The Court Jester speaks out again...

by No9 Wed 22 Mar 2017, 1:43 pm

First topic message reminder :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/39347452

BBC wrote:Eddie Jones says the British and Irish Lions should name four captains for the tour of New Zealand - one from each of their four national teams.

Well thank the Lord that Eddie isn't the Lions coach.

What a really stupid thing to say, showing he has no clue at all to the Lions and what will make them into a team.

The toughest thing the Lions captain has to achieve, is getting all players to pull together as Lions, and not England, Wales, Scotland or Ireland. Having 4 Captains, each the home nation captain, straight away creates cliques, and although he said you then swap the captain later in the tour depending on who's starting, at what time do you get the players to pull together and not simply form allegiances to their national captain.

Wow.. He may have delivered 2 consequtive titles for England, but he needs to learn how to put his brain in gear before putting his mouth into action. Bet the RFU are torn. One part regretting it every time he opens his mouth, the other well we have won some silverware....

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:14 pm

LordDowlais wrote:
R!skysports wrote:We are also quite defensive when our wins get put into the bucket of other teams losing rather than Scotland playing any rugby - which seems to be the stock response here -

Examples ?

I have not seen any of this. Scotland have done well to take advantage of the other teams inability to win. Vern Cotter is twice the coach Rob Howely is, that is how you beat Wales, sheer bloody mindedness got you past Ireland, Scotland wanted it more.

Wales lost their games because as a whole they were not good enough, the players are still the same players who have been finishing 2nd mostly over the years and a few 1st places. The coaches have a lot to answer for in this respect of finishing 5th.

Is this an attempt at humour, because you have just provided an example. Other teams inability to win, as opposed to Scotland's ability to win?

Remarkable. Headscratch

Scotland's attack was the best in the 6N, We scored more tries against everybody else with the Exception of Italy. We scored more tries against Ireland, Wales, France and England than any of our peers. So it's not a case of inability to win, it was our ability to attack that won us most games. The blip was being unable to defend for a variety of reasons against England. We still scored 21 points in the game so despite the hammering we were still able to bare or teeth.

by funnyExiledScot Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:15 pm

GunsGermsV2 wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
GunsGermsV2 wrote:
Cyril wrote:You can be the better team on that particular day but not a better team overall. Nobody would argue that Ireland are a better team than NZ even though they bested them in Trumpland.

Id say if England beat NZ people would try to argue that they are better than NZ though.

I don't think a one-off would do the trick, but if England won a series against New Zealand then I'd say that's a fair shout. Massive "if" though. NZ are still, for my money, comfortable on top of the tree.

Maybe not alright, not sensible people anyway. Maybe someone funny like Cyril.

NZ just seem to be good at everything whereas all other teams have weaknesses.

Agreed. Good scrum, good lineout, great at the breakdown, great handling basics, awesome kicking game, strong one on one players out wide, great pace in the backs, good in defence, well drilled etc. etc.

They are not unbeatable. Ireland proved that. But beating the All Blacks usually requires the opposition to be at 100% and for the All Blacks not to be at their best. I do think England under Eddie Jones have the potential to reach that level, or at least get close enough to score a victory or two, but the ABs won't stand still either.

by mikey_dragon Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:16 pm

R!skysports wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Scotland didn't come close against England however, and are still trying to claim some moral victory. Wales' performances have proper nose-dived since Howley come in but the results have been moderate I suppose (Aus being the worst by far). The previous year Wales were better and a lot of those players haven't suddenly become sh!te.

#fakenews

Where has anyone ever said we had a moral vistory

Stop making up lies

It's the insinuations that Scotland did alright at twickenham because they lost some players to injury and scored 3 tries...

Scotland finished fourth this year so they aren't as good as some of their supporters believe, although I can admit that they have improved.

by mikey_dragon Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:18 pm

LordDowlais wrote:FFS, you have got to love this place. Firstly well done Scotland for beating us at home for the first time since 2007.

Secondly, if we are talking about this devalued nonsense, what about when everybody was saying Wales's grand slams were devalued because they came after a Lions tour or a WC ?

And last of all, FFS, how mouthy have some of the Scottish members gotten all of a sudden on here since they won a few games in the 6N instead of their usual 0 or 1 ? Lets not forget you had a record score put on you this year as well. Lets put more of these Scottish players in the Lions team so New Zealand can do the same thing.

