Leicester vs Scarlets - Friday 16th Jan, 19:45

Leicester Tigers (v Scarlets, Welford Road, Friday 7.45pm)
15 Mathew Tait
14 Adam Thompstone
13 Vereniki Goneva
12 Seremaia Bai
11 Miles Benjamin
10 Freddie Burns
9 Ben Youngs (c)
1 Michele Rizzo
2 Leonardo Ghiraldini
3 Logovi'i Mulipola
4 Brad Thorn
5 Geoff Parling
6 Tom Croft
7 Julian Salvi
8 Jordan Crane

Replacements
16 Tom Youngs
17 Marcos Ayerza
18 Fraser Balmain
19 Graham Kitchener
20 Robert Barbieri
21 Sam Harrison
22 Owen Williams
23 Matt Smith

Scarlets: 15 Jordan Williams, 14 Harry Robinson, 13 Regan King, 1 2 Scott Williams (c), 11 Hadleigh Parkes, 10 Rhys Priestland, 9 Aled Davies; 1 Rob Evans, 2 Ryan Elias, 3 Jacobie Adriaanse, 4 Jake Ball, 5 George Earle, 6 Aaron Shingler, 7 John Barclay, 8 Rob McCusker
Replacements: 16 Darran Harris, 17 Wyn Jones, 18 Peter Edwards, 19 Lewis Rawlins, 20 James Davies, 21 Rhodri Williams, 22 Steven Shingler, 23 Rory Pitman

Only two backs on the bench? No star Liam Williams due to injury. Apparently Gareth Davies recovery from a knee injury is taking a bit more time.

Great opportunity for Jordan Williams to show what he can do

Someone else will have to talk about the Scarlets line-up.

For Tigers only Geoff Parling remains in the tight 5 from the weekend. Logo getting a first start following injury is joined by second string Risso and Ghiraldini. Brad Thorn returns from injury. A lot of power and experience amongst the forwards on the bench, all likely to come on between the 50th and 60th minutes.

Freddie Burns preferred to Owen Williams at 10 while yet another injury to Anthony Allen sees Seremai Bai starting at 12.


My Friday night trips up the motorway, or more importantly back home again, have been pleasant affairs thi sseason. I hope that continues, but sadly feel Scarlets should have the beating of us.

Has Owen williams had an injury???

Can't find any reports???

Strange to see out of favour Burns at ten and not Williams???

I will be there. In a Leicester box unfortunately but with my Scarlets shirt on!

LondonTiger wrote: sadly feel Scarlets should have the beating of us.

Is this some kind of reverse psychology?

The Scarlets are missing 16 players.

maestegmafia wrote:

Strange to see out of favour Burns at ten and not Williams???

Not really. They look to be after the 5 points they need. Burns to run it. Their backrow is light and fast. Carriers on the bench if they need to change.

Chunky Norwich wrote:

LondonTiger wrote: sadly feel Scarlets should have the beating of us.

Is this some kind of reverse psychology?

The Scarlets are missing 16 players.

If those 16 contained 15 first choice players, we may have a chance. We are however a pretty poor team, surviving on spirit. Surely Scarlets even missing a few can beat a poor team?

Oh and Burns vs William - they have been interchanging for the last month - with burns looking the better player. Goal kicking has been the only thing in Williams favour - but for this game Cockerill is taking the "less pragmatic" choice of selecting the player more likley to help the team score tries.

maestegmafia wrote:Has Owen williams had an injury???

Can't find any reports???

Strange to see out of favour Burns at ten and not Williams???

 Not really IMO, gives burns a run out in a attacking game.

 Then Bring on Williams with the big forwards impact subs (Ayerza, Balmaian, Youngs, Kitchener, Barbieri) and play a more tactical aggressive game against a tiring defence (Esp in the front row).

LondonTiger wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

LondonTiger wrote: sadly feel Scarlets should have the beating of us.

Is this some kind of reverse psychology?

The Scarlets are missing 16 players.

If those 16 contained 15 first choice players, we may have a chance. We are however a pretty poor team, surviving on spirit. Surely Scarlets even missing a few can beat a poor team?

They are 15 first choice players. Each would have slotted into the team. I'm assuming you're having a bit of a laugh. We are down to our 5th choice hooker. Our backrow appears to be covering for our replacement wings.

Welly wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Has Owen williams had an injury???

Can't find any reports???

Strange to see out of favour Burns at ten and not Williams???

 Not really IMO, gives burns a run out in a attacking game.

 Then Bring on Williams with the big forwards impact subs (Ayerza, Balmaian, Youngs, Kitchener, Barbieri) and play a more tactical aggressive game against a tiring defence (Esp in the front row).

