Scotland 2020 Internationals

by bsando Sun 23 Aug 2020, 4:02 pm

First topic message reminder :

With club rugby in Europe back up and running I thought it might be time to begin a new International thread.

Scotland's Upcoming 2020 International Fixtures

Warm Up

Scotland vs Georgia 23rd October BT Murrayfield (KO TBC)

6 Nations

Wales vs Scotland 31st October 2.15pm KO (venue TBC)

Eight Nations Tournament pool games

Italy vs Scotland November 14th November 12.45pm KO (Venue TBC)

Scotland vs France 22nd November 3pm KO BT Murrayfield

Scotland vs Fiji 28th November 1.45pm KO BT Murrayfield

December 5th Eight Nations play-off matches (1st vs 1st, 2nd vs 2nd, 3rd vs 3rd, 4th vs 4th)

by **RDW** Thu 10 Sep 2020, 11:16 pm

Fagerson still doesn't do it for me - he hasn't made consistent impact for Glasgow, and has generally been anonymous for Scotland.

Haining in the 6N has been our best 8 for a while, and he doesn't even get into the Edinburgh team!

by **BigGee** Fri 11 Sep 2020, 7:25 am

RDW wrote:Fagerson still doesn't do it for me - he hasn't made consistent impact for Glasgow, and has generally been anonymous for Scotland.

Haining in the 6N has been our best 8 for a while, and he doesn't even get into the Edinburgh team!

He probably should over Bradbury though!

by **RDW** Fri 11 Sep 2020, 7:48 am

Bradbury is a weird one – he has all the attributes to be a top international 6/8. Rightly or wrongly to me he just never looks that bothered and doesn’t influence games like he should do. I want to see him really get angry, like Jonny did against Japan in the WC and put in one of his best ever performances.

I’d still take Bradbury over Fagerson just now as at least he adds physicality and bulk, which has been one of our shortcomings over the years!

by tigertattie Fri 11 Sep 2020, 7:54 pm

Amazon required to see the AI games.

Thankfully I have it, but still can’t say I’m nappy about it.

by Anglobraveheart Fri 11 Sep 2020, 8:30 pm

Evening all.
Just want to chuck this out there. How about Matt Fagerson to hooker?
Brown and McInally are coming to the end of their tenure, and may make it to the next World Cup. As part of the succession planning, Matt Fagerson could retrain as a hooker in the same way McInally did.
The way the game is, I can't see him being big enough for the duties expected of a modern day No 8.
The other thing that crossed my mind was whether Scott Cummings could move to No8?

by mikey_dragon Fri 11 Sep 2020, 10:30 pm

tigertattie wrote:Amazon required to see the AI games.

Thankfully I have it, but still can’t say I’m nappy about it.

At least 3 games for Wales via Prime - one on Channel 4 and I think Wales vs Scotland is BBC. I'm okay with it, I have Prime - which has numerous benefits in addition to the music and streaming. I still rate Spotify and Netflix better on those fronts, but I imagine Amazon will take over in a few years. I think we're witnessing how the game will go on to survive in the smaller nations Very Happy

. Can't say I'm impressed with Premier Sports rugby coverage either.

by **BigGee** Fri 11 Sep 2020, 11:02 pm

Amazon can certainly afford to pay, that is for sure!

I imagine they could take over the whole of the sports market if they really wanted, their profits are obscene.

by **NeilyBroon** Sat 12 Sep 2020, 11:22 am

Anglobraveheart wrote:Evening all.
Just want to chuck this out there. How about Matt Fagerson to hooker?
Brown and McInally are coming to the end of their tenure, and may make it to the next World Cup. As part of the succession planning, Matt Fagerson could retrain as a hooker in the same way McInally did.
The way the game is, I can't see him being big enough for the duties expected of a modern day No 8.
The other thing that crossed my mind was whether Scott Cummings could move to No8?

Skinner is playing 8 for Exeter tomorrow and has experience in the back row. I'd rather see him than Cummings make the move, especially as cummings is currently our best SR.

Matt Fagerson is too big to be a hooker really, McInally and brown were short for most modern flankers (although 6ft is only really "short" by rugby standards, for instance Hamish Watson is 6ft and he looks short which is mad). The taller front rowers tend to struggle as their opposite number will have more leverage to collapse the scrum.

Besides, Matt Fagerson is only 24 and gets regular time in the back row for Glasgow and Scotland. It could be he just needs specialist coaching to help him use his bulk effectively, look at the impact du pleissus had on Fagerson Sr's development.

by **NeilyBroon** Sat 12 Sep 2020, 11:30 am

My mistake, Skinner isn't playing. But he has played 8 before!

by **RDW** Sat 12 Sep 2020, 11:55 am

Said it many times before - Skinner for me isn't an international back row. He's too lumbering and slow.

