Winners of the 6ns based on the Ais.

First topic message reminder :

Should be Ireland in first place.

England/Wales/Wales/England fighting it out for 2nd 3rd place.

Have not seen any of the France games or Scotland games for that matter.

Will their be a GRAND SLAM next year? probably not.

But it will be very exciting to see if the Ais have any bearing on the 6ns.

Your thoughts.

TightHEAD wrote:To English and Welsh fans:

Whats more important next year 'Winning 6 Nations or getting out of the Pool 'of death' in the RWC? '

Ask Martin Johnson! Apparently winning the 6 nations counts for nothing if you don't back it up with a good world cup...

Big wrote:

TightHEAD wrote:To English and Welsh fans:

Whats more important next year 'Winning 6 Nations or getting out of the Pool 'of death' in the RWC? '

Ask Martin Johnson!  Apparently winning the 6 nations counts for nothing if you don't back it up with a good world cup...

Martin Johnson didn't get the GS though. GS is different to just winning the 6 nations. England flattered to deceive and were found out in the RWC.


Good performance in the RWC vs 6 nations win - I would be disappointed if England don't make at least the final - should start favourite in all matches bar vs NZ and SA.

If England do happen to get knocked out in the pool stages then Lancaster and co should have their contracts terminated - with of course the RFU picking up the bill for the folly of giving them long term contracts.

On most recent evidence:

France will marmalise us with breakdown aggression and numbers.
England will run us into the ground and score try after try
Wales will taunt us and toy with us and wait for the penalties, which Halfpenny or Biggar will knock over with the rhythm of a ticking clock
Scotland will muck us around, feck us up and bury us under the new Murrayfield turf....
And Italy.... well, they'll refuse to play us because we're only a Tier 2 Nation and not eligible for 6Ns.

Ireland has become an enigma - again.  Now that we've achieved a level of consistency at International, it's Provincial that seems to be suffering from the hangover.  I have a feeling there are orders about that pacing this year is extremely important even at the risks to Provinces.  So I'm not feeling as bad as I probably should about the shoddy form of our three top Provinces. But that old idea about confidence v fragility.  You can't just turn on confidence, it's a grower.  Irish players are risking losing that built up confidence bit by bit now post the AIs.

How can you say Ireland have become an enigma? They had a good AIs, have a decent head coach, have been consistent.

Ireland are deservedly the favourites.

beshocked wrote:How can you say Ireland have become an enigma? They had a good AIs, have a decent head coach, have been consistent.

Ireland are deservedly the favourites.

Jesus Beshocked!!!  Pouncing on me again??!!!  Will you give a guy a break to get up off the ground and brush himself down after a mauling sometime!

I mean to say 'Ireland' as in totality - Irish International and Provincial.  The enigma a few years ago was that Provinces were so strong relatively - had a hard as nails side for the big forward contingent and a slick willy side for the running stuff + a resilient enough Ulster to fill in any gaps.   The enigma was that Provinces shone but the International side was a stuttering mess of confusion and knock-ons and inter-tibal warfare.  Provinces functioned - International failed.

Now it's growing to be the opposite - International good - Provinces wilting.  That's the 'enigma' I'm talking about.   The ideal balance would be that both Provinces and International function well... but it seems it's an either/or scenario that is our lot.

beshocked wrote:
Martin Johnson didn't get the GS though. GS is different to just winning the 6 nations. England flattered to deceive and were found out in the RWC.


Good performance in the RWC vs 6 nations win - I would be disappointed if England don't make at least the final - should start favourite in all matches bar vs NZ and SA.

If England do happen to get knocked out in the pool stages then Lancaster and co should have their contracts terminated - with of course the RFU picking up the bill for the folly of giving them long term contracts.

Largely agree, but unless I missed something the question asked about winning the 6 nations - not getting a grand slam. And I don't think England were simply found out, I'm happy to admit that performances were hit and miss before the world cup but I also think they inexplicably reverted back to a more conservative playing style that hadn't worked for them previously.

Regardless of that though my point really is that we already have pretty strong evidence that if you win the 6 nations you aren't likely to be forgiven for a poor performance in the world cup. And on that front I'd very strongly agree that Lancaster should have his contract terminated if they don't get out of the group.

Secretfly fair enough I guess though last week I agreed with you twice!

This particular thread is about the international sides though and the Irish will be the favourites next year. Irish players will be re energised when they play for Ireland. Wales have been like that for years.

Also it's very difficult to get both club and country firing on all cylinders. Look at France - strong clubs but flaky international side, England - solid clubs, okay international side. Wales - okay international side, poorly performing regions.

Of course there's going to be some difference when you take arguably the best coach of a province and make him your coach of the international side!

Big my point about the GS vs winning the 6 nations is that martin johnson didn't even manage the former.

A GS is far better than just winning a 6 nations (you don't necessarily to win every match). Beating everyone is far more satisfying.

