Ulster 2015/2016

First topic message reminder :

Thought i would give ol' GC a helping hand and try and get Ulster types looking inward at what has been a tricky season and looking forward to next season and how we should improve. Dont have time to put down all my own theories but will do so later. This thread is a matawalu free zone btw!

I'd be more than happy with Dom as well Notch but we'll see if there's any substance to what they're saying over there.

Pete330v2 wrote:I think Hendo could do a job at 10 for goodness sake
He's an awesome player with one hell of a future ahead of him and I would love to see him get a run at No.8. As Aukster said we want Hendo getting as much ball as possible.

On other matters t'other forum are reporting that one signing we've made is that of a Leinster backrower. They've all agreed that it's Dominic Ryan and the guy in the know hasn't said yeah or nay.

Well, the guy in the know says he isn't in the know on this one.

Personally hoping it's Jordi Murphy. Or Conan. Or Leavy.

Haven't seen enough of Leavy to comment.

I like Murphy as he plays smart rugby in the Henry mould (and formerly Wilson) but Ulster need a bruiser.

Conan could be a real dynamic player like O'Brien, but I can't see Leinster letting him go.

Dom Ryan would be a good signing, because he is falling between two stools at the moment. He bulked up a bit to become Kevin McLaughlin lite, but not enough to be in the Ruddock category. In doing so he lost some of his dynamism when compared to Murphy, VdF and Conan.
If he comes to Ulster he will undoubtedly be a first choice fixture at either 6 or 8, and that will get him on Schmidt's radar again.

Players who've been part of the Ireland set-up want to play under Les Kiss

The only two out of contract are Murphy and Ryan. I'd be very happy with either of them! (as long as theres still a big NIQ signing)

You have to say though, it certainly sounds like a deal that has been made to seal Hendo's fate as a lock...


Edit: Actually... I can't find contract info on Conan. I see only that he was included in a list of contract renewals last year, but they didn't say how long the contracts were. So who knows, maybe he could be an option.

Also...
It IS plausible that Notch and I recently hypothesising a Leinster signing grew legs, got whispered in a few ears, and then ending up on the  other forum's rumours thread.

There's really nothing in it. But who knows!

clivemcl wrote:Also...
It IS plausible that Notch and I recently hypothesising a Leinster signing grew legs, go whispered in a few peoples ears, and ending up on the  other forum's rumours thread.

There's really nothing in it. But who knows!

I remember a poster called red-stag on the old 606 made up a rumour about Munster, posted it on the forum and we all laughed as it appeared on one website/newspaper/forum after another.

Those who know don't talk.
And those that talk don't know.

Or maybe... maybe I just know more than you think?

Thanks for the replies. My tuppence worth is the same as some of you in that I'd like to see him get his hands on the ball as much as possible. That's why I thought no.8 might be a good option.

Ah good old Redstag, he and MBTGOG, and erudite pair indeed. Put most of us to shame when it came to rugby knowledge and analysis.

And now the guy in the know is definitely playing with us whether he knows any information or not. He likes to tease us mortals. He has now said this "Wonder who the replacement for ihumph is? A Leinster player maybe??"

Pete330v2 wrote:And now the guy in the know is definitely playing with us whether he knows any information or not. He likes to tease us mortals. He has now said this "Wonder who the replacement for ihumph is? A Leinster player maybe??"

You guys are taking one of the turnstiles from the RDS????

Well played Golden!

Three fly-halves in their acadamy, and the young Cathal Marsh in the senior squad. They probably could spare one.

The only Leinster players for outhalf are Sexton and Marsh, with Byrne and Corbary in the Academy. Possibly Crosbie but i think hes mostly a centre and you have enough of them.

Cant imagine theyd be too keen to lose Marsh or Byrne with Mads gone too.

Interesting interview with Bryn.

Sounds like Lewis Stevenson basically chose to leave, and came to an arrangement with UR to get out early. Think he knew he would be getting a deal from Exeter that Ulster wouldn't match.

Bryn also talks again about the importance of letting nobody go.

No new info really. And gives nothing away about new signings.

Hate when interviewers don't push their luck. But in fairness it's a UR production, so what do you expect!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfdOp61o4HY

Question. Who is next in line at hooker if we don't get Herring back from Ireland??

clivemcl wrote:Question. Who is next in line at hooker if we don't get Herring back from Ireland??

Best and Cronin are starter and bench and Strauss has been released back to Leinster so surely Herring should be too

Pete330v2 wrote:

On other matters t'other forum are reporting that one signing we've made is that of a Leinster backrower. They've all agreed that it's Dominic Ryan and the guy in the know hasn't said yeah or nay.

Crikey talk about a come down from George Smith!

