Pro 16 needs to pull the plug on Premier Sports

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If the Pro 16 wants to compete with the likes of the other top leagues in Europe and further abroad, they need to part ways with Premier Sports. The current Premier Sports contract with the Pro 14 finishes at the end of this season it still remains to be seen if this will be renewed or another broadcaster will takeover the rights.

Many fans have voiced their dislike of the online platform which after several seasons appears to be stable via Sky or Virgin sports packages but less so as an outright online viewing package. Coupled with annoying multiple login requirements to swap from devices and random lost connection error codes before, during and even when trying to watch on demand matches, it would be a real shame to see the new Pro 16 format begin in this manner.

Do you feel the upcoming Pro 16 competition would be a good addition to BT Sports or Sky Sports or even one of the streaming platforms like Amazon Prime?

Would it be better for a return to the domestic networks in a similar format as before?

Could CVC play a part in this decision with their recent investment in the Pro 14 league and 6N?

Brendan wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Why celebrate it being on the BBC if its rubbish anyway?

I havent said it's rubbish.

I have said it isn't very good, but thats because of the hash they have made with the organisation the past two seasons. The league has massive potential. Putting behind a paywall before it was really established on a totally obscure channel that nobody was familiar with put a hold on the potential.

It was just starting to get a foothold in Wales before they made the stupid idea to put it on a channel that nobody had ever heard of. Now that it is back on the BBC perhaps it will raise it's profile in Wales.

I thought the league had been dying in Wales and Premiers Sports was going to be the death nail.

I didn't realize it was starting to become more popular in Wales in 2016

It is dying, there is not enough people watching it, because it's on some obscure PPV channel that nobody will pay for, or know about. When it was on the BBC it was getting more popular, that is why I am celebrating now it is going back onto the BBC.

I do not know what problem you have with me celebrating this ?

No 7&1/2 wrote:It was actually more a point to Phil initially than yourself but the point still stands I think. More people getting the chance to see a product that 'isn't very good in your opinion or seemingly worse in Phils has the very real chance of putting a nail in the coffin.

Ps people don't have to agree with you or get in trouble for pointing out a real potential for a downside.

Mate, the coffin is already six foot under.

If you want to make a point to somebody, try using the quote button. It'll save confusion.

So no celebration from you then Phil.

None

QUOTE

Does this mean the value of the TV deal is dropping.

Quoth the raven 'Nevermore'.

Bristol and Sale should really be working on pulling the Welsh fans to support them. Potential money there.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Quoth the raven 'Nevermore'.

Bristol and Sale should really be working on pulling the Welsh fans to support them. Potential money there.

There would seem to be a few looking at Bristol, Bath and Glaws, judging by what I have seen on Twitter.

I'll be honest, I will probably look at going to all three next season. All very easy on the train.

Not sure on what to make on the tv news yet. Kind of puts me in a quandary, as to whether it's worth getting a Premier subscription now. If there was a good deal early doors, I guess I would have to commit (like their £59 one). Otherwise, I will gamble on FTA games and then use "other sources" for Premier games. This multi broadcaster deal does nothing for the look of the league, that already gets heavily criticised.

PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Just watch the Prem Risca. By the sounds of some of the grumbles its the perfect solution. Bristol at the moment looks worth the trip for me and I live in South Yorkshire!

I'll obviously get a Dragons ST, but it'll be good to get about too.

I went to Ashton Gate for a Bristol Utd v UK Armed Forces game and it looks a great set up.

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

Joke 'competition' in every sense of the word.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

Or look at the Gallagher Premiership deal, which is for the same cash. Or look at the Top14 deal, which is a 17% increase.

And remember the piffling sum that Premier Sports pay to begin with.

This 'competition' gets the TV contract it deserves.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

No.

Its because they massively overstated the probable subscribers by going on what the BBC were getting. A lot of people who watched the Pro14 on BBC Wales were casual fans, who were never going to subscribe to a PPV channel, especially one that they had never heard of, and knew nothing about.

Now the potential to get these fans watching again is back, and it can only be good for the league.

