Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[dynamark]

First topic message reminder :

I think its a done deal -no doubt he will be sat with the owner tonight
Villa should be a big big club remember going to cup semis there but probably need an owner willing to throw in some quick money .
No messing around in football these days from any of the owners.

[westisbest]

....and yet Derby are not promoted yet.

And hoping they won’t be.
Very nervous about the game.

[beninho]

Hopefully Villa go up, sign Kourtney Hause, and the chairboys get a tidy sell on payment. Please!!

Pompey fans showing themselves up, kicking o'nien like that. Hopefully banned by the club.

[super_realist]

Baku is a stupid place to hold the final. But uefa like tge cash that cones with it from a pretty dodgy country.

Anyway, 13k fans from both teams purely because its so difficult to get to. Puts to bed any argument that its not a stupid place for the final. And it's kicking off at 11pm or something,not great for the players.

Baku was a money choice, pure and simple and a stupid one at that.

Are you serious? What sort of excuse is that? They've got plenty time to adjust to a 2-3 hour time difference to their usual evening match time.
Tennis players, athletes, boxers etc play at all times of the day, and unless it goes past 2am, you rarely hear a complain.

Do you seriously think a difference of 2-3 hours is going to make the slightest bit of difference to the players?

[pedro]

Pompey fans showing themselves up, kicking o'nien like that. Hopefully banned by the club.

Didn’t know kwini was at the game.

[McLaren]

Not to get repetive but in F1 for the Singapore night race the teams just stick close to European time schedules. Get up at midday and go to bed in the middle of the night. So 2-3 hours is easy to adjust to given how short their stay in the country will be.

[kwinigolfer]

Pompey fans showing themselves up, kicking o'nien like that. Hopefully banned by the club.

Didn’t know kwini was at the game.

It wouldn't have happened if I was reffing, pedro, I'd've had him off well before the fans got involved.
Have passed on my congrats to Mr.Diggers . . . . . . .
Now, what to do with Our Mourning Jackett? Terrible second half of the season, and mercenaries picked last night instead of the lads wot got them there in the first place.

[beninho]

These abortion laws in states are bonkers. America is going backwards. Horrendous decisions.

[pedro]

That’s religion for you ben. If any of the major religions had been invented today they would have been banned, or at least labeled fake news.

[beninho]

I think him being sacked and losing his job is better then just being laughed at.

[I'm never wrong]

I think him being sacked and losing his job is better then just being laughed at.

Sorry Ben, who are you referring to?

[Davie]

I think he was referring to a post from Super talking about the Aussie rugby player. Strangely the post from super seems to have been deleted

[I'm never wrong]

Thanks Davie. Understood.

[Davie]

Unlike Super to delete a comment - but it if was an admin who did it, it makes a mockery of following comments - and I don't recall anything worse than usual about it

[beninho]

It was about Israel Folau and his gay hating ways.think Realist was of the view he should be laughed at, I think its worse for him to be sacked from his $4m contract.

[super_realist]

I didn't delete a bloody thing. Nothing I said was remotely contentious or controversial and it wasn't even close to breaking the rules of the forum.
What's wrong with someone that they would delete such a inoffensive post?

[Davie]

So who deleted it then? And why? Must be an overly zealous admin. I saw it and Beninho obviously saw it. Nothing to panic over

[beninho]

To be fair, compared to sone of your bat sh&t crazy ramblings, I don't remember what you said being that crazy. Still the ramblings of an unhinged person, but not in the top echelon.

[super_realist]

To be fair, compared to sone of your bat sh&t crazy ramblings, I don't remember what you said being that crazy. Still the ramblings of an unhinged person, but not in the top echelon.

Wasn't remotely crazy or the ramblings of anyone unhinged, quite the opposite actually, seeing Folau's laughable threat for what it is.

