**** The B+I Lions! (+ 2 Scots)

by TightHEAD Tue 18 Apr 2017, 10:14 am

Please use this thread to vent your anger at the Lions tour selections and lack of ambition shown from the coaching staff.

For me this could have been a tour we could win in NZ, but with an out of form, out of date coach at the helm we have no chance.

Thoughts?

Full squad steam

Forwards: Rory Best (Ireland), Dan Cole (England), Taulupe Faletau (Wales), Tadhg Furlong (Ireland), Jamie George (England), Iain Henderson (Ireland), Maro Itoje (England), Alun Wyn Jones (Wales), George Kruis (England), Courtney Lawes (England), Joe Marler (England), Jack McGrath (Ireland), Ross Moriarty (Wales), Sean O'Brien (Ireland), Peter O'Mahony (Ireland), Ken Owens (Wales), Kyle Sinckler (England), CJ Stander (Ireland), Justin Tipuric (Wales), Billy Vunipola (England), Mako Vunipola (England), Sam Warburton (Wales)

Backs: Dan Biggar (Wales), Elliot Daly (England), Jonathan Davies (Wales), Owen Farrell (England), Leigh Halfpenny (Wales), Robbie Henshaw (Ireland), Stuart Hogg (Scotland), Jonathan Joseph (England), Conor Murray (Ireland), George North (Wales), Jack Nowell (England), Jared Payne (Ireland), Jonathan Sexton (Ireland), Tommy Seymour (Scotland), Ben Te'o (England), Anthony Watson (England), Rhys Webb (Wales), Liam Williams (Wales), Ben Youngs (England)

by Totalflanker Tue 18 Apr 2017, 10:44 am

A Gatland Welsh bias is understandable given he is the national coach, he will select on what he knows - so 50/50s will go in the Welsh favour. But main concern has to be the backline. Six nations just past England scored 16 tries, Ireland and Scotland both 14 and Wales 8.

Presuming 15-17 backs on the plane, if some of the pundit mood music is right and Webb, Bigger, JDavies, North, Williams and Halfpenny go, Wales will have a third of the backs selected, which just doesn't add up.

To beat NZ we need tries.

by marty2086 Tue 18 Apr 2017, 10:49 am

Halfpenny and Davies dont make sense, the only reason to take Halfpenny is for his kicking and that hasn't seemed as reliable as it once was plus with Farrell around you get that anyway. Davies ahead of Joseph is just nonsense

Biggar is a close call with Russell

by Totalflanker Tue 18 Apr 2017, 11:12 am

England scored 14 of 16 via the backs and Joseph with 3 albeit against an injury ravaged Scotland and isn't in the reckoning.
Scotland scored 12 of 14 tries via the backs in the competition behind a pack that struggled against pretty much all the teams and look likely to have just one rep.
To be fair all 8 of Wales' tries via backs which is the same as Ireland's 8 of 12.

by mikey_dragon Tue 18 Apr 2017, 1:46 pm

Lions tour 2017; Don't watch it or think about it. Log off. Return to your safe space.

Sorted.

by SecretFly Tue 18 Apr 2017, 1:53 pm

Totalflanker wrote:England scored 14 of 16 via the backs and Joseph with 3 albeit against an injury ravaged Scotland and isn't in the reckoning.
Scotland scored 12 of 14 tries via the backs in the competition behind a pack that struggled against pretty much all the teams and look likely to have just one rep.
To be fair all 8 of Wales' tries via backs which is the same as Ireland's 8 of 12.

4 from forwards....so how were the other two scored?

by TightHEAD Tue 18 Apr 2017, 1:54 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Lions tour 2017; Don't watch it or think about it. Log off. Return to your safe space.

Sorted.

I wish I could but unfortunately some of our (ENG) players will take part in this doomed, negative rugby (GatlandBall) tour of NZ.

by TightHEAD Tue 18 Apr 2017, 3:42 pm

Gatlands 1st Test v NZ

1 - Jenkins /Marler
2 - Owens / Best
3 - Lee / Francis
4- AWL (c)
5 - Itoje / Ball
6 - Warburton
7 - SOB / Tips
8 - Faletau / Moriarty
9 - Webb /
10 - Sexton / Biggar
11 - North
12 - S.Williams / Roberts
13 - JD2
14 - L.Williams / Cuthbert
15 - Hogg / 1/2p

by SecretFly Tue 18 Apr 2017, 3:45 pm

1st test = loss.

by Scottrf Tue 18 Apr 2017, 3:54 pm

SecretFly wrote:
Totalflanker wrote:England scored 14 of 16 via the backs and Joseph with 3 albeit against an injury ravaged Scotland and isn't in the reckoning.
Scotland scored 12 of 14 tries via the backs in the competition behind a pack that struggled against pretty much all the teams and look likely to have just one rep.
To be fair all 8 of Wales' tries via backs which is the same as Ireland's 8 of 12.

