European Rugby..

First topic message reminder :

What a disappointment... I thought with BT and Sky sharing coverage of the European Rugby we'd have more coverage of the games. However, Round 1 of the Challenge Cup and only 2 are being shown on the TV, and one of them is by the French broadcaster only.

I appreciate that its big money, and that BT and Sky have put up a lot of money to cover European Rugby, but if you have games you don't want to or cant fit in your schedule, then why not let other broadcasters show them like BBC, ITV, S4C or even b!oody DAVE. Or better still, if they want to keep control put them out on your Web Sites.. But not showing any coverage at all is just damn annoying...

If this is the way they think they are investing in Rugby then they need to think again...

LordDowlais wrote:You can all say what you like. We are three years in, and we still do not have all these sponsors that we were promised, the second tier is even less marketable than ever, we were told that the the European comp would be the shangri-la of rugby now that the unions are our of the way, but lets be honest here, it's dying on it's feet, BT has another 2 years left after this one, unless they bid the same money again, then the competition is done for.

Why are people avoiding the elephant in the room ? We have not got what we were promised from the outset, you were saying last year that it was only the second year and it was still in it's infancy, well that excuse is a non starter now.

We will have to wait until 2 years time, but trust me, it will be very messy, and I reckon the unions will have to sort the mess out.

As a supporter why care about sponsors? Watch the games , enjoy.

No 7&1/2 wrote:As a supporter why care about sponsors? Watch the games , enjoy.

There will be no games to enjoy in two years time at this rate, also, unless I go to France, I will not be able to enjoy half the games, because they are not televised, why bother with the second tier if they are not going to air it ? FFS, they do not even show highlights on any of the round up shows of the second tier either. It's almost as if the second tier is not happening, yep, that's the more higher profile bollox they were peddling us.

There were loads of games on tv? How many do you want? Try not to get upset and swear.

No 7&1/2 wrote:There were loads of games on tv? How many do you want? Try not to get upset and swear.

I would like to see the teams from my country playing on tele, especially as I do not have the spare time of an international jet setter and cannot travel to all the games. Also, why are you trying to deviate from the point in play ? The fact that we were lied to, you know, about everything ? Where is all this money we are supposed to be swimming in ? Where are all these lavish sponsors ? What has been done to raise the profile of the second tier comp ? I will let you ponder those before I throw more PRL lies at you.

Scarlets were on Tv

Money has come from the tv you're complaining about ld. The lying sucks but much like the fools believing the lies about brexit pretty obvious! Have you enjoyed the rugby?

No 7&1/2 wrote:Have you enjoyed the rugby?

Nope. I have not been watching it. I am not interested in teams from other countries.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Money has come from the tv you're complaining about ld

That money came from the big BT sports grab. They wanted to monopolise all the sports, so they threw stupid money at everything, look at what has happened since, SKY flexed their muscles and now BT get the dregs of the Premiership football that SKY do not show.

Do you honestly believe BT will throw the same money at the CC cups again ? I seriously doubt it. Also SKY will not want it either, it's tainted. The PRL have ruined European rugby with their lies.

No 7&1/2 wrote:The lying sucks but much like the fools believing the lies about brexit pretty obvious!

Brexit has nothing to do with this. It must be concerning that a bunch of liars are running the show though. Greedy businessmen who's only concerns are themselves, it's the death toll for European rugby.

LordDowlais wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Have you enjoyed the rugby?

Nope. I have not been watching it. I am not interested in teams from other countries.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Money has come from the tv you're complaining about ld

That money came from the big BT sports grab. They wanted to monopolise all the sports, so they threw stupid money at everything, look at what has happened since, SKY flexed their muscles and now BT get the dregs of the Premiership football that SKY do not show.

Do you honestly believe BT will throw the same money at the CC cups again ? I seriously doubt it. Also SKY will not want it either, it's tainted. The PRL have ruined European rugby with their lies.

No 7&1/2 wrote:The lying sucks but much like the fools believing the lies about brexit pretty obvious!

Brexit has nothing to do with this. It must be concerning that a bunch of liars are running the show though. Greedy businessmen who's only concerns are themselves, it's the death toll for European rugby.

Always had you down for a rugby fan. So all this comes down to you wanting the tv companies to show all the Welsh club games, not really anything to do with the quality or entertainment on show (self coonfessed), not really bothered about money as the Pro 12 teeams get the same. From that I see your problem but there's no solution that Unions would fix bar selling their ownn rigghts for far less than the other teams then having to prop the clubs up through paying more percentage of wages than they do currently.