What I said was that people shouldn't be offended by Folau, they should be laughing at it for being such a stupid claim to make. Folau's beliefs are indistinguishable from a fairy tale and his threats of hell are about as credible as saying "if you're not good this year, Santa won't bring you any presents". Why would anyone be offended by that?

What Dillian Whyte has said in regards to him wanting a "body" on his record was far far worse. One is actively wanting to kill someone and clearly bringing the sport into disrepute, and one is a meaningless threat based on a bloody bronze age myth which at worst is something against the code of the Australian Rugby Union.

[navyblueshorts]

To be fair, compared to sone of your bat sh&t crazy ramblings, I don't remember what you said being that crazy. Still the ramblings of an unhinged person, but not in the top echelon.

Wasn't remotely crazy or the ramblings of anyone unhinged, quite the opposite actually, seeing Folau's laughable threat for what it is.

What I said was that people shouldn't be offended by Folau, they should be laughing at it for being such a stupid claim to make. Folau's beliefs are indistinguishable from a fairy tale and his threats of hell are about as credible as saying "if you're not good this year, Santa won't bring you any presents". Why would anyone be offended by that?

What Dillian Whyte Deontay Wilder has said in regards to him wanting a "body" on his record was far far worse. One is actively wanting to kill someone and clearly bringing the sport into disrepute, and one is a meaningless threat based on a bloody bronze age myth which at worst is something against the code of the Australian Rugby Union.

Corrected it for you. Agree with you though. Folau's an A1 idiot; not sure what annoys me most about his silly social media post though - what he actually said, or the fact that all the media seem to making it only about how it relates to homosexuals (or whatever allowed term it is today).

[beninho]

Wilder says what he says with the aim of hyping a fight and selling tickets, its standard boxing fare. Things get said at most press conferences.

Folau has said gays should go to hell. Its pretty homophobic. There's wuite a big difference between the 2.

I can quite easily accept why gay people find it offensive. Mainly because it is. Especially when you get a lot of follow up messages agreeing with him.

[navyblueshorts]

Wilder says what he says with the aim of hyping a fight and selling tickets, its standard boxing fare. Things get said at most press conferences.

Folau has said gays should go to hell. Its pretty homophobic. There's wuite a big difference between the 2.

I can quite easily accept why gay people find it offensive. Mainly because it is. Especially when you get a lot of follow up messages agreeing with him.

The groups he targeted were "drunks, homosexuals, adulterers, liars, fornicators, thieves, atheists and idolaters". I could maybe give him thieves, and to a lesser extent, liars and drunks (although the latter two are heavily nuanced), but the rest? How dare the SJW media etc condemn me, an atheist, as being OK to insult, but jump up and down about homosexuals? **** right off. You and they obviously don't care about Folau's comment re. other religions either eh? Or about anyone who's done a bit of horizontal jogging outside of wedlock?

[Collapse2005]

Folau said hell awaits those categories of people. Is that the same as saying they should go to hell or rather he believes they will?

Anyway I think they probably sacked him as he pretty much covered the whole Australia squad with that list.

[Davie]

Surely the point is though that whether you believe in "hell" or not, HE does and he is condemning all these categories of people to it. It makes no difference if you yourself believe in heaven and hell or not. He is wishing ill on these people in his own way

[Collapse2005]

Is he wishing them ill or does he just believe thats their fate? I think there is a difference.

[Davie]

There is a difference - but as a practicing, God-fearing Christian he's hardly saying it will be a picnic is he?

[pedro]

Anyway I think they probably sacked him as he pretty much covered the whole Australia squad with that list.

Fixed it for you.

[navyblueshorts]

Anyway I think they probably sacked him as he pretty much covered the whole Australia squad with that list.

Fixed it for you.

Careful. Let's not go too far that way...

[super_realist]

Wilder says what he says with the aim of hyping a fight and selling tickets, its standard boxing fare. Things get said at most press conferences.

Folau has said gays should go to hell. Its pretty homophobic. There's wuite a big difference between the 2.