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

Or look at the Gallagher Premiership deal, which is for the same cash. Or look at the Top14 deal, which is a 17% increase.

And remember the piffling sum that Premier Sports pay to begin with.

This 'competition' gets the TV contract it deserves.

But their fans actually watch their leagues unlike some here who do nothing but moan then expect the league to go out and somehow match what other leagues are doing.

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

No.

Its because they massively overstated the probable subscribers by going on what the BBC were getting. A lot of people who watched the Pro14 on BBC Wales were casual fans, who were never going to subscribe to a PPV channel, especially one that they had never heard of, and knew nothing about.

Now the potential to get these fans watching again is back, and it can only be good for the league.

No.

Tv deals are reaching saturation point across the globe hence why football owners are coming up with European super league ideas. PS and eir's tv deal was an astounding deal given the size of the league.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
But their fans actually watch their leagues unlike some here who do nothing but moan then expect the league to go out and somehow match what other leagues are doing.

Not sure who you are referring to there, sorry. Nobody I know expects the PrO'Shambles to generate anything other than another shambolic broadcast contract because, as you know, the product is garbage.

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

No.

Its because they massively overstated the probable subscribers by going on what the BBC were getting. A lot of people who watched the Pro14 on BBC Wales were casual fans, who were never going to subscribe to a PPV channel, especially one that they had never heard of, and knew nothing about.

Now the potential to get these fans watching again is back, and it can only be good for the league.

What benefit to the league is there for a fan sitting at home, watching the product without financially contributing to it?

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
No.

Tv deals are reaching saturation point across the globe hence why football owners are coming up with European super league ideas. PS and eir's tv deal was an astounding deal given the size of the league.

The actions of CVC and Silver Lake are in direct contrast to your claim.

Why do you think they disagree with you?

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

No.

Its because they massively overstated the probable subscribers by going on what the BBC were getting. A lot of people who watched the Pro14 on BBC Wales were casual fans, who were never going to subscribe to a PPV channel, especially one that they had never heard of, and knew nothing about.

Now the potential to get these fans watching again is back, and it can only be good for the league.

No.

Tv deals are reaching saturation point across the globe hence why football owners are coming up with European super league ideas. PS and eir's tv deal was an astounding deal given the size of the league.

PS still would not have payed the same amount.

I read somewhere on the internet they only had about a third of the subscribers they thought they were going to get. It was a failure from the start to put the Pro14 on PS. And y ddraig goch ( The red Dragon) could not have put it better earlier on in this thread.

Only the hard core regional supporters in Wales were ever going to pay for this amateur channel that nobody had ever heard of.

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
But their fans actually watch their leagues unlike some here who do nothing but moan then expect the league to go out and somehow match what other leagues are doing.

Not sure who you are referring to there, sorry. Nobody I know expects the PrO'Shambles to generate anything other than another shambolic broadcast contract because, as you know, the product is garbage.

Nonsense before the last tv deal there were plenty on here giving out about the size of the tv deal which was mostly free to air based. The league went out and got a huge increase in it's tv deal and then they complained that it wasn't on free to air. You can't have it both ways when you have a league this size.

PhilBB wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

No.

Its because they massively overstated the probable subscribers by going on what the BBC were getting. A lot of people who watched the Pro14 on BBC Wales were casual fans, who were never going to subscribe to a PPV channel, especially one that they had never heard of, and knew nothing about.

Now the potential to get these fans watching again is back, and it can only be good for the league.

What benefit to the league is there for a fan sitting at home, watching the product without financially contributing to it?

You never know, one day he might like what he is seeing, and might think he will buy a ticket.

On the other hand, potential sponsors might see the viewing figures and stump up more money, and these casual fans might even go and watch judgement day, the numbers have being going down since the Pro14 was put on this obscure channel.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
But their fans actually watch their leagues unlike some here who do nothing but moan then expect the league to go out and somehow match what other leagues are doing.

Not sure who you are referring to there, sorry. Nobody I know expects the PrO'Shambles to generate anything other than another shambolic broadcast contract because, as you know, the product is garbage.

