Brexit

by **navyblueshorts** Wed 18 Oct 2017, 8:51 pm

First topic message reminder :

Galted wrote:It will stop foreigners praying in our mosques.

by Samo Tue 07 Nov 2017, 4:52 pm

LionsV2 wrote:
Samo wrote:May isnt going anywhere because she is a puppet of a PM. Both Johnson and Patel have commited stone cold sackable offences recently. Either A. May doesnt have the bottle to sack them. B. She's too incompetent to sack them, or C. someone else is pulling the strings in the background.

Or D. they're both prominent Brexiteers and p1ssing off the members is a bad idea.

So they can do whatever they want then?

by LionsV2 Tue 07 Nov 2017, 4:56 pm

To an extent yes, Johnson would have had a say in the Patel incident and as key allies within the party he will have backed her, that's politics.

by lostinwales Tue 07 Nov 2017, 5:35 pm

You do wonder what they would actually have to do to be given the boot though.

by Samo Tue 07 Nov 2017, 5:39 pm

lostinwales wrote:You do wonder what they would actually have to do to be given the boot though.

Boris could take a Poopie on the cenotaph and the Brexit bankbenchers would still keep him in a job.

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 07 Nov 2017, 7:04 pm

Labour have just tabled 30 questions about Patel's trip that need to be answered by Monday..

Problem for May and the Minister...

by LionsV2 Tue 07 Nov 2017, 10:20 pm

Samo wrote:
lostinwales wrote:You do wonder what they would actually have to do to be given the boot though.

Boris could take a Poopie on the cenotaph and the Brexit bankbenchers would still keep him in a job.

And rightly so, you seem to think your left wing view of him matters but it doesn't at all, he is despite your protestations highly regarded within the party.

by LionsV2 Tue 07 Nov 2017, 10:21 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Labour have just tabled 30 questions about Patel's trip that need to be answered by Monday..

Problem for May and the Minister...

Surprise surprise, pro Israel MP isn't much liked by Labour.

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 07 Nov 2017, 10:31 pm

Not a single Tory has backed her up...and it looks like nighty night according to the BBC.

Try harder buddy..You are falling short these days..

by LionsV2 Tue 07 Nov 2017, 10:33 pm

We shall see, if she goes we're one step closer to the end of May.

by **JuliusHMarx** Tue 07 Nov 2017, 11:29 pm

LionsV2 wrote:We shall see, if she goes we're one step closer to the end of May.

End of May? It's not even December yet!

by **JuliusHMarx** Tue 07 Nov 2017, 11:32 pm

And a thread split! Congratulations to navyblueshorts

by Scottrf Wed 08 Nov 2017, 12:38 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Labour have just tabled 30 questions about Patel's trip that need to be answered by Monday..

Problem for May and the Minister...

Hopefully they ask where she thinks the best sabich is.

by **Pr4wn** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 3:04 pm

LionsV2 wrote:
Samo wrote:
lostinwales wrote:You do wonder what they would actually have to do to be given the boot though.

Boris could take a Poopie on the cenotaph and the Brexit bankbenchers would still keep him in a job.

And rightly so, you seem to think your left wing view of him matters but it doesn't at all, he is despite your protestations highly regarded within the party.

How depressing is that, though? Reminds me quite a lot of the situation in the USA. Politicians like Paul Ryan are forced into kowtowing to Trump, even though they don't agree with him because the knuckle-draggers in the population support him.

Johnson is a lot like Trump in that the only person he cares about is himself.

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 3:09 pm

In what way is it depressing?

The members are the ones who bankroll the party so their opinion on such things is incredibly important and I love the way you feel the need to insult anyone who has a differing view to you. 'Knuckle-draggers', pfft you're not worth the time of day making comments like that.

Lazy comparison to make and spoken like someone who has never met the man nor ever listened to what he actually says.

by **Pr4wn** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 3:16 pm

You do know that he advocated for the EU strongly before magically changing his mind and becoming a hard Brexiteer when he though he could smell No. 10?

How naive can you be to think that he cares about anyone but Boris Johnson?

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 3:22 pm

I wouldn't exactly say he advocated for the EU strongly and his journalistic career was heavily Eurosceptic.

Naïve? Unlike you I have met and spoken to the man as well as many within the party, you however are basing your opinion on media snippets, i'll stick with my actual experiences of the man.

by **JuliusHMarx** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 3:36 pm

I guess none of us should have an opinion on Donald Trump then.
Anyone met Jeremy Corbyn? If not, we probably shouldn't comment on him either.