I can quite easily accept why gay people find it offensive. Mainly because it is. Especially when you get a lot of follow up messages agreeing with him.

Why is it offensive though? If he'd said that gay people were "subhuman" or something like that, then yes, I would agree. All he's done is make the absurd claim that gay people (and all the rest) are going to hell. So what? How is saying that anyone is going to some fictional place for living their lives as they see fit insulting?

He said atheists were going to hell too, yet all I can do is laugh at such a laughable claim. It's as a ridiculous a claim to make as if you make a face and the wind changes then your face will stay like it. Why would anyone take such a juvenile threat as anything other than the ramblings of a religious moron? If someone said that the Holy Book of the Flying Spaghetti monster will send you to hell for not liking pasta, no one would care, yet for some reason they take this threat as being "offensive". It's crazy.

I'd be very interested to see what condemnation he would get if he was a Muslim though, I think people would be tip toeing around it a bit more and most likely make excuses for him.

[super_realist]

Surely the point is though that whether you believe in "hell" or not, HE does and he is condemning all these categories of people to it. It makes no difference if you yourself believe in heaven and hell or not. He is wishing ill on these people in his own way

I don't care what he believes, I care what he can demonstrate to be true. He can't, so his threats are laughable.  It's a bit like when people over-react to their mum being called a lady of loose morals. Who cares? You know she isn't, so why care what someone says. People are way too sensitive and insecure if they are offended by such an hilarious threat. If he wishes ill on me or anyone, why should I care? His beliefs are no more reasonable than believing in the Loch Ness Monster, Bigfoot or Fairies, so if anything I should feel pity that there are still people this stupid and gullible in the world.

The good thing about this is though is that it highlights how deluded and moronic the religious are (as is also being shown at the Birmingham schools issue)

Anyway, hell sounds an awful lot better than heaven. Can you imagine singing songs and praising god all day? I can't imagine much worse, besides why would "the devil" punish me for turning against god? It makes no sense, just like all religion.

[beninho]

Well known sportsman calls out gays (among others) as being beneath him, and basically a lower form of person to millions on social media. This is picked up lots more people agreeing with his views. Yet, some people see no wrong in it.

But im glaf realist speaks for the gay population of the world. With his claims that its not insulting.

Each to their own.

[super_realist]

You are missing the point. I'm talking about people making threats that cannot be backed up in reality. Why would someone be offended by the threat of a fairy tale?

If someone says to you, "last one to the pub is a rotten egg" and you are last, do you actually believe you are a rotten egg? Of course not. So why does anyone think that if someone says that they're going to hell for being gay, atheist, adulterer, have sex out of wedlock etc then they're going to hell?  Why is anyone taking such a threat seriously? It's laughably stupid.

If I told Folau that he was going to hell for tattooing his body (as per bible instructions, he's committed a "sin"), do you think he'd be worried? No, he'd simply brush it off because he's a religious hypocrite. So why aren't other people simply laughing off this pathetic attempt at an insult? What's wrong with people?


Where did I say I was speaking for the gay world? He addressed his hilarious attempt at an insult at a broad spectrum of people of which I (and you) are one. Are you worried you are going to hell? No, you treat it with the same derision you do as being potentially labelled a rotten egg for being last to the pub.

Why are you trying to generate fake offence at this? Have you actually met anyone who is offended by what he says, or like I suspect is everyone commenting about him being a religious moron? The only people I've seen pretend to be offended are the hand wringing types who are professionally offended, usually on someones behalf.

I've not heard one single person give me a reason as to why they find it offensive. If it was a true claim, then it might be, but as it's about as real as Santa Claus, how can anyone take it seriously?

[beninho]

I think you are missing the point.

The threat of going to hell is not necessarily the offensive bit. The calling out that people are veneath him, and this being agreed by a large number of people could be deemed offensive.

If someone deems gays to be second class citizens, I could understand why some gays may deem it offensive.