Scarlets were on TV.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Always had you down for a rugby fan. So all this comes down to you wanting the tv companies to show all the Welsh club games, not really anything to do with the quality or entertainment on show (self coonfessed), not really bothered about money as the Pro 12 teeams get the same. From that I see your problem but there's no solution that Unions would fix bar selling their ownn rigghts for far less than the other teams then having to prop the clubs up through paying more percentage of wages than they do currently.

Stop dodging things and twisting things.

At this rate there will be no European competition in 2yrs time. Try and wrap your head around that for five minutes instead of surmising what sort of rugby fan I am. For once in your life try and see the wood for the trees.

LordDowlais wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Have you enjoyed the rugby?

Nope. I have not been watching it. I am not interested in teams from other countries.

And that response should have been the end of this discussion. Maybe one day all your dreams can come true and Welsh clubs will leave Pro12 and set up their own pro competition.

LordDowlais wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Have you enjoyed the rugby?

Nope. I have not been watching it. I am not interested in teams from other countries.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Money has come from the tv you're complaining about ld

That money came from the big BT sports grab. They wanted to monopolise all the sports, so they threw stupid money at everything, look at what has happened since, SKY flexed their muscles and now BT get the dregs of the Premiership football that SKY do not show.

Do you honestly believe BT will throw the same money at the CC cups again ? I seriously doubt it. Also SKY will not want it either, it's tainted. The PRL have ruined European rugby with their lies.

No 7&1/2 wrote:The lying sucks but much like the fools believing the lies about brexit pretty obvious!

Brexit has nothing to do with this. It must be concerning that a bunch of liars are running the show though. Greedy businessmen who's only concerns are themselves, it's the death toll for European rugby.

Why are you interested in a European competition then?

I am a little confused

As was pointed out Scarlet was on TV

And if your teams get to the quarters etc, they will be on a lot more (I wish Glasgow could get there)...

LordDowlais wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Always had you down for a rugby fan. So all this comes down to you wanting the tv companies to show all the Welsh club games, not really anything to do with the quality or entertainment on show (self coonfessed), not really bothered about money as the Pro 12 teeams get the same. From that I see your problem but there's no solution that Unions would fix bar selling their ownn rigghts for far less than the other teams then having to prop the clubs up through paying more percentage of wages than they do currently.

Stop dodging things and twisting things.

At this rate there will be no European competition in 2yrs time. Try and wrap your head around that for five minutes instead of surmising what sort of rugby fan I am. For once in your life try and see the wood for the trees.

I think there will be and I'm not twisting anything you're not bothered about rugby just watching Welsh teams on tv and you didn't even do that with the option to last weekend.

So what Lord Bluster wants is Sky/BT to show every game that any of his precious regions play, regardless of the quality of the opposition, interest in the game, or importance of the matchup

Glad that's cleared up

Luckily for the rest of us, the broadcasters televise games based on what people actually want to watch

I've always said: the vast bulk of interest is with the Main Competition... from players to coaches to fans to sponsors.  There is no getting away from the fact that European teams want to be involved with a crack at the major European competition.  Telling a good many of them that they should be satisfied with the Lower European version (a version that has difficulties being televised for want of general rugby fan interest) is not going to be a successful recommendation - ever.  And before I get reminded of the auld Amlin Cup in the grand auld days of Heineken - I had the same attitude to it.  Superfluous.  An indulgence for the cobwebs to settle on

General Rugby fans (i.e. fans tuning in to a game that their specific side isn't involved in) have enough quality rugby to watch on European rugby weekends with the Champions competition - they don't need the extra Challenge competition - and both sponsors and TV people know it, so they shy away from committing fully to it.  There are only so many hours in a weekend and only so many fans that will sit down to watch the 'rugby' bit of a sporting weekend that is filled with so many other sporting distractions.

So I suggest end the Challenge bit completely and allow the considered 'lesser' League sides the break from play and the 'advantage' of being fresher then for their League than their grandiose Champions Cup colleagues    - and in so doing, this gives those 'lesser' sides an even better chance of getting into the Champions Cup the following season and theoretically improves the quality of all League games.  
Two birds, one stone.  Pay me later for the proposal

I always get confused by the 'greedy businessman' argument. If they are involved in rugby they are nuts in the first place (and quite often paying a great deal for the privilege). But unless they have some weird ulterior motive (vanity or self publicity say?) they are also interested in growing the game and the bottom line. It is just that their view on how best to do so may not match yours (or mine).