For the first time in an age I agree with mikey_dragon, as a shiver goes down my spine:-

mikey_dragon wrote:Scotland didn't come close against England however, and are still trying to claim some moral victory. Wales' performances have proper nose-dived since Howley come in but the results have been moderate I suppose (Aus being the worst by far). The previous year Wales were better and a lot of those players haven't suddenly become sh!te.

Well said LD!

by funnyExiledScot Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:19 pm

Scottrf wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
Scottrf wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:I honestly beleive, that if Warren Gatland did not get offered the Lions job, then we would not be having this conversation. Normal service will resume this time next year.
Harsh on Howley. He won the games he'd be expected to win, and lost the ones he'd be expected to lose, and won the game that rankings would have shown as a 50/50 (Ireland).

I'm not sure many Welsh fans would agree that Wales would "expect to lose" against Scotland.
Rankings wise they would have been. Wales were 82.44, Scotland 80.90 - with home advantage 83.90.

Perhaps, but considering Caesar still ruled Rome the last time Scotland actually beat Wales, I don't think the rankings stats were at the forefront of you average Welsh supporter (if there is such a thing).

by funnyExiledScot Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:20 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:FFS, you have got to love this place. Firstly well done Scotland for beating us at home for the first time since 2007.

Secondly, if we are talking about this devalued nonsense, what about when everybody was saying Wales's grand slams were devalued because they came after a Lions tour or a WC ?

And last of all, FFS, how mouthy have some of the Scottish members gotten all of a sudden on here since they won a few games in the 6N instead of their usual 0 or 1 ? Lets not forget you had a record score put on you this year as well. Lets put more of these Scottish players in the Lions team so New Zealand can do the same thing.

For the first time in an age I agree with mikey_dragon, as a shiver goes down my spine:-

mikey_dragon wrote:Scotland didn't come close against England however, and are still trying to claim some moral victory. Wales' performances have proper nose-dived since Howley come in but the results have been moderate I suppose (Aus being the worst by far). The previous year Wales were better and a lot of those players haven't suddenly become sh!te.

Well said LD!

Did you just congratulate someone for quoting you?? That's almost Trump-esque.

by LordDowlais Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:20 pm

GunsGermsV2 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
R!skysports wrote:We are also quite defensive when our wins get put into the bucket of other teams losing rather than Scotland playing any rugby - which seems to be the stock response here -

Examples ?

I have not seen any of this. Scotland have done well to take advantage of the other teams inability to win. Vern Cotter is twice the coach Rob Howely is, that is how you beat Wales, sheer bloody mindedness got you past Ireland, Scotland wanted it more.

Wales lost their games because as a whole they were not good enough, the players are still the same players who have been finishing 2nd mostly over the years and a few 1st places. The coaches have a lot to answer for in this respect of finishing 5th.

If I was Welsh Id be a bit concerned that you have only had three new caps since the RWC. Your squad is still quite young but some players have a lot of mileage on the clock? 70 caps for a 24 year old is bananas (North).

Charteris is our only really ageing player, if you call 34yrs old these days. All the rest are in their mid to late twenties so we have no real need to panic yet. There are plenty of players coming through.

Lets not lose the fact that players like Samson Lee, Rob Evans and Tomas Francis are only 24yrs old. Nicky Smith is only 22, Sam Parry 25, Scot Baldwin 28. Ken Owens is the old man in the front row at 30. How old is the Irish front row ? I bet they are a lot older on average than the Welsh. Wales had to cap a lot of players at a very young age out of necessity, there are also a lot of younger players as a result playing for the regions. Rory Thornton, James Davies, Sam Davies, Tyler Morgan, Hallam Amos, Ellis Jenkins, Olly Cracknell, Steffan Hughes, Tom Habberfield.

Just because we have a lot of capped players in the Welsh squad, that does not mean they are all close to retirement.

by mikey_dragon Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:24 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:FFS, you have got to love this place. Firstly well done Scotland for beating us at home for the first time since 2007.

Secondly, if we are talking about this devalued nonsense, what about when everybody was saying Wales's grand slams were devalued because they came after a Lions tour or a WC ?

And last of all, FFS, how mouthy have some of the Scottish members gotten all of a sudden on here since they won a few games in the 6N instead of their usual 0 or 1 ? Lets not forget you had a record score put on you this year as well. Lets put more of these Scottish players in the Lions team so New Zealand can do the same thing.