I also think he's probably 4th/5th choice lock just now for Scotland. He doesn't start for Exeter!

by **RDW** Sat 12 Sep 2020, 12:03 pm

https://www.ruck.co.uk/watch-finn-russell-sets-up-two-tries-with-magical-kicks/

Finn looks like he's had one too many pastries but he's still pulling the strings marvelously.

by bsando Sat 12 Sep 2020, 11:32 pm

I was just watching a dodgy replay of the game. The amount of racing 92 games where he causes chaos and splits the field open is incredible. How do teams defend against that? The crossfield kick try came from his marvellous half break and offload from the phase before. He had no right to get that ball away. Montpellier did hardly anything wrong but that was them buggered. It also came straight off the back of his chip over that put Vakatawa away beforehand. 19 - 3 at the 44.30 mark then literally 3 minutes later it was 31 - 3 and Montpellier's night was over. He missed a few kicks to touch biting off more than he could chew but god his variety of attack is just awesome. I seriously hope he tours with the Lions, it would be such a shame if he doesn't.

by Anglobraveheart Sun 13 Sep 2020, 2:00 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:
Anglobraveheart wrote:Evening all.
Just want to chuck this out there. How about Matt Fagerson to hooker?
Brown and McInally are coming to the end of their tenure, and may make it to the next World Cup. As part of the succession planning, Matt Fagerson could retrain as a hooker in the same way McInally did.
The way the game is, I can't see him being big enough for the duties expected of a modern day No 8.
The other thing that crossed my mind was whether Scott Cummings could move to No8?

Skinner is playing 8 for Exeter tomorrow and has experience in the back row. I'd rather see him than Cummings make the move, especially as cummings is currently our best SR.

Matt Fagerson is too big to be a hooker really, McInally and brown were short for most modern flankers (although 6ft is only really "short" by rugby standards, for instance Hamish Watson is 6ft and he looks short which is mad). The taller front rowers tend to struggle as their opposite number will have more leverage to collapse the scrum.

Besides, Matt Fagerson is only 24 and gets regular time in the back row for Glasgow and Scotland. It could be he just needs specialist coaching to help him use his bulk effectively, look at the impact du pleissus had on Fagerson Sr's development.

If this works, it's a first time success at the quote function!
Done a bit of research, MF is 22 and 6'1", which is only and inch taller than Fraser Brown, but 2 inches shorter than SMc. MF is about the same weight as SMc and a stone lighter than FB.
I think there's mileage in MF having a go at hooker. For comparison, Billy V is 6'2", but 20.5 stone. And Toby Faletau is 6'2" and 18 stone. They are much more robust builds for carrying, which is why I think MF moving to hooker could be a good switch. I don't think he is big enough for an international No8.

by Anglobraveheart Sun 13 Sep 2020, 2:01 pm

Hey! I worked the quote function.
That's made my Sunday. Very Happy

by Guest Sun 13 Sep 2020, 4:55 pm

RDW wrote:Said it many times before - Skinner for me isn't an international back row. He's too lumbering and slow.

I also think he's probably 4th/5th choice lock just now for Scotland. He doesn't start for Exeter!

Lumbering and slow or powerful and effective? Given how Scotland have been dominated up front for the last decade Skinner looks like exactly the kind of player the Scotland team could do with at blindside.

by Guest Sun 13 Sep 2020, 4:57 pm

RDW wrote:https://www.ruck.co.uk/watch-finn-russell-sets-up-two-tries-with-magical-kicks/

Finn looks like he's had one too many pastries but he's still pulling the strings marvelously.

The opposition defence makes that look a lot more impressive than it is. Particularly for the second try. Weak one on one defence and then a scramble defence that is non existent on the left side of the pitch.

by **NeilyBroon** Sun 13 Sep 2020, 6:18 pm

Anglobraveheart wrote:
NeilyBroon wrote:
Anglobraveheart wrote:Evening all.
Just want to chuck this out there. How about Matt Fagerson to hooker?
Brown and McInally are coming to the end of their tenure, and may make it to the next World Cup. As part of the succession planning, Matt Fagerson could retrain as a hooker in the same way McInally did.
The way the game is, I can't see him being big enough for the duties expected of a modern day No 8.
The other thing that crossed my mind was whether Scott Cummings could move to No8?

Skinner is playing 8 for Exeter tomorrow and has experience in the back row. I'd rather see him than Cummings make the move, especially as cummings is currently our best SR.

Matt Fagerson is too big to be a hooker really, McInally and brown were short for most modern flankers (although 6ft is only really "short" by rugby standards, for instance Hamish Watson is 6ft and he looks short which is mad). The taller front rowers tend to struggle as their opposite number will have more leverage to collapse the scrum.