If Europe is an opportunity to make money then they will do their best to make it pay.

I have an even better idea.
Ditch all euro comps for a decade. There are still too many teams in the top tier who are trying to run before they can walk against sides stacked artificially either by individuals or Unions with ex or current internationals.

TV should then be able to pay the proper going rate for a 22 or 26 week competition which gives far greater access for fans either through the turnstiles or from the sofa.

All three NH leagues should focus on their domestic competition with each perhaps holding an additional knockout cup incorporating lower league genuine clubs.

We already have a euro comp - the Six Nations and that is enough.

lostinwales wrote:I always get confused by the 'greedy businessman' argument. If they are involved in rugby they are nuts in the first place (and quite often paying a great deal for the privilege). But unless they have some weird ulterior motive (vanity or self publicity say?) they are also interested in growing the game and the bottom line. It is just that their view on how best to do so may not match yours (or mine).

If Europe is an opportunity to make money then they will do their best to make it pay.

Yeah, lost.... but a 'greedy businessman' has a tendency to see a going concern in a little village, move in next door to sell the same products at a reduced price, laugh as he watches his little rival close his shop for one last time, chuckles as he proceeds to buy the building off the little business man for little or nothing (what it's now worth) and then proceeds to expand his store into the old shop and sell his products for three times the price.

So yeah, a businessman is a business man, but nope, we still don't trust all of them jus coz they tell us they is nice peoples really

Recwatcher16 wrote:I have an even better idea.
Ditch all euro comps for a decade. There are still too many teams in the top tier who are trying to run before they can walk against sides stacked artificially either by individuals or Unions with ex or current internationals.

TV should then be able to pay the proper going rate for a 22 or 26 week competition which gives far greater access for fans either through the turnstiles or from the sofa.

All three NH leagues should focus on their domestic competition with each perhaps holding an additional knockout cup incorporating lower league genuine clubs.

We already have a euro comp - the Six Nations and that is enough.

Well yeah, that'd work too, Rec. Less rugby played by players (what is recommended), better quality of rugby in all Leagues (what is asked for), fans seeing their major star players play through most of a season in the League (what Welsh fans want more than anything else).

But you're forgetting the money men (Networks, owners, sponsors). They don't like the word 'Less'. It makes them ill even thinking about it.

It would actually make the rugby business model easier for TV and there would be far less fretting over understanding where the priorities lie for teams.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/european-cup/irish-internationals-protected-from-rigours-of-club-game-1.2841046

I watched loads of rugby this weekend

No 7&1/2 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:All I can say about the matter is, thank feck it is over for the next few weeks. Nobody really cares about the competition outside of England.

The second tier is a joke, and we were all sold do the swanny by greedy businessmen. Never mind we have a few weeks now without the farce that is now the European competition.

As others have said you're missing some good games. A few here seem more keen to support tv stations than rugby!

I'll say this once more and then f*** it..

Not everyone can get to the games live. There are many reasons for this.. Location, work, money... Just try attending EVERY GAME live.. Also, many in Wales, like myself, may have a connection to one region, as a true Welsh rugby supporter and not one of just one region, I would like to see the other regions play as well. Now taking the Ospreys, are you seriously saying, its my fault and I should have gone Grenoble this weekend... GET REAL...

The tournament was bid on the fact that more games would be shown, and less are. With 2 sports broadcaster sharing this, there is no reason why they couldn't cover "nearly" all games. But NO they choose to cover the Champions Cup and to feck with the Challenge Cup. They don't even show highlights in their highlight show.

I suggest you get off your high horse, and get a dose of reality... You'll increase gates when you develop your product and advertise it, ie. when the punters know its on and how good it can be. But they wont know that unless it gets aired on TV. Until then, the gates will remain stagnant. There is NO proof, that attendance increases when its not on the telly, and to say we support the TV instead of the rugby is nothing more than ignorant.

No9 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:All I can say about the matter is, thank feck it is over for the next few weeks. Nobody really cares about the competition outside of England.

The second tier is a joke, and we were all sold do the swanny by greedy businessmen. Never mind we have a few weeks now without the farce that is now the European competition.

As others have said you're missing some good games. A few here seem more keen to support tv stations than rugby!

I'll say this once more and then f*** it..

Not everyone can get to the games live. There are many reasons for this.. Location, work, money... Just try attending EVERY GAME live.. Also, many in Wales, like myself, may have a connection to one region, as a true Welsh rugby supporter and not one of just one region, I would like to see the other regions play as well. Now taking the Ospreys, are you seriously saying, its my fault and I should have gone Grenoble this weekend... GET REAL...