Oh crap that is worrying for the Scarlets. They don't have a bench of the same calibre. Missing a lot of front row players

Chunky Norwich wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

LondonTiger wrote: sadly feel Scarlets should have the beating of us.

Is this some kind of reverse psychology?

The Scarlets are missing 16 players.

If those 16 contained 15 first choice players, we may have a chance. We are however a pretty poor team, surviving on spirit. Surely Scarlets even missing a few can beat a poor team?

They are 15 first choice players. Each would have slotted into the team. I'm assuming you're having a bit of a laugh. We are down to our 5th choice hooker. Our backrow appears to be covering for our replacement wings.

Really - not one of the starters for Scarlets is a first choice player? Incredible.

In which case we may have a chance.

LondonTiger wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

LondonTiger wrote: sadly feel Scarlets should have the beating of us.

Is this some kind of reverse psychology?

The Scarlets are missing 16 players.

If those 16 contained 15 first choice players, we may have a chance. We are however a pretty poor team, surviving on spirit. Surely Scarlets even missing a few can beat a poor team?

They are 15 first choice players. Each would have slotted into the team. I'm assuming you're having a bit of a laugh. We are down to our 5th choice hooker. Our backrow appears to be covering for our replacement wings.

Really - not one of the starters for Scarlets is a first choice player? Incredible.

In which case we may have a chance.

You can not read.

Pleas explain to me what I am missing as you wrote:

They are 15 first choice players.

So if the 16 injured include 15 first choice players, then that surely means that none of the starters tomorrow are first choice? Either that or Scarlets field more than 15 players?

LondonTiger wrote:Pleas explain to me what I am missing as you wrote:

They are 15 first choice players.

So if the 16 injured include 15 first choice players, then that surely means that none of the starters tomorrow are first choice? Either that or Scarlets field more than 15 players?

We have 4 Hookers missing. So the next available hooker becomes automatic first choice. But the next available hooker is injured 4 times. Same with wings.

I count 13 (not 15 sorry) players that would have started if it weren't for injuries.

The Tigers will win this with a bonus point as well.

OK, humour me as I try again.

How many of that Scarlets starting XV are first choice players?

I would say six or seven are.

LondonTiger wrote:OK, humour me as I try again.

How many of that Scarlets starting XV are first choice players?

Well their whole front row for a start, so thats 3 plus a few of the 2nd choice front rowers so thats another 2, scrum half thats another 1, full back 1, also they are touch and go on a few other players, so I would say about 5 to six first teamers, and about another three or four replacements, so they have the replacements for the replacements in the front row, and just replacements in other areas.

Not really sure who are the first choices on the wing this season. There are four decent lads there but not sure who I would think is first choice.
Musically dictated by injury.

LondonTiger, I have to say though, if you think Scarlets are going to win this one, at Welford Rd, then you are either a crap wum or a very miserable pessimist. The Tigers will win this one at a canter, if Scarlets had a full side, then it would have gone either way.

LD I think that is a fair comment.

As pointed out above, Leicester are resting several first choice players on the bench for impact substitutions later in the game..

I'd say the Scarlets are missing 7 in the XV on the field

Full-Back
Wingers x 2
Scrum-Half
Entire Front Row

Big problem is that that Front Row has the 5th choice hooker

LordDowlais wrote:LondonTiger, I have to say though, if you think Scarlets are going to win this one, at Welford Rd, then you are either a crap wum or a very miserable pessimist. The Tigers will win this one at a canter, if Scarlets had a full side, then it would have gone either way.

I have no intention to wum on this. I have only seen Scarlets play in the ERCC - and their form has been light years ahead of ours. Their worst performance was at home against us, yet they beat us easily. I believe they will play better than that tomorrow.

At home we should win, but our season has been shocking. We have no defence, no attack and due to injuries and selectorial decisions (yes we can do that too ) will be lining up with just 6 positions filled by first choice players. If Scarlets play well, then they have a very, very good chance of winning.

LondonTiger wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:LondonTiger, I have to say though, if you think Scarlets are going to win this one, at Welford Rd, then you are either a crap wum or a very miserable pessimist. The Tigers will win this one at a canter, if Scarlets had a full side, then it would have gone either way.

I have no intention to wum on this. I have only seen Scarlets play in the ERCC - and their form has been light years ahead of ours. Their worst performance was at home against us, yet they beat us easily. I believe they will play better than that tomorrow.

At home we should win, but our season has been shocking. We have no defence, no attack and due to injuries and selectorial decisions (yes we can do that too   ) will be lining up with just 6 positions filled by first choice players. If Scarlets play well, then they have a very, very good chance of winning.

Six first choice players in the starting XV but plenty of first choice players on the bench...

PS - Leicesters best wins have been at home against Toulon, Bath & Quins. In each of those games the visiting side chose to try and make the match an arm-wrestle.

