Italian teams and the Pro 12

First topic message reminder :

"Treviso and Zebre have been given until the end of the mont to pay 1.5m Euros to the rest of the pro12 clubs or face immediate expulsion"

says TRP.

Also says that other teams pay £80k a season visiting Italy, which they could do without. Sounds ominous.

Pot Hale wrote:

Munchkin wrote:“There is no threat at all to the continued participation of the two Italian teams.

“And there has been no official or unofficial contact with London Scottish, London Welsh, London Irish or anybody else."

Short and to the point. That should put an end to the present speculation. No London Scots/Welsh in Pro12 and the Italians are staying

That certainly puts an end to the deliberate misinformation being spread about travel costs, etc.   Some of the Pro12 coaches have also commented that they want to see the Italian teams stay in the league as well.

No one seems to be coming out and saying "wow - London Welsh and London Scottish - that'd really liven up the league" - it's been more - "well that might give us a few more chimney pots in England, never mind the quality of the team".

From what I can gather, the push for bringing in LW (in particular) has come from one Welsh region and has got this bandwagon rolling with kite-flying and speculative leaks.

Let's see how it plays out.

It would be interesting to find who it was that started all this, and why. Not that we will. Some things just didn't add up and now we know why. They weren't true

“It’s our firm belief that the Guinness Pro12 will continue in its current format next season and will continue to grow from strength to strength.

“We have set a new attendance record for the league this season, with one round of matches still to go.

“And, on the pitch, the story has been a very positive one. The new meritocracy for European qualification has been a major factor. There is just one point between the top four and we have three teams fighting it out for the final automatic qualifying spot for the Champions Cup.

“There is something on every game this weekend, which is great to see.”


Great to see Pro12 have broke their attendance record this season. The Pro12 have had a great season, which is fantastic considering the bad press during last seasons Euro war.

I think Pot's Thread is becoming less and less pathetic as I read the positive stuff coming from Pro12 camp!  

One might almost suggest a few grumblers that don't want the Pro12 to succeed (NOT meaning Chunky who is more than entitled to his opinion here!) but a few inner sanctum grumblers somewhere behind the scene decided to spin some admin facts to create more 'negative' copy.  And of course any and all negative copy keeps weighing down on the ability of Pro12 to fully bounce up in confidence.

Someone somewhere within the secret coven of Pro12ness once again doesn't want it to succeed, and will obviously continue to spin any details that come their way in negativity over the coming months/years.

These guys - officials/pen-pushers/accountants (or South African tea ladies) should be exposed for who they are and replaced.  I don't mind people having opinions on the Pro12.  You can like it or dislike it - but if you work within it simply to get the details to undermine it at every opportunity, then there is no need for you.  You can find other career opportunities.  

Hasta la vista, suckers

I thought Treviso were meant to be leaving the league at the end of last season anyway? They were going to pull out over uncertainty about it's future:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/26122565

10th Feb 2014

"Pro12: Treviso to quit competition at end of season

Italian side Benetton Treviso will leave the Pro12 at the end of the season because of uncertainty over its future.

A statement on the club's website said "a prolonged lack of final decisions" had led them not to renew their contract with the tournament.

Clubs from Wales, Ireland, Scotland and Italy participate in the competition.

Treviso say they will consider taking part in a tournament the Italian Rugby Federation intends to promote.

They cite indecision over the "organisation, participation and regulations" of the Pro12 as the main reason for the decision.

Organisers of the competition, which replaced the Celtic League when teams from Italy joined in 2010, are understood to be in negotiations over future Italian participation.

Italian Rugby Federation president Alfredo Gavazzi had said the organisation intends to withdraw Treviso and Zebre from the Pro12 and enter them in an eight-team Italian League.

Treviso have competed in the Pro12 since 2010, and had previously competed in the Italian domestic championship.

Treviso's withdrawal comes amid concern over the future of all European competitions."