The tournament was bid on the fact that more games would be shown, and less are. With 2 sports broadcaster sharing this, there is no reason why they couldn't cover "nearly" all games. But NO they choose to cover the Champions Cup and to feck with the Challenge Cup. They don't even show highlights in their highlight show.

I suggest you get off your high horse, and get a dose of reality... You'll increase gates when you develop your product and advertise it, ie. when the punters know its on and how good it can be. But they wont know that unless it gets aired on TV. Until then, the gates will remain stagnant. There is NO proof, that attendance increases when its not on the telly, and to say we support the TV instead of the rugby is nothing more than ignorant.

Not many people get to watch all club games live and tv won't cover it all. I support Boro in footy but they're not on tv every week, it doesn't affect the PL as a product. When you start going down the leagues there is less coverage as it's a poorer product. My comment above was on rugby games btw not specific clubs which is the overall point in the quote.

Sponsorship the qualification process and the Challenge cup are still a mess. But from a pure rugby perspective, it was a great weekend. You had multiple games come down to the last kick of the game. Last minute drop goal win. Last minute draw. The emotion of the Munster match. Sure a few matches were poor (with some terrible reffing) but this has been a great start for the euro competition. The fear is like last year the pools will be settled too early and the last two rounds are filled with dead rubbers. But so far so good.

I watched our game (Lyon v Ospreys) on a stream, with French commentary and had to readjust a number of times, also couldn't get any of the 2nd half, that was more down to me than the stream.

Why some of the Welsh games are not allowed to be broadcast live on S4C is beyond me, especially the away RCC2 games, I know it is small money in the large scheme of things, but every little helps.

Let me finally say watched a couple of games in RCC1 and thoroughly enjoyed them.

No 7&1/2 wrote:

No9 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:All I can say about the matter is, thank feck it is over for the next few weeks. Nobody really cares about the competition outside of England.

The second tier is a joke, and we were all sold do the swanny by greedy businessmen. Never mind we have a few weeks now without the farce that is now the European competition.

As others have said you're missing some good games. A few here seem more keen to support tv stations than rugby!

I'll say this once more and then f*** it..

Not everyone can get to the games live. There are many reasons for this.. Location, work, money... Just try attending EVERY GAME live.. Also, many in Wales, like myself, may have a connection to one region, as a true Welsh rugby supporter and not one of just one region, I would like to see the other regions play as well. Now taking the Ospreys, are you seriously saying, its my fault and I should have gone Grenoble this weekend... GET REAL...

The tournament was bid on the fact that more games would be shown, and less are. With 2 sports broadcaster sharing this, there is no reason why they couldn't cover "nearly" all games. But NO they choose to cover the Champions Cup and to feck with the Challenge Cup. They don't even show highlights in their highlight show.

I suggest you get off your high horse, and get a dose of reality... You'll increase gates when you develop your product and advertise it, ie. when the punters know its on and how good it can be. But they wont know that unless it gets aired on TV. Until then, the gates will remain stagnant. There is NO proof, that attendance increases when its not on the telly, and to say we support the TV instead of the rugby is nothing more than ignorant.

Not many people get to watch all club games live and tv won't cover it all. I support Boro in footy but they're not on tv every week, it doesn't affect the PL as a product. When you start going down the leagues there is less coverage as it's a poorer product. My comment above was on rugby games btw not specific clubs which is the overall point in the quote.

I think the point is still being missed.. So, my last attempt at making it..

As per your comment above (I've bold and underlined).. We agree you cant get to ALL games live (bit obvious that one), so why cant we see some of the other games on the TV. AND, your point that TV wont cover it all, is VALID.. But, as I pointed out earlier, out of 40 games in the first 4 rounds only 10 are being broadcast and out of those 10, only 5 being broadcast for the UK on BT or Sky Sports... That's the TV broadcasting 1/5th of the games. Now I don't expect them to cover ALL of them, and yes I would be disappointed if they didnt cover the Welsh Regions (as it is only 1 Welsh Region game being shown, and that's Bath v Blues - bet its because its Bath, rather than Blues), but covering only a 1/5th of the games, is that really fair. Its a long way off covering ALL isn't it.. If they covered at least 1/2 if would be something...

... and if they wont cover the games live, why aren't they even getting air time on the highlights shows..

If it keep going like this, I'm afraid LD is right.. It will be the end of the European tournaments, which unlike LD, I think will be a shame.