Interesting that Ulster are on the receiving end of players front Connacht and potentially Leinster. If these transfers have been "influenced" by Nucifora, surely Ulster must be under some pressure to share their backs?

Just checked wiki and Jared Payne's contract is up 2016 ( Thought he'd signed an extension ? - Actually I'm not certain how relevant that is, as it's probably a central IRFU contract..) Anyways with Piutau coming surely there has to be some give?    

I would love to see Dom Ryan moving north but maybe not so pleased at seeing a player of Payne's (etc) caliber moving south. I have of course no basis for this HUGE assumption but all this focus on keeping players seems a bit one sided....just saying!

Centres from Ulster Academy playing in top level club rugby:

Stuart McCloskey
Stuart Olding
Luke Marshall
Darren Cave
Michael Allen (Edinburgh)
Chris Farrell (Grenoble)
Ian Whitten (Exeter Chiefs)

and Nevin Spence gone.

clivemcl wrote:Question. Who is next in line at hooker if we don't get Herring back from Ireland??

John Andrew. Good player. If had to compare him any current Irish hooker it would be Sean Cronin.

Ulster team and replacements to play Benetton Treviso

(15-9): L Ludik, R Scholes, D Cave, S Olding, C Gilroy, I Humphreys, P Marshall;
(1-8): C Black, R Herring (capt), R Lutton; A O'Connor, F van der Merwe; C Ross, S Reidy, R Wilson;
Replacements (16-23): J Andrew, A Warwick, B Ross, P Browne, L Dow, D Shanahan, L Marshall, J Stockdale.

Hopefully Treviso can continue their consistency this season though that team has me thinking it could change

Good to see Dow making the bench, hopefully he can start to show some of the quality he has shown at underage level

Rob Herring and Luke Marshall only players released from Ireland camp for us. Rory Best, Paddy Jackson, Stuart McCloskey, Jared Payne and Andrew Trimble retained in Carton House. Very deliberate in giving Lorcan Dow a chance this week. Robbie Diack and Nick Williams rested. We're all of a mind to say the back row is weak behind the first choice now Kiss is testing that.

Interestingly Chris Henry not included- still injured? Being rested? I wonder how much he is in the plans of Schmidt right now.

Oh that back row.

In fairness, Reidy has definitely come on. Still...

Best, Jackson, McCloskey, Trimble, Payne retained by Ireland.

McCall, Williams, Henry, Arnold out injured, Pienaar still sick.

Has Stevenson literally gone already?

Don Alfonso wrote:Oh that back row.

In fairness, Reidy has definitely come on. Still...

Best, Jackson, McCloskey, Trimble, Payne retained by Ireland.

McCall, Williams, Henry, Arnold out injured, Pienaar still sick.

Has Stevenson literally gone already?

Yes.

Don Alfonso wrote:
Has Stevenson literally gone already?

Already back at Exeter training and may play this weekend for them

Shame. Would have liked to have seen him get a proper goodbye at a home game.

But not our Lewis. Someone, somewhere is in trouble and needs a lock.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgGKSjiw0HQ

Balls.ie picking up on Les Kiss' mention of 'exciting signings', and along with the expected chat of Ryan/Murphy/Conan, they throw in two new names to the NIQ suggestion box. Those of Liam Gill, and Adam Thompson. Again though - perhaps only candidates for the sole reason that they have yet to renew contracts.

http://www.balls.ie/rugby/figuring-out-who-ulsters-exciting-signings-could-be/322811

Great players, but we need a number eight. A big, ball-carrying no. 8.

Don Alfonso wrote:Great players, but we need a number eight. A big, ball-carrying no. 8.

Thompson played mostly at 8 for the Reds and is a strong ball carrier but come next season will be 34

Liam Gill is 23, will likely not have given up on international ambitions. I'd much rather somebody like Pienaar who is likely to hang about and settle and maybe re-sign. Thompson too old in my opinion. The ages of Vito and Pocock (29 and 28 come the summer) would fit the bill better.

clivemcl wrote:Liam Gill is 23, will likely not have given up on international ambitions. I'd much rather somebody like Pienaar who is likely to hang about and settle and maybe re-sign. Thompson too old in my opinion. The ages of Vito and Pocock (29 and 28 come the summer) would fit the bill better.

Gill is down the pecking order in Australia at the moment. Sean McMahon has passed him out now. He might fancy a move to Europe for a few years and see what happens with Pocock and Hooper.