Nonsense before the last tv deal there were plenty on here giving out about the size of the tv deal which was mostly free to air based. The league went out and got a huge increase in it's tv deal and then they complained that it wasn't on free to air. You can't have it both ways when you have a league this size.

The TV deal was very short termism.

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:PS was never going to offer what they did the first time around.

Of course not most leagues are getting reduced TV deals. Just look at super league in England where their sky sports deal has almost halved.

No.

Its because they massively overstated the probable subscribers by going on what the BBC were getting. A lot of people who watched the Pro14 on BBC Wales were casual fans, who were never going to subscribe to a PPV channel, especially one that they had never heard of, and knew nothing about.

Now the potential to get these fans watching again is back, and it can only be good for the league.

No.

Tv deals are reaching saturation point across the globe hence why football owners are coming up with European super league ideas. PS and eir's tv deal was an astounding deal given the size of the league.

PS still would not have payed the same amount.

I read somewhere on the internet they only had about a third of the subscribers they thought they were going to get. It was a failure from the start to put the Pro14 on PS. And y ddraig goch ( The red Dragon) could not have put it better earlier on in this thread.

Only the hard core regional supporters in Wales were ever going to pay for this amateur channel that nobody had ever heard of.

None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
But their fans actually watch their leagues unlike some here who do nothing but moan then expect the league to go out and somehow match what other leagues are doing.

Not sure who you are referring to there, sorry. Nobody I know expects the PrO'Shambles to generate anything other than another shambolic broadcast contract because, as you know, the product is garbage.

Nonsense before the last tv deal there were plenty on here giving out about the size of the tv deal which was mostly free to air based. The league went out and got a huge increase in it's tv deal and then they complained that it wasn't on free to air. You can't have it both ways when you have a league this size.

Sorry, you seem to have lost all sense of relativity.

A "huge increase" from a base of naff all just proves that the previous rights weren't sold properly.

I don't know who the 'plenty on here' you're referring to or why you think they are representative, sorry.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

In your opinion.

Looking at what we have lost since it was on Premier Sports, I would have to disagree. Especially when we see where we are now.

LordDowlais wrote:

You never know, one day he might like what he is seeing, and might think he will buy a ticket.

On the other hand, potential sponsors might see the viewing figures and stump up more money, and these casual fans might even go and watch judgement day, the numbers have being going down since the Pro14 was put on this obscure channel.

So you give up guaranteed income in the hope of some potential income. Ok. Sounds an odd business model, doesn't it?

Premier Sports took over in 2018, so here are the effects of PS on the crowds in Wales:

Cardiff:
17/18 = 7,409 (https://www.cardiffrfcfans.com/fix.php?clubID=1&seasonID=23)
18/19 = 9,207 (https://www.cardiffrfcfans.com/fix.php?clubID=1&seasonID=24)

Dragons:
17/18 = 6,360 (https://www.cardiffrfcfans.com/fix.php?clubID=20&seasonID=23)
18/19 = 6,590 (https://www.cardiffrfcfans.com/fix.php?clubID=20&seasonID=24)

Ospreys = 17/18 6,580 and 18/19 6,649
Turks = 17/18 8,848 and 18/19 8,318



So your claim of "the numbers have being going down since the Pro14 was put on this obscure channel" is factually untrue overall and only applicable at the Scarlets, whose small drop in attendances was because of a lack of European knock out rugby.

I mean, it's ok to have an opinion but the facts disprove you here. Sorry.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

To me, this reads like you think the Premier Sports deal was more 'than the league is worth'. Am I reading you correctly? And, if so, why do you think CVC disagrees with you?

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

In your opinion.

Looking at what we have lost since it was on Premier Sports, I would have to disagree. Especially when we see where we are now.

What "have we lost"? Please quantify it.

PhilBB wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

You never know, one day he might like what he is seeing, and might think he will buy a ticket.

On the other hand, potential sponsors might see the viewing figures and stump up more money, and these casual fans might even go and watch judgement day, the numbers have being going down since the Pro14 was put on this obscure channel.

So you give up guaranteed income in the hope of some potential income. Ok. Sounds an odd business model, doesn't it?