And as I pointed out earlier with both Euro comps run at the same time the lesser comp is going to get less coverage rightly so. Which matches did you enjoy this weekend?

LordDowlais wrote:You can all say what you like. We are three years in, and we still do not have all these sponsors that we were promised, the second tier is even less marketable than ever, we were told that the the European comp would be the shangri-la of rugby now that the unions are our out of the way, but lets be honest here, it's dying on it's feet, BT has another 2 years left after this one, unless they bid the same money again, then the competition is done for.

Why are people avoiding the elephant in the room ? We have not got what we were promised from the outset, you were saying last year that it was only the second year and it was still in it's infancy, well that excuse is a non starter now.

We will have to wait until 2 years time, but trust me, it will be very messy, and I reckon the unions will have to sort the mess out.

Something else that has been forgotten in the heady mists of the PRL/BT revolution is the "growing the game" aspect. One of the big selling points supposedly was that they would sponsor and develop a third tier competition for the Spanish, Romainians, etc. that would lead to proper development of club rugby in these countries, I understood this was supposedly a big selling point for the French in their role heading up European rugby.

What happened to that ?

No9 wrote:I think the point is still being missed.. So, my last attempt at making it..

As per your comment above (I've bold and underlined).. We agree you cant get to ALL games live (bit obvious that one), so why cant we see some of the other games on the TV. AND, your point that TV wont cover it all, is VALID.. But, as I pointed out earlier, out of 40 games in the first 4 rounds only 10 are being broadcast and out of those 10, only 5 being broadcast for the UK on BT or Sky Sports... That's the TV broadcasting 1/5th of the games. Now I don't expect them to cover ALL of them, and yes I would be disappointed if they didnt cover the Welsh Regions (as it is only 1 Welsh Region game being shown, and that's Bath v Blues - bet its because its Bath, rather than Blues), but covering only a 1/5th of the games, is that really fair. Its a long way off covering ALL isn't it.. If they covered at least 1/2 if would be something...

... and if they wont cover the games live, why aren't they even getting air time on the highlights shows..

If it keep going like this, I'm afraid LD is right.. It will be the end of the European tournaments, which unlike LD, I think will be a shame.

I honestly think that this would not be an issue at all, for a number of people, if the Ospreys and/or Blues, had actually made it into the top teir. Over the past years how many of us have actually watched any of the Challenge Cup matches that have been televised? Because if you didn't watch the matches back then, I am afraid you are being a bit of a hypocrite complaining about lack of coverage now.l

Irish Londoner wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:You can all say what you like. We are three years in, and we still do not have all these sponsors that we were promised, the second tier is even less marketable than ever, we were told that the the European comp would be the shangri-la of rugby now that the unions are our out of the way, but lets be honest here, it's dying on it's feet, BT has another 2 years left after this one, unless they bid the same money again, then the competition is done for.

Why are people avoiding the elephant in the room ? We have not got what we were promised from the outset, you were saying last year that it was only the second year and it was still in it's infancy, well that excuse is a non starter now.

We will have to wait until 2 years time, but trust me, it will be very messy, and I reckon the unions will have to sort the mess out.

Something else that has been forgotten in the heady mists of the PRL/BT revolution is the "growing the game" aspect. One of the big selling points supposedly was that they would sponsor and develop a third tier competition for the Spanish, Romainians, etc. that would lead to proper development of club rugby in these countries, I understood this was supposedly a big selling point for the French in their role heading up European rugby.

What happened to that ?

Wasn't that the route Enisei took into the Challenge Cup?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Rugby_Challenge_Cup_Qualifying_Competition

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Rugby_Challenge_Cup_Qualifying_Competition 'European Rugby Challenge Cup Qualifying Competition' wrote:Under the Heads of Agreement announced on 10 April 2014, there are two places available in the European Rugby Challenge Cup through the Qualifying Competition.[1]

For the 2014-15 season, given the time constraints in filling the competition, this was a reduced competition the form of 2 two-legged play-off matches, with the aggregate winner of each taking one of the two Rugby Europe spots in the draw, and it involved the 2 best teams from Italy's National Championship of Excellence, plus a Romanian and Georgian selection.[2]

An expanded format was announced on 22 December 2014,[3] the expanded format includes clubs from Rugby Europe member Unions, Russia, Spain and Portugal alongside representatives from the Italian Eccellenza.

The 6 teams in the Qualifying Competition are split into 2 pools of 3 teams each. Each team will play the other teams in their pool once, before the two pool winners compete in a two-legged play-off against the teams currently competing in the Challenge Cup from the previous Qualifying Competition.