For the first time in an age I agree with mikey_dragon, as a shiver goes down my spine:-

mikey_dragon wrote:Scotland didn't come close against England however, and are still trying to claim some moral victory. Wales' performances have proper nose-dived since Howley come in but the results have been moderate I suppose (Aus being the worst by far). The previous year Wales were better and a lot of those players haven't suddenly become sh!te.

Well said LD!

Did you just congratulate someone for quoting you?? That's almost Trump-esque.

A billionaire, philanthropist, proper sound guy, and not to mention the most powerful man in the world thumbsup

- it's a shame he was cheering on Scotland against Wales though.

by R!skysports Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:34 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
R!skysports wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Scotland didn't come close against England however, and are still trying to claim some moral victory. Wales' performances have proper nose-dived since Howley come in but the results have been moderate I suppose (Aus being the worst by far). The previous year Wales were better and a lot of those players haven't suddenly become sh!te.

#fakenews

Where has anyone ever said we had a moral vistory

Stop making up lies

It's the insinuations that Scotland did alright at twickenham because they lost some players to injury and scored 3 tries...

Scotland finished fourth this year so they aren't as good as some of their supporters believe, although I can admit that they have improved.

No, we got spanked and we know it

We might have said we had a chance to keep it closer without ending up with the tea lady in the backs - but we have always admitted, it would be keeping it closer and not that we would have won it

We are proud that we continued to fight and scoring 3 tries at Twickenham is a small positive (we have not done that for a while) that we can look at.
But it is a small consolation and we know it

by Gwlad Tue 28 Mar 2017, 3:45 am

IanBru wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Again? What a moron.

I do get what he means, a leadership team always exists within a squad. However there can be only one captain. Like Connor McLeod. Otherwise you just end up looking like a helmet... like AWJ during the Scotland game. Thats when the captain was ignored and the leadership team made a democratic decision.

Don't stir that hornets nest!

Let's just go old school and pick one captain. I'll do it.

Warburton it is then. It certainly won't be Chief Johnny of the Gray Clan - the guy gets his ass driven backward by locks who are more class than he is (AWJ).
Ah yes, Alun Wyn Jones, the captain so influential that his players openly disobey him on the rugby pitch, to the potential cost of pivotal matches. Yes, let's pick him.

No lets pick from the huge range of potential Lions attains amongst the Scots…..where should i start? Rolling Eyes

With regards to 'influence' lets not forget that great Lions Captain's like Jonno for example are humans; he nearly influenced his side to lose the RWC with his large gob.

AWJ is new in the job and he'll have learned a great lesson.

by RuggerRadge2611 Tue 28 Mar 2017, 9:09 am

Gwlad wrote:
IanBru wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Again? What a moron.

I do get what he means, a leadership team always exists within a squad. However there can be only one captain. Like Connor McLeod. Otherwise you just end up looking like a helmet... like AWJ during the Scotland game. Thats when the captain was ignored and the leadership team made a democratic decision.

Don't stir that hornets nest!

Let's just go old school and pick one captain. I'll do it.

Warburton it is then. It certainly won't be Chief Johnny of the Gray Clan - the guy gets his ass driven backward by locks who are more class than he is (AWJ).
Ah yes, Alun Wyn Jones, the captain so influential that his players openly disobey him on the rugby pitch, to the potential cost of pivotal matches. Yes, let's pick him.

No lets pick from the huge range of potential Lions attains amongst the Scots…..where should i start?

You could start with the player of the 6N 2 years running! angel

by Gwlad Tue 28 Mar 2017, 6:51 pm

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:
Gwlad wrote:
IanBru wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Again? What a moron.

I do get what he means, a leadership team always exists within a squad. However there can be only one captain. Like Connor McLeod. Otherwise you just end up looking like a helmet... like AWJ during the Scotland game. Thats when the captain was ignored and the leadership team made a democratic decision.

Don't stir that hornets nest!

Let's just go old school and pick one captain. I'll do it.

Warburton it is then. It certainly won't be Chief Johnny of the Gray Clan - the guy gets his ass driven backward by locks who are more class than he is (AWJ).
Ah yes, Alun Wyn Jones, the captain so influential that his players openly disobey him on the rugby pitch, to the potential cost of pivotal matches. Yes, let's pick him.

No lets pick from the huge range of potential Lions attains amongst the Scots…..where should i start?

You could start with the player of the 6N 2 years running!

Hogg. Captain?

Just no.

by RuggerRadge2611 Wed 29 Mar 2017, 8:44 am

Gwlad wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:
Gwlad wrote:
IanBru wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Again? What a moron.

