Scotland v Australia 25th November

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Scotland v Australia
25th November 2017
BT Murrayfield Stadium

ko 14.30
Coverage BBC/BT Sport

While the overall balance in this fixture leans heavily towards Australia, it is also fair to say that the Aussie's don't have the hex over Scotland in the same way that the All Blacks do. Scotland have won on several occasions, including their most recent fixture in Australia in the summer and before that was the infamous (from a Scottish perspective) WC quarter final, with a certain dubious reffing decision, that may have had an impact on the result.

Australia were in the middle of a post WC slump during the summer, from which they have largely recovered now, but similarly Scotland were missing a few key players and it could well be argued are a more complete side now.

Probably more influential on the result will be what the two games this weekend have taken out of the two teams, particularly in terms of injured players.

Australia ended up well beaten by England, but with a score line that did not really reflect the match, in fact, with a few of the more marginal calls going their way, the result could easily have gone the other way. They did however worryingly run badly out of steam in the last 10 mins when the match ran away from them.

Scotland, on the other hand, despite taking a horrible injury toll against NZ, actually finished the game the stronger team and how often can that be said when playing the blackness.

My worries for Scotland are that they may have lost, from an already inexperienced side, just one or two players to many; as well as just how can they possibly get themselves back up again after playing so well and getting nothing to show for it. This match will actually be a massive test for them in terms of their progress. Are they just a team that can get themselves up for a big game, or can they be consistently good now and back up a performance with another. In the 6N last year and on the summer tour, they failed to do that and to move forward, they need to start doing so.

Thank god the TMO got that one right. Thought Price had messed up. Looking good for the second half.

Both Scottish props hooked!

Came out complacent

Not the start we wanted!

Good try but maitland nearly got caught by the 2nd row. He's looking sooooo slow

Ping pong

This is nuts. Have Aus brought on the th?

That's more like it!

tigertattie wrote:Good try but maitland nearly got caught by the 2nd row. He's looking sooooo slow

Well, this post aged badly.

Bhatti on the hooooooof

Right through Stephen Moore. Not a nice way to bow out of rugby

What the hell is Tommy Seymour doing?!

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

tigertattie wrote:Good try but maitland nearly got caught by the 2nd row. He's looking sooooo slow

Well, this post aged badly.

I'm lost at the point you are making

RDW_Scotland wrote:What the hell is Tommy Seymour doing?!

Making Tim visser look competent

tigertattie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

tigertattie wrote:Good try but maitland nearly got caught by the 2nd row. He's looking sooooo slow

Well, this post aged badly.

I'm lost at the point you are making

Apologies, my feed is delayed, from my perspective Maitland scored after you said he was slow.

Well that was cheeky

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

tigertattie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

tigertattie wrote:Good try but maitland nearly got caught by the 2nd row. He's looking sooooo slow

Well, this post aged badly.

I'm lost at the point you are making

Apologies, my feed is delayed, from my perspective Maitland scored after you said he was slow.

Ahhhhhh. Now I get ya

Go on Scotland, you get those pesky criminals.

Wallabies hearts just are not in this. Terrific display from Scotland but Australia no longer defending.

We want 50!

Seriously every time Scotland get the ball you think it's on. I can't ever remember thinking that before

Great stuff from the Scots.

The Aussies are a shambles.

Not been a good afternoon for Australia

I'll take that!

Cracking result Scotland.

The Aussies looked tired and broken today, but the Scots deserved winners.

Great watch.

Love McGuigan's scottish accent (won't mention that again, promise)

I'd like to think we would have won that even without the red - Australia looked flat and we just had so much fire power.

Not a bad game of rugby that.
Is Hamish Watson some sort of genetic experiment? Never seen so much power in such a small fella.

Congratulations lads. Brilliant score.

RDW_Scotland wrote:I'd like to think we would have won that even without the red - Australia looked flat and we just had so much fire power.

Yes - Australia were very patchy. At times looked very dangerous (especially with Foley showing some lovely touches) but the defense was just appalling.

You can only play what is in front of you but Scotland did so well. Not many years ago Scotland would still have won but it would have been by around 2 points from a stack of penalties and one flukey try.

John Barclay's try was my favourite - he's such a warrior. The look of his face was priceless!

Well done Scotland. Really getting the best of the Aussies recently.

To draw from my 4th year English teacher, who was never happy with anything, that was officially "no' bad".

That was Huw Jones' 7th try in 11 internationals. Holy sh!tballs.

Someone also told me that this moves us up to 4th in the world rankings, but that doesn't quite smell right to me yet.

George Carlin wrote:To draw from my 4th year English teacher, who was never happy with anything, that was officially "no' bad".

