinson 17.Brown 18.Cross 19.Gilchrist 20.Beattie 21.Cusiter 22.Weir 23.Bennett

I don't usually like the fella, but Tom English's article for the Beeb strikes a pleasingly optimistic note - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/30167481

RDW_Scotland wrote:Pretty much spot on for me, with the only real debating point being the 8 shirt and sub.

Still think Kelly should be on the bench.

Hopefully Fraser Brown gets some gametime for Glasgow - he's similar in stature to Ford and seems to be fairly dynamic.

Agree with both FES' team and also RDW's comment above.

In that company, Denton stands out like a banana in a bunch of grapes at the moment - I would say that all of the others are strong candidates for a starter's shirt and deserve their place. Very difficult to put Denton in that category. I am not a hater, I just think that Kelly B is in a completely different league and a more versatile loose forward generally.

Other than this switch, that squad would give anyone in the 6N a game. I agree that it's difficult to see where the obvious win is going to come from but that's completely missing the point at present.

We used to have a side riddled with obvious weakness, who worked to a limited gameplan, had no Plan B and sometimes looked like that they were just waiting to be humanely euthanised. Now I see the relative strengths instead of the glaring holes in ability and a young side who look like they just want to give it a crack. This makes me keen to watch them again and that's about the best gift Cotter could have given his players.

Scotland have had a very strong AI series of games. I've been impressed with how Cotter has settled into the job.

I think the last game of the 6Ns will be interesting with Ireland @ Scotland, any spare tickets going for that fixture?

Blair Cowan named on the Planet Rugby team of the week - that's every week now there's been a Scotsman in there!

I just spotted that. I was actually slightly disappointed not to see more than one guy there. How times have changed

As a London Irish fan, we are all hoping that Geoff Cross comes back into the starting side with us. Our current first choice tight head is getting munched every week and it would be good to see if Cross can sort things out for us.

nickj wrote:I just spotted that. I was actually slightly disappointed not to see more than one guy there. How times have changed

Jonny Gray got an honourable mention this week after having been in the team last week.
Some punter called Brodie Retallick got the shirt instead. Who?

Very good article from Mike Blair on the beeb - goes into some depth on technicalities too.

Looking at the score-board, reading 37-12 in Scotland's favour over Tonga, the suggestion is a comfortable win.

In reality, it probably was, but all thanks to a much tidier, accurate and direct second-half performance.

There were hints of deja vu from the loss two years ago, as the first half unravelled. Handling errors, indecision and indiscipline from the home side as the visiting Tongans gained in confidence.

I could see what the Scots were trying to do. They had played a forward-orientated game in the first two matches of the autumn series, running directly from Greig Laidlaw, and it seemed that they were trying to add another building block to their attacking game by also using running options off fly-half Finn Russell.

The problem seemed to be the lines and depth on the outside. Tonga were playing with an aggressive defence, coming hard up off their line and getting in the faces of the Scottish attack.
Play media

For me, the forwards were too wide and/or too flat; so either the ball was in the air too long from Russell's pass, resulting in a man and ball tackle, or the forward was too flat when up against an organised line, thereby catching the ball on the gain line and at the same time being clobbered in the tackle.

Different methods and styles are used by different teams, which will be affected by speed of ball and the integrity of the defensive line, but I feel that you have two main options.

If there is a solid line of defence, give the ball early to a deeper, well-supported forward, taking the contact on his own terms, so that possession can be maintained and the defensive line can be manipulated.

The other option is the fly-half taking the ball flat to the line from quick ball, against a disorganised defence, and the forward runners doubling up on either side of one defender and playing through the defence.

From a mixed first half, saved by Stuart Hogg's length-of-the-fielder, Scotland got back in the sheds, said what needed to be said and turned the screw.

In either instance you do not want the ball in the air for long as it enables the defence to 'blitz' the receiving player.

The other issue in the first half, and first two minutes of the second half, was the discipline.
Vern Cotter's team conceded five penalties for not rolling away in the tackle. It is an unforced penalty concession and is a very cheap way of conceding points and territory.

An interesting discussion point on the game is what Scotland tried to do from their first two attacking lineouts. There was front peel and a 10-man special play lineout involving some smart jiggery pokery.

