SF1 - Match Thread - ENGLAND v NEW ZEALAND - 26/10/19 - K/O 09:00 BST (PART 2)

[Guest]

First topic message reminder :

Because everyone else is getting a bit excited and the first thread is going to spill over during the match.

ENGLAND

Team:Daly; Watson, Tuilagi, Farrell (capt), May; Ford, Youngs; M Vunipola, George, Sinckler, Itoje, Lawes, Curry, Underhill, B Vunipola.

Replacements: Cowan-Dickie, Marler, Cole, Kruis, Wilson, Heinz, Slade, Joseph.

NEW ZEALAND

Team: Beauden Barrett; Sevu Reece, Jack Goodhue, Anton Lienert-Brown, George Bridge; Richie Mo'unga, Aaron Smith; Joe Moody, Codie Taylor, Nepo Laulala, Brodie Retallick, Sam Whitelock, Scott Barrett, Ardie Savea, Kieran Read (capt).

Replacements: Dane Coles, Ofa Tuungafasi, Angus Ta'avao, Patrick Tuipulotu, Sam Cane, TJ Perenara, Sonny Bill Williams, Jordie Barrett.



Venue: Yokohama
Referee: Nigel Owens
AR1: Romain Poite
AR2: Pascal Gauzere
TMO: Marius Joncker

[RiscaGame]

Wrong brother.

[Scottrf]

Just amazing pressure on their receivers, have never seen NZ so unable to play and look so uninventive. Barrett literally just kicked all day.
Amazing breakdown and mauls, so many turnovers.
Except the try, line out was great. Hopefully next time Lawes is picked there will be fewer doubters. Don’t think so though.
Such great control and execution.

[majesticimperialman]

It as been said by some poster's that England have not beaten NZ in how many years?

Thinking about the game tomorrow Wales v South Africa. Wales have won their i think it is 4 game against South Africa.

The point i am making is like this game today. what as happend in the past, does not count.

This is a Rugby World Cup, knock out rugby so any thing can happen.

Who ever wins tomorrow, based on what we have seen today will have to play extremely well.

Could Wales win tomorrow?

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Itoje was MOTM, according to World Rugby online. 

Well, that was a very impressive performance, and it puts the Australia game and England’s pool performances into perspective. This is a team that’s capable of taking control of a game and holding onto it for 80 minutes. And I don’t think the ABs can have any complaints about the refereeing this time.

If anything it would be England complaining. I am not wishing to be disparaging to Owens but apart from the tries disallowed (correctly), I saw Whitelock with two choke tackles around the neck that should have been punished and that reversed penalty when he threw Farrell down should have been looked at closer as it looked to me that he head butted him and Farrell was holding his face.

[Taylorman]

T-man, ebop, is this the end of the road for a number of the older players? Can we expect the new faces that played today plus some more now to come to the fore at the start of a new 4 year cycle or will the AB bring the new faces in slowly?

18 ABs are signed past this year but 30, most of this squad, are signed to end this year only. 11 played of the 30 tonight. So potentially a real clean out. NZRU is trying to sign as many up as possible.

[Heaf]

Itoje was MOTM, according to World Rugby online. 

Well, that was a very impressive performance, and it puts the Australia game and England’s pool performances into perspective. This is a team that’s capable of taking control of a game and holding onto it for 80 minutes. And I don’t think the ABs can have any complaints about the refereeing this time.

If anything it would be England complaining. I am not wishing to be disparaging to Owens but apart from the tries disallowed (correctly), I saw Whitelock with two choke tackles around the neck that should have been punished and that reversed penalty when he threw Farrell down should have been looked at closer as it looked to me that he head butted him and Farrell was holding his face.

The number of forward passes was ridiculous too ...

[lostinwales]

One more to go

[Old Man]

Itoje was MOTM, according to World Rugby online. 

Well, that was a very impressive performance, and it puts the Australia game and England’s pool performances into perspective. This is a team that’s capable of taking control of a game and holding onto it for 80 minutes. And I don’t think the ABs can have any complaints about the refereeing this time.

If anything it would be England complaining. I am not wishing to be disparaging to Owens but apart from the tries disallowed (correctly), I saw Whitelock with two choke tackles around the neck that should have been punished and that reversed penalty when he threw Farrell down should have been looked at closer as it looked to me that he head butted him and Farrell was holding his face.

England also had choke tackles around the neck, There was no headbutt.