England could have and probably should have won the 6 nations this year. As far I am concerned - Lancaster threw the opportunity of a GS away. Sure they won 4 matches and could have won on points difference but winning a tournament on points difference is not the same as winning outright.

GunsGerms wrote:Looks like all Ireland's provinces will get ko'd of the Anglo French cup in the group stages. This may well help Ireland in the 6N and WC.

Yup, it could be a blessing in disguise. Less likely that players will get injured and filter back injured players.

The HEC success never really had any effect on Ireland. It was the opposite to Wales - a similarly sized rugby nation. Irish teams doing well in the HEC while the Welsh national side were winning 6 nations.

If you takes the players' mindset, the struggles with the provinces might mean they feel more energised when playing for Ireland. Thats what it looks like for the Welsh players.

Heard a rumour that the IRFU are broke due to the RWC bid and thay they can't afford to pay the provinces travel in the KO stages - therefore the directive is that if by round 3 they can't qualify as a top seed they are to abandon ship in this years competition.

If this is true then expect the sides to send out the B&I cup teams in the next round.

The world cup bid is only €1.9m and it is split between the NI execquer, the Irish govt and the IRFU. That bill probably wouldnt even bankrupt Jamie Heaslip's restaraunt.

You are telling porkies again Rodders.

GunsGerms wrote:
You are telling porkies again Rodders.

again?? ....

Ok well you are telling porkies now.

Well you can't fool all of the people all of the time I suppose.

How is everyone?

Merry Xmas

Merry Xmas. How is the Shrink? I'll be in Resolven for Christmas again (apologies if I have you confused you with someone else )

Shix! I'll be back in Glynneath, come and watch us v Swansea in the league on the 27th and give my regards to Clanger in Resolven

I'll pass on your regards to the Shrink

Where is it? St Helens? I might see if I can convince my father-in-law.

PS. Glynneath in the same league as Swansea? WTF?

You mean Swansea in the same league as us big boys - get your fat arse down there - Yes St Helens

If your father in law is from Resolven you've got no hope, they hate us Germans

I think it'll be alright. He's easy going and my wife went to Welsh school there I think. He was even cheering for England in the 2007 WC final. Although he is a Scarlet fan (he's a confused bangwagon supporter that forgot to get off when it broke down)

Back to the original question and 2015 is a pretty easy one with Eng and Ire home for us:


1 - WALES
2 - Ireland
3 - England/France
5 - Italy
6 - The Perrenial Dark Horses with yet another false dawn

The Scots probably think you're wrong there, Ruby. Don't go disrespecting their opinions now.

They've been saying I'm wrong for the past 12 years Fly, I just see a bit more organisation with Scotland with the others being way ahead - We owe you guys a good slamming in Cardiff and I'm comfortable that we'll achieve that - FFS, the last time you beat us there we still won the championship with that narrow victory over the mighty English in the last game. My opinion is as valid as any and probably more valid than most. As usual, good luck to all teams in the 6 Nations in this special year ahead

Scotland will be one of the weaker teams no doubt. Ireland and England the best. Scotland must win two and maybe nick a third. Not a huge amount between any of the teams so no grand slam

Sexton out until mid-Feb (missing Italy game at least) with concussion (from Ireland v Australia game).

Sexton is apparently out till Valentine's day now...

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_9611393,00.html

if he only miss the Italy game and perhaps the France one it might not be such an issue for team Ireland.

Will he be able to just slot back in? You would have thought he is going to be a little rusty

With all these guys we are going from 'as long as he is OK for the 6N' to 'as long as he is OK for the RWC'

As the 6N falls within an IRB international window the IRFU will have the final say on whether Sexton will be ok to play.

Given he was concussed on the 22nd of  November I would imagine he should be ok for February 7th.

It wouldn't be the end of the world if Madigan or someone else had to deputise for him against Italy as long as he was training with Ireland all along.

so it's ok to play if Ireland decides to do so eventhough a local specialist advise him not to?

Ireland have their own specialists.

Given Racing are giving a date of Feb 14 there can't be a lot in it.

A more suspicious man than myself might read more into the fact that Racing don't want him to play until the 14th which happens to be the day Ireland play France.

Sin é wrote:Sexton out until mid-Feb (missing Italy game at least) with concussion (from Ireland v Australia game).

Over 2 months for concussion? Blimey it must have been a proper smack on the melon, but it is good to see new protocols are being taken seriously.

Shame we can't silence Russell Brand this way

MunsterMac wrote:Ireland have their own specialists.

Given Racing are giving a date of Feb 14 there can't be a lot in it.

A more suspicious man than myself might read more into the fact that Racing don't want him to play until the 14th which happens to be the day Ireland play France.

It is the LNR medical commission that decided the date after various reviews by an independent neurologist.

whocares wrote:so it's ok to play if Ireland decides to do so eventhough a local specialist advise him not to?

Not if the local specialist is right. If the local specialist is right, I think Ireland camp would concur with the advice. But they'll want to do their own analysis of course, if Sexton comes over for a Christmas time Ireland team chat.