The religion bit is surface dresssing. Homophobia is still homophobia, and its a homophobic statement.

* I accept other may also feel offended.

[Davie]

I think you are missing the point.

Of course he is - as usual. It's not the point that he is wishing "hell" on anyone - when many people don't believe in "hell" - it's the fact he is wishing bad on someone.

It doesn't matter if I said Super would deserve to be devoured by the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal - it might be a totally fictional beast but the fact is that I'd (hypothetically) be wanting him to meet some horrendous fate of my own imagination. The fact that the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal doesn't exist doesn't remove the threat

Super however lives in his own little world and can't see beyond the literal.

[beninho]

I just cant stop biting...bloody trolls.

[dynamark]

Is Santa not real then ?
Super has gone too far this time.All these years wasted.

[pedro]

Is Santa not real then ?
Super has gone too far this time.All these years wasted.

With the massive amount of confirmed sightings each year he MUST be real.

[super_realist]

I think you are missing the point.

Of course he is - as usual. It's not the point that he is wishing "hell" on anyone - when many people don't believe in "hell" - it's the fact he is wishing bad on someone.

It doesn't matter if I said Super would deserve to be devoured by the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal - it might be a totally fictional beast but the fact is that I'd (hypothetically) be wanting him to meet some horrendous fate of my own imagination. The fact that the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal doesn't exist doesn't remove the threat

Super however lives in his own little world and can't see beyond the literal.

Who cares if someone wishes ill on you especially when it comes as an empty threat? Why would you care what they say? Do you seriously expect to be liked by everyone? If you're the sort of weak willed person who feels "offence" why do you think you should be immune.

I don't care that Folau thinks I'm below him (as you claim he does). I couldn't give a flying toss. Why would anyone else?

I would imagine almost everyone who Folau targeted in his list is disregarding his "threat" as ridiculous and only the SJW types like Beninho actually place any emphasis on the statement. Anyway, nothing in Floau's statement says that these groups are "beneath" him. He says they are going to hell because of their actions according to his fairy tale. That doesn't say anything about where he places them in context to himself, after all, according to his imaginary jewish sky zombie, he's going to hell too.

[beninho]

Yep, everyone should be like you. The caricature of super realist. Or maybe people are different.

I don't know why I bother getting involved with an extremist.

[McLaren]

Super

You seem to be divorcing what he said with any consequences it could have, some of which have been laid out by other posters.

As an exercise would you humor me and list what consequences you think there might be when a prominent figure makes homophobic comments?

[JAS]

Meanwhile, having thought we’d done the Baku as a venue thing to death now we have one of the competing teams unable to field a full strength side because one of their players is from a nation with whom the hosting nation is in dispute. Now...What if an Armenian side had made the final?

[McLaren]

Jas

mkhitaryan being unable to travel to Baku should really mean the match is played elsewhere. I know I said that Baku was no worse than a lot of the dodgy connections in football but once a teams player cannot even travel to the country surely the venue has to be changed?

The defense from Uefa (and super) will no doubt be that it was the players/clubs own decision, which is really no defense at all.

They have a week to sort it out, I am sure the new Spurs stadium or Wembley could be prepared in that time.

[pedro]

Well, as I understand Azerbaijan are not denying him entry. Mkhitaryan chooses not to play due to security fears. That's fair enough. But what should UEFA do?

Imagine if an Israeli team made it to a final being played in Paris? Or if a Ukrainian team made it to a final in Moscow? Or various Balkan teams playing in various Balkan cities? Or Irish teams (ok, hypothetical) playing in super_realists home town?

You have players of all sorts of nationalities on all teams. There will always be some of certain nationalities that will be unpopular in certain venues.

[westisbest]

Jas

mkhitaryan being unable to travel to Baku should really mean the match is played elsewhere. I know I said that Baku was no worse than a lot of the dodgy connections in football but once a teams player cannot even travel to the country surely the venue has to be changed?