Premier Sports took over in 2018, so here are the effects of PS on the crowds in Wales:

Cardiff:
17/18 = 7,409 (https://www.cardiffrfcfans.com/fix.php?clubID=1&seasonID=23)
18/19 = 9,207 (https://www.cardiffrfcfans.com/fix.php?clubID=1&seasonID=24)

Dragons:
17/18 = 6,360 (https://www.cardiffrfcfans.com/fix.php?clubID=20&seasonID=23)
18/19 = 6,590 (https://www.cardiffrfcfans.com/fix.php?clubID=20&seasonID=24)

Ospreys = 17/18 6,580 and 18/19 6,649
Turks = 17/18 8,848 and 18/19 8,318



So your claim of "the numbers have being going down since the Pro14 was put on this obscure channel" is factually untrue overall and only applicable at the Scarlets, whose small drop in attendances was because of a lack of European knock out rugby.

I mean, it's ok to have an opinion but the facts disprove you here. Sorry.

You need to read what I have said more closely.

I have said Judgment day numbers have gone down since the Pro14 went to Premier Sports.

You do not always have to win the internet, you can have a decent debate about rugby without trying to win all the time.

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
But their fans actually watch their leagues unlike some here who do nothing but moan then expect the league to go out and somehow match what other leagues are doing.

Not sure who you are referring to there, sorry. Nobody I know expects the PrO'Shambles to generate anything other than another shambolic broadcast contract because, as you know, the product is garbage.

Nonsense before the last tv deal there were plenty on here giving out about the size of the tv deal which was mostly free to air based. The league went out and got a huge increase in it's tv deal and then they complained that it wasn't on free to air. You can't have it both ways when you have a league this size.

Sorry, you seem to have lost all sense of relativity.

A "huge increase" from a base of naff all just proves that the previous rights weren't sold properly.

I don't know who the 'plenty on here' you're referring to or why you think they are representative, sorry.

How were the previous rights not sold properly if the league is garbage in your opinion? This is comical.

PhilBB wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

In your opinion.

Looking at what we have lost since it was on Premier Sports, I would have to disagree. Especially when we see where we are now.

What "have we lost"? Please quantify it.

Exposure, public profile, awareness. I would wager if the league did not go to Premier Sports in the first place, it would be in a much better bargaining position now.

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

To me, this reads like you think the Premier Sports deal was more 'than the league is worth'. Am I reading you correctly? And, if so, why do you think CVC disagrees with you?

CVC are angling for a position in the international game where the real money is... This is incredibly obvious surely...

LordDowlais wrote:

You need to read what I have said more closely.

I have said Judgment day numbers have gone down since the Pro14 went to Premier Sports.

You do not always have to win the internet, you can have a decent debate about rugby without trying to win all the time.

It's not a question of reading more closely, it's a matter of dealing with your bad grammar.

There was a 10,000 drop off in Judgement Day attendance figures for the first year of the Premier Sports contract. From memory, that may have been because of the weekend falling in the Easter holidays but, of course, if you wish to attribute the drop off solely to Premier Sports broadcasting the competition then so be it.

However, it's worth remembering that one of the JD games was shown live on S4C....

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
How were the previous rights not sold properly if the league is garbage in your opinion? This is comical.

Because getting just €900k out of TG4 and £150k out of BBC Alba is clearly an indication of not doing things properly, wouldn't you say? Especially when Sky pumped in £5m and BBC Wales £4.5m, for reference.

And please do answer the points about CVC

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

To me, this reads like you think the Premier Sports deal was more 'than the league is worth'. Am I reading you correctly? And, if so, why do you think CVC disagrees with you?

CVC are angling for a position in the international game where the real money is... This is incredibly obvious surely...

So they bought into the PrO'14 to angle for a position in the international game, even though they've already agreed a deal with the 6N.

If that's incredibly obvious to you then happy days. But, as a contortion of thinking, it's most illogical.

But if the product your increasing the exposure to isn't very good surely that's just turning people away LD? If its simply that they will sit and watch it as its cheaper and its on what do they or will they add the league or specific teams as they're showing its about cheapness and ease rather than being interested in the product?