Our worst defeats were against Bath, Gloucester and Quins away and London Irish at home. In each of thoise games the opposition moved the ball away from set-piece and breakdowns wil alacrity and made us have to constantly re-organise. We failed to do that and lost - in 3 cases were hammered.

So if Scarlets arrive thinking "oh dear, we have injuries we cannot win we just need to try and avoid embarrassment" well they will lose. Should they however decide "sod that, we are Scarlets and we run the ball" well they will probably win.

LondonTiger wrote:
I have no intention to wum on this. I have only seen Scarlets play in the ERCC - and their form has been light years ahead of ours. Their worst performance was at home against us, yet they beat us easily. I believe they will play better than that tomorrow.

Are you aware the Scarlets haven't won away in any competition in almost a year?

And you reckon they'll do it with 13 players unavailable?

I have explained why I believe Tigers may lose in some detail, if you cannot be arsed to read what I say, well no point repeating myself.

LondonTiger wrote:PS - Leicesters best wins have been at home against Toulon, Bath & Quins. In each of those games the visiting side chose to try and make the match an arm-wrestle.

Our worst defeats were against Bath, Gloucester and Quins away and London Irish at home. In each of thoise games the opposition moved the ball away from set-piece and breakdowns wil alacrity and made us have to constantly re-organise. We failed to do that and lost - in 3 cases were hammered.

So if Scarlets arrive thinking "oh dear, we have injuries we cannot win we just need to try and avoid embarrassment" well they will lose. Should they however decide "sod that, we are Scarlets and we run the ball" well they will probably win.

If Scarlets are bright they'll play a good open attack..

Could be interesting.

That tigers pack looks a formidable challenge for a team missing so many front row options though.

Full strength back row, and front 5 not bad for primarily second choice players. Needs to be as we need to dominate set piece and breakdown, so Scarlets get no opportunities for quick ball. If they can keep possession, keep moving the ball quickly, we will end up very narrow in defence. Best example is the defeat at Franklins Gardens. Despite being a player down, Saints scored tries by making us tackle, tackle, and tackle again - eventually ending up with easy 3 man overlaps.

I think most Tigers fans are feeling overly pessimistic this year. The man who dragged us from mediocrity last season was Ed Slater and without his leadership on the pitch we've lacked direction. Add to that no cohesive plan for the backs to attack from and a defensive structure that is either sublime or a shambles.

I've gone for Tigers to win. Attack and defence has been pretty woeful on the whole this season but in the big games at home they've have enough dog to grind it out.

To deny that it's perfectly valid to believe that Scarlets can win is ridiculous though, if you'd watched much of Tigers this year you'd see why.

Fuzzy Dunlop wrote:

To deny that it's perfectly valid to believe that Scarlets can win is ridiculous though, if you'd watched much of Tigers this year you'd see why.

The cornerstone of any Scarlet goodness this season has been 2,3,9,15

All out.

At least you have a cornerstone of goodness this season...

Tiger should win this as it's at home but if Scarlets come out and throw the ball around the may find some serious success. Add to that it's been seriously windy on Leicestershire over the last week so tactical kicking won't be much of an option. Though Scarlets did that better than us at the Parc anyway...

1st Choice players in the Scarlets 23 are.
1 Rob Evans 1st.
2 Ryan Elias 4th
3 Peter Edwards 3rd
4 Jake Ball 1st
5 George Earl 1st
6 Aaron Shingler 1st
7 John Barclay 1st
8 Rob McCusker 2nd choice 6/8
9 Aled Davies 2nd
10 Rhys Priestland 1st
11 Hadliegh Parkes. (Centre) ? Quality player, New.
12 Scott Williams 1st +
13 Regan King 1st
14 Harry Robinson 1st.
15 Jordan Williams 2nd or 3rd choice but big talent.?

16 Darran Harris. 5th
17 Wyn Jones 3rd
18 Jacobie Adriaanse 4th
19 Lewis Rawlins 5th
20 James Davies 2nd choice 7
21 Rhodri Williams 3rd choice 9
22 Steve Shingler 2nd choice 10, utility back.
23 Rory Pitman 1st choice 8.

the real worry is the decimated front row, if we start giving away scrum penalties costing 40 mtrs a time it could be a long game defending lineout mauls.
If we can just hold the scrum together though then our backline could find some space to keep us competetive, not been a goid season for our backs so far though and with Gareth Davies and Liam Williams missing our 2 most prolific try scorers are out. We need Rhys at his visional best to put Scott in space then just maybe!