The winners, on aggregate, of these two play-offs will take up the Qualifying Competition places in the Challenge Cup.[3]

No9 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:

No9 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:All I can say about the matter is, thank feck it is over for the next few weeks. Nobody really cares about the competition outside of England.

The second tier is a joke, and we were all sold do the swanny by greedy businessmen. Never mind we have a few weeks now without the farce that is now the European competition.

As others have said you're missing some good games. A few here seem more keen to support tv stations than rugby!

I'll say this once more and then f*** it..

Not everyone can get to the games live. There are many reasons for this.. Location, work, money... Just try attending EVERY GAME live.. Also, many in Wales, like myself, may have a connection to one region, as a true Welsh rugby supporter and not one of just one region, I would like to see the other regions play as well. Now taking the Ospreys, are you seriously saying, its my fault and I should have gone Grenoble this weekend... GET REAL...

The tournament was bid on the fact that more games would be shown, and less are. With 2 sports broadcaster sharing this, there is no reason why they couldn't cover "nearly" all games. But NO they choose to cover the Champions Cup and to feck with the Challenge Cup. They don't even show highlights in their highlight show.

I suggest you get off your high horse, and get a dose of reality... You'll increase gates when you develop your product and advertise it, ie. when the punters know its on and how good it can be. But they wont know that unless it gets aired on TV. Until then, the gates will remain stagnant. There is NO proof, that attendance increases when its not on the telly, and to say we support the TV instead of the rugby is nothing more than ignorant.

Not many people get to watch all club games live and tv won't cover it all. I support Boro in footy but they're not on tv every week, it doesn't affect the PL as a product. When you start going down the leagues there is less coverage as it's a poorer product. My comment above was on rugby games btw not specific clubs which is the overall point in the quote.

I think the point is still being missed.. So, my last attempt at making it..

As per your comment above (I've bold and underlined).. We agree you cant get to ALL games live (bit obvious that one), so why cant we see some of the other games on the TV. AND, your point that TV wont cover it all, is VALID.. But, as I pointed out earlier, out of 40 games in the first 4 rounds only 10 are being broadcast and out of those 10, only 5 being broadcast for the UK on BT or Sky Sports... That's the TV broadcasting 1/5th of the games. Now I don't expect them to cover ALL of them, and yes I would be disappointed if they didnt cover the Welsh Regions (as it is only 1 Welsh Region game being shown, and that's Bath v Blues - bet its because its Bath, rather than Blues), but covering only a 1/5th of the games, is that really fair. Its a long way off covering ALL isn't it.. If they covered at least 1/2 if would be something...

... and if they wont cover the games live, why aren't they even getting air time on the highlights shows..

If it keep going like this, I'm afraid LD is right.. It will be the end of the European tournaments, which unlike LD, I think will be a shame.

I watched eight games last weekend and seven in the previous round. So your assertion is not accurate.

Its a bit of an arse that hardly any Challenge cup games were televised but I managed to find to find a stream of us losing to the Gulag Pro Select XV

munkian wrote:Its a bit of an arse that hardly any Challenge cup games were televised but I managed to find to find a stream of us losing to the Gulag Pro Select XV

Agreed.   I'd say they are only covering 12-13 games per round.  The ones away at places like Timosara Saracens, Enesei or Zebre are unlikely - although they do put up highlights of all the games afterwards I think.

In Round 3, of the Challenge Cup games, only three are scheduled for broadcast - one each on Sky, BeIN Sports, and FR4 for the Gloucs vs La Rochelle, Grenoble v Ospreys, and Edinburgh v Stade F games.    However, they don't seem to be covering the Cardiff vs Bath and Worcester vs Dragons games.

All ten games in the Champions Cup are covered with either BT or Sky and BeIN across every match.  So that's 13/20 for Round 3. Or 78 out of 120 pool games - 65%.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

No9 wrote:I think the point is still being missed.. So, my last attempt at making it..

As per your comment above (I've bold and underlined).. We agree you cant get to ALL games live (bit obvious that one), so why cant we see some of the other games on the TV. AND, your point that TV wont cover it all, is VALID.. But, as I pointed out earlier, out of 40 games in the first 4 rounds only 10 are being broadcast and out of those 10, only 5 being broadcast for the UK on BT or Sky Sports... That's the TV broadcasting 1/5th of the games. Now I don't expect them to cover ALL of them, and yes I would be disappointed if they didnt cover the Welsh Regions (as it is only 1 Welsh Region game being shown, and that's Bath v Blues - bet its because its Bath, rather than Blues), but covering only a 1/5th of the games, is that really fair. Its a long way off covering ALL isn't it.. If they covered at least 1/2 if would be something...