Besides, Matt Fagerson is only 24 and gets regular time in the back row for Glasgow and Scotland. It could be he just needs specialist coaching to help him use his bulk effectively, look at the impact du pleissus had on Fagerson Sr's development.
If this works, it's a first time success at the quote function!
Done a bit of research, MF is 22 and 6'1", which is only and inch taller than Fraser Brown, but 2 inches shorter than SMc. MF is about the same weight as SMc and a stone lighter than FB.
I think there's mileage in MF having a go at hooker. For comparison, Billy V is 6'2", but 20.5 stone. And Toby Faletau is 6'2" and 18 stone. They are much more robust builds for carrying, which is why I think MF moving to hooker could be a good switch. I don't think he is big enough for an international No8.

Only 22! Well that's surprising! I think even more reason to persist with him at 8 as he's a few years from his full potential if his brother is anything to go by.

Hooker we've got Ashman and Stewart, not to mention Kerr making up the youngsters. Add Turner to the mix and consider that McInally is only just 30 we've got the next couple of seasons covered at least. Plenty of time for those young guys to mature.

As for Skinner at 8 RDW, he's put some decent performances in for Scotland at 6 and is hardly lumbering, he can't be much slower than haining and offers as much physicality. Also, to put it into perspective with regard to his position in the pecking order of locks, Richie gray is probably joint 4th or 5th choice. Hardly a bad account of his abilities, just shows how insanely competitive second row is, and it is at Exeter too. That's all without considering up and comers like CHH and Craig for Scotland either!

Skinner has a good rugby brain, and when fully fit is one of our most dynamic forwards. None of us wrote off Richie gray even when he wasn't playing for almost two seasons, why is Skinner suddenly scrap heap material because he's on the bench for Exeter??

by **RDW** Sun 13 Sep 2020, 11:27 pm

I don’t think I ever said he should be resigned to the scrapheap! I’m sure he’ll be there or there abouts with selection, particularly given he can cover back row. I just don’t think he’s an international 6/8. The trend in the backrow selection just now is more towards athleticism, dynamism and breakdown ability, especially with the way the breakdown is being refereed now. It says it all that England of all teams pick two opensides just now.

Lock-wise for me the front line is J Gray, Cummings and Gilchrist which gives a good balance in the squad regardless of who starts and who benches. Toolis and Skinner there or there abouts with R Gray an unknown quantity just now. We’ve then got the next generation coming through who are probably unlikely to break into that in the next couple of years.

by **BigGee** Mon 14 Sep 2020, 8:38 am

I watched the Sarries v Exeter game on Sunday.

Albeit it was largely 2 B sides playing, Hunter-Hill had a good game and seems to have moved up a level since I last saw him play. He may play himself into the frame as well over the next few seasons if he keeps it up.

by Hazel Sapling Mon 14 Sep 2020, 10:15 am

Skinner is behind J Gray (big ticket transfer) and Hill (noises being made for him to become fourth choice for England) at Exeter. I would love him to push out Hill but it appears Baxter views him as a partner for Dennis, who is a short squatter lock. I would not describe Skinner as lumbering but neither would I describe him as fast. He looked to me to have put on a little bit more size earlier this season, probably to give him the bulk to deal with international second row.

Gilchrist - J Gray in combination do not fit together as we saw in RWC 2019. Should be more powerful in the scrum but the dynamism is not there. When the game opens up late, Skinner, Toolis or R Gray makes more sense as the bench option. Gilchrist has looked decent at times this season and should be considered the next man up if J Gray is out.

by Hazel Sapling Mon 14 Sep 2020, 10:19 am

We have some hookers coming through and not many no. 8s. Forgot that M Fagerson is 22 as well and is several years away from his physical prime.

I do think he will need a proper, old type BS who can carry like a Crosbie, Bradbury or Graham to help get the hard yards and allow him to target the gaps that appear when the ball is recycled fast. There is a risk of having to play a certain back-row paring to make it work at international level for him

by Tramptastic Mon 14 Sep 2020, 10:36 am

Yeh it's all about your pack balance. If you are solely dependent on MF for getting across the gainline then you've failed before you've started. If you picked a back row of Bradbury, Watson and MF with the Gray + Gray/Skinner/Cummings at lock and a front row of Suz/McInally/Fagerson then you have a really dynamic pack, carrying options everywhere, all capable of getting across the gainline in the hard yards. This allows the likes of MF to really link with the backs and exploit the space created.

Lets be clear MF is not a vunipola but not all 8s should be modelled on vunipola. Read certainly wasn't a vunipola, neither was pockock, Harinordoquy, Parisse or even Faletau (people focus on his size but it's his footwork and his hands that make him a truely special player).