4 from forwards....so how were the other two scored?

8+4=12

by SecretFly Tue 18 Apr 2017, 3:59 pm

by Gwlad Tue 18 Apr 2017, 4:59 pm

oh mock outrage…..shock horror 2 england players dont get picked so mass tantrum collective dummy spit, absolutely no way we can win now if some Entitled, sorry, Enland players are left out. Laugh

in fact we don't even WANT to win, or even watch. no, the Lions should be banned as without two English players the concept is a travesty

signed

Spoilt English brats

p.s. please can we have our dummy back

by Scottrf Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:02 pm

Gwlad wrote:oh mock outrage…..shock horror 2 england players dont get picked so mass tantrum collective dummy spit, absolutely no way we can win now if some Entitled, sorry, Enland players are left out.

in fact we don't even WANT to win, or even watch. no, the Lions should be banned as without two English players the concept is a travesty

signed

Spoilt English brats

p.s. please can we have our dummy back

I think justifiably they don't want the Lions stocked with players for a nation making a beeline towards tier 2 who are unable to beat NZ.

by Gwlad Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:13 pm

yes because with 1 win out of 7 against NZ in the last 7 years England are the experts in beating NZ (they were sick)

Fact is English players have contributed very little to Lions tours, the last two wins have been due to the men in Wales

by Hammersmith harrier Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:15 pm

Alex Corbisero says hi again.

by Breadvan Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:19 pm

Fgs tighthead get a grip. The 'leaked' squad is fine. Launchbury is unlucky but so are many others. Its not going to be a replica from 2013...

by mikey_dragon Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:26 pm

Launchbury is the most overrated player ever. JJ losing out to JD2 is remarkable though, and not in a good way. There's a chance the leak might be false too I guess, so the entitled-English might not have reason to be upset after all.

by Gwlad Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:32 pm

i should add that i believe not taking both these players is a mistake but the reactions here are hilariously petulant.

Launchbury deserves picking as much as any lock and more than most. As for JJ this outrage is even funnier since he was dropped after round 2 for Te'o because he was was making little impact and i don't recall the outrage then?

by SecretFly Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:36 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:There's a chance the leak might be false too I guess, so the entitled-English might not have reason to be upset after all.

They'll be upset it was a fake leak! There's always a reason for outrage!

by Scottrf Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:38 pm

He was left out for Italy, probably why nobody cared.

by Gwlad Tue 18 Apr 2017, 6:47 pm

but why no outrage, no threatening to boycott watching england then?

fact is , it's the usual vicarious anti Welsh sentiment

Gatland (the NH's most successful coach)=Wales =English hate born of jealousy.

Sad, so much potential to get behind the Lions but because English fans are wallowing in arrogance to an almost Antipodean extent after squandering a back to back Slam, any hint of their players not being treated like minor deities is met with derision, threats to boycott the lions (as if anyone cared) and child like tantrums. too funny.

by Breadvan Tue 18 Apr 2017, 7:03 pm

Only from one poster who has a history of this Gwlad.

by Guest Tue 18 Apr 2017, 7:07 pm

TightHEAD wrote:If the leaks are true then for me the Lions concept is dead in the water and I for one will not be watching the All Blacks win the series 3-0 all because the Head Coach is a biased Potato Head.

For me this could have been a tour we could win in NZ, but with an out of form, out of date coach at the helm we have no chance.

Thoughts?

**** The B+I Lions! (+ 2 Scots) Article-0-02DC3D7A0000044D-141_468x348

by Cyril Tue 18 Apr 2017, 7:09 pm

Gwlad wrote:English fans are wallowing in arrogance to an almost Antipodean extent

Efficient 'two birds with one stone' insult

Sounds like us English need to up our arrogance game though. 'Almost' just doesn't cut it. Perhaps we're still too much 'Stu' and not enough 'Eddie'.

by nathan Tue 18 Apr 2017, 8:02 pm

Reports are saying Roberts will be included.... eek

by aucklandlaurie Tue 18 Apr 2017, 8:26 pm

Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:English fans are wallowing in arrogance to an almost Antipodean extent
Efficient 'two birds with one stone' insult

Sounds like us English need to up our arrogance game though. 'Almost' just doesn't cut it. Perhaps we're still too much 'Stu' and not enough 'Eddie'.

