British & Irish Lions Squad 2017

First topic message reminder :

Poorfour wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:
 There was no spear tackle.

Technically, you're right. It was off the ball, so it wasn't a tackle. Whatever it was, it wasn't pretty, it was deliberately dangerous and it wasn't remotely legal. The way it was handled by the officials was appalling.

 With an imagination like that you could get a job at Disneyland.

kingelderfield wrote:I think its a mistake to do ALL of these cultural events. We're allowing the squad to be distracted from their purpose.

One or two only is enough. Respect as a rugby player will be earn't on the pitch.

Depends on what "their purpose" is.

The Lions purpose as a brand is to make as much money as possible - that's what perpetuates these tours. The more coverage they get on TV the more sponsors will pay and the brand makes more money. Expect photo opportunities to increase rather than diminish.

You'd hope that Gatland wouldn't pick any player who hasn't already earned respect as a rugby player. As long as the opposition ensure they don't put any humiliating scores on the board they can keep the golden goose alive for the foreseeable future.

Rugby Fan wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:While I would agree that applies to 1983 and 2005, the 1993 tour (refereeing aside) was far from a miserable tour. The 77 tour largely passed me by at the time, but looking purely at the results then (excepting the last 4 days) the 3 month tour looks as if it was a pretty good one.

Unless you win, it's not just about results. 2009 was a lost series but widely seen as rehabilitating the idea of the Lions. 1977 was badly managed, and there were several personality conflicts. If you put that tour in today's media environment, it would rank a bit better than 2005 but worse than 2001.

The 1993 tour was deeply divided between the dirtrackers and test sides. Some of the midweek players went off the reservation, and pretty much scuppered any hopes their team mates might have had of earning Test selection. McGeechan was very disenchanted with the squad selection, which he though had been too political. It was that experience which led him to demand a free hand to choose the 1997 squad.

In which case RF (and as I said I cannot remember the 77 tour) pretty much all the Lions tours in my living memory have been pretty miserable.

1980 - massive shadow of apartheid, high turnover of players and disappointing test results.
1983 - politicised selections, shocking test match results
1989 - dodgy selections for the first test, accusations of over aggressive play
1993 - Saturdays good, midweek shocking - last amateur tour and boy did some players enjoy themselves
1997 - Series won (though helped by SA selections) and a successful first post apartheid tour for the Lions
2001 - Henry (according to Gats) lost half the squad at the first training session
2005 - Alistair Cambell. Nuff said.
2009 - Lost the series but a tour that revived the brand. Was that a good thing though?
2013 - Divisions, recriminations and a won series against the worst Australian side in living history. Lions should have wiped the floor with them.


If I had to rate the tours:

The Good - 97/09

The Bad - 80/83

The Ugly - 01/05

The Great Aukster wrote:

kingelderfield wrote:I think its a mistake to do ALL of these cultural events. We're allowing the squad to be distracted from their purpose.

One or two only is enough. Respect as a rugby player will be earn't on the pitch.

Depends on what "their purpose" is.

The Lions purpose as a brand is to make as much money as possible - that's what perpetuates these tours. The more coverage they get on TV the more sponsors will pay and the brand makes more money. Expect photo opportunities to increase rather than diminish.

You'd hope that Gatland wouldn't pick any player who hasn't already earned respect as a rugby player. As long as the opposition ensure they don't put any humiliating scores on the board they can keep the golden goose alive for the foreseeable future.

I'm assuming this will be Gatland's last Lions tour. Now imagine if this tour goes big time pear shaped, the BIL are walloped from pillar to post and the players and coaches et al fall out with catastrophic newspaper headlines north and south, in other words its an all out disaster. Then maybe, maybe the concept will be questioned again and maybe if the 2023 WC is awarded to the IRFU, then there maybe a change in the Irish perspective. However for the forseeable future there are way to many mouths in the troth, be they union or media or other commercial interests and lets not forget the players, or fans as well, who by their patronage buy into the Lions.

I've long argued that it's rugby's biggest cul de sac but until the WC breaks the spell we're stuck with this 'romantic' commercial treadmill.

Finally you never know perhaps the negotiation of a global season could see the Lions reduced to test matches plus a couple of warm ups, but I suspect that will be at the clubs doing/benefit and not of the union/international games benefit.