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 3:47 pm

JuliusHMarx wrote:I guess none of us should have an opinion on Donald Trump then.
Anyone met Jeremy Corbyn? If not, we probably shouldn't comment on him either.

It was in reference to my apparent naivety towards him which would only be relevant if I was basing my opinion on the media perception.

by Duty281 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 3:55 pm

JuliusHMarx wrote:Anyone met Jeremy Corbyn?

Yes, but only briefly. He was very scruffy and had a bigger entourage than most boy bands.

by Scottrf Wed 08 Nov 2017, 3:56 pm

My mate saw BJ the other day jogging through St. James Park with 2 athletic guys trailing him.

Apparently he wasn't going very fast.

by **JuliusHMarx** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 4:04 pm

Duty281 wrote:
JuliusHMarx wrote:Anyone met Jeremy Corbyn?

Yes, but only briefly. He was very scruffy and had a bigger entourage than most boy bands.

My stubble used to look like Indiana Jones, now it looks like Jeremy Corbyn. What was once synonymous with adventure now appears to indicate an inability to self-care.

by **Pr4wn** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 6:25 pm

I also think that Johnson's support within the chamber is hugely overstated. Look at how many Tory MPs turned out to support him yesterday after his disastrous handling of the Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe situation. Also, if he has such huge support, why isn't he leader? Why was he so far off in terms of support at the last Tory leadership race?

Quite honestly, if there's one thing I'm grateful to May for, it's making Johnson Foreign Secretary in the first place. She's really highlighted what a bumbling incompetent he is.

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 6:36 pm

You seem to be arguing with yourself there, I stated members not MPs, you understand the difference yes?

by **Pr4wn** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 6:49 pm

MPs matter more, despite what you think. Any idea why Johnson was so far off during the last leadership contest?

Yes, he's extremely popular with a pocket of donors and members, but I'd love to see concrete evidence that he's massively popular with the membership as a whole.

Face it, he's been an utterly terrible FS so far.

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 6:53 pm

MPs aren't the ones who get out and vote, they aren't the ones who provide the party with it's money so no they do not matter more, i'm sure you'd have the opposite view of Labour and Corbyn, strange that.

He was so far off because he didn't enter into the leadership contest, that small detail might be a reason but don't let facts get in the way, oddly I couldn't give a toss if you think he's terrible, goes to show what a fine job he is doing.

by **JuliusHMarx** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 6:58 pm

He makes too many avoidable errors to be doing a fine job.

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 7:01 pm

JuliusHMarx wrote:He makes too many avoidable errors to be doing a fine job.

Avoidable or deliberate? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

by **Pr4wn** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 7:04 pm

LionsV2 wrote:MPs aren't the ones who get out and vote, they aren't the ones who provide the party with it's money so no they do not matter more, i'm sure you'd have the opposite view of Labour and Corbyn, strange that.

He was so far off because he didn't enter into the leadership contest, that small detail might be a reason but don't let facts get in the way, oddly I couldn't give a toss if you think he's terrible, goes to show what a fine job he is doing.

This is the standard of response that is expected in the political discourse these days. "If you think he's bad then he must be good". Pathetic.

It's well-documented that Johnson intended on running in the contest but decided against it because he wouldn't have been able to get anywhere near the level of support that May had. He was also stabbed in the back by the other all-round nice bloke in that party, Michael Gove.

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 7:06 pm

To be honest I think every single opinion you hold is pathetic but oh well, if he annoys people like you then that's a good thing in my book.

Is it well documented or was it assumed he would run, you seem to base a lot of your opinions on hearsay rather than the reality of the inner workings of the party, something you know nothing about hence why you've had to move the goalposts yet again.

by Samo Wed 08 Nov 2017, 7:20 pm

LionsV2 wrote:
JuliusHMarx wrote:He makes too many avoidable errors to be doing a fine job.

Avoidable or deliberate? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Im confused, neither of those are good things? And Im not even sure what a deliberate error is apart from an oxymoron.

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 7:21 pm

Then the use of the word error wouldn't be needed, good God.

by Samo Wed 08 Nov 2017, 7:25 pm

Nuh, you've lost me.

by LionsV2 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 7:26 pm

Not hard really is it.

by **JuliusHMarx** Wed 08 Nov 2017, 10:06 pm

LionsV2 wrote:
JuliusHMarx wrote:He makes too many avoidable errors to be doing a fine job.

Avoidable or deliberate? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Ok then. He makes too many avoidable and/or deliberate errors to be doing a fine job.

by Ent Wed 08 Nov 2017, 10:38 pm

Johnston is incompetent.