10th Feb 2014

So they didn't pull out at the end of the season is the conclusion to that one.

Seems that 'Treviso Leaving!!' will become the new cyclical end of season Urban Myth for Pro12.... a bit like Big Phil constantly threatening to end his career.

We can't go on like this every season, with teams threatening to leave. It will tarnish the league and put off investors...

Pot Hale wrote:
That certainly puts an end to the deliberate misinformation being spread about travel costs.

Why is it deliberate misinformation?

Pot Hale wrote:

Munchkin wrote:“There is no threat at all to the continued participation of the two Italian teams.

“And there has been no official or unofficial contact with London Scottish, London Welsh, London Irish or anybody else."

Short and to the point. That should put an end to the present speculation. No London Scots/Welsh in Pro12 and the Italians are staying

That certainly puts an end to the deliberate misinformation being spread about travel costs, etc.   Some of the Pro12 coaches have also commented that they want to see the Italian teams stay in the league as well.

No one seems to be coming out and saying "wow - London Welsh and London Scottish - that'd really liven up the league" - it's been more - "well that might give us a few more chimney pots in England, never mind the quality of the team".

From what I can gather, the push for bringing in LW (in particular) has come from one Welsh region and has got this bandwagon rolling with kite-flying and speculative leaks.

Let's see how it plays out.

Which Welsh region is it?

It's interesting what you come across as you do your little research bits on certain topics.

Just in August of last year the London Welsh Director of Rugby wasn't exactly crying to get into the Pro12.  Nope, he was feeling pretty bullish about where things was best


BBC article:

'In 2006, London Welsh sought to join the Celtic League as a fifth Welsh region.

But Burnell is glad that move did not transpire given the current row between the WRU and Welsh regions.

"There are a lot of politics, but why would you not want to be part of the strongest club competition in the world? It's getting better too," he said.

"I don't really listen to Welsh rugby, or read much about it…it doesn't interest me.

"I'm in England now and the Aviva Premiership is just fantastic.

"It's an honour to be part of the best club league in the world. The gap [with the Pro12] is widening to be honest." '



It's an honour knowing you want to change your mind now, Justin.  Thanks for the interest but no thanks.  You just enjoy the League you're going to be in next season LW, it'll obviously be more up to your ideal standards even if it is a step down from the Best One in the World.  You'd be too good for us here at the end of the Gap.

Ah, but Burnell was sacked two months ago

SecretFly wrote:It's interesting what you come across as you do your little research bits on certain topics.

Just in August of last year the London Welsh Director of Rugby wasn't exactly crying to get into the Pro12.  Nope, he was feeling pretty bullish about where things was best


BBC article:

'In 2006, London Welsh sought to join the Celtic League as a fifth Welsh region.

But Burnell is glad that move did not transpire given the current row between the WRU and Welsh regions.

"There are a lot of politics, but why would you not want to be part of the strongest club competition in the world? It's getting better too," he said.

"I don't really listen to Welsh rugby, or read much about it…it doesn't interest me.

"I'm in England now and the Aviva Premiership is just fantastic.

"It's an honour to be part of the best club league in the world. The gap [with the Pro12] is widening to be honest." '



It's an honour knowing you want to change your mind now, Justin.  Thanks for the interest but no thanks.  You just enjoy the League you're going to be in next season LW, it'll obviously be more up to your ideal standards even if it is a step down from the Best One in the World.  You'd be too good for us here at the end of the Gap.

The bit you should be highlighting is right after the bit you've highlighted.

LondonTiger wrote:Ah, but Burnell was sacked two months ago

No wonder the change of mood

Anyway, same reality exists. Just as a team is about to slide down, it begs to slide across instead. We're still honoured to be Second Best choice when Third Choice is what's in store for them next season.

Chunky Norwich wrote:

The bit you should be highlighting is right after the bit you've highlighted.

Well the Gap certainly widened pretty damn quick for LW - that's a fact.