The defense from Uefa (and super) will no doubt be that it was the players/clubs own decision, which is really no defense at all.

They have a week to sort it out, I am sure the new Spurs stadium or Wembley could be prepared in that time.

Having it in England, cmon now Mac, that’s very shortsighted and unimaginative

[Be_the_ball]

Agree with Pedro, if you are a professional footballer contracted to a club you should be available to play.

"X country doesn't allow marriage equality" I'm not playing.

It's a can of worms that will get insane pretty quickly..

[JAS]

Agree with Pedro, if you are a professional footballer contracted to a club you should be available to play.

"X country doesn't allow marriage equality" I'm not playing.

It's a can of worms that will get insane pretty quickly..

I think it’s a wee bit more complex, Azerberjhan and Armenia are pretty much at war with each other, diplomatic relations are broken off. It’s fine for UEFA and the Azerberjhanis to “guarantee” the players safety and say “grow a pair ya snowflake” but....he shouldn’t really be put in that situation. As to how they would implement such a guarantee anyway is anybodies guess.

Having said that I suppose it’s like (maybe not so much now but back in the 70s/80s at the height of the Troubles it would be like Celtic players not wanting to travel to play Linfield or Rangers players not wanting to travel to play say Bohemian in Dublin. I’m sure neither sets of players would have backed out there.

What is bizarre though is UEFA wanting to fine clubs for racist/sectarian chanting because it’s offensive and may cause trouble then deliberately taking a show piece final to a country in a defacto war with its neighbour and with a history of rampant intolerance.

[McLaren]

Imagine if an Israeli team made it to a final being played in Paris?

I hate to think what this is getting at.



But to your wider points doesn't it just show that UEFA should be more diligent when picking venues for its finals? There are plenty of countries (including France) in Europe where every player would be safe and welcome.

[pedro]

Yes. I also think Baku is a dodgy venue - this is just one of many reasons.

[super_realist]

Well, as I understand Azerbaijan are not denying him entry. Mkhitaryan chooses not to play due to security fears. That's fair enough. But what should UEFA do?

Imagine if an Israeli team made it to a final being played in Paris? Or if a Ukrainian team made it to a final in Moscow? Or various Balkan teams playing in various Balkan cities? Or Irish teams (ok, hypothetical) playing in super_realists home town?

You have players of all sorts of nationalities on all teams. There will always be some of certain nationalities that will be unpopular in certain venues.

After all, they're playing the World Cup in Qatar, are we to believe that Saudi Arabia and UAE won't turn up if they qualify?

[super_realist]

Imagine if an Israeli team made it to a final being played in Paris?

I hate to think what this is getting at.



But to your wider points doesn't it just show that UEFA should be more diligent when picking venues for its finals?  There are plenty of countries (including France) in Europe where every player would be safe and welcome.

Why Mac? Do you think UEFA should go through every possible diplomatic issue one country has with another before deciding on a venue?

You can't guarantee anyone's safety in any country. Should we just hold the final of every tournament in Zurich every year due to neutrality?

[super_realist]

Yep, everyone should be like you. The caricature of super realist. Or maybe people are different.

I don't know why I bother getting involved with an extremist.

You've still failed to explain why anyone would be offended by such a ridiculous threat, even if HE means it and the outcome of his threat is laughable, so bloody what? What is wrong with someone that they'd take offence at something so ridiculous? I'm sure you've had plenty people say something derogatory about you in your life. Did you go running to the authorities about it, or like a sensible person did you just shrug it off as the ramblings of some idiot you happen to know a bit?

He's broken the code of the ARU, that's about as bad as it seems to me. Anyone actually getting offended by this needs to toughen up a bit and see it for what it is, ridiculous and worthless and more indicative of what a pathetic moron Folau is rather than a reflection on anything to do with themselves.

Honestly, caring about the opinions of Folau on a personal level is just absurd under any description. Were you offended by his statement as an atheist/adulterer/fornicator? No.

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