... and if they wont cover the games live, why aren't they even getting air time on the highlights shows..

If it keep going like this, I'm afraid LD is right.. It will be the end of the European tournaments, which unlike LD, I think will be a shame.

I honestly think that this would not be an issue at all, for a number of people, if the Ospreys and/or Blues, had actually made it into the top teir.  Over the past years how many of us have actually watched any of the Challenge Cup matches that have been televised?  Because if you didn't watch the matches back then, I am afraid you are being a bit of a hypocrite complaining about lack of coverage now.l

I agree its more prominent this year, with Os and Blues not in the Champions, but I have made this point previously (past years), and been quite cross that past years coverage of the Challenge Cup (as it is now) has been poor. But I think this year its worse.

Pot Hale wrote:

No9 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:

No9 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:All I can say about the matter is, thank feck it is over for the next few weeks. Nobody really cares about the competition outside of England.

The second tier is a joke, and we were all sold do the swanny by greedy businessmen. Never mind we have a few weeks now without the farce that is now the European competition.

As others have said you're missing some good games. A few here seem more keen to support tv stations than rugby!

I'll say this once more and then f*** it..

Not everyone can get to the games live. There are many reasons for this.. Location, work, money... Just try attending EVERY GAME live.. Also, many in Wales, like myself, may have a connection to one region, as a true Welsh rugby supporter and not one of just one region, I would like to see the other regions play as well. Now taking the Ospreys, are you seriously saying, its my fault and I should have gone Grenoble this weekend... GET REAL...

The tournament was bid on the fact that more games would be shown, and less are. With 2 sports broadcaster sharing this, there is no reason why they couldn't cover "nearly" all games. But NO they choose to cover the Champions Cup and to feck with the Challenge Cup. They don't even show highlights in their highlight show.

I suggest you get off your high horse, and get a dose of reality... You'll increase gates when you develop your product and advertise it, ie. when the punters know its on and how good it can be. But they wont know that unless it gets aired on TV. Until then, the gates will remain stagnant. There is NO proof, that attendance increases when its not on the telly, and to say we support the TV instead of the rugby is nothing more than ignorant.

Not many people get to watch all club games live and tv won't cover it all. I support Boro in footy but they're not on tv every week, it doesn't affect the PL as a product. When you start going down the leagues there is less coverage as it's a poorer product. My comment above was on rugby games btw not specific clubs which is the overall point in the quote.

I think the point is still being missed.. So, my last attempt at making it..

As per your comment above (I've bold and underlined).. We agree you cant get to ALL games live (bit obvious that one), so why cant we see some of the other games on the TV. AND, your point that TV wont cover it all, is VALID.. But, as I pointed out earlier, out of 40 games in the first 4 rounds only 10 are being broadcast and out of those 10, only 5 being broadcast for the UK on BT or Sky Sports... That's the TV broadcasting 1/5th of the games. Now I don't expect them to cover ALL of them, and yes I would be disappointed if they didnt cover the Welsh Regions (as it is only 1 Welsh Region game being shown, and that's Bath v Blues - bet its because its Bath, rather than Blues), but covering only a 1/5th of the games, is that really fair. Its a long way off covering ALL isn't it.. If they covered at least 1/2 if would be something...

... and if they wont cover the games live, why aren't they even getting air time on the highlights shows..

If it keep going like this, I'm afraid LD is right.. It will be the end of the European tournaments, which unlike LD, I think will be a shame.

I watched eight games last weekend and seven in the previous round.  So your assertion is not accurate.

NO my assertion is spot on... Its about the CHALLENGE CUP coverage... So there is no way you watched eight games from the Challenge Cup.. The coverage of the Champions Cup is spot on, and I should say, as I have been a critic of Sky covering rugby, the way they covered the Munster v Glasgow game was great. They showed the right level of compassion, cutting the pundit interviews pre-game short to go to the choir and fans singing, not broadcasting drivel over that emotional "show" (dont like calling it a "show" but cant think what else to call it).. Basically, they where in tune with what needed to be broadcast. Only quip, is they really should have had sound engineers closer to the choir/crowd, as the sound was a little muffled, but I'm not going to shoot them for that.

Pot Hale wrote:

munkian wrote:Its a bit of an arse that hardly any Challenge cup games were televised but I managed to find to find a stream of us losing to the Gulag Pro Select XV

Agreed.   I'd say they are only covering 12-13 games per round.  The ones away at places like Timosara Saracens, Enesei or Zebre are unlikely - although they do put up highlights of all the games afterwards I think.

