Political round up.............

First topic message reminder :

Duty281 wrote:Sunak speaks for a grand total of 84 seconds and then scuttles away to get his orders.

Crackpot.

If Duty's posts are to be believed on here, he doesn't vote for anyone and he hates all the parties.

Also, his posts above are completely laughable. Wonder if he took part in any Brexit activism.

It doesn't matter which party. Given that some racists vote for each party, no matter which party you vote for you are aligning yourself with the racists who vote for that party. Because everyone knows that if you march to the ballot box with racists, you are a racist by association. It is that simple.

Pr4wn wrote:If Duty's posts are to be believed on here, he doesn't vote for anyone and he hates all the parties.

Also, his posts above are completely laughable. Wonder if he took part in any Brexit activism.

1) I don't hate all the parties, but I do dislike the major ones, yes.
2) What's laughable about anti-Semitism? I'm sure if some far-right, white supremacist mob had been saying these things about Jews, it wouldn't be so laughable.

JuliusHMarx wrote:It doesn't matter which party. Given that some racists vote for each party, no matter which party you vote for you are aligning yourself with the racists who vote for that party. Because everyone knows that if you march to the ballot box with racists, you are a racist by association. It is that simple.

What a frightful, and deliberate, misunderstanding.

Its your logic.

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:It doesn't matter which party. Given that some racists vote for each party, no matter which party you vote for you are aligning yourself with the racists who vote for that party. Because everyone knows that if you march to the ballot box with racists, you are a racist by association. It is that simple.

What a frightful, and deliberate, misunderstanding.

Oh, so if, with good intention and no racism, you go on a march for peace, and some racists end up on the same march, that makes you a racist as well. But if you vote for the same party as racists, that doesn't make you a racist.

Give over, dear boy.

Duty281 wrote:

Pr4wn wrote:If Duty's posts are to be believed on here, he doesn't vote for anyone and he hates all the parties.

Also, his posts above are completely laughable. Wonder if he took part in any Brexit activism.

1) I don't hate all the parties, but I do dislike the major ones, yes.
2) What's laughable about anti-Semitism? I'm sure if some far-right, white supremacist mob had been saying these things about Jews, it wouldn't be so laughable.

Where did I say antisemitism is laughable? You're talking absolute nonsense.

Samo wrote:Its your logic.

No it isn't, because I was talking specifically about marches, not voting.

You were the one who brought up the ballot box. It's not my belief that if you happen to vote the same way as someone who is racist/antisemitic/homophobic that it means you are one of those things.

Duty281 wrote:

Samo wrote:Its your logic.

No it isn't, because I was talking specifically about marches, not voting.

You were the one who brought up the ballot box. It's not my belief that if you happen to vote the same way as someone who is racist/antisemitic/homophobic that it means you are one of those things.

Lol, glad we cleared that up.

Pr4wn wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

Pr4wn wrote:If Duty's posts are to be believed on here, he doesn't vote for anyone and he hates all the parties.

Also, his posts above are completely laughable. Wonder if he took part in any Brexit activism.

1) I don't hate all the parties, but I do dislike the major ones, yes.
2) What's laughable about anti-Semitism? I'm sure if some far-right, white supremacist mob had been saying these things about Jews, it wouldn't be so laughable.

Where did I say antisemitism is laughable? You're talking absolute nonsense.

You said my posts above were completely laughable. Most of what I was talking about was the anti-Semitism on display in London today. So you found that laughable, or do you mean to say that my posts weren't completely laughable?

The idea that everyone on that march is racist is laughable, and I find it surprising that you think that, because I had thought you more intelligent. I find your way of thinking on this to be divisive and actually quite dangerous to a civilised society.

Duty281 wrote:

Pr4wn wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

Pr4wn wrote:If Duty's posts are to be believed on here, he doesn't vote for anyone and he hates all the parties.

Also, his posts above are completely laughable. Wonder if he took part in any Brexit activism.

1) I don't hate all the parties, but I do dislike the major ones, yes.
2) What's laughable about anti-Semitism? I'm sure if some far-right, white supremacist mob had been saying these things about Jews, it wouldn't be so laughable.

Where did I say antisemitism is laughable? You're talking absolute nonsense.

You said my posts above were completely laughable. Most of what I was talking about was the anti-Semitism on display in London today. So you found that laughable, or do you mean to say that my posts weren't completely laughable?

What a frightful, and deliberate, misunderstanding.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:It doesn't matter which party. Given that some racists vote for each party, no matter which party you vote for you are aligning yourself with the racists who vote for that party. Because everyone knows that if you march to the ballot box with racists, you are a racist by association. It is that simple.