If you pick the pack right then MF can flourish. I wouldn't pick him in the same back row where we have two 7s playing but i would pick him in a backrow with a bruiser and a poacher.

by **NeilyBroon** Mon 14 Sep 2020, 10:54 am

Hazel Sapling wrote:We have some hookers coming through and not many no. 8s. Forgot that M Fagerson is 22 as well and is several years away from his physical prime.

I do think he will need a proper, old type BS who can carry like a Crosbie, Bradbury or Graham to help get the hard yards and allow him to target the gaps that appear when the ball is recycled fast. There is a risk of having to play a certain back-row paring to make it work at international level for him

That's a good point. I'd like to see more of crosbie tbh, maybe that'll happen when Watson retires and Ritchie shifts over to openside. It's hard having exceptional 7s who really add to the squad! It'll be interesting to see how dalziel approaches it as a former flanker, I can't imagine he'll change much. To be honest I'd quite like to see Watson do a half and Ritchie do a half and have some bruisers on the pitch. The best combo with Ritchie and Watson is haining imo. Future-wise he's not the best option as probably only has a couple of seasons of pro rugby left but has been better than Maggie for sure.

by Highland Shaun Wed 16 Sep 2020, 1:05 am

I asked a very interesting question on a Scotland Rugby fans Facebook group which I think would also get good responses on here :-).

Who do you think GT will announce in his squad for October/November time, that hasn't been capped yet?

So far I have had: Van der Merwe, van der Walt (the poster said he's eligible in November), Oli Kebble, Callum Hunter-Hill, Scott Steele, Nathan Chamberlain, Jack Stanley and Jamie Dobie :-O.

I'm not sure how many new caps will be announced but I'm fairly certain it won't be too many.

by **RDW** Wed 16 Sep 2020, 6:02 am

Highland Shaun wrote:I asked a very interesting question on a Scotland Rugby fans Facebook group which I think would also get good responses on here :-).

Who do you think GT will announce in his squad for October/November time, that hasn't been capped yet?

So far I have had: Van der Merwe, van der Walt (the poster said he's eligible in November), Oli Kebble, Callum Hunter-Hill, Scott Steele, Nathan Chamberlain, Jack Stanley and Jamie Dobie :-O.

I'm not sure how many new caps will be announced but I'm fairly certain it won't be too many.

Knowing that Facebook page as I do that was probably a risky move!

The trend seems to be for large training squads this year due to the bio-bubble rules etc. so I expect there to be some new names in there. Of that list I don't think Steele, Chamberlain and Stanley will be involved, unless invited to train for the experience.

A bit of a brain dump of a potential 44 man squad (I'm sure someone will point of I've forgotten someone obvious):

LH - Sutherland, Kebble, Dell, Bhattie
H- McInally, Brown, Turner
TH - Nel, Fagerson, Berghan, Rae
L - J Gray, R Gray, Gilchrist, Cummings, Toolis, Skinner
6/8 - Ritchie, Bradbury, Haining, Thomson (if he's fit), Wilson (for some reason)
7 - Watson, Crosbie, Gordon

9 - Price, Horne, SHC, Dobbie
10 - Russell, Hastings, VDW
C - Johnson, Jones, Harris, Scott, Hutchinson, Bennett
W - VDM, Graham, Maitland, McGuigan
FB - Hogg, Kinghorn

Looking back at that list there's not so many new people, but returning players or those that have been on the periphery for a while.

by **NeilyBroon** Wed 16 Sep 2020, 6:23 am

RDW wrote:
Highland Shaun wrote:I asked a very interesting question on a Scotland Rugby fans Facebook group which I think would also get good responses on here :-).

Who do you think GT will announce in his squad for October/November time, that hasn't been capped yet?

So far I have had: Van der Merwe, van der Walt (the poster said he's eligible in November), Oli Kebble, Callum Hunter-Hill, Scott Steele, Nathan Chamberlain, Jack Stanley and Jamie Dobie :-O.

I'm not sure how many new caps will be announced but I'm fairly certain it won't be too many.

Knowing that Facebook page as I do that was probably a risky move!

The trend seems to be for large training squads this year due to the bio-bubble rules etc. so I expect there to be some new names in there. Of that list I don't think Steele, Chamberlain and Stanley will be involved, unless invited to train for the experience.

A bit of a brain dump of a potential 44 man squad (I'm sure someone will point of I've forgotten someone obvious):

LH - Sutherland, Kebble, Dell, Bhattie
H- McInally, Brown, Turner
TH - Nel, Fagerson, Berghan, Rae
L - J Gray, R Gray, Gilchrist, Cummings, Toolis, Skinner
6/8 - Ritchie, Bradbury, Haining, Thomson (if he's fit), Wilson (for some reason)
7 - Watson, Crosbie, Gordon

9 - Price, Horne, SHC, Dobbie
10 - Russell, Hastings, VDW
C - Johnson, Jones, Harris, Scott, Hutchinson, Bennett
W - VDM, Graham, Maitland, McGuigan
FB - Hogg, Kinghorn

Looking back at that list there's not so many new people, but returning players or those that have been on the periphery for a while.

