Blues vs Dragons Match Thread

[GavinDragon]

First topic message reminder :

Blues: 15 Rhys Patchell, 14 Dan Fish, 13 Garyn Smith, 12 Rey Lee-Lo, 11 Tom James, 10 Gareth Anscombe, 9 Lloyd Williams; 1 Gethin Jenkins (c), 2 Kristian Dacey, 3 Taufa'ao Filise, 4 Jarrad Hoeata, 5 James Down, 6 Ellis Jenkins, 7 Sam Warburton, 8 Josh Turnbull

Replacements: 16 Matthew Rees, 17 Brad Thyer, 18 Dillon Lewis, 19 Manoa Vosawai, 20 Josh Navidi, 21 Tomos Williams, 22 Harri Millard, 23 Aled Summerhill

Dragons: C Meyer, A Hughes, T Morgan, A Warren, H Amos, D Jones, S Pretorius, P Price, E Dee, B Harris, R Landman, N Crosswell, L Evans (captain), N Cudd, T Faletau. Replacements: R Buckley, B Stankovich, L Fairbrother, M Screech, E Jackson, C Davies, A O'Brien, GR Jones.

Although buoyed by our victory over Gloucester, I still think we will struggle in this match. The Blues have been playing some sublime attacking rugby at home and on that artificial surface, despite Kingsley pointing out that we train on one all week, I don't think we are fit enough to cope with that intensity.

For the Dragons, I don't think we will see too many changes from the side that beat Gloucester. So hopefully no injuries. It would have been nice if Ollie Griffiths was fit as I would have liked to seen the battle between him and Ellis Jenkins whom, along with James Davies, will in my opinion all be competing for the Welsh 7 jersey in a few years. Jack Dixon and James Thomas continued their comebacks with Bedwas in their defeat to Llandovery last night.

I also hope you the Blues involve Hobbs and Mitchell so we can see them in action before they move east to Rodney Parade in the summer.

I think it will be an entertaining game with a lot of tries scored, and with the Blues coming out on top and keeping their hopes of a top 6 finish alive.

[munkian]

I wonder what the crowd will be. You'd expect a good one, given the proximity. What is the capacity at CAP?

About 12k.

I can't see it being a sell out, however, what with the NGD being crap and the game being on a Sunday.

There doesn't seem to be any 'buzz' about this game.

Above us in the league this season and you think you're chocolate

[PhilBB]

Where can I see the teams selected? You know, so that I can make a score prediction.

Thanks.

[PhilBB]

Above us in the league this season and you think you're chocolate

Cardiff aren't great, but are significantly better than the NGD.

[RDW]

From an Edinburgh PoV I'd very much like the Dragons to win this and deny the Blues anything.

With Dragons not really having anything to play for and Euro semi in the back of their minds, I can see the Blues getting BP win.

[PhilBB]

From an Edinburgh PoV I'd very much like the Dragons to win this and deny the Blues anything.

With Dragons not really having anything to play for and Euro semi in the back of their minds, I can see the Blues getting  BP win.

Well, Joe Schmidt has done you a favour when he selected Leinster's team for this weekend, so how many favours do you want!?!?

[wales606]

From an Edinburgh PoV I'd very much like the Dragons to win this and deny the Blues anything.

With Dragons not really having anything to play for and Euro semi in the back of their minds, I can see the Blues getting  BP win.

Edinburgh have a tough run in to get 6th. Hope you guys can beat Munster for us though, then it could all come down to the last weekend.

[wales606]

From an Edinburgh PoV I'd very much like the Dragons to win this and deny the Blues anything.

With Dragons not really having anything to play for and Euro semi in the back of their minds, I can see the Blues getting  BP win.

Well, Joe Schmidt has done you a favour when he selected Leinster's team for this weekend, so how many favours do you want!?!?

Leinster's team doesn't look that bad.

[RDW]

I think Edinburgh's chances are over - we've paid the price for some bad defeats earlier in the season and losing games that we really should have won.

The Blues have crept up almost out of nowhere and stand a real chance now!

[PhilBB]

Leinster's team doesn't look that bad.

Their fans are moaning that their paymasters aren't allowing their players to play for their branch team.

Union owned teams. What a waste of everybody's time.

[PhilBB]

I think Edinburgh's chances are over - we've paid the price for some bad defeats earlier in the season and losing games that we really should have won.

The Blues have crept up almost out of nowhere and stand a real chance now!

Imagine losing two games in Italy, thus not being in 5th place right now.

[GavinDragon]

Imagine if the Dragons hadn't lost 10 games by less than 7, where would we be now?