LordDowlais wrote:

PhilBB wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

In your opinion.

Looking at what we have lost since it was on Premier Sports, I would have to disagree. Especially when we see where we are now.

What "have we lost"? Please quantify it.

Exposure, public profile, awareness. I would wager if the league did not go to Premier Sports in the first place, it would be in a much better bargaining position now.

But crowds went up?

It's an interesting thought to claim that, by taking an even more inferior broadcast contract three seasons ago that would have meant even less money in the game (so the game being even weaker), somehow the bargaining position now would be greater despite the product being even weaker.

That's a bit illogical, no?

PhilBB wrote:It's not a question of reading more closely, it's a matter of dealing with your bad grammar.

Good grief Phil, you are hard work.

PhilBB wrote:There was a 10,000 drop off in Judgement Day attendance figures for the first year of the Premier Sports contract. From memory, that may have been because of the weekend falling in the Easter holidays but, of course, if you wish to attribute the drop off solely to Premier Sports broadcasting the competition then so be it.

However, it's worth remembering that one of the JD games was shown live on S4C....

It's a bit of a coincidence that it happened when the they took it off BBC Wales though, and it was down the following year as well. I reckon it was because people were just not that bothered anymore because they were not watching the regions week in week out.

I could be wrong, but I think it's a massive coincidence.

PhilBB wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

PhilBB wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:None of this counters the fact that the deal was over what the league is worth. It was a great deal financially end of.

In your opinion.

Looking at what we have lost since it was on Premier Sports, I would have to disagree. Especially when we see where we are now.

What "have we lost"? Please quantify it.

Exposure, public profile, awareness. I would wager if the league did not go to Premier Sports in the first place, it would be in a much better bargaining position now.

But crowds went up?

It's an interesting thought to claim that, by taking an even more inferior broadcast contract three seasons ago that would have meant even less money in the game (so the game being even weaker), somehow the bargaining position now would be greater despite the product being even weaker.

That's a bit illogical, no?

Well, no not really, as investors will look at the viewing figures, which by all accounts at the time PS took over, were three times as much as what PS are getting, and by now if the trend kept going upwards, then the TV rights might have been more attractive to better sponsors, and better broadcasters.

LordDowlais wrote:

PhilBB wrote:It's not a question of reading more closely, it's a matter of dealing with your bad grammar.

Good grief Phil, you are hard work.

PhilBB wrote:There was a 10,000 drop off in Judgement Day attendance figures for the first year of the Premier Sports contract. From memory, that may have been because of the weekend falling in the Easter holidays but, of course, if you wish to attribute the drop off solely to Premier Sports broadcasting the competition then so be it.

However, it's worth remembering that one of the JD games was shown live on S4C....

It's a bit of a coincidence that it happened when the they took it off BBC Wales though, and it was down the following year as well. I reckon it was because people were just not that bothered anymore because they were not watching the regions week in week out.

I could be wrong, but I think it's a massive coincidence.

We have discussed previously how there was a massive storm, with travel disruptions on the first JD after the Premier deal.

It was definitely down the following year, but you may want to use google to see why that was. There's a little thing called a pandemic.

LordDowlais wrote:

PhilBB wrote:It's not a question of reading more closely, it's a matter of dealing with your bad grammar.

Good grief Phil, you are hard work.

PhilBB wrote:There was a 10,000 drop off in Judgement Day attendance figures for the first year of the Premier Sports contract. From memory, that may have been because of the weekend falling in the Easter holidays but, of course, if you wish to attribute the drop off solely to Premier Sports broadcasting the competition then so be it.

However, it's worth remembering that one of the JD games was shown live on S4C....

It's a bit of a coincidence that it happened when the they took it off BBC Wales though, and it was down the following year as well. I reckon it was because people were just not that bothered anymore because they were not watching the regions week in week out.

I could be wrong, but I think it's a massive coincidence.

It wasn't down the following year. It was cancelled because of Covid.

S4C were still broadcasting, week in week out.

