DP World Tour chat

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As Pedro says, there isn’t a thread for this so I thought I’d start one (sticky, please?).

A great British Masters tournament and fantastic to see Thunderbear put all his past woes behind him and win again, thanks to two monster putts on 17 and 18, having done pretty much the same on Saturday.

On to Belgium this week.

Do you want examples? Otherwise I am using the common definitions of "architecture" and "merit"

McLaren wrote:Do you want examples? Otherwise I am using the common definitions of "architecture" and "merit"

You could, perhaps, from an evidence-based golf architectural perspective, explain (using examples) why Torrey Pines allegedly has little architectural merit? Just a thought...

Great result recently for Manassero. Comprehensive win and a stellar 61 in round 2. Good to see him back in the winner's circle.

I see Paul Casey has a sponsor’s invitation to this week’s Porsche Singapore Open. I wonder what sort of reception he’ll get from his fellow pros?

LadyPutt wrote:I see Paul Casey has a sponsor’s invitation to this week’s Porsche Singapore Open. I wonder what sort of reception he’ll get from his fellow pros?

A lukewarm one, hopefully. Especially as I presume he's taken a position of someone more deserving.

Final qualifying underway at four locations. I've picked out some names known to me who are trying - with differing success. I believe the last tee time for the second rounds was at 3pm.
Abraham Ancer, Justin Rose, Anirban Lahiri, Chris Wood, Justin Harding. (Burnham & Berrow)
Sam Hutsby, Rhys Enoch, Marc Warren, Robert Rock, Peter Uhlein, Ian Snyman (Dundonald Links) Tome Lewis retired.
Mathew Southgate, Branden Grace, Graeme McDowell, Thomas Detry, (Royal Cinque Ports)
Sam Horsfield, Sergio Garcia, Richard Mansell, Marcus Armitage (West Lancashire)

Not looking good for McDowell or Detry. Sergio on the edge, looking good for Rose.
https://www.theopen.com/qualification/final-qualifying?CountryCode=GB

I'm never wrong wrote:Final qualifying underway at four locations. I've picked out some names known to me who are trying - with differing success. I believe the last tee time for the second rounds was at 3pm.
Abraham Ancer, Justin Rose, Anirban Lahiri, Chris Wood, Justin Harding. (Burnham & Berrow)
Sam Hutsby, Rhys Enoch, Marc Warren, Robert Rock, Peter Uhlein, Ian Snyman (Dundonald Links) Tome Lewis retired.
Mathew Southgate, Branden Grace, Graeme McDowell, Thomas Detry, (Royal Cinque Ports)
Sam Horsfield, Sergio Garcia, Richard Mansell, Marcus Armitage (West Lancashire)

Not looking good for McDowell or Detry. Sergio on the edge, looking good for Rose.
https://www.theopen.com/qualification/final-qualifying?CountryCode=GB

Interested to the see the B & B scores, as that's my neck of the woods pre-university. Have some scar tissue from the odd 'exciting' round there, especially when there's a bit of wind. Excellent course though.

Just checked B & B scores. You know you aren't as good as you think/once hoped you'd be when you see 65s and 66s off the back blocks at this sort of course, knowing full well that your best on the same track is in the mid-to-upper 70s off tees some way forward than these guys are playing from, easier paced greens and less brutal rough.

Bit of life in Chris Wood it would seem. Maybe. Some way to go, but he should know that track like the back of his hand.

Rose makes it, Grace and Garcia don't. I think the alternates come from these qualifiers, but I don't know how deep they will go. Garcia was T6th

I'm never wrong wrote:Rose makes it, Grace and Garcia don't. I think the alternates come from these qualifiers, but I don't know how deep they will go. Garcia was T6th

Pleased for Rose and strangely pleased for Garcia, as well .

Was very pleased to see Peter Finch shoot 83 in Regional qualifying. These YouTube golfers are seriously deluded.

super_realist wrote:Was very pleased to see Peter Finch shoot 83 in Regional qualifying. These YouTube golfers are seriously deluded.