[VinceWLB]

I can't believe Blues lost both their games in Italy but if i remember correctly, they had to play both times on very heavy pitches and it worked against them and their super rugby style of play.

[munkian]

Above us in the league this season and you think you're chocolate

Cardiff aren't great, but are significantly better than the NGD.

Only if you get 6th place or you've done nothing to improve this season apart from be above the Dragons.

[PhilBB]

Imagine if the Dragons hadn't lost 10 games by less than 7, where would we be now?

Probably having to face slightly stronger teams than the ones faced all year.

Cardiff have lost 7 by fewer than 7.

[PhilBB]

Only if you get 6th place or you've done nothing to improve this season apart from be above the Dragons.

I think that's a bit silly. The progress at Cardiff this season has been blindingly obvious.

[GavinDragon]

Shows what a good coach can do. And, with the £££ being pumped in next season, it will improve further.

[munkian]

Only if you get 6th place or you've done nothing to improve this season apart from be above the Dragons.

I think that's a bit silly. The progress at Cardiff this season has been blindingly obvious.

Would explain your one eyedness...

[PhilBB]

Would explain your one eyedness...

That's an odd comment. It seems that it can only be read to suggest that you think Cardiff have made no progress from last season, but only a clown could think that.

Maybe you could explain yourself?

[GavinDragon]

Would explain your one eyedness...

That's an odd comment. It seems that it can only be read to suggest that you think Cardiff have made no progress from last season, but only a clown could think that.

Maybe you could explain yourself?

I would rather you explain your need to add such comments?

[PhilBB]

I would rather you explain your need to add such comments?

Because only a clown would think there's been no progress. Isn't that self explanatory?

[GavinDragon]

I understood the premise Phil, just not the need to include it.

I mean, how do you know that clowns concern themselves with the form of the Welsh rugby regions?

[PhilBB]

I understood the premise Phil, just not the need to include it.

I mean, how do you know that clowns concern themselves with the form of the Welsh rugby regions?

Because one of their own is presently DoR at NGD.

[GavinDragon]

I understood the premise Phil, just not the need to include it.

I mean, how do you know that clowns concern themselves with the form of the Welsh rugby regions?

Because one of their own is presently DoR at NGD.

Touche

[GavinDragon]

Blues' team is up. From that xv, I would say we are only stronger in the 13, 2 and 8 jersey.

[wales606]

Blues team

Cardiff Blues: 15 Rhys Patchell, 14 Dan Fish, 13 Garyn Smith, 12 Rey Lee-Lo, 11 Tom James, 10 Gareth Anscombe, 9 Lloyd Williams; 1 Gethin Jenkins (c), 2 Kristian Dacey, 3 Taufa'ao Filise, 4 Jarrad Hoeata, 5 James Down, 6 Ellis Jenkins, 7 Sam Warburton, 8 Josh Turnbull

Replacements: 16 Matthew Rees, 17 Brad Thyer, 18 Dillon Lewis, 19 Manoa Vosawai, 20 Josh Navidi, 21 Tomos Williams, 22 Harri Millard, 23 Aled Summerhill

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Filtzgibbon's the referee for this, if anyone was wondering. Leighton Hodges (with his Communards haircut) is one of the assistant referees.

[RiscaGame]

No changes for NGD according to bbc Wales

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Head coach Kingsley Jones has named an unchanged side for Newport Gwent Dragons’ Guinness Pro12 derby at Cardiff Blues on Sunday.

Newport Gwent Dragons: C Meyer, A Hughes, T Morgan, A Warren, H Amos, D Jones, S Pretorius, P Price, E Dee, B Harris, R Landman, N Crosswell, L Evans (captain), N Cudd, T Faletau. Replacements: R Buckley, B Stankovich, L Fairbrother, M Screech, E Jackson, C Davies, A O'Brien, GR Jones.

[RiscaGame]

Well in LP. You beat me.

Bit surprised there are no changes. Lyn must be sick, or I suspect the tombola would've been out.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Fairbrother for Knight is the only change. I'm glad we haven't rested players with Montpellier in mind.

[RiscaGame]

Ah yeah. They tend to rotate a lot anyway, as Kingsley said. I didn't notice that.

[Stone Motif]

Only if you get 6th place or you've done nothing to improve this season apart from be above the Dragons.

I think that's a bit silly. The progress at Cardiff this season has been blindingly obvious.

But still?

Can't see you terrifying anyone in RCC1 even if you do make it. Unless blistering x-factor runner Matthew Morgan will make all the difference like.

The implosion at NGD has been equally obvious.

[PhilBB]

But still?