I'm a believer in trying to beat what is in front of you and against a Pacific Island team, I see the strength as being in the set piece and organisation. I don't dispute that if the moves were performed 100% then Scotland would have scored, but I was keen to see a good old fashioned catch-and-drive to put the squeeze on.

The second half was a much simpler affair. Discipline - better; Handling - better; Composure - better; Directness - direct. Oh, and didn't the lineout function brilliantly in attack and defence.
The forwards did the hard graft, running off Laidlaw, getting everything moving forward. And Finn Russell, taking the ball on the front foot, showed his range of skills.

From a mixed first half, saved by Stuart Hogg's length-of-the-fielder, Scotland got back in the sheds, said what needed to be said and turned the screw.

This was the difference from two years previously, they were able to fix problems, adapt and overcome.

A young, talented team learning on the job.

Nematode wrote:I'd give the series a 7.

There was plenty to be happy with:
- Scoring a bundle of tries
- Laidlaw and Ford's comeback (R Gray to a certain extent)
- Settled 2, 4-15

But there's still plenty to work on:
- Shirts 1 & 3 are up for grabs in my book
- A full 80 minute performance lacking
- Would have liked to have seen some drop goals, just to keep the scoreboard ticking vs ABs.

I agree that the tighthead jersey is looking problematic (although far better than it has in the past for those of us who remember Mattie Stewart) but I don't see loosehead as an issue, more that there are there strong options to choose from in Dickinson, Grant and Reid. Dickinson does some fantastic work in the loose, but isn't a destructive scrummager (isn't a bad one either), whereas Grant is probably the better scrum man, with Reid coming somewhere between the two.

I think a fully fit Ryan Grant probably edges it, but Cotter was right to spare him a bit in this AI series, and let him get fully up to speed before the 6 Nations.

funnyExiledScot wrote:

Nematode wrote:I'd give the series a 7.

There was plenty to be happy with:
- Scoring a bundle of tries
- Laidlaw and Ford's comeback (R Gray to a certain extent)
- Settled 2, 4-15

But there's still plenty to work on:
- Shirts 1 & 3 are up for grabs in my book
- A full 80 minute performance lacking
- Would have liked to have seen some drop goals, just to keep the scoreboard ticking vs ABs.

I agree that the tighthead jersey is looking problematic (although far better than it has in the past for those of us who remember Mattie Stewart) but I don't see loosehead as an issue, more that there are there strong options to choose from in Dickinson, Grant and Reid. Dickinson does some fantastic work in the loose, but isn't a destructive scrummager (isn't a bad one either), whereas Grant is probably the better scrum man, with Reid coming somewhere between the two.

I think a fully fit Ryan Grant probably edges it, but Cotter was right to spare him a bit in this AI series, and let him get fully up to speed before the 6 Nations.

Having watched Edinburgh's game against Cardiff I would say that Nel looks to be developing in to a good option, his scrummaging looked pretty steady (wasn't always the case previously) and he is very mobile and works hard in defence. I would think he will be a good asset once qualified if he continues to improve. Sutherland also looked good at loosehead against Adam Jones and great things are hoped for from Dell in the future also.

Against the Cardiff Blues, Edinburgh had only ONE Scottish born player in their pack, that is pretty feeble given that Scotland have the second highest population in GB. Before long the Scottish national team will be like a who's who of from the southern hemisphere.

New 7s kit is in, so presumably that means we are stuck with that foul, cash sucking jamboree for a while longer. I like the navy one. The pink one is completely appropriate given the enormous jessies that comprise our 7s team.

Whilst we do have a number of non scottish players, we are shafted with injuries and international call ups.

Normally we would have either Dickinson (with Scotland)/Sutherland (played) (or now Sheils) at LH, Ford (with Scotland) at hooker.  Then one or two of the following in the 2nd row, Gilchrist (injured), McKenzie (came off the bench), and in the back row Watson (injured).

From that list at least 4 would be regular starters and you could argue 6 would be involved in some capacity.  All of whom were born in Scotland.  Then you have the others who are SQ, in Denton, Atikins, Toolis & Grant.

So not that bad really.

EWT Spoons wrote:So not that bad really..

7 out of eight forwards who are not Scottish, starting for one of your TWO regions is very bad, really. Injuries or not, you only have two regions/pro clubs, and you are filling them with NSQ players, I would not be happy with this if the Welsh regions feilded that many NWQ players in one game, and you wonder why Scotland's main game of the 6n is Italy ? Come on, the SRU need to do better than this.