It would be a much celebrated victory to get an away win

Well if it makes you feel better;

1. Rizzo - 2nd choice
2. Ghildrildini - 2nd choice
3. Mulipola - 2nd choice
4. Thorn - 2nd choice (I wish we had Slater fit)
5. Parling - 2nd choice (Kitchener has overtaken him)
6. Croft - 2nd choice (Gibson has overtaken him on current form)
7. Salvi - 1st choice
8. Crane - 1st choice
9. Youngs - 1st choice
10. Burns - 2nd choice
11. Benjamin - 2nd choice
12. Bai - 2nd choice
13. Goneva - 3rd choice (1st choice wing)
14. Thompstone - 5th choice
15. Tait - 1st choice

Ideally we'd have;

Ayerza, Youngs, Cole
Slater, Kitchener
Gibson, Crane, Salvi
Youngs, Williams
Allen, Manu
Goneva, Tait, Morris

It doesn't work really work sam when we have 8 of your staring 15 in the 23 though.

 Also Gibson is fit..

formerly known as Sam wrote:Well if it makes you feel better;

1. Rizzo - 2nd choice
2. Ghildrildini - 2nd choice
3. Mulipola - 2nd choice
4. Thorn - 2nd choice (I wish we had Slater fit)
5. Parling - 2nd choice (Kitchener has overtaken him)
6. Croft - 2nd choice (Gibson has overtaken him on current form)
7. Salvi - 1st choice
8. Crane - 1st choice
9. Youngs - 1st choice
10. Burns - 2nd choice
11. Benjamin - 2nd choice
12. Bai - 2nd choice
13. Goneva - 3rd choice (1st choice wing)
14. Thompstone - 5th choice
15. Tait - 1st choice

Ideally we'd have;

Ayerza, Youngs, Cole
Slater, Kitchener
Gibson, Crane, Salvi
Youngs, Williams
Allen, Manu
Goneva, Tait, Morris

How many first choice players are on the replacements bench?

16 Tom Youngs
17 Marcos Ayerza
18 Fraser Balmain
19 Graham Kitchener
20 Robert Barbieri
21 Sam Harrison
22 Owen Williams
23 Matt Smith

Looks like four...!

Looks like Tigers coaches must be pretty confident that this game doesn't need a Leicester first team effort from the start?

maestegmafia wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:Well if it makes you feel better;

1. Rizzo - 2nd choice
2. Ghildrildini - 2nd choice
3. Mulipola - 2nd choice
4. Thorn - 2nd choice (I wish we had Slater fit)
5. Parling - 2nd choice (Kitchener has overtaken him)
6. Croft - 2nd choice (Gibson has overtaken him on current form)
7. Salvi - 1st choice
8. Crane - 1st choice
9. Youngs - 1st choice
10. Burns - 2nd choice
11. Benjamin - 2nd choice
12. Bai - 2nd choice
13. Goneva - 3rd choice (1st choice wing)
14. Thompstone - 5th choice
15. Tait - 1st choice

Ideally we'd have;

Ayerza, Youngs, Cole
Slater, Kitchener
Gibson, Crane, Salvi
Youngs, Williams
Allen, Manu
Goneva, Tait, Morris

How many first choice players are on the replacements bench?

16 Tom Youngs
17 Marcos Ayerza
18 Fraser Balmain
19 Graham Kitchener
20 Robert Barbieri
21 Sam Harrison
22 Owen Williams
23 Matt Smith

Looks like four...!

Looks like Tigers coaches must be pretty confident that this game doesn't need a Leicester first team effort from the start?

It's not confidence, it's a game plan. Wait till the 60 minute mark when Scarlets forwards are getting tired and bring on the heavyweights.

News on the RAFT of Scarlets injuries:-

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/rugby-union/30795302

Raft you mean canoe.

Welly wrote:Raft you mean canoe.

I'm only going on what the article say's.

Ermm we had like 24 players injured at one point and did we use that as a excuse NO!!!!!!!.



 Well maybe a little bit.

Welly wrote:Ermm we had like 24 players injured at one point and did we use that as a excuse NO!!!!!!!.



 Well maybe a little bit.

don't think i ever heard it mentioned!

nathan wrote:

Welly wrote:Ermm we had like 24 players injured at one point and did we use that as a excuse NO!!!!!!!.



 Well maybe a little bit.

don't think i ever heard it mentioned!

Cannot remember that at all.

Us.

Excuses. Nah

LordDowlais wrote:

Welly wrote:Raft you mean canoe.

I'm only going on what the article say's.

Yeah, you're doing that quite often lately aren't you.

Well you've been allowed to even it up by bringing the ref with you.

Thorn off already. That's not a good sign.

Apparently Leicester's pack is massive, according to lazy media stereotypes Quinnell. Guess which is which?

Front row 333kg
Second row 225kg
Back row 313kg


Front row 233+hooker
Second row 231kg
Back row 315kg