Can't disagree with that squad (Wilson aside!). There is of course the wildcard that our scouts could have been talking to someone in the premiership like dingwall or redpath and convinced them to swap England for Scotland again. Lang will also probably be in there.

by **NeilyBroon** Wed 16 Sep 2020, 6:26 am

Oh and Finlay Christie of course. Who will obviously give up a chance at the ABs for the mighty Scotland.

by bsando Wed 16 Sep 2020, 7:26 am

I am willing to bet my life savings that Townsend has spoken to him after his run of form for the Blues. Wether Christie decides to pop over though will be interesting. To be honest I think he has shown enough to be capable of getting an AB's cap. The AB's youtube channel have a video of him titled "Next Generation: Finlay Christie" which was posted on August 6th this year. So I'm beginning to think he may well stay put and push on at Blues. It seems like a fantastic club to be a part of at the moment so he may well feel he should stick around, unless he does have a burning desire to play in Scotland in which case we'll hopefully see him named in the Autumn squad. A lot of speculation at the moment.

by **NeilyBroon** Wed 16 Sep 2020, 7:46 am

bsando wrote:I am willing to bet my life savings that Townsend has spoken to him after his run of form for the Blues. Wether Christie decides to pop over though will be interesting. To be honest I think he has shown enough to be capable of getting an AB's cap. The AB's youtube channel have a video of him titled "Next Generation: Finlay Christie" which was posted on August 6th this year. So I'm beginning to think he may well stay put and push on at Blues. It seems like a fantastic club to be a part of at the moment so he may well feel he should stick around, unless he does have a burning desire to play in Scotland in which case we'll hopefully see him named in the Autumn squad. A lot of speculation at the moment.

,

Yeah hard to see him give up that kind of opportunity. I guess it depends how expat he is. It's like my parents harping on about halcyon days of square sausage, scottish rolls and all things Scottish. Ask them if they want to move back it's a straight no.

I'd like to think if I was a pro rugby player and got the opportunity I'd 100% play for Scotland but if England came knocking and I was in a position to compete for a starting spot I'd be seriously considering it... It'd be the opportunity to win a world cup vs the opportunity to possibly win a 6 nations title once then not again for another 30 years.

by **RDW** Wed 16 Sep 2020, 7:47 am

The main unknowns for me just now are the returning players like Scott, SHC, Bennett etc and whether Toonie has given up on them and will look at other options. I think they all still have a lot to add as rugby players, albeit all 3 are unlikely to be anywhere near the first choice 23.

All 3 of them would also benefit from a good run in their respective club teams.

by **RDW** Wed 16 Sep 2020, 7:56 am

Should probably add R Gray to that list too.

If he's fit he'll surely be in the squad, if only to have a look at him and see if he can still cut it at the top level. If not then CHH, Alex Craig or the likes of Davidson or Carmichael (who has barely played in the last 2 years) may be brought in instead as ones for the future.

by bsando Wed 16 Sep 2020, 8:04 am

I'm sure I heard from Toonie that he is looking with an eye to the future rather than the past. So I doubt we'll see Wilson or P Horne involved again barring injury but that might include others. It's probably the right idea if you want to have a good world cup in 2023. Getting players like Dobbie, DVDM, VDW, Kebble capped and sitting on 30 - 50+ caps by 2023 would be pretty handy. Scotland don't really need to hit the reset button like Australia have done but now is the time for any dramatic changes.

by **NeilyBroon** Wed 16 Sep 2020, 8:07 am

RDW wrote:The main unknowns for me just now are the returning players like Scott, SHC, Bennett etc and whether Toonie has given up on them and will look at other options. I think they all still have a lot to add as rugby players, albeit all 3 are unlikely to be anywhere near the first choice 23.

All 3 of them would also benefit from a good run in their respective club teams.

Bennett is less of an uncertainty for me, he's looked good for Edinburgh and is probably 3rd/2nd choice at OC atm, he's also still only 27 so has a couple of seasons left in him at least and could realistically feature in 2023. By getting gametime at FB for Glasgow, Jones has probably cemented a bench spot as the utility back unfortunately. I expect we won't see him starting at 13 for the foreseeable future barring an injury to Harris. That being said I have much less of a problem with Harris starting than I did before, he's maturing into a very dependable player at International level and whilst not as exciting as Jones he's still a decent pair of hands. From a distribution perspective I think Jones is better but he needs a chance to nail the starting spot that he probably won't get.