What a frightful, and deliberate, misunderstanding.

Oh, so if, with good intention and no racism, you go on a march for peace, and some racists end up on the same march, that makes you a racist as well.

But if you vote for the same party as racists, that doesn't make you a racist.

Give over, dear boy.

Point one - yes, absolutely. I'm not sure why this is hard to grasp. If you march with people chanting for the eradication of Israel, you are associated with it.

Point two - also correct. There will be at least one racist voting for every single party, so it's impossible to disassociate in that regard. If you vote for a party that has racist policies, however, that would make you a racist.

JuliusHMarx wrote:The idea that everyone on that march is racist is laughable, and I find it surprising that you think that, because I had thought you more intelligent. I find your way of thinking on this to be divisive and actually quite dangerous to a civilised society.

Of course it's divisive. We disagree with each other, hence division. You are as equally divisive as I am.

Yes, of course, it's me that's dangerous to a civilised society. Not the racists calling for violence against Jews, just the person calling it out.

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:It doesn't matter which party. Given that some racists vote for each party, no matter which party you vote for you are aligning yourself with the racists who vote for that party. Because everyone knows that if you march to the ballot box with racists, you are a racist by association. It is that simple.

What a frightful, and deliberate, misunderstanding.

Oh, so if, with good intention and no racism, you go on a march for peace, and some racists end up on the same march, that makes you a racist as well.

But if you vote for the same party as racists, that doesn't make you a racist.

Give over, dear boy.

Point one - yes, absolutely. I'm not sure why this is hard to grasp. If you march with people chanting for the eradication of Israel, you are associated with it.

Point two - also correct. There will be at least one racist voting for every single party, so it's impossible to disassociate in that regard. If you vote for a party that has racist policies, however, that would make you a racist.

This should be on the Wikipedia page for cognitive dissonance.

Pr4wn wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:It doesn't matter which party. Given that some racists vote for each party, no matter which party you vote for you are aligning yourself with the racists who vote for that party. Because everyone knows that if you march to the ballot box with racists, you are a racist by association. It is that simple.

What a frightful, and deliberate, misunderstanding.

Oh, so if, with good intention and no racism, you go on a march for peace, and some racists end up on the same march, that makes you a racist as well.

But if you vote for the same party as racists, that doesn't make you a racist.

Give over, dear boy.

Point one - yes, absolutely. I'm not sure why this is hard to grasp. If you march with people chanting for the eradication of Israel, you are associated with it.

Point two - also correct. There will be at least one racist voting for every single party, so it's impossible to disassociate in that regard. If you vote for a party that has racist policies, however, that would make you a racist.

This should be on the Wikipedia page for cognitive dissonance.

In keeping with the forum rules, moderator, kindly address the points made and don't make ad hominem attacks. We may disagree with one another, but I'm perfectly able to be civil towards you, and would appreciate the same token in return.

Duty281 wrote:Point one - yes, absolutely. I'm not sure why this is hard to grasp. If you march with people chanting for the eradication of Israel, you are associated with it.

Sorry but that's nonsense, and as I say, it's also a simplistic and dangerous way of thinking. It is entirely possible to march for something and not be associated with people who are there at the same time shouting things you vehemently disagree with, who have infiltrated the march.

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:The idea that everyone on that march is racist is laughable, and I find it surprising that you think that, because I had thought you more intelligent. I find your way of thinking on this to be divisive and actually quite dangerous to a civilised society.

Of course it's divisive. We disagree with each other, hence division. You are as equally divisive as I am.

Yes, of course, it's me that's dangerous to a civilised society. Not the racists calling for violence against Jews, just the person calling it out.

Here's a possibility - more than one thing can be dangerous to a civilised society. When I mention one of them, is it necessary that I list all the others for balance?

It is not an ad hominem attack. It's simply an (somewhat humorous) observation this your point above displays all the usual hallmarks of cognitive dissonance.

Apologies if you find that offensive, old boy. But I'd say most other posters here are finding your smearing of peaceful protestors as being racist more than a little offensive.

We've already spoke about the Christian woman who was interviewed at the march. That must mean that everyone at the march was a Christian woman.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Point one - yes, absolutely. I'm not sure why this is hard to grasp. If you march with people chanting for the eradication of Israel, you are associated with it.

Sorry but that's nonsense, and as I say, it's also a simplistic and dangerous way of thinking. It is entirely possible to march for something and not be associated with people who are there at the same time shouting things you vehemently disagree with, who have infiltrated the march.

What do you mean by 'infiltrated'? Who is to say that the anti-Semites are the infiltrators, and not the peaceful ones?