The calls went 50/50. No controversy in this match.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Do NZ RU have the same control over the clubs that say Ireland do? Dictate who plays where and when, what sort of tactics are used etc?

[Scottrf]

50/50? Haha. TMO, I didn’t see anything but please check the last 5 minutes of play for anything that could rule the try out.

[Rinsure]

Absolutely pumped. That was epic.

Thought we (Eng) were brilliant, stifling defence and good attack, although we lost our shape at the end of the first half when we should have been scoring more. You could feel the suffocating pressure on NZ growing, building... Our back row were immense, the Kamikaze Kids just everywhere, and as for Itoje...

Never felt "in the bag" until the whistle went though, we've all seen NZ score quick late tries to pull it out of the fire before.

The only blemish was the try, which was of our own making.

What a great game. Can't wait until next Saturday.

I might even support Wales tomorrow.

[Old Man]

Obstruction was clear, can’t believe you are questioning it

[Steffan]

Hard to believe England are going to win another RWC. But it has happened I guess. Not sure who the English will cheer on tomorrow. Obviously they will want to see the Welsh lose...but at the same time would prefer Wales in the final

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Old Man, I wasn't sure, but I thought it was something that ought to be looked at, particularly as Farrell was holding his face. Agree that there was no real controversy, Whitelook just seemed to be going a bit further than I thought was legal, if England were doing the same and with my rose tinted specs I did nor see it, they should have been penalised as well.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Obstruction was clear, can’t believe you are questioning it

Who is?

[Old Man]

Scotfrrrrrr

[Heaf]

Obstruction was clear, can’t believe you are questioning it

He's probably talking about the knock-on which wasn't as George had his hand on it all the time ... fortunately England 'took the ref out of the equation' as the ABs are fond of saying I believe ...

[kingelderfield]

Surely Dan Robson? Though would be happy with Ben Spencer to replace Hines.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

I will always support any of the home nations against SH opposition, even though sometimes it can be very difficult to support those in red (unless it is the Lions of course)

[BamBam]

Was just a push in the face from Whitelock on Farrell, stupid but just a penalty

By the letter of the law we can't have any complaints about the first disallowed try but seen them given so it did feel harsh. The Youngs non try I need to see again, but I'm glad we took the refereeing decisions out of the game

[majesticimperialman]

Did i miss it or did they not interview Kieran Read after the game?

[Scottrf]

Questioning the amount of involvement of the TMO in the game, not the decision.

[Old Man]

Old Man, I wasn't sure, but I thought it was something that ought to be looked at, particularly as Farrell was holding his face. Agree that there was no real controversy, Whitelook just seemed to be going a bit further than I thought was legal, if England were doing the same and with my rose tinted specs I did nor see it, they should have been penalised as well.

Doesn’t matter Wellpastit, it was a great test match and Owens didn’t have an influence over the result.

There will always be things referees miss, but this was a great test match.

[Old Man]

Did i miss it or did they not interview Kieran Read after the game?

yes they did.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Obstruction was clear, can’t believe you are questioning it

I thought he disallowed it for a technical offside as he was ahead of the ball. Curry didn't seek contact, both NZ came in to tackle him

[Old Man]

Yes, being in front of the ball carrier and making contact with a defender.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Old Man, I wasn't sure, but I thought it was something that ought to be looked at, particularly as Farrell was holding his face. Agree that there was no real controversy, Whitelook just seemed to be going a bit further than I thought was legal, if England were doing the same and with my rose tinted specs I did nor see it, they should have been penalised as well.

Doesn’t matter Wellpastit, it was a great test match and Owens didn’t have an influence over the result.

There will always be things referees miss, but this was a great test match.

I still cannot believe the intensity from both sides over the full 80 minutes. England just had that 5% more in the last quarter that enabled us to get back and keep our line safe.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Yes, being in front of the ball carrier and making contact with a defender.

Not arguing the decision Old Man

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Has anything come out about the injuries?

[Old Man]

I haven’t heard anything, no

[robbo277]

What a game. England were on it. The tackles went flying in. There were a lot more missed this week than last but the defensive effort was huge, forcing runners down the wrong channel into waiting defenders. Itoje, Curry and Underhill lead it. They were massive.

In attack we lacked a bit, but credit to the NZ defence for making it difficult. We looked good in patches but only came away with the 1 try. In the end that was enough, with NZ forced to give away penalties and England kept the scoreboard ticking over.

One more game. It's far from certain but I'm indifferent to who we get, currently you would put us slightly ahead regardless. Can watch on tomorrow dispassionately, which will be a nice change after today.