Scott I think will make it, he's got good international experience and was having a great season up until covid. Not to mention we've only got Hutchinson or Lang as a back up 12, Hutchinson is small and untested at 12 for Scotland and Lang is relatively inexperienced at international level still. Scott is a good physical 12 with great handling skills. He'll definitely come into the picture at some point, unless Toonie feels he's been usurped by Taylor, who has been a bit underwhelming for his last couple of appearances. Christine may come into the picture too but he's also a bit small.

by Highland Shaun Thu 17 Sep 2020, 1:32 pm

Any idea on when the squad is named Smile

?

by Hazel Sapling Thu 17 Sep 2020, 1:48 pm

Highland Shaun wrote:Any idea on when the squad is named ?

When does the Pro14 2020/2021 season start?

by Highland Shaun Fri 18 Sep 2020, 2:23 am

RDW wrote:
Highland Shaun wrote:I asked a very interesting question on a Scotland Rugby fans Facebook group which I think would also get good responses on here :-).

Who do you think GT will announce in his squad for October/November time, that hasn't been capped yet?

So far I have had: Van der Merwe, van der Walt (the poster said he's eligible in November), Oli Kebble, Callum Hunter-Hill, Scott Steele, Nathan Chamberlain, Jack Stanley and Jamie Dobie :-O.

I'm not sure how many new caps will be announced but I'm fairly certain it won't be too many.

Knowing that Facebook page as I do that was probably a risky move!

The trend seems to be for large training squads this year due to the bio-bubble rules etc. so I expect there to be some new names in there. Of that list I don't think Steele, Chamberlain and Stanley will be involved, unless invited to train for the experience.

A bit of a brain dump of a potential 44 man squad (I'm sure someone will point of I've forgotten someone obvious):

LH - Sutherland, Kebble, Dell, Bhattie
H- McInally, Brown, Turner
TH - Nel, Fagerson, Berghan, Rae
L - J Gray, R Gray, Gilchrist, Cummings, Toolis, Skinner
6/8 - Ritchie, Bradbury, Haining, Thomson (if he's fit), Wilson (for some reason)
7 - Watson, Crosbie, Gordon

9 - Price, Horne, SHC, Dobbie
10 - Russell, Hastings, VDW
C - Johnson, Jones, Harris, Scott, Hutchinson, Bennett
W - VDM, Graham, Maitland, McGuigan
FB - Hogg, Kinghorn

Looking back at that list there's not so many new people, but returning players or those that have been on the periphery for a while.

No Kyle Steyn on that squad you think it'll be :O, or is he not playing for his club regularly to warrant another call up.

Also, how good is Callum Hunter-Hill, would he be a useful addition to Scotland Smile

?

by **RDW** Fri 18 Sep 2020, 4:15 am

Steyn hasn't featured recently - I wonder if he's injured. I also don't think he's been able to follow up his form of last season - not helped by injury and disruption to this season. He may be involved though, particularly as we don't have massive wing depth. He's still young too with his best heard ahead of him.

CHH is a weird one - he was let go by Cockers but is now a
close to being a first team regular in one of the best packs in the UK. It will be interesting to see how he develops - he's definitely a success story in terms of the recent cast offs from the Scottish pro game. We've got good lock depth so he will likely have to bide his time.

by Tramptastic Fri 18 Sep 2020, 8:47 am

With regards to CHH we know that he was loaned out to sarries to aquire game time but chose to stay/was enticed by a decent offer.

Was he let go because sarries outbid cockerill for his services or was he guaranteed game time which he wouldnt necessarily get at edinburgh?

He was rated highly before he left and he starts most games for sarries now so i'd say he's worth a gander for scotland

by bsando Fri 18 Sep 2020, 9:00 am

In the Scottish rugby podcast this week Hoggy mentioned that Toonie will be using a larger squad and rotating everyone to deal with the condensed fixtures. Hogg is also probably going to be absent for the Georgia game so he won't be captaining initially at least. I wonder who will be captain for that one? Brown or McInally would probably be the obvious choice but Price or even Ritchie could be possibilities.

by Hazel Sapling Fri 18 Sep 2020, 9:17 am

bsando wrote:In the Scottish rugby podcast this week Hoggy mentioned that Toonie will be using a larger squad and rotating everyone to deal with the condensed fixtures. Hogg is also probably going to be absent for the Georgia game so he won't be captaining initially at least. I wonder who will be captain for that one? Brown or McInally would probably be the obvious choice but Price or even Ritchie could be possibilities.

If Gilchrist starts (he shouldn't if it is the first team) then he may be in with a shout. Otherwise it would not be a bad one to blood Ritchie as captain.

by jimbopip Fri 18 Sep 2020, 11:14 am

RDW wrote:
Highland Shaun wrote:I asked a very interesting question on a Scotland Rugby fans Facebook group which I think would also get good responses on here :-).