That was Huw Jones' 7th try in 11 internationals. Holy sh!tballs.

Someone also told me that this moves us up to 4th in the world rankings, but that doesn't quite smell right to me yet.

Nah we are still stuck at 6th. The Irish can thank us though as they move up to 3rd

Think we could go to 5th

Not that it matters a jot but that was blatantly a pen try at the end.

Negatives
- We are not used to receiving restarts. Too many years not scoring tries. Need to get used to it
- Scrum was still struggling, even against 7
- Came out really flat to start the 2nd. Not sure we would have won as comprehensively if Aus had not scored
- Seymour was poor. He needs a break. Going through the Lions hangover Hogg had in 2013. 2-3 weeks off just to get his mind and body back
- Hope Hogg has not pulled a hamstring. They can be an absolute bugger
- Brown went off for a head knock again. Can he please protect his head?

Positives
- The front row are great in the loose. Bhatti and Fagerson both were given space and took full advantage. McInally was the pick of them though. Thought he had the best game in the front 5 and that is saying something
- 2nd row were excellent. R Gray will need to play well to get back in let alone Swinson
- Back row were phenomenal. Barclay should have been man of the match. Watson is the best pure 7 in the NH. Denton is having a blinder for Worcester off the bench apparently and Strauss is still about. Depth for any future injuries.
- Price was excellent; Pyrgos is a different sort of scrum half. Not sure if it suits us yet
- Russell had a poor first half and settled into a fine second half. If Racing force him to clean up his kicking...
- Horne was overpowered at times but made sure to get in the way and did what he could. Attacking wise him and Jones (who was sublime (need a thesaurus for excellent)) were toying with the Aussies.
- McGuigan and Maitland were in fine form. If McGuigan can do what he did today by carrying hard, running support lines and working hard defensively (ignoring his try efforts), he is an international level wing. Amazing to say that about him and L Jones. If I said that 2-3 seasons ago...
- Scotland scored the most points ever in a game between these 2 sides. No side had scored more than 45. Largest margin of victory as well for Scotland (by 20 points). We did that whilst mucking up our kicking in the first half and struggling a bit in the scrum. We did that with about 10-12 of our first choice 23 out. If we can get any traction in the scrum, we can put any team to the sword.

Final note, it was a shame for Moore to go out like that. He has had an excellent career and was an industrious player who gave his all. Deserved the applause and should have a chance to walk out at a home game sometime.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Not that it matters a jot but that was blatantly a pen try at the end.

The argument was that there was no guarantee McGuigan would have got there as Beale was in front. Moot point as Australia were anihalated in that maul over the line directly afterwards

Beale is removed from the situation in the decision so clearly wrong. Yes good job it didn't matter as clearly didn't know the law if that's the case.

Quick summary of the Series from me

We're getting better but still work to do. We need more leadership and better decision making (like not opting for scrums). We need to get a better kicking game (in play and from penalties to touch)

Lessons learned.

Marfo looks fine at this level and once our other loose heads return, we're well stocked at 1.

McInally turning into a hooker seems to have worked.

We need Nel as we're struggling at tighthead. Berghan is struggling and Fagarson is a good bench option but his struggling to scrum makes for him lacking as a starter.

Toolis is a completely capable internationalist and gives excellent options to the Gray boys

We're blessed with flankers. We need a big ball carrying 8. CDP seems best placed for that role.

Price is coming on nicely.

Finn. Hopefully going to France will bring more consistency to his game. Big fall off in talent behind him though.

Centre. We need a good replacement at 12 if Dunbar is cabbaged. Can Matt Scott get firing again? Perhaps Taylor? 13, what a find Huw Jones has been and with Bennett to fight with for the jersey they should push each other on

Looking good at wing with Byron taking his chance so far. Seymour needs to get his mojo back.

Fullback. Hogg is king. Maitland makes a defensive option but he's not the attacker hogg is (but no one is)

We're looking so much better than 5 years ago. Only England and Ireland should be posing us issues at the 6ns

As an England fan I think I'm going to have to put a bet on Scotland to beat us at Murrayfield as I have a feeling you guys are going to be very hard to beat at home and hedging some consolation may be wise!

mid_gen wrote:As an England fan I think I'm going to have to put a bet on Scotland to beat us at Murrayfield as I have a feeling you guys are going to be very hard to beat at home and hedging some consolation may be wise!

I still have big concerns about our power to front and particularly the scrum. Hopefully we have some key players back by then, particularly in the front row.

If we have Nel, Dell and Sutherland all fit and firing on top of present options we may be able to at least hang with England. The ref is still big for us in the ruck area though our reputation has improved enough to get a bit more of a benefit of a doubt. Our second row options are fine and the back row could do with one of Strauss, Ashe, Bradbury or CDP making the 8 jersey their own.