Can't see you terrifying anyone in RCC1 even if you do make it. Unless blistering x-factor runner Matthew Morgan will make all the difference like.

The implosion at NGD has been equally obvious.

Cardiff have a long way to go before they terrify anybody other than their own followers.

[Guest]

Only if you get 6th place or you've done nothing to improve this season apart from be above the Dragons.

I think that's a bit silly. The progress at Cardiff this season has been blindingly obvious.

But still?

Can't see you terrifying anyone in RCC1 even if you do make it. Unless blistering x-factor runner Matthew Morgan will make all the difference like.

The implosion at NGD has been equally obvious.

It's frustrating (as always) because at times we've played some lovely rugby and scored some wonderful tries. There's skill there at the Dragons. There's talent. There's even class (but not world class ). But there's also a lot of players who are inconsistent and that means that all of the good work and flashes of brilliance are rubbed out by woeful defending, brain farts, sill errors, giving the ball away, etc. We're a very frustrating team to watch and support.

[GavinDragon]

I think that we do have some fantastic young talent who, due to the fact we have no money, a crap DOR and no hope, will continue to get a lot of game time.

The plan is to keep hold of these players, but how long can we seriously hope to unless we start competing at the right end of the table?

[PhilBB]

I think that we do have some fantastic young talent who, due to the fact we have no money, a crap DOR and no hope, will continue to get a lot of game time.

The plan is to keep hold of these players, but how long can we seriously hope to unless we start competing at the right end of the table?

I think that the NGD have two fantastic young talents, potentially three with Dixon. It's just Morgan and Amos.

The others that get hyped up are either unable to shift old timers (Dee) or kids who haven't played adult pro rugby (the tight head and Keedie).

[Stone Motif]

Only if you get 6th place or you've done nothing to improve this season apart from be above the Dragons.

I think that's a bit silly. The progress at Cardiff this season has been blindingly obvious.

But still?

Can't see you terrifying anyone in RCC1 even if you do make it. Unless blistering x-factor runner Matthew Morgan will make all the difference like.

The implosion at NGD has been equally obvious.

That's what I was getting at. Cardiff are getting the most out of their players but only the most anti-NGD critic would say our team is playing to its maximum potential.

It's frustrating (as always) because at times we've played some lovely rugby and scored some wonderful tries.  There's skill there at the Dragons.  There's talent.  There's even class (but not world class ).  But there's also a lot of players who are inconsistent and that means that all of the good work and flashes of brilliance are rubbed out by woeful defending, brain farts, sill errors, giving the ball away, etc.  We're a very frustrating team to watch and support.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

I think that we do have some fantastic young talent who, due to the fact we have no money, a crap DOR and no hope, will continue to get a lot of game time.

The plan is to keep hold of these players, but how long can we seriously hope to unless we start competing at the right end of the table?

I think that the NGD have two fantastic young talents, potentially three with Dixon. It's just Morgan and Amos.

The others that get hyped up are either unable to shift old timers (Dee) or kids who haven't played adult pro rugby (the tight head and Keedie).

I wouldn't say Dee's 'unable' to shift Rhys Thomas, they're just not selecting their best hooker. Having made Rhys Thomas captain, they feel obliged to play him.

[GavinDragon]

I think that we do have some fantastic young talent who, due to the fact we have no money, a crap DOR and no hope, will continue to get a lot of game time.

The plan is to keep hold of these players, but how long can we seriously hope to unless we start competing at the right end of the table?

I think that the NGD have two fantastic young talents, potentially three with Dixon. It's just Morgan and Amos.

The others that get hyped up are either unable to shift old timers (Dee) or kids who haven't played adult pro rugby (the tight head and Keedie).

Ollie Griffiths - if he comes back from injury the same, will be capped by Wales.
Ashton Hewitt - may not play for Wales (despite being tipped at present), but will be a solid regional player.

Elliot Dee hasnt been able to shift Thomas due to Lyn Jones. He is our best hooker by far.

Leon Brown and Keddie have played adult pro rugby. They played for the prem select side against Jersey, Connacht A and Doncaster, the latter being the top of the English champsionship. However, neither excelled in that game.

[PhilBB]

Ollie Griffiths - if he comes back from injury the same, will be capped by Wales.
Ashton Hewitt - may not play for Wales (despite being tipped at present), but will be a solid regional player.

Elliot Dee hasnt been able to shift Thomas due to Lyn Jones. He is our best hooker by far.

Leon Brown and Keddie have played adult pro rugby. They played for the prem select side against Jersey, Connacht A and Doncaster, the latter being the top of the English champsionship. However, neither excelled in that game.

Griffiths will be well behind Warburton, Tipuric, Jenkins and Davies.