[Guest]

The ABs underestimated England and Eddie said they spent 2.5 years focussing on this game, so you have to say, England, don’t f**k it up next week because today ‘was your final’. Food for thought.

[king_carlos]

Has anything come out about the injuries?

I was just thinking this.

Farrell was walking wounded. Sinckler and May hobbled off early.

All key players for England if any of those knocks are serious enough to be risks for the final.

Sinckler in particular raises an interesting scenario. If he's touch and go England will want to give him every chance by not replacing him but will also need a reserve. If Farrell, May or Nowell are ruled out do you then call up Williams in their place?

[BamBam]

If it's Wales, I'm glad I'm going to be blissfully unaware of anything until the final whistle. Wales annual World Cup final in the actual World Cup final is going to be quite something

Also quite glad I'm not going to be on here for the next two weeks

[BamBam]

Farrell apparently had a dead leg, which I think should be OK. May looks like he's out, but would be hopeful of a Nowell return, would rather risk him than throw Cokanasiga in

[Soul Requiem]

The most epic forward performance I've seen for a long time; the handling of Sinckler and the sheer physicality of Lawes, Itoje, Curry and most notably Underhill, beyond happy right now.

[No 7&1/2]

Yeah. May looked a risk the second he got that ball on the wing as normally he'd have scored that. Must have been touch and go and aggravated it.

[LondonTiger]

Farrell apparently had a dead leg, which I think should be OK. May looks like he's out, but would be hopeful of a Nowell return, would rather risk him than throw Cokanasiga in

Really May was not fit enough to start, but his ability under high balls was crucial.

[lostinwales]

May our best winger and one of our most consistent players but at least we have options. Hopefully Nowell will be OK by next week. It would be a big call to play Cokanasinga but he offers real threat too.

[king_carlos]

Farrell apparently had a dead leg, which I think should be OK. May looks like he's out, but would be hopeful of a Nowell return, would rather risk him than throw Cokanasiga in

Really May was not fit enough to start, but his ability under high balls was crucial.

It was noticeable that he didn't fully put his foot down when Scott Barrett caught him down the wing. I'm not saying he'd had burnt Barrett fully fit with the angle but in that scenario May would usually put his foot down.

Hopefully Nowell is fit for the final if May isn't.

[robbo277]

Farrell should be fine. Early knock, came through it, finished the game, although not as a kicker. You think he'd come through.

If there's any doubt over Sinckler I'm sure Williams will get a call to fly to Japan, even if he doesn't get added straight away. And then maybe they'll be more flexible with a replacement if there's an opportunity to give Sinkler more time but also give Williams a chance apparently.

[BamBam]

McConnochie to pick up a tournament ending injury tomorrow I reckon

[LondonTiger]

McConnochie to pick up a tournament ending injury tomorrow I reckon

I hear him and Francis are concerns

[Soul Requiem]

Wilson was also immense the moment he came on, Jones persevering with him for just 20 minutes thus far has paid off.

[LondonTiger]

Seen some of the different player ratings. NZ being marked far too low imo.

[bsando]

Incredible performance from England today. That first try was excellent. Then the defensive work by the whole team and the backrow and locks in particular was immense. I was also very impressed with the English front row in attack, more than once they unlocked the backs via some quick hands rather than looking to go into contact.

The final is going to be a really special occasion for England fans, best of luck!

[Soul Requiem]

Seen some of the different player ratings. NZ being marked far too low imo.

I don't think they played badly at all, they just had no answer to the ferocity of that England performance.

[maestegmafia]

Wow what an amazing performance. I really didn’t expect that level of tenacity and conviction.

Had grand kids climbing all over me so will have to re-watch the game later but from what I saw england were immensely talented.

Nerves are going for tomorrow’s game, a proper hide behind the sofa match for sure.

[majesticimperialman]

I take it most of the NZ team will either retire from international rugby, or be dropped  from the team altogether.

Who will take over the captaincy of the Abs? There is no one that stand's out for me.

[Shifty]

England squashed them up front and stopped their game in it's tracks.  The game wasn't close really, England were winning all the way through and could of won by more.  

Personally everyone I know in Wales was hoping for an English win because were aware if Wales can beat South Africa we won't find the English as intimidating as the New Zealanders.  A Wales V England final would be wonderful for European rugby.  Lets hope

God help the team that loses between Wales and South Africa, as New Zealand will be angry next week!

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