Two other YouTube golfers popped up on my feed as failing.

I'm never wrong wrote:

super_realist wrote:Was very pleased to see Peter Finch shoot 83 in Regional qualifying. These YouTube golfers are seriously deluded.

Two other YouTube golfers popped up on my feed as failing.

Andy Carter was quite close and Rick Shiels shot 81, but he did say beforehand he expected nothing.
Finch would eat himself if he was made of chocolate, but you see better golfers at every club in the country who wouldn't bother entering Qualification because they know they aren't up to it. It's basically comparable to Shane Lowry trying to qualify for the Olympic 100m

LIV golfers playing in Germany today. (Reed and Kaymer - possibly others). Reed top of the pile after 14 holes as I write this. I know he was aDP World member, but how does he get to play in DP World tournaments? Did he pay a fine or something? I think there may be a spot or two for The Open up for grabs if you finish high enough.

super_realist wrote:

I'm never wrong wrote:

super_realist wrote:Was very pleased to see Peter Finch shoot 83 in Regional qualifying. These YouTube golfers are seriously deluded.

Two other YouTube golfers popped up on my feed as failing.

Andy Carter was quite close and Rick Shiels shot 81, but he did say beforehand he expected nothing.
Finch would eat himself if he was made of chocolate, but you see better golfers at every club in the country who wouldn't bother entering Qualification because they know they aren't up to it. It's basically comparable to Shane Lowry trying to qualify for the Olympic 100m

Surprised they were scoring quite that high, but then the only evidence we have is YouTube videos and who knows what's true there.
Always makes me grin on some of their 'testing' where the latest driver they're hitting carries >280 and rolls out to >300. This in the UK, at sea level, in what passes for our summer temperatures if we're lucky.
Still, no doubt this is all content for their channels and more money in the bank.

Exactly Navy, I've always said their distances are wildly inaccurate.
They play a lot of course I know and end up in spots nowhere near to the distances they claim to hit it.

Totally agree that it's for content only mostly, but it's really cringeworthy that the likes of Finch and Fryer genuinely appear to think ( or at least pretend) they can qualify, when they aren't even close to getting out of regional qualifying. They need a target which genuinely has an element of jeopardy to it rather than a foregone conclusion like that.
I'm pretty confident I'd give them a good game and I'm rubbish.

Not bad from MacIntyre yesterday. Outrageous luck on 16, though. I was hoping Scott would pull it off; always loved his swing and if the speed gun numbers are to be believed, he was still cranking his driver at around 180 mph ball speed at times yesterday.

Is Bob had wanted to be completely true to the honour of the game is there an argument that says he just pretends he didn't step on the sprinkler head? Or does he just accept that sometimes you get a huge bit of luck?

He doesn't win if he doesn't step on it.

McLaren wrote:Is Bob had wanted to be completely true to the honour of the game is there an argument that says he just pretends he didn't step on the sprinkler head? Or does he just accept that sometimes you get a huge bit of luck?

He doesn't win if he doesn't step on it.

Tend to agree, but accept rules is rules and he got a drop out of it. His drive was in the deep cabbage and deserved the hit from that, really. In his head, I'm sure he's happy with the logic that 'anyone else in the same situation would do the same'.

McLaren wrote:Is Bob had wanted to be completely true to the honour of the game is there an argument that says he just pretends he didn't step on the sprinkler head? Or does he just accept that sometimes you get a huge bit of luck?

He doesn't win if he doesn't step on it.

True to the honour of the game? Like 9 Chins and his numerous dodgy drops?

Who is 9 chins, I lose track of all your nicknames?

Navy

I guess there's no way any pro is turning that opportunity down but I do wonder if some players would think about it later on. I get the feeling this meant so much to Bob that he would happily take a fortuitous drop to secure the win.

McLaren wrote:Who is 9 chins, I lose track of all your nicknames?

Your demi god Woods.