Who do you think GT will announce in his squad for October/November time, that hasn't been capped yet?

So far I have had: Van der Merwe, van der Walt (the poster said he's eligible in November), Oli Kebble, Callum Hunter-Hill, Scott Steele, Nathan Chamberlain, Jack Stanley and Jamie Dobie :-O.

I'm not sure how many new caps will be announced but I'm fairly certain it won't be too many.

Knowing that Facebook page as I do that was probably a risky move!

The trend seems to be for large training squads this year due to the bio-bubble rules etc. so I expect there to be some new names in there. Of that list I don't think Steele, Chamberlain and Stanley will be involved, unless invited to train for the experience.

A bit of a brain dump of a potential 44 man squad (I'm sure someone will point of I've forgotten someone obvious):

LH - Sutherland, Kebble, Dell, Bhattie probably spot on here, Flounder, Bhatti looks very much the fourth choice, maybe should have stayed at Scotstoun
H- McInally, Brown, Turner possibly add Grant Stewart if it's an extended squad
TH - Nel, Fagerson, Berghan, RaeThe Fugitive looks more of a fourth choice than Bhatti
L - J Gray, R Gray, Gilchrist, Cummings, Toolis, Skinner MrsPip has a sofa blanket that spends less time draped over bodies than GG at a ruck: way behind in fifth place
6/8 - Ritchie, Bradbury, Haining, Thomson (if he's fit), Wilson (for some reason) I believe Batman has retired from winning us the Calcutta Cup in the tunnel before the match. Someone else will have to terrorise English 10's from now on. Possibly a place for Callista Flockhart?
7 - Watson, Crosbie, Gordon If Hamish is injured/rested that is a bit of a drop off.

9 - Price, Horne, SHC, Dobbie Considering he had no pace and made 3 sniping runs per decade it is a tribute to his game management (and competitiveness) that Frodo was our best 9 for so long.
10 - Russell, Hastings, VDW Furra Linee will be watching the game on the Batbox in the Batcave with his ADHD mate.
C - Johnson, Jones, Harris, Scott, Hutchinson, Bennett Seaman should be there, I'm certain he was injured just before the 1872 matches, and the Good Lord Stafford Of McDowall. Bennett looked fit but until someone passes him the ball we can't tell.
W - VDM, Graham, Maitland, McGuigan Tagive should get some game time. Toonie, and DR and DW all see something there so it's finally time for him to put in a couple of performances.
FB - Hogg, Kinghorn Will Blarehorn play at 15? Or Not A Pony, or Seaman? KB has all the pace but has resolutely refused to learn when to involve other players in attack.

Looking back at that list there's not so many new people, but returning players or those that have been on the periphery for a while.

by **BigGee** Fri 18 Sep 2020, 11:23 am

RDW wrote:Steyn hasn't featured recently - I wonder if he's injured. I also don't think he's been able to follow up his form of last season - not helped by injury and disruption to this season. He may be involved though, particularly as we don't have massive wing depth. He's still young too with his best heard ahead of him.

Steyn has done a hammy and that is why he did not play in the derby games. Hopefully will be back for the beginning of the season.

by **BigGee** Fri 18 Sep 2020, 11:30 am

It won't be a Toonie squad unless there is at least one curve ball that will catch us out.

I will hold out for Christie coming over for this series, there are enough games to make it worth his while. We definitely need another SH in the squad. Dobie is not ready yet and I am not entirely convinced about SHC or Steele.

How about Ashman as the 4th hooker, he has been getting some game time with Sale and is definitely one for the future, which Grant Stewart is unlikely to be.

Maybe he has persuaded one of the dual qualified young centres to come over to us as well.

A big squad gives him the chance to try a few players out.

by jimbopip Fri 18 Sep 2020, 11:36 am

BigGee wrote:It won't be a Toonie squad unless there is at least one curve ball that will catch us out. As per usual, totally in agreement with our Laddie With The Lamp

I will hold out for Christie coming over for this series, there are enough games to make it worth his while. We definitely need another SH in the squad. Dobie is not ready yet and I am not entirely convinced about SHC or Steele. Would he not have to be quarantined for a couple of weeks, and then on his return to Kiwi A-go-go-land ?

How about Ashman as the 4th hooker, he has been getting some game time with Sale and is definitely one for the future, which Grant Stewart is unlikely to be.As usual, we disagree. I think Stewart has massive potential, wether he'll get enough gametime behind Chuckles and Fitter& in order to fully develop, or he becomes another Alex Allan is the big question.

Maybe he has persuaded one of the dual qualified young centres to come over to us as well.