Yes he is amusing in a bumbling idiot kind of way and he head butted a German in a charity match but hes terrible.

Annoying a lot of the electorate isn't a good thing either if you want a majority.

A sex scandal, a suspended minister committing suicide and Priti Patel gone now, politics in the U.K. Is in crisis.

by Duty281 Wed 08 Nov 2017, 11:16 pm

Not quite strong and stable, is it?!

by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 09 Nov 2017, 10:13 am

Ent wrote:Johnston is incompetent.

Yes he is amusing in a bumbling idiot kind of way and he head butted a German in a charity match but hes terrible.

Annoying a lot of the electorate isn't a good thing either if you want a majority.

A sex scandal, a suspended minister committing suicide and Priti Patel gone now, politics in the U.K. Is in crisis.

The big picture.

Stuck in a Brexit that the Govt is I'll prepared for....With fair expectations of unemployment rises and a run on the pound at the end of it.
300,000 living on the streets.
Public sector workers using food banks
NHS in a terrible state..
Violent crime rising..Less Police officers.

by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 09 Nov 2017, 12:43 pm

ORB...

Britain will be better off economically post Brexit ??

Agree 37 (-6)
Disagree 40 (+5)....

Crossover....

Slowly but surely the UK is repenting its decision..

by Duty281 Thu 09 Nov 2017, 1:03 pm

About 70% think we should go ahead with Brexit, so not really.

by Samo Thu 09 Nov 2017, 1:15 pm

Duty281 wrote:About 70% think we should go ahead with Brexit, so not really.

Source?

by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 09 Nov 2017, 1:15 pm

That is not an endorsement of Brexit...Duty.

More to do with a sizeable number of people respecting the decision and thinking the Country has to make the best of it...Me thinks.

Good attempt at spin though.....

by **Pr4wn** Thu 09 Nov 2017, 1:38 pm

Samo wrote:
Duty281 wrote:About 70% think we should go ahead with Brexit, so not really.

Source?

www.ukip.org

by Duty281 Thu 09 Nov 2017, 2:02 pm

Samo wrote:
Duty281 wrote:About 70% think we should go ahead with Brexit, so not really.

Source?

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/05/12/forget-52-rise-re-leavers-mean-pro-brexit-electora/
https://yougov.co.uk/news/2016/11/17/brexit-briefing/

by Duty281 Thu 09 Nov 2017, 2:06 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:That is not an endorsement of Brexit...Duty.

More to do with a sizeable number of people respecting the decision and thinking the Country has to make the best of it...Me thinks.

Good attempt at spin though.....

It is partially people respecting the decision, yes, which shouldn't surprise us as the exit data shows the Remain vote was a very soft one.

However, the main point is that if Leave voters were regretting their choice, or if the hardcore Remain vote was strengthening, that would show us the UK was 'repenting' its decision. But there is no evidence for this. Leave voters have no regrets. A sizeable contingent of Remain voters are happy to get on board.

by **JuliusHMarx** Thu 09 Nov 2017, 3:05 pm

Not 'happy', but 'willing', even though they still think it is a bad decision.

by **Pr4wn** Thu 09 Nov 2017, 3:44 pm

And also because any disagreement with it is being faced with accusations of treachery and treason.

by **navyblueshorts** Thu 09 Nov 2017, 4:21 pm

I voted to remain. I think the Brexit decision is fundamentally insane and based on outright lies, bad information and an element of misplaced xenophobia. It's a proxy for long-standing and deteriorating issues that are solely to do with Britain and the British. Easy to blame Johnny Foreigner though - wonder who'll be blamed when we've 'taken back control' ? picard

However, I still think we should get on with getting out of the EU though. That's what 'we' voted for and we've made our bed so now we better lie in it. We're British; we tend to abide by referenda decisions and the outcome of things like elections whether we like the result or not. Doesn't mean I agree though.

by **Hero** Thu 09 Nov 2017, 4:28 pm

Brexit is a god send for the traditional Tory voter.
Removing a huge chunk of the lowest paid overseas workers that do the menial jobs that us Brits refuse to do then means the class system can continue to split further, spend less on the education system per student as the country will need a portion of the masses to now take up the bottom end of the rung with ever increasing improbability they can escape it.

by Duty281 Thu 09 Nov 2017, 4:45 pm

Brits don’t refuse to do menial jobs.

Lazy prejudice, sadly made popular by the Lib Dems and Nick Clegg.

by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 09 Nov 2017, 7:47 pm

ONS

EU migrants contribute £1.34 to the UK economy for every £1 they receive..

Should have put that on the Bus instead.. thumbsup

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