McLaren wrote:Navy

I guess there's no way any pro is turning that opportunity down but I do wonder if some players would think about it later on. I get the feeling this meant so much to Bob that he would happily take a fortuitous drop to secure the win.

Could be, but in general I think that most top sportspeople will justify anything in a grey area if it means they win. Too many these days argue that if something isn't specifically there in black and white, they're happy to abuse the spirit of something and are quite happy to get away with it.

Don't think this is a grey area at all.
The rule is that if an object interferes with your stance, you get relief,it says nothing about the state of the vegetation which your ball might be in.
It's perhaps a bit surprising there was a sprinkler head there, but it's no different from standing on a sprinkler head in the middle of a fairway in relation to the rules.

There is no "abuse of spirit" at all here.

super_realist wrote:Don't think this is a grey area at all.
The rule is that if an object interferes with your stance, you get relief,it says nothing about the state of the vegetation which your ball might be in.
It's perhaps a bit surprising there was a sprinkler head there, but it's no different from standing on a sprinkler head in the middle of a fairway in relation to the rules.

There is no "abuse of spirit" at all here.

It does seem generous that he got relief when he was way into the jungle, but I don't blame him at all for following the letter of the rules - every pro would do the same. The question of whether the rule is right per the spirit of the game is a different question to whether it was applied correctly - when in the rough, it should be 'play as it lies' unless there is a physically impossible reason (and in this case MacIntyre would have had to play out in a different direction if he did not want his stance interfered with by the sprinkler). ON the other hand, I think players should be allowed free drops out of divots on the fairway.

super_realist wrote:Don't think this is a grey area at all.
The rule is that if an object interferes with your stance, you get relief,it says nothing about the state of the vegetation which your ball might be in.
It's perhaps a bit surprising there was a sprinkler head there, but it's no different from standing on a sprinkler head in the middle of a fairway in relation to the rules.

There is no "abuse of spirit" at all here.

I don't disagree. Rules are rules, and I certainly don't hold anything against MacIntyre here. He was lucky, but that's not his fault.

dummy_half wrote:...ON the other hand, I think players should be allowed free drops out of divots on the fairway.

Would never work. A really fresh divot is easy to identify. An older one? Not so much. You'd have people claiming free drops out of all sorts of nicks, scrapes and bare patches.

It's hard to imagine how golf could become more tedious but watching what constitutes a divot being determined every other shot is one way.

Not to mention the cheating you'd see at club level.

McLaren wrote:It's hard to imagine how golf could become more tedious but watching what constitutes a divot being determined every other shot is one way.

Not to mention the cheating you'd see at club level.

Cheating is absolutely rife with the WHS. The St Andrews Club Handicap Secretary was forced to resign over his own cheating.
Makes you realise that golf really isn't an honest game.

What did he do?

McLaren wrote:What did he do?

First of all he went from 8 to Scratch in about 2 weeks, secondly he was caught putting a par 5 down when he had about an 8, then he put an 18 hole score in by playing two balls whilst playing nine holes, and numerous other examples of him being seen to cheat.

Before we had the WHS or whatever it was called I always used to raise an eyebrow when American tourists would declare what their handicap was and then proceed to have an horrific score and look nothing like what they claimed they were.
It's a cheats charter.

Who's going to win The Open then?
Hopefully not another boring American.

super_realist wrote:Who's going to win The Open then?
Hopefully not another boring American.

I know he hasn't been in good form this year, but I have a hunch for Jon Rahm this week.

I think it would be good for golf if Åberg won. We need a PGA player to threaten the dull dominance of Scheffler and get a bit of rivalry going. Three round Rory just doesn't seem to contend enough or put enough pressure on him.

super_realist wrote:I think it would be good for golf if Åberg won. We need a PGA  player to threaten the dull dominance of Scheffler and get a bit of rivalry going. Three round Rory just doesn't seem to contend enough or put enough pressure on him.

Would be great if Åberg were to win. He certainly seems to have the game needed to do it, as well as (what appears to be) a pretty good temperament. Be interesting to see how he copes if he's right in it coming down the back 9 on Sunday. Anyone except a LIV player for me, although I've changed my tune somewhat on DeChambeau.