You admitted above that Dee is not a good enough scrummager, didn't you? He can't be the best hooker if the scrum suffers.

The prem select is a thrown together mismatch. Come on, it's not even PrO'12 standard and a few games at that level is no indication of ability at big boys rugby. It's just a hint at it.

[GavinDragon]

Ollie Griffiths - if he comes back from injury the same, will be capped by Wales.
Ashton Hewitt - may not play for Wales (despite being tipped at present), but will be a solid regional player.

Elliot Dee hasnt been able to shift Thomas due to Lyn Jones. He is our best hooker by far.

Leon Brown and Keddie have played adult pro rugby. They played for the prem select side against Jersey, Connacht A and Doncaster, the latter being the top of the English champsionship. However, neither excelled in that game.

Griffiths will be well behind Warburton, Tipuric, Jenkins and Davies.

You admitted above that Dee is not a good enough scrummager, didn't you? He can't be the best hooker if the scrum suffers.

The prem select is a thrown together mismatch. Come on, it's not even PrO'12 standard and a few games at that level is no indication of ability at big boys rugby. It's just a hint at it.

Griffiths is behind warburton and tipuric, but is only 21(?). I rate him higher than Jenkins who hasn't impressed me that much if I am honest, and I think he is a better carrier, but perhaps not as good a pilferer, as Davies. Still, its based on form in any given season so we shall see.

I said his scrummaging isn't the best, which isn't suprising for a 22 year old at any level. It will improve.

You could argue that some sides in the champonship are actually more physical. Certainly that Doncaster pack I watched were as big, if not as mobile, as any of the packs I have seen at RP this year, and when you're assessing scrummaging, which I was when looking at Brown, it does give an indication of ability. Besides, I said that neither excelled in that game, but they are young, incredibly young in Brown's case, so I hold my judgement. Certainly Dillon Lewis looks a better prospect at the moment on the TH.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Dillon Lewis has benefited from actually being selected for the Blues' first team. I do think we should bring these players through more quickly. Is Ed Jackson really a better option than Harrison Keddie? There is an argument for integrating them gradually, but it's not as if we're winning games without them.

[GavinDragon]

As I said LP, I watched them both against Doncaster and Jersey. Brown did well in the scrum against the latter, but struggled a little against Doncaster. However, he did carry well in the loose. Keddie didn't really get over the gainline against either. It is all well and good breaking out of tackles against 20 year olds, but he needs to show he can do it against senior pros. That being said, he hasn't been given the opportunity yet. I am sure he will next season.

Lewis is also a year older that Brown which in propping terms at that age is a difference.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

At least we have prospects coming / to come through, which is something.

[GavinDragon]

At least we have prospects coming / to come through, which is something.

The regional pathway is working - across the board. Not sure if you're on twitter, but give the @dragons_academy a follow. All there results are on there.

They recently held a "trial day" with their dewar shield teams - Newport Schools, Pontypool Schools (who appear to be fairly strong this year), Blaenau-Gwent Schools, Islwyn Schools and Rhymney Valley Schools. Those who impress make up the Dragons 'North' and 'South' teams at u16's next season. They then played each other with the following results:-

Newport Schools 5 - 0 Rhymney Valley Schools
Blaenau-Gwent Schools beat Newport Schools
Rhymney Valley Schools 0 - 5 Pontypool Schools
Blaenau-Gwent Schools 5 - 0 Rhymney Valley Schools
Blaenau-Gwent Schools beat Pontypool Schools
Pontypool Schools 10 - 5 Newport Schools
Pontypool Schools 20 - 5 Islwyn Schools
Pontypool Schools 5 - 0 Newport Schools
Newport Schools beat Islwyn Schools

[GavinDragon]

Case in point. Wales' u16s to face England this weekend:-

Harri Dole (Scarlets/ Llandovery RFC/ Ysgol Dinefwr);
Rio Dyer (Dragons/ Pill Harriers/ Bassaleg High),
Ben Cambriani (Ospreys/ Gowerton RFC/ Bishopston),
Tiaan Wheeler (Ospreys/ Trebanos/ Llangatwg),
Ioan Davies (Blues/ Abercynon/ Rhydywaun);
Luke Scully (Ospreys/ Neath Athletic/ Llangatwg),
Dan Babos (Dragons/ Pontypool Utd/ Croesyceiliog);