Yeah, come on Cyril, you are now up with the big boys, by being ranked number two means you have to show a bit of leadership (sometimes mistaken for arrogance) and act accordingly.

by Hammersmith harrier Tue 18 Apr 2017, 8:59 pm

nathan wrote:Reports are saying Roberts will be included.... eek

Davies, Te'o and Roberts will strike fear into the All Blacks, I highly doubt Farrell will be starting at 12 in that case.

by SecretFly Tue 18 Apr 2017, 9:03 pm

nathan wrote:Reports are saying Roberts will be included.... eek

He's had his new titanium skull inserted at a pretty high cost to the WRU, so it would be negligent of Gats not to include him.

by Guest Tue 18 Apr 2017, 9:04 pm

Roberts can't even get into the Wales team, and we've got 2 centres (Scott Williams and JD2) who are not playing that well either (although JD2 had a better 6N than his form before that, and better than a lot of posters are willing to give him credit for)! Surely not?!

Maybe he's just seen as midweek, senior player, cannon fodder? But if so, what a waste of a space on the plane.

by SecretFly Tue 18 Apr 2017, 9:14 pm

Griff wrote:Roberts can't even get into the Wales team, and we've got 2 centres (Scott Williams and JD2) who are not playing that well either (although JD2 had a better 6N than his form before that, and better than a lot of posters are willing to give him credit for)! Surely not?!

Maybe he's just seen as midweek, senior player, cannon fodder? But if so, what a waste of a space on the plane.

Well if that's what Gatland is offering him/hinting at then he should have the self respect to tell Gatland to f**k off. Mid-week Captain propaganda crap. "We need you to show leadership to the mid-week chancers. It's a very special role. All the best players want it...and you get to hold the mascot at dinner times."

by Guest Tue 18 Apr 2017, 9:25 pm

SecretFly wrote:
Griff wrote:Roberts can't even get into the Wales team, and we've got 2 centres (Scott Williams and JD2) who are not playing that well either (although JD2 had a better 6N than his form before that, and better than a lot of posters are willing to give him credit for)! Surely not?!

Maybe he's just seen as midweek, senior player, cannon fodder? But if so, what a waste of a space on the plane.

Well if that's what Gatland is offering him/hinting at then he should have the self respect to tell Gatland to f**k off. Mid-week Captain propaganda crap. "We need you to show leadership to the mid-week chancers. It's a very special role. All the best players want it...and you get to hold the mascot at dinner times."

Quite. For me, any player selected should have a chance of making the test team, subject to good showings in the warm up games. No-one should be identified as a Lions B-team player before the plane has even left, in my opinion. Although perhaps that's what happens in the pro era? Maybe the tight turnaround and packed schedule necessitates that sort of forward planning. Rubbish if true though Sad

by Gwlad Tue 18 Apr 2017, 9:31 pm

And now Roberts on tour! That's too funny even I think that's some mad sheeeeet

by Gwlad Tue 18 Apr 2017, 10:02 pm

People should remember that it's Howley's Wales that Roberts was dropped in and not Gatland's. The 09 lions player of the series and 2013 winner is a class act still. Timeless like Gethin Jenkins

by Exiledinborders Tue 18 Apr 2017, 10:27 pm

Griff wrote:Roberts can't even get into the Wales team, and we've got 2 centres (Scott Williams and JD2) who are not playing that well either

He struggles to get in a pretty poor Quins team.

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 10:57 am

Roberts could help out the medical staff for when they get battered in the 1st game.

Great plan selecting a Captain who spends most of his time on the treatment table after a light non-contact training session!

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 11:05 am

Anyone fancy setting up a petition to remove Gatland from the Lions job ASAP?

by marty2086 Wed 19 Apr 2017, 11:13 am

TightHEAD wrote:Anyone fancy setting up a petition to remove Gatland from the Lions job ASAP?

Clive Woodwards ahead of you there Whistle

by No9 Wed 19 Apr 2017, 11:35 am

The Lions is about the 4 nations coming together to tour and play the southern hemisphere.

So why don't you just get behind it and support it, irrespective of who's captain, who's selected to tour and who's in the test sides.

If you cant, then shut the F*** up and watch the football.

Just remember this. It is NOT England, Scotland, Ireland or Wales playing the All Blacks, its the LIONS. Embrace it and what it means or simply do something else this summer.

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 11:54 am

No9 wrote:The Lions is about the 4 nations coming together to tour and play the southern hemisphere.

So why don't you just get behind it and support it, irrespective of who's captain, who's selected to tour and who's in the test sides.

If you cant, then shut the F*** up and watch the football.

Just remember this. It is NOT England, Scotland, Ireland or Wales playing the All Blacks, its the LIONS. Embrace it and what it means or simply do something else this summer.