I'm not sure Åberg and Scheffler would create any sort of exciting rivalry though - both seem too sensible and under control.

super_realist wrote:

McLaren wrote:What did he do?

First of all he went from 8 to Scratch in about 2 weeks, secondly he was caught putting a par 5 down when he had about an 8, then he put an 18 hole score in by playing two balls whilst playing nine holes, and numerous other examples of him being seen to cheat.

Before we had the WHS or whatever it was called I always used to raise an eyebrow when American tourists would declare what their handicap was and then proceed to have an horrific score and look nothing like what they claimed they were.
It's a cheats charter.

The idea that golf has ever been an honourable game is baloney, really. People have always cheated and/or massaged their handicap in all sorts of ways. Requires too much self-policing, too much time is out of sight of playing partners etc and it just reflects the rest of society. Loads of winkers in society; loads of winkers in any typical golf club, I'm afraid.

I've always wished golf didn't have a handicap system. Best score wins seems to work well in every other sport.

McLaren wrote:I've always wished golf didn't have a handicap system. Best score wins seems to work well in every other sport.

I never ever play anything other than scratch games. I have no interest in handicap golf at all.

super_realist wrote:

McLaren wrote:I've always wished golf didn't have a handicap system. Best score wins seems to work well in every other sport.

I never ever play anything other than scratch games. I have no interest in handicap golf at all.

Would getting thrashed all the time in club comps as you improved from whenever you started, have put you off at all, do you think? I suspect it would for many.

navyblueshorts wrote:

super_realist wrote:

McLaren wrote:I've always wished golf didn't have a handicap system. Best score wins seems to work well in every other sport.

I never ever play anything other than scratch games. I have no interest in handicap golf at all.

Would getting thrashed all the time in club comps as you improved from whenever you started, have put you off at all, do you think? I suspect it would for many.

Depends why you play golf Navy. I have never played golf to win handicap competitions.
Perhaps I was lucky as my first handicap as an adult was 7 and I came down quick from there. I get that people would see value in handicap competitions, but they never interested me.

Golf is about being as good as I can be as a golfer and having fun with my usual group of golf friends, however I think the best way to improve is to play with better golfers, not confect a way of making it a level playing field.

Navy

From pretty much the moment I started playing golf I aimed to shoot par. For the first couple of years my dad encouraged me to focus on the more realistic goal of breaking level 5's but after that par was the target.

In my prime, shooting par regularly was possible. Handicap just never interested me. I can't imagine being satisfied with using the crutch of a handicap to get a good score. Would I have quit if I wasn't any good? Probably, there are plenty of sports I liked but didn't play and that was probably because I wasn't any good at them.

I think I have only won a handicap medal once or twice, but many scratch.

McLaren wrote:Navy

From pretty much the moment I started playing golf I aimed to shoot par. For the first couple of years my dad encouraged me to focus on the more realistic goal of breaking level 5's but after that par was the target.

In my prime, shooting par regularly was possible. Handicap just never interested me. I can't imagine being satisfied with using the crutch of a handicap to get a good score. Would I have quit if I wasn't any good? Probably, there are plenty of sports I liked but didn't play and that was probably because I wasn't any good at them.

I think I have only won a handicap medal once or twice, but many scratch.

If you applied a handicap to other sports you do, how would it translate, for example, what does a 16 handicap footballer look like? Keir Starmer at five a side?

Prince Andrew having a shocker of a round at Troon.

super_realist wrote:Prince Andrew having a shocker of a round at Troon.

?

McLaren wrote:

super_realist wrote:Prince Andrew having a shocker of a round at Troon.

?

Justin Leonard. Certainly a likeness there.

McIlroy ruined another major.

What's your best score round troon super?

McLaren wrote:What's your best score round troon super?

Not played it Mac, not played many West Cost courses. Have you?

65

McLaren wrote:65

What did you score on the back 9?