Nathan Evans (Dragons/ Newbridge RFC/ Oakdale),
Will Griffiths (Dragons/ Abergavenny RFC /West Mon),
Adam Thomas (Scarlets/ Burry Port RFC / Strade),
Cian Lewis-Hughes (Blues/ Ystrad Rhondda/ Cymer),
Iestyn Rees (Scarlets/ Llandovery/ Bro Dinefwr),
Ioan Rhys Davies (Blues/ St Peters/ Glantaf),
Gethin Davies (capt, Scarlets/ Crymych RFC/ Y Preseli),
Taine Basham (Dragons/ Talywain/ Abersychan)

Replacements: Dom Booth (Scarlets/ Tenby/ Greenhill),
Tyler Pugsley (Scarlets/ Felinfoel/ Strade),
Ben Warren (Blues/ Treorchy/ Treorchy),
Rob Brookson (Dragons/ Pontypool Utd/ West Mon),
Callum James (Blues/ Brecon RFC/ Brecon HS),
Sam Cambriani (Ospreys/ Gowerton RFC / Gowerton),
Llew Smith (Scarlets/ Llandovery RFC/ Llandovery Coll),
Rhys Davies (Blues/ Merthyr RFC/ Cyfarthfa)

Scarlets - 7
Blues - 6
Dragons - 6
Ospreys - 4

[RiscaGame]

Why aren't we talking about Dorian as a prospect? His dad has said that Bob Howley is looking at him too.

[GavinDragon]

As I said on dragged up, he has good distribution and takes the ball to the line fairly well. But he is not quick enough to play top level pro rugby. His tackling is suspect, and his kicking is poor. If his old man wasn't the coach, which team would he be at?

[PhilBB]

Griffiths is behind warburton and tipuric, but is only 21(?). I rate him higher than Jenkins who hasn't impressed me that much if I am honest, and I think he is a better carrier, but perhaps not as good a pilferer, as Davies. Still, its based on form in any given season so we shall see.

I said his scrummaging isn't the best, which isn't suprising for a 22 year old at any level. It will improve.

You could argue that some sides in the champonship are actually more physical. Certainly that Doncaster pack I watched were as big, if not as mobile, as any of the packs I have seen at RP this year, and when you're assessing scrummaging, which I was when looking at Brown, it does give an indication of ability. Besides, I said that neither excelled in that game, but they are young, incredibly young in Brown's case, so I hold my judgement. Certainly Dillon Lewis looks a better prospect at the moment on the TH.

Bloody hell. Seriously? Appreciating the work of a flanker is a sign of comprehension of the game so not rating Ellis Jenkins is one hell of an admission. 'Pilferers' are often playing to game plans in that some teams encourage their players over the ball, others set back. Cardiff go for very few turnovers, preferring to hold a strong line. That noted, if he's there early then Jenkins is as strong over the ball as Warburton.

It's also a bonkers call to claim Doncaster as physically challenging as PrO'12 teams, but there we go.

I take your point on scrummaging front rowers. It does take time, that's a point well made. Dillon Lewis, in that regard, is a freak.

[GavinDragon]

Griffiths is behind warburton and tipuric, but is only 21(?). I rate him higher than Jenkins who hasn't impressed me that much if I am honest, and I think he is a better carrier, but perhaps not as good a pilferer, as Davies. Still, its based on form in any given season so we shall see.

I said his scrummaging isn't the best, which isn't suprising for a 22 year old at any level. It will improve.

You could argue that some sides in the champonship are actually more physical. Certainly that Doncaster pack I watched were as big, if not as mobile, as any of the packs I have seen at RP this year, and when you're assessing scrummaging, which I was when looking at Brown, it does give an indication of ability. Besides, I said that neither excelled in that game, but they are young, incredibly young in Brown's case, so I hold my judgement. Certainly Dillon Lewis looks a better prospect at the moment on the TH.

Bloody hell. Seriously? Appreciating the work of a flanker is a sign of comprehension of the game so not rating Ellis Jenkins is one hell of an admission. 'Pilferers' are often playing to game plans in that some teams encourage their players over the ball, others set back. Cardiff go for very few turnovers, preferring to hold a strong line. That noted, if he's there early then Jenkins is as strong over the ball as Warburton.

It's also a bonkers call to claim Doncaster as physically challenging as PrO'12 teams, but there we go.

I take your point on scrummaging front rowers. It does take time, that's a point well made. Dillon Lewis, in that regard, is a freak.

It is an opinion Phil. I have probably seen Jenkins less than I have Griffiths, and considering Griffiths only played four games or so this season you get why perhaps I haven't been as impressed as others may have been. He did impress me when the Blues played the Scarlets however.

And why is it bonkers to suggest that a champsionship side are as physically challenging as a pro 12 pack? Just because a team play at a supposed higher level does not automatically make them a more physical team. If physicality equated to quality, SA would win the WC every fours years.

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