In Round 3, of the Challenge Cup games, only three are scheduled for broadcast - one each on Sky, BeIN Sports, and FR4 for the Gloucs vs La Rochelle, Grenoble v Ospreys, and Edinburgh v Stade F games.    However, they don't seem to be covering the Cardiff vs Bath and Worcester vs Dragons games.

All ten games in the Champions Cup are covered with either BT or Sky and BeIN across every match.  So that's 13/20 for Round 3.  Or 78 out of 120 pool games - 65%.

As I've said.. My quip was on the coverage of the Challenge Cup not the Champions..

No 7&1/2 wrote:And as I pointed out earlier with both Euro comps run at the same time the lesser comp is going to get less coverage rightly so.  Which matches did you enjoy this weekend?

I actually recorded them all (those which where televised of course)... I was busy this weekend, so couldn't watch any live.. tell a lie, I did watch Bristol v Bath live on the Thr. I have watched all of Munster v Glasgow, Saracens v Scarlets and Tigers v Racing and have fast forwarded through a few others (ie my own highlights show), as not had time to watch the whole game.

Well it would be madness to allow rival broadcasters to show live matches at the same time and you say the top comp is good so your solution would still be to award another station the matches for a lower price on the basis of showing how many matches and when would these be scheduled? Problem for me is unlike football you really can't play 3 matches in 8 days. Do you just reduce the amount of top tier games allowed on tv but reduce money in?

No9 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:And as I pointed out earlier with both Euro comps run at the same time the lesser comp is going to get less coverage rightly so.  Which matches did you enjoy this weekend?

I actually recorded them all (those which where televised of course)... I was busy this weekend, so couldn't watch any live.. tell a lie, I did watch Bristol v Bath live on the Thr. I have watched all of Munster v Glasgow, Saracens v Scarlets and Tigers v Racing and have fast forwarded through a few others (ie my own highlights show), as not had time to watch the whole game.

Some good games this year.

No 7&1/2 wrote:

No9 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:And as I pointed out earlier with both Euro comps run at the same time the lesser comp is going to get less coverage rightly so.  Which matches did you enjoy this weekend?

I actually recorded them all (those which where televised of course)... I was busy this weekend, so couldn't watch any live.. tell a lie, I did watch Bristol v Bath live on the Thr. I have watched all of Munster v Glasgow, Saracens v Scarlets and Tigers v Racing and have fast forwarded through a few others (ie my own highlights show), as not had time to watch the whole game.

Some good games this year.

Sounds like there has been in both European comps. I think most of the Pro12 teams were uncharacteristically poor last season but going by this season's opening games they have improved which is good because last year it was a little one-side with the English clubs doing a lot better than all the others involved.

Well we were sulkin' for two years, innit.........

I think Falcons were only once in the HK (in the far distant past) so I'm quite used to the poor coverage of the lower competition.

It hasn't got any worse - it's always been patchy. Of course you get used to this if you are a habitual challenge cup competitor, but then again, rugby union in England has never been well covered on terrestrial TV, so you get used to being the poor neighbour of footie.

I suppose if you are used to being spoon fed with lots of rugby coverage it might get a bit irksome, but are a few of us not feeling a sense of privilege here? Just because you get (subsidised) wall to wall rugby most of the time due to the benevolence of Aunty Beeb, doesn't mean that it's a God given right.

1. I am the Lord thy God.
2. Thou shalt have no other gods.
3. No graven images or likenesses.
4. Not take the Lord's name in vain.
5. The BBC shalt provide free Rugby to eternity.


Oh it's in there alright, Trail. You just have to be more observant in your research.

No 7&1/2 wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Like I said earlier theres only so muchh that can be broadcast. You can't play 1st and 2nd tier together and the bbc need to bid for it.

The up and coming Bath v Cardiff game on free-to-air would be nice.
And quite possibly, 1000s of team Wales only fans who are not even aware of a Euro rugby comp going on might tune and like it. Only club rugby they're really exposed too at present is the Pro12. A bouncing Rec live on the telly could work wonders.

True but no free to air station bid enough.

Thinking about it, "free-to-air" is a misnomer. Doesn't exist in reality. All paid for by us plebs in some shape or form. Be interesting to know what the licence fee gets spent on nowadays.

SecretFly wrote:Well we were sulkin' for two years, innit.........

Grand to have yis back!