Vito would be perfect. Mobile, skilful, technically superb, reliable. That would be a 10 out of 10 signing. Pocock is slightly fantastical but a bit like Rory Lamont I can see that he wouldn't just make his mind up based on rugby reasons- he seems like a great guy. Gill is excellent and I think he would be quality- only the All Blacks will not pick a player at Ulster and Pocock would also be selected so thats not a concern. Not too concerned over Thomsons age. Sometimes age is just a number. Remember when we let Pedrie Wannenburg go and replaced him with Roger Wilson, and Wilson was outplayed by Wannenburg over in Oyonnax in the first leg of that fixture.

In terms of the rumours we've signed a Leinster back row, I'd say all of them are very good. Ruddock, Ryan, Murphy, Conan, Leavy, Van Der Flier. All quality players or players who can be quality. Leavy would be the most underwhelming in terms of being the guy with most learning to do, most rough edges to knock off. Conan and Murphy would be the best. Ruddock is probably as unrealistic a target as the centrally contracted guys.

clivemcl wrote:Balls.ie picking up on Les Kiss' mention of 'exciting signings', and along with the expected chat of Ryan/Murphy/Conan, they throw in two new names to the NIQ suggestion box. Those of Liam Gill, and Adam Thompson. Again though - perhaps only candidates for the sole reason that they have yet to renew contracts.

http://www.balls.ie/rugby/figuring-out-who-ulsters-exciting-signings-could-be/322811

Either Balls.ie or Les Kiss need to check the definition of exciting. I don't think those names would have anyone wetting themselves

Notch wrote:Pocock is slightly fantastical but a bit like Rory Lamont I can see that he wouldn't just make his mind up based on rugby reasons- he seems like a great guy.

Yeah maybe he wants sign for Ulster thinking he will sort out the Abortion laws

toml wrote:

clivemcl wrote:Balls.ie picking up on Les Kiss' mention of 'exciting signings', and along with the expected chat of Ryan/Murphy/Conan, they throw in two new names to the NIQ suggestion box. Those of Liam Gill, and Adam Thompson. Again though - perhaps only candidates for the sole reason that they have yet to renew contracts.

http://www.balls.ie/rugby/figuring-out-who-ulsters-exciting-signings-could-be/322811

Either Balls.ie or Les Kiss need to check the definition of exciting. I don't think those names would have anyone wetting themselves

Come on, you know that the branding is all part of it. Ulster need to promoting these signings heavily regardless of their quality. But still- signing an All Black number 8 isn't exciting now?

He'd be a more established back row player that almost any other we've brought in.

Ah come on now... 29 caps for All Blacks and part of a world cup winning squad is not to be sniffed at!
Although, like I said, he's my least favoured out of the 4.

The point is though.... these are 4 of very few backrowers who have not got a contract next year. So... basically... if its not one of these, it's likely to be an even more underwhelming name!

Here's hoping its Pocock or Vito.

...as long as Davy takes it easy on the hippy liberal crap...

Watching the Leinster game and I really am not fussed about Dom Ryan. Sub-Sean Reidy.

Looking at that game there was really no Leinster player stood out so there was no one to be fussed about: McGrath, Teo, Kirchner, McFadden, Leavy, Strauss, Madigan, Murphy etc. etc.
Dom Ryan was no worse than the rest - Ringrose was anonymous but if he was offered I wouldn't write him off on the strength of that game.

Sean Doyle is making his return to Ulster.

Pete330v2 wrote:Sean Doyle is making his return to Ulster.

Not a bad signing per se, but you'd want more players signing up.

He's the side salad of a main course soon to be served......I hope.
I was disappointed when he left us as he had started to really click. Lets hope he can bring some of that form back to us.

In terms of squad depth, Sean Doyle should most definately not be sniffed at. He was starting to look very solid and reliable before he left. Much like Reidy in the past number of games. Just hope it doesn't mean Reidy is leaving.

A top club really needs to have stupid depth - much like we have in the back five - but from 1-15.

Is Wilson likely to retire do you think? Certainly... underneath our starting backrow you would much prefer the likes of Reidy, Diack, Doyle, Ryan... than Wilson, Clive Ross and Falloon (if you can ever find him injury free).

I'd be very happy to see Doyle return, not so much because he will win us big matches... but he might help us not lose some smaller matches...

Been looking in occasional and thought a few updates might be helpful.

Firstly Bryn has definitely tightened up the ship re rumours and I have to say he comes across a lot more professional than that bloke who went to Gloucester
Also have to say that in the way he conducts himself Les Kiss is by a country mile the best coach we have had in the professional era (I go back as far as Alan Solomon).
These 2 together give me a lot of hope.

Firstly (and I know this is what really interest people ) - Comings and Goings

It is my belief we have 3 on the way - a NIQ backrower, an IQ backrower and an IQ 10.
The last 2 would appear to be from Leinster.
No names, for reasons given.