You could argue the Scots defense is suspect and will cough up points. When they are scoring as they were against Australia it doesn't matter, but it could well do against us English.

What the heck has happened to the Aussies 

We need to get at them in The Ashes too and really rub it in!

The cup ain't worth it, Cyril. That cup is too puny to put in the effort.

SecretFly wrote:The cup ain't worth it, Cyril.  That cup is too puny to put in the effort.

It may be small, but it has the heart of a wee Shane 

Just thought I'd drop in to offer my hearty congratulations to the Scots. What a win!

Had a feeling we might get pipped by about 3 points or so.... but not 29!

I think this marks a turning point in Scotto-Okker relationships.

From now on, the criminal element will be forced to march ahead and pitch the tents and set up fire for all the Scottish townsfolk who wish to resettle in these vast new areas across the great divide.

I really do hope your guys can maintain this form early next year during the 6N. That would be great to watch. Well done!

The end of Cheika? Or would that be too rash, considering Australia have time to get themselves back in order before next WC...and have been given the right shock treatment to help the study of where everything is going wrong.

My player ratings:

1 Marfo - 6

His quietest game of the series and had a bad knock on, but will definitely be in the mix come the 6N. What a find!

2 McInally - 8

Another strong performance and he's well and truly laid down the marker as number one hooker.

3 Berghan - 5

Some good carries but more struggles at scrum time. Shame he's not been able to carry on his club form into this level. IMO he doesn't look fit enough for Townsend's style of play

4 Gilchrist - 8

Toolis didn't do much wrong last week but Gilchrist justified his selection with a powerful display. I'd still start with toolis but it's good he's coming into form as well!

5 Gray - 8

Continuing his high standards and another well taken try.

6 Barclay - 9

Captain fantastic. A menace around the breakdown and huge determination to get his try. I'm so happy he patched up his differences with the SRU!

7 Watson - 9

My MOTM. Big carries, breakdown  mastery and real physicality in the contact area.  Would things have been different if he hadn't gone off last week?

8 Wilson - 7

Did his usual job and didn't get carded! He'll give his all whenever selected but IMO we need a bigger carrier at 8. I don't know who that would be though...

9 Price - 8

If any doubt about our first choice 9 then it should be ended. He's a perfect 9 for the Townsend style of play. Laidlaw should settle for the bench at best!

10 Russell - 7

His usual flashes of brilliance combined with some big mistakes - two missed kicks to touch the biggest ones. The less said about his quick 22 the better. His goal kicking is a real asset now though, and means we don't need to rely on Laidlaw.

11 McGuigan - 8

Thrust into the action at short notice and made a great first impression. Some powerful carries and 2 well taken tries. He's a bit Visser-esque in defence and he got away with some dodgy football skills but great to have unearthed more depth at 10.

12 Horne - 7

Prominent in attack but still lightweight in defence, which I worry about in the 6N. I think he's best served off the bench.

13 Jones - 8

The boy just can't stop scoring! A wonderful attacking talent

14 Seymour - 3

And we thought he played badly last week! That surely must be his worst ever performance in a Scotland top.

15 Maitland - 7

Great to have him back and filled in nicely for Hogg at 15 (although not the same class). He looked a bit slow though - the Aussie second row almost caught him!

Pick of the subs - Bhatti and fagerson made a great impact off the bench

SecretFly wrote:The end of Cheika?  Or would that be too rash, considering Australia have time to get themselves back in order before next WC...and have been given the right shock treatment to help the study of where everything is going wrong.He 

He should quit or be removed as soon as possible. He's destroying the Aussies. It's a shame as I love to see a strong Australia side. They're pathetic right now, which doesn't seem right

SecretFly wrote:The end of Cheika?  Or would that be too rash, considering Australia have time to get themselves back in order before next WC...and have been given the right shock treatment to help the study of where everything is going wrong.

Maybe a game too far. Maybe beating the AB's took a lot out of them. Following that with a good fight with Wales, then getting roughed up big time by us left them open to being hammered by the Scots.

For all the brilliance of the Scottish attacking play there is no way that some of those tries should have been scored. However much deserved Barclay's try was he should not have been able to make it. Too much of the defense was powderpuff in that 2nd half.

There are real issues too. Had a good look around Green and Gold which is a great site, with its combination of intelligent and wonderful insights and some incredibly sore losers . There does seem to be a feeling that Cheika only likes certain kinds of characters around the squad and that it lacks leaders. Also that he has managed to alienate players. How on earth they did not fight harder to hang onto Scott Fardy I will never know.