A big squad gives him the chance to try a few players out. When did Mr Tombola ever need a chance to try things out?

by **RDW** Fri 18 Sep 2020, 12:47 pm

Tramptastic wrote:With regards to CHH we know that he was loaned out to sarries to aquire game time but chose to stay/was enticed by a decent offer.

Was he let go because sarries outbid cockerill for his services or was he guaranteed game time which he wouldnt necessarily get at edinburgh?

He was rated highly before he left and he starts most games for sarries now so i'd say he's worth a gander for scotland

Well Swinson is starting ahead of him this weekend so he can't be that good! Laugh

by Tramptastic Fri 18 Sep 2020, 2:03 pm

Goddamit, imagine being undermined by facts Laugh

by Hazel Sapling Fri 18 Sep 2020, 2:49 pm

That Sarries pack is stuffed with top class international players

George, Koch, Itoje, the Vunipola brothers, Swinson....

To be fair Hunter-Hill has played frequently for them in the other bigger games, May view him more of an impact coming on than Swinson

It is something to behold that Exeter and Saracens, the leading English sides, both now have four Scots in or around the matchday 23 in all their big games. Almost don't want to see Sarries relegated for that reason alone!

by funnyExiledScot Fri 18 Sep 2020, 10:02 pm

Wasn't there a time when Swinson claimed to be 18st?

Seriously though, in lieu of having a 3rd pro side (that old chestnut), it's fantastic seeing Scots thriving in top quality set-ups. As noted above, Hogg in particular seems to be benefiting hugely, and I doubt it's doing Russell any harm either. We don't have many world class players, so we need to maximise their abilities.

by Highland Shaun Fri 18 Sep 2020, 11:20 pm

jimbopip wrote:
RDW wrote:
Highland Shaun wrote:I asked a very interesting question on a Scotland Rugby fans Facebook group which I think would also get good responses on here :-).

Who do you think GT will announce in his squad for October/November time, that hasn't been capped yet?

So far I have had: Van der Merwe, van der Walt (the poster said he's eligible in November), Oli Kebble, Callum Hunter-Hill, Scott Steele, Nathan Chamberlain, Jack Stanley and Jamie Dobie :-O.

I'm not sure how many new caps will be announced but I'm fairly certain it won't be too many.

Knowing that Facebook page as I do that was probably a risky move!

The trend seems to be for large training squads this year due to the bio-bubble rules etc. so I expect there to be some new names in there. Of that list I don't think Steele, Chamberlain and Stanley will be involved, unless invited to train for the experience.

A bit of a brain dump of a potential 44 man squad (I'm sure someone will point of I've forgotten someone obvious):

LH - Sutherland, Kebble, Dell, Bhattie probably spot on here, Flounder, Bhatti looks very much the fourth choice, maybe should have stayed at Scotstoun
H- McInally, Brown, Turner possibly add Grant Stewart if it's an extended squad
TH - Nel, Fagerson, Berghan, RaeThe Fugitive looks more of a fourth choice than Bhatti
L - J Gray, R Gray, Gilchrist, Cummings, Toolis, Skinner MrsPip has a sofa blanket that spends less time draped over bodies than GG at a ruck: way behind in fifth place
6/8 - Ritchie, Bradbury, Haining, Thomson (if he's fit), Wilson (for some reason) I believe Batman has retired from winning us the Calcutta Cup in the tunnel before the match. Someone else will have to terrorise English 10's from now on. Possibly a place for Callista Flockhart?
7 - Watson, Crosbie, Gordon If Hamish is injured/rested that is a bit of a drop off.

9 - Price, Horne, SHC, Dobbie Considering he had no pace and made 3 sniping runs per decade it is a tribute to his game management (and competitiveness) that Frodo was our best 9 for so long.
10 - Russell, Hastings, VDW Furra Linee will be watching the game on the Batbox in the Batcave with his ADHD mate.
C - Johnson, Jones, Harris, Scott, Hutchinson, Bennett Seaman should be there, I'm certain he was injured just before the 1872 matches, and the Good Lord Stafford Of McDowall. Bennett looked fit but until someone passes him the ball we can't tell.
W - VDM, Graham, Maitland, McGuigan Tagive should get some game time. Toonie, and DR and DW all see something there so it's finally time for him to put in a couple of performances.
FB - Hogg, Kinghorn Will Blarehorn play at 15? Or Not A Pony, or Seaman? KB has all the pace but has resolutely refused to learn when to involve other players in attack.

Looking back at that list there's not so many new people, but returning players or those that have been on the periphery for a while.

Not sure I understand some of your nicknames for players lol so help me out and who is Seaman :O?

by **RDW** Sat 19 Sep 2020, 2:45 am

Kyle Steyn.

(Seaman Steyn)

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