I do get what he means, a leadership team always exists within a squad. However there can be only one captain. Like Connor McLeod. Otherwise you just end up looking like a helmet... like AWJ during the Scotland game. Thats when the captain was ignored and the leadership team made a democratic decision.

Don't stir that hornets nest!

Let's just go old school and pick one captain. I'll do it.

Warburton it is then. It certainly won't be Chief Johnny of the Gray Clan - the guy gets his ass driven backward by locks who are more class than he is (AWJ).
Ah yes, Alun Wyn Jones, the captain so influential that his players openly disobey him on the rugby pitch, to the potential cost of pivotal matches. Yes, let's pick him.

No lets pick from the huge range of potential Lions attains amongst the Scots…..where should i start?

You could start with the player of the 6N 2 years running!

Hogg. Captain?

Just no.

Where did I say make him captain? I just said he is probably first name on the team sheet. Certainly around 98% of Lions teams have Hogg as the starting 15.

by funnyExiledScot Wed 29 Mar 2017, 8:51 am

At least Hogg would tell Princess Biggar where to go, do what he's told and to just kick for goal.....

by RuggerRadge2611 Wed 29 Mar 2017, 9:57 am

funnyExiledScot wrote:At least Hogg would tell Princess Biggar where to go, do what he's told and to just kick for goal.....

Alas, poor Jones wanted to kick at the posts,
to further pile the pressure on the hosts.
He was overruled by the young pretender,
Dan Biggar, a Lions contender?
The set piece went wrong and the maul wasn't set,
surely and exchange Alun-Wyn won't forget.
A day of democracy on the field,
denied him his captain's powers to wield.
Wales defeated for the first time in a decade,
upon the hallowed turf of Murrayfield the Scots began to parade.

by SecretFly Wed 29 Mar 2017, 2:06 pm

by Gwlad Wed 29 Mar 2017, 3:16 pm

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:At least Hogg would tell Princess Biggar where to go, do what he's told and to just kick for goal.....

Alas, poor Jones wanted to kick at the posts,
to further pile the pressure on the hosts.
He was overruled by the young pretender,
Dan Biggar, a Lions contender?
The set piece went wrong and the maul wasn't set,
surely and exchange Alun-Wyn won't forget.
A day of democracy on the field,
denied him his captain's powers to wield.
Wales defeated for the first time in a decade,
upon the hallowed turf of Murrayfield the Scots began to parade
And as per usual Ruggerradge
Has his head inserted up his rusty sheriff's badge.

by SecretFly Wed 29 Mar 2017, 3:27 pm

by RuggerRadge2611 Wed 29 Mar 2017, 4:13 pm

Poor old Glwad, with his desperate sonnet,
surly more wit rests within his bonnet?
Tustles over Lions, 6N and Wales,
whilst the spring winds blow away the winter gales.
We look to the future and a summer so bright,
I hope the forum will take a different plight.
4 Nations in union to crush the All Blacks,
best not fill the squad with ancient hacks.
Gatland will pick who he thinks is best,
I'm hoping he brings enough to let the players rest.
A tour schedule from hell, where the odds are stacked,
hopefully a team that can say we attacked.
Posters will grumble, bicker and fight,
I hope the test team will ignore it and be tight.
At the end of the day we want the pride to win,
for all the controversy and sin.
NZ is a tough place to go,
but heres to a win cider

and a damn good show.

by Gwlad Wed 29 Mar 2017, 4:20 pm

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Poor old Glwad, with his desperate sonnet,
surly more wit rests within his bonnet?
Tustles over Lions, 6N and Wales,
whilst the spring winds blow away the winter gales.
We look to the future and a summer so bright,
I hope the forum will take a different plight.
4 Nations in union to crush the All Blacks,
best not fill the squad with ancient hacks.
Gatland will pick who he thinks is best,
I'm hoping he brings enough to let the players rest.
A tour schedule from hell, where the odds are stacked,
hopefully a team that can say we attacked.
Posters will grumble, bicker and fight,
I hope the test team will ignore it and be tight.
At the end of the day we want the pride to win,
for all the controversy and sin.
NZ is a tough place to go,
but heres to a win and a damn good show.
And most of all we hope he knows
We want no more dodgy Ruggerradge prose

by SecretFly Wed 29 Mar 2017, 4:41 pm

Prose is prose,
And rhymes is rhymes.
The two are different
At all times.

But you two are good
At word weavin' and metrical stitchin',
You easily drew the contest,
Now quit the goddamned bitchin'!

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