Going - to be honest other than dead wood - nobody.
However the continued talk of Ludik staying doesn't quite fit.
Firstly it would mean we will have 4 NIQ and 2 Projects next year. (As I previously posted the 3+1 idea has been dropped due to Provincial pressure, officially it remains 4+1)
Secondly it would mean we have 4 players for 15 - Piatau, Payne, Ludik, Nelson.
Also we get players from other provinces and no one goes the other way ?
This doesn't gel with me so we have to speculate on our threes out of contract this year - Payne, Olding, Marshall.
Olding is going nowhere - it would be over Les Kiss's dead body. Marshall does not want to go and I believe will sign.
So I am afraid that slight doubt about Payne remains unanswered

There is a resolve to get of what is perceived as dead wood and a number of players will not, I understand, have their existing contracts renewed. I would expect all of the following to go this summer or next.

Murphy, BRoss, Browne, Windsor, Rowley (these 3 have been a huge disappointment), Humphreys, Joyce, Taggart.
The only ones with a chance of staying are Browne and Taggart but I doubt it.
If Doyle is confirmed my take on it is Faloon is close to going due to injury, Reidy has seriously impressed this year.

Next post on the squad as a whole

The squad going forward

Ulster are starting to develop a serious SID in the front 5.
Going into next season we have:

LH - McCall, Warwick, Black
Hooker - Best, Herring, Andrew
TH - Herbst, Ah You, Lutton
Lock - de Merwe, Henderson, Tuohy, O'Connor, Treadwell, Donnan, Thompson.

The view of McCall is he is the real deal
O'Connor has impressed
(Also to be perfectly clear these guys have made the team because of Kiss - Doak and Clarke would not have picked them. Clarke had McCall as 4th choice LH behind Black, Warwick, and Murphy !!)
Andrew looks promising at Hooker.
Ah You has been signed to improve our power and ability to break the game line.
Treadwell is perhaps the coup of the season - I have seen him play he looks really good.
Donnan and Atkinson are close to getting a chance

Overall it gives us a front 5 with a overall age profile that is impressive and after 2017 no NIQ players in it.
(The IRFU have blocked any big name Locks coming to Ireland as this is seen as, by some margin, Irelands biggest problem going forward).
The situation of Henderson remains uncertain - Ireland want him to play Lock but we have a bigger need at 6.
I expect some sort of 50/50 compromise on this.
de Merwe staying suggests this. Also I believe de Merwe is here to teach Henderson, O'Connor, Treadwell, Donnan, Thompson the ropes. That is a very youthful set of second rowers.
Stephenson could see the writing on the wall and new his contract would not be renewed in 2017.
Lot of respect for him in the club, never gives less than 100%, and they wanted to do the right thing by him.
Tuohy remains an issue - needs to rediscover his appetite for the game

Backrow is far more problematic - essentially next year - we have the 2 unnamed new boys, Diack, Henderson (part time) with Wilson and CRoss as cover, for 6 and 8, and not much else.
Wilson will, I am certain, retire when his contract is up in 2017. Someone here mentioned he is on big money, he isn't. He was when he first re signed but his extension included a huge drop in salary.
7 is covered by Henry, Reidy and I guess Doyle replacing Faloon.
The youngsters aren't cutting it - this is illustrated by an Academy player, Dow, leapfrogging Joyce and Taggart (who as I say I think will , probably, go), for todays match.
We really could do with Dow coming good. Timoney looks a decent prospect as well.

Won't bother with 11 to 15 we are well served.

10 - Jackson backup up by new IQ 10, Olding and Nelson
9 - Looks to me like Shanahan is close to usurping Marshall as the backup. His pass is so superior.
Also he may look small but as big as Marshall - just has the face of a 12 year old    
We need one of the 2 Academy 9's to come through though and Pienaar leaving remains the biggest black hole, player wise, facing Ulster in the near future.

Good man Geoff. Any idea on the NIQ backrower?

nope as I say things have tighten up all round - will be SH though

Any word on Clarke/Doak? Doak has come into his own now he's not Head Coach, seemingly, but is seems like Clarke has been an absolute hindrance. Any sense of that feeling within the set-up?

clivdmcl wrote:I'd be very happy to see Doyle return, not so much because he will win us big matches... but he might help us not lose some smaller matches...

Absolutely. But I think he'll be in direct competition with Reidy. Difficult for both of them to play- no bad thing, but someone will definitely lose out. With Faloon also around it's really 6 and 8 I am most concerned about.

Doak and Clarke will have there future decided by Kiss.

Basically I would say they are on probation till the end of the year.
Like the players they need to prove to him they are part of the future.
Doyle has got a lot to do to surpass Reidy.
There have been games this year when Reidy has played better than Henry.
Falloon as I say, I fear the worst, hope I'm wrong