I agree, it is entirely possible to march for something and not be associated with these people. You do this by setting up a separate march, not walking with them. I'm not sure this will be a popular example on here, but in November 2016 there was set to be a pro-Brexit march in London, which was to be led by Farage as part of the Leave.EU group. However, the march was hijacked by the far-right who said they were going to turn up and take part. So, Farage and Leave.EU cancelled this gathering, because they didn't want to be associated with the far-right. I'm sure many on here, had that march gone ahead with Farage in it, wouldn't have said 'oh, Nigel's not far-right, his march has just been infiltrated.'

I would also add that it's not just shouting things, but also holding up placards with racist statements and anti-Semitic imagery.

Why dangerous, also?

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:The idea that everyone on that march is racist is laughable, and I find it surprising that you think that, because I had thought you more intelligent. I find your way of thinking on this to be divisive and actually quite dangerous to a civilised society.

Of course it's divisive. We disagree with each other, hence division. You are as equally divisive as I am.

Yes, of course, it's me that's dangerous to a civilised society. Not the racists calling for violence against Jews, just the person calling it out.

Here's a possibility - more than one thing can be dangerous to a civilised society. When I mention one of them, is it necessary that I list all the others for balance?

This is an amusing post from you, because in the past you've said that because I have raised a problem with x, that means I don't care about y. Now there's a reversal.

And, indeed it can, but this is the first time you've listed a potential danger to civilised society on a discussion about anti-Semites calling for violence. I get called out as a danger before they do.

Dangerous because it is inflammatory to lump people with very different viewpoints into one group and to demonise innocent (non-racist) people.

Pr4wn wrote:It is not an ad hominem attack. It's simply an (somewhat humorous) observation this your point above displays all the usual hallmarks of cognitive dissonance.

Apologies if you find that offensive, old boy. But I'd say most other posters here are finding your smearing of  peaceful protestors as being racist more than a little offensive.

I don't find it offensive, I'm just hoping for a positive discussion.

If peaceful protestors don't want to be smeared as racist, perhaps they shouldn't walk with them.

JuliusHMarx wrote:Dangerous because it is inflammatory to lump people with very different viewpoints into one group and to demonise innocent (non-racist) people.

And it's even more inflammatory to call for violence against Jews, but there we are.

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:Dangerous because it is inflammatory to lump people with very different viewpoints into one group and to demonise innocent (non-racist) people.

And it's even more inflammatory to call for violence against Jews, but there we are.

What are you after, a 'dangerous' scale? Grow up.
You're literally saying my daughter is an anti-semitic racist, and by inference that I am a bad parent. Which is complete bullsh1t.

Duty281 wrote:

Pr4wn wrote:It is not an ad hominem attack. It's simply an (somewhat humorous) observation this your point above displays all the usual hallmarks of cognitive dissonance.

Apologies if you find that offensive, old boy. But I'd say most other posters here are finding your smearing of  peaceful protestors as being racist more than a little offensive.

I don't find it offensive, I'm just hoping for a positive discussion.

If peaceful protestors don't want to be smeared as racist, perhaps they shouldn't walk with them.

And how would that be policed exactly? Should the 295,000 non-racists hire private security? Would the Met allow that? Or should they ask them politely to leave? Are you living in some sort of deliberate fantasy world that makes you feel better?

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

Pr4wn wrote:It is not an ad hominem attack. It's simply an (somewhat humorous) observation this your point above displays all the usual hallmarks of cognitive dissonance.

Apologies if you find that offensive, old boy. But I'd say most other posters here are finding your smearing of  peaceful protestors as being racist more than a little offensive.

I don't find it offensive, I'm just hoping for a positive discussion.

If peaceful protestors don't want to be smeared as racist, perhaps they shouldn't walk with them.

And how would that be policed exactly? Should the 295,000 non-racists hire private security? Would the Met allow that? Or should they ask them politely to leave? Are you living in some sort of deliberate fantasy world that makes you feel better?

Wish I did live in a fantasy world. Instead I live in a world where in Britain in 2023 another MP suffered homophobic abuse and nearly got seriously attacked (by the pro-Palestine lot, not the EDL), if it weren't for the actions of the police (my fantasy is not for him to be seriously attacked, it's just depressing that that's the state of things).

In answer to your queries, I have no idea. Maybe there just wouldn't be a notable protest, just like there wasn't a notable protest when Hamas massacred innocents, and the only ones marching would be the openly anti-Semitic ones (which almost certainly number more than 5,000). Who knows?

Duty281 wrote:...the only ones marching would be the openly anti-Semitic ones (which almost certainly number more than 5,000).