LordDowlais wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:So not that bad really..

7 out of eight forwards who are not Scottish, starting for one of your TWO regions is very bad, really. Injuries or not, you only have two regions/pro clubs, and you are filling them with NSQ players, I would not be happy with this if the Welsh regions feilded that many NWQ players in one game, and you wonder why Scotland's main game of the 6n is Italy ? Come on, the SRU need to do better than this.

There is a difference between NSQ and not Scottish-born. Four of the players in the pack vs Cardiff are the latter, and still qualify to play for Scotland (Grant, Denton, Atkins and Toolis). Another (Sutherland) is Scottish born, so only three are NSQ.

Given our low player numbers, it isn't surprising that the SRU has to bring in SQ'd players from abroad. The establishment of national academies should help increase player numbers, but this will take time.

Captain_Sensible wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:So not that bad really..

7 out of eight forwards who are not Scottish, starting for one of your TWO regions is very bad, really. Injuries or not, you only have two regions/pro clubs, and you are filling them with NSQ players, I would not be happy with this if the Welsh regions feilded that many NWQ players in one game, and you wonder why Scotland's main game of the 6n is Italy ? Come on, the SRU need to do better than this.

There is a difference between NSQ and not Scottish-born. Four of the players in the pack vs Cardiff are the latter, and still qualify to play for Scotland (Grant, Denton, Atkins and Toolis). Another (Sutherland) is Scottish born, so only three are NSQ.

Given our low player numbers, it isn't surprising that the SRU has to bring in SQ'd players from abroad. The establishment of national academies should help increase player numbers, but this will take time.

Glasgow's predominantly Scottish squad balances this out a little, Dowlais. It's true that the Exfoliators of the East rely on foreign importants, but Glasgow don't.

Out of a squad of 47 registered players, only 6 are NSQ at the moment and some of these will become SQ over the next year or so. Of Glasgow's first choice 15, I would say that there are only 3 players (Leone Nakarawa, Nikola Matawalu and Joshua Strauss) who are NSQ and Strauss will become SQ next summer.

Also, roddy Grant and David Denton moved to Scotland after leaving high school, so it's not as if they are mercenaries who have just turned up looking to play for Scotland. I don't think anyone could question their desire or pride for playing for Scotland either.

So as am Edinburgh and Scotland fan, I have no problem at all with the pack we had out!

Sutherland - Scottish born and bred
Hilterbrand - sq, moved to Scotland last year
Atkins - sq, moved to Scotland two years ago
Toolis - sq, moved to Scotland two years ago
Coman - nsq
Grant - sq moved to Scotland as a teenager
Denton - sq moved to Scotland as a teenager

Subs -

Shiells - Scottish born
Cochrane - Scottish born
McKenzie - Scottish born
Leonardi - nsq

So of all the 12 forwards in the squad 9 sq, 4 Scottish born and bred

Just out of interest, how many of the Scottish national side are actualy Scottish ? By this I mean, people who have lived in Scotland for the majority, or all their lives, also, how many of these SQ players do you have at your two pro clubs ?

And as has been mentioned Dickinson, Ford, Gilchrist will be back soon and they're all Scottish born and bred.

Just don't ask about the situation in the backs...

LordDowlais wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:So not that bad really..

7 out of eight forwards who are not Scottish, starting for one of your TWO regions is very bad, really. Injuries or not, you only have two regions/pro clubs, and you are filling them with NSQ players, I would not be happy with this if the Welsh regions feilded that many NWQ players in one game, and you wonder why Scotland's main game of the 6n is Italy ? Come on, the SRU need to do better than this.

Don't get me wrong, if I had the choice it would be a full 15 of Scottish players, but during international windows then the number of Scottish players in the side is going to suffer.  Especially when there are only 2 pro sides.

As I said normally when it’s not an international window, we would have Dickinson & Ford in the front row, Gilchrist & McKenzie in the 2nd row and Watson in the back row.  4 of them are near certain starters, McKenzie is at worst on the bench, normally joined by Sutherland.  Then as Capt Sensible pointed out there are the players who whilst not born in Scotland are SQ, in Denton, Grant, Toolis & Atkins.

So normally you would be looking at 4 or 5 born Scots in the side, or 6-7 SQ players in the side.