The positioning of your comma, in your first post about Judgement Day, put the explanation into a different clause. Never mind. If you want to hang your hat on JD being about Premier Sports, when you made up the stuff about "the following year" then so be it.

RiscaGame wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

PhilBB wrote:It's not a question of reading more closely, it's a matter of dealing with your bad grammar.

Good grief Phil, you are hard work.

PhilBB wrote:There was a 10,000 drop off in Judgement Day attendance figures for the first year of the Premier Sports contract. From memory, that may have been because of the weekend falling in the Easter holidays but, of course, if you wish to attribute the drop off solely to Premier Sports broadcasting the competition then so be it.

However, it's worth remembering that one of the JD games was shown live on S4C....

It's a bit of a coincidence that it happened when the they took it off BBC Wales though, and it was down the following year as well. I reckon it was because people were just not that bothered anymore because they were not watching the regions week in week out.

I could be wrong, but I think it's a massive coincidence.

We have discussed previously how there was a massive storm, with travel disruptions on the first JD after the Premier deal.

It was definitely down the following year, but you may want to use google to see why that was. There's a little thing called a pandemic.

Numbers were down before the pandemic.

LordDowlais wrote:
Well, no not really, as investors will look at the viewing figures, which by all accounts at the time PS took over, were three times as much as what PS are getting, and by now if the trend kept going upwards, then the TV rights might have been more attractive to better sponsors, and better broadcasters.

So you think that Pay Per View broadcaster would look to the viewing figures on free to air tv as a barometer for what price they'd offer? Ok.

In that case, why did Sky not bid for the PrO'league when Premier Sports took over?

PhilBB wrote:S4C were still broadcasting, week in week out.

They actually were not.

LordDowlais wrote:

Numbers were down before the pandemic.

Only for one year, which was the year we discussed. You then claimed they were down 'the following year', which was a statement that has no basis in truth.

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
How were the previous rights not sold properly if the league is garbage in your opinion? This is comical.

Because getting just €900k out of TG4 and £150k out of BBC Alba is clearly an indication of not doing things properly, wouldn't you say? Especially when Sky pumped in £5m and BBC Wales £4.5m, for reference.

And please do answer the points about CVC

Getting 900k out of TG4 is an achievement to be honest. You have to agree then surely the Premier and Eir deal was very good. Super leagues Sky deal is worth 25 million for instance.

LordDowlais wrote:

PhilBB wrote:S4C were still broadcasting, week in week out.

They actually were not.

The PrO'14 (dated here 24th July, 2018) suggests otherwise? https://www.pro14.rugby/latest/news/s4c-will-continue-to-show-free-to-air-guinness-pro14-games-until-2021

PhilBB wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:
Well, no not really, as investors will look at the viewing figures, which by all accounts at the time PS took over, were three times as much as what PS are getting, and by now if the trend kept going upwards, then the TV rights might have been more attractive to better sponsors, and better broadcasters.

So you think that Pay Per View broadcaster would look to the viewing figures on free to air tv as a barometer for what price they'd offer? Ok.

In that case, why did Sky not bid for the PrO'league when Premier Sports took over?

I don't know. Perhaps they thought it was not worth it. I don't know.

What I am saying is, that if it never went to PS in the first place, I reckon that better broadcasters would be sniffing around now. I just think it was a bit of short term gain by the league and they just took the money, it was a bit of a money grab, they did not consider the long term damage.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

PhilBB wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
How were the previous rights not sold properly if the league is garbage in your opinion? This is comical.

Because getting just €900k out of TG4 and £150k out of BBC Alba is clearly an indication of not doing things properly, wouldn't you say? Especially when Sky pumped in £5m and BBC Wales £4.5m, for reference.

And please do answer the points about CVC

Getting 900k out of TG4 is an achievement to be honest.  You have to agree then surely the Premier and Eir deal was very good. Super leagues Sky deal is worth 25 million for instance.

Yes, Super League (a minority sport that interests just about two counties England) is a more valuable TV contract that the premier Rugby Union offering of three nations.

And you think the Premier deal 'was very good'?

Ok. That must mean that you value the league even more lowly than I do.