But all 300,000 are anti-semitic, correct? Whether they are open about it or not.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:...the only ones marching would be the openly anti-Semitic ones (which almost certainly number more than 5,000).

But all 300,000 are anti-semitic, correct? Whether they are open about it or not.

If you march with racists, you're a racist by association. Don't like it? Don't march with them. Very simple.

I doubt you have any issue with this logic when it concerns protests of a right-wing nature.

I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

I see Channel Four have been forced to delete their misinformation, initially claiming the pro-Palestine protest went off peacefully, and that the only fights involved far-right clashes with the police.

They've now updated to say that the 'vast majority' of arrests were of far-right people (still not accurate, I believe), and that Gove needed police protection from pro-Palestinian demonstrators.

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

It is staggeringly ignorant to assume that everyone on that march is racist.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

It is staggeringly ignorant to assume that everyone on that march is racist.

Yes, I get that's your point, but why is this the case?

If you march with people who call for the destruction of Israel, celebrate the deaths of Jews, hold up placards with racist imagery/slogans, and the like, then you are associated if you continue to march with them and don't call them out. Racism by association. Do you disagree with the idea of racism by association?

Presumably you don't think all of the so-called far-right protesters are racist either?

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

It is staggeringly ignorant to assume that everyone on that march is racist.

Yes, I get that's your point, but why is this the case?

If you march with people who call for the destruction of Israel, celebrate the deaths of Jews, hold up placards with racist imagery/slogans, and the like, then you are associated if you continue to march with them and don't call them out. Racism by association. Do you disagree with the idea of racism by association?

Presumably you don't think all of the so-called far-right protesters are racist either?

There was 300,000 people there. The vast majority of them would have had no idea that those chants or placards where there. So its frankly idiotic to suggest they "call it out". But then again you're a fascist, racist, bigoted homophobe so maybe you see the world different to me.

Samo wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

It is staggeringly ignorant to assume that everyone on that march is racist.

Yes, I get that's your point, but why is this the case?

If you march with people who call for the destruction of Israel, celebrate the deaths of Jews, hold up placards with racist imagery/slogans, and the like, then you are associated if you continue to march with them and don't call them out. Racism by association. Do you disagree with the idea of racism by association?

Presumably you don't think all of the so-called far-right protesters are racist either?

There was 300,000 people there. The vast majority of them would have had no idea that those chants or placards where there.  So its frankly idiotic to suggest they "call it out".  But then again you're a fascist, racist, bigoted homophobe so maybe you see the world different to me.

I imagine we see the world differently, but how am I a fascist, racist, bigoted homophobe?

Duty281 wrote:

Samo wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

It is staggeringly ignorant to assume that everyone on that march is racist.

Yes, I get that's your point, but why is this the case?

If you march with people who call for the destruction of Israel, celebrate the deaths of Jews, hold up placards with racist imagery/slogans, and the like, then you are associated if you continue to march with them and don't call them out. Racism by association. Do you disagree with the idea of racism by association?

Presumably you don't think all of the so-called far-right protesters are racist either?

There was 300,000 people there. The vast majority of them would have had no idea that those chants or placards where there.  So its frankly idiotic to suggest they "call it out".  But then again you're a fascist, racist, bigoted homophobe so maybe you see the world different to me.

I imagine we see the world differently, but how am I a fascist, racist, bigoted homophobe?

By association apparently. Come on man we've been through this already.

Samo wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

Samo wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

It is staggeringly ignorant to assume that everyone on that march is racist.

Yes, I get that's your point, but why is this the case?

If you march with people who call for the destruction of Israel, celebrate the deaths of Jews, hold up placards with racist imagery/slogans, and the like, then you are associated if you continue to march with them and don't call them out. Racism by association. Do you disagree with the idea of racism by association?

Presumably you don't think all of the so-called far-right protesters are racist either?

There was 300,000 people there. The vast majority of them would have had no idea that those chants or placards where there.  So its frankly idiotic to suggest they "call it out".  But then again you're a fascist, racist, bigoted homophobe so maybe you see the world different to me.

I imagine we see the world differently, but how am I a fascist, racist, bigoted homophobe?

By association apparently.  Come on man we've been through this already.

Association with who? I haven't gone on any marches with people who have chanted fascistic, racist or homophobic slogans. If I had have done, and hadn't called it out or left the march, that would be a fair comment.

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

It is staggeringly ignorant to assume that everyone on that march is racist.

Yes, I get that's your point, but why is this the case?

If you march with people who call for the destruction of Israel, celebrate the deaths of Jews, hold up placards with racist imagery/slogans, and the like, then you are associated if you continue to march with them and don't call them out. Racism by association. Do you disagree with the idea of racism by association?