Did you read the title before you posted your rose tinted view of the Lions! Erm

and its the British and Irish Lions these days!

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 12:14 pm

Back's
Biggar WTF?
Daly
JD2!! NOOOOOOOOO
Farrell
1/2p lucky
Henshaw
Hogg
JJ YESSSSSSSS
Murray
North
Nowell
Payne
Sexton
Seymour
T'eo - Undeserved
Watson
Webb
L Williams
B Youngs

Forwards
Best
Cole
Faletau
Ferlong
George
Henderson
Itoje
AWJ
Kruis? WTF no game time
Lawes
Marler
McGrath
Moriarty
SOB
O'Mahony
Owens
Sinckler
Stander (SA)
Tips
M.Vunipola
B.Vunipola
Warbs (c)

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 12:15 pm

Well Done Scotland on your players selected???????? Rolling Eyes

Just goes to show its not how well you play but how well you know Gatland!

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 12:24 pm

Biggar = Joke

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 1:12 pm

Canterbury are offering people who purchased Lions jerseys in Scotland a refund. Lol

by RuggerRadge2611 Wed 19 Apr 2017, 1:14 pm

I do find your new title quite funny tho laughing

by little_badger Wed 19 Apr 2017, 1:17 pm

Squad aside, I've said it before and I'll say it again, the head coach of the Lions should not be a national coach. Even if there is no actual bias the perception is that there will be. It's why Geech worked so well.

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 1:18 pm

little_badger wrote:Squad aside, I've said it before and I'll say it again, the head coach of the Lions should not be a national coach. Even if there is no actual bias the perception is that there will be. It's why Geech worked so well.

It makes sense.

by No9 Wed 19 Apr 2017, 2:29 pm

TightHEAD wrote:
No9 wrote:The Lions is about the 4 nations coming together to tour and play the southern hemisphere.

So why don't you just get behind it and support it, irrespective of who's captain, who's selected to tour and who's in the test sides.

If you cant, then shut the F*** up and watch the football.

Just remember this. It is NOT England, Scotland, Ireland or Wales playing the All Blacks, its the LIONS. Embrace it and what it means or simply do something else this summer.

Did you read the title before you posted your rose tinted view of the Lions!

and its the British and Irish Lions these days!

1. Did I read the title first - Yes. It doesn't stop me having my opinion, and as such voice it. I still believe you support the Lions, whoever is picked or you don't. If you don't, then why try and rip it apart with churlish comments, as you do.

2. Rose tinted views - One thing I don't have is a ROSE tinted view. A daff or leak maybe, but no rose here.

3. Its STILL the LIONS. Not the British Lions (without adding the British & Irish Lions), but LIONS is ok.

As for the announcement, I reckon its not a bad one. Scots could have/should have had more players selected, especially the Jonnie and Richie Gray, so I do feel for the Scots. But the rest of the selections is about right.

by TightHEAD Wed 19 Apr 2017, 2:32 pm

I hope they get stuffed.

Strange that you get an opinion yet I have to shut the F up and watch football. Go and do one.

by Poorfour Wed 19 Apr 2017, 2:38 pm

Players per match point earned in the 6N:
England – 16 players, 19 points – 0.84
Ireland – 11 players, 14 points – 0.79
Scotland – 2 players, 14 points - 0.14
Wales – 12 players, 10 points – 1.20.

by No9 Wed 19 Apr 2017, 2:40 pm

TightHEAD wrote:
little_badger wrote:Squad aside, I've said it before and I'll say it again, the head coach of the Lions should not be a national coach. Even if there is no actual bias the perception is that there will be. It's why Geech worked so well.

It makes sense.

Rubbish... for that to work it would have to be a non British or Irish coach, as any conceived bias would still be argued. So what do you do then. Get a French, S African, Australian, Kiwi, Argentinian or maybe Italian coach. Lets be sensible. It has to be a coach from the Britain or Ireland, maybe not a current national coach, but still has to be someone with present experience of the current players.

Cant say, I'm happy with Gats taken the job, for two reasons.

1. Beat the All Blacks and Hansen will be on his way, leaving Gats prime candidate for the job he really wants. Result, Wales looking for new coach.
2. Don't select the Welsh boys on the tour, and he loses the Welsh players backing when he comes back to the Wales job (like Graham Henry did). Result, Wales looking for a new coach.
3. Select the Welsh boys and loose the series, everyone else on his back.. Result, who knows may decide to pack it in...

Either way, its a poison chalice I would rather he didn't have. But he does have it, so he, the captain and the team will get my full support (Even the English contingent).

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