Presumably you don't think all of the so-called far-right protesters are racist either?

How would you like the average person on that march to call them out to your satisfaction? E-mail you with a condemnation?
What if the average person - by which I mean the vast majority of the marchers - vehemently disagrees with relatively few hateful anti-semites but continues to march anyway, not with them except in physical proximity, but for something else that they believe in? That something being the purpose of the march in the first place, which is not anti-semitic. Those people are not racist by association because they disavow the racists - but the average person does not have the opportunity to publicly tell Duty281 on 606v2 of their viewpoint.

Poland’s nationalist ‘Independence March’ has in the past drawn far-right individuals with xenophobic placards. Does that make all the marchers far-right xenophobes by association? Presumably you think it does, but I think to make such as assumption would be ridiculously simplistic.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:I find that level of ignorance to be quite staggering.

Sound. If you can articulate why that is, I'll be interested to hear your reasoning.

It is staggeringly ignorant to assume that everyone on that march is racist.

Yes, I get that's your point, but why is this the case?

If you march with people who call for the destruction of Israel, celebrate the deaths of Jews, hold up placards with racist imagery/slogans, and the like, then you are associated if you continue to march with them and don't call them out. Racism by association. Do you disagree with the idea of racism by association?

Presumably you don't think all of the so-called far-right protesters are racist either?

How would you like the average person on that march to call them out to your satisfaction? E-mail you with a condemnation?
What if the average person - by which I mean the vast majority of the marchers - vehemently disagrees with relatively few hateful anti-semites but continues to march anyway, not with them except in physical proximity, but for something else that they believe in? That something being the purpose of the march in the first place, which is not anti-semitic. Those people are not racist by association because they disavow the racists - but the average person does not have the opportunity to publicly tell Duty281 on 606v2 of their viewpoint.

Poland’s nationalist ‘Independence March’ has in the past drawn far-right individuals with xenophobic placards. Does that make all the marchers far-right xenophobes by association? Presumably you think it does, but I think to make such as assumption would be ridiculously simplistic.

By calling them out. You know, going up to the offender/s and saying 'Excuse me? That racist placard you're holding [they were so many; but I'll pick one] that says pick the white side of history or the right side - could you please take it down? That swastika over the Star of David, that's not very pleasant is it? etc.'

That's a good way of calling it out. Presumably as the vast majority are apparently not anti-semitic, and it's just a tiny number being racist, this would be easy to achieve through strength of number?

And, like with your comment about infiltrators, who are you to say what the definitive purpose of the march is? For many people the purpose was to be anti-Semitic and hateful. They would argue differently to you as to what the purpose of the march is. The man who was handing out flyers about getting Hamas taken off the proscribed terrorist list, his purpose was probably different as well.

And how do we know these supposedly average people disavow the racists if they literally do nothing about it? I might have more sympathy with these supposedly average people, if it weren't for the fact that these anti-semitic marches have been happening for the last few Saturdays. It's not as if they were totally blind towards what would happen and who would be turning up.

I'm not sure about Poland's 'independence march', but I presume you think not all of the so-called far-right protesters today were racist? And, a few years back, if Farage had led a pro-Brexit march that had been infiltrated by the far-right then he wouldn't have been associated with it either?

The chances are that the vast majority of the marchers didn't see any racist placards themselves, or if they did, they reported it to the police rather than risk getting their heads kicked in by thugs. Or maybe they just ignored them got on with what they were there for. I didn't see you down there squaring up to any Hamas supporters - don't you feel strongly enough about it? Perhaps if a few of the marchers had ended up in hospital you'd have been happy to declare them non-racists?

Dear me - that is what I mean by living in a fantasy world.

If Farage had led a pro-Brexit march that had been infiltrated by far-right thugs who supported racist violence, then no, I would not lump Farage in with them.

JuliusHMarx wrote:The chances are that the vast majority of the marchers didn't see any racist placards themselves, or if they did, they reported it to the police rather than risk getting their heads kicked in by thugs. Or maybe they just ignored them got on with what they were there for. I didn't see you down there squaring up to any Hamas supporters - don't you feel strongly enough about it? Perhaps if a few of the marchers had ended up in hospital you'd have been happy to declare them non-racists?

Dear me - that is what I mean by living in a fantasy world.

If Farage had led a pro-Brexit march that had been infiltrated by far-right thugs who supported racist violence, then no, I would not lump Farage in with them.

On your last sentence, fair enough, I think that's the crux of our disagreement.

I wasn't down there because I wasn't interested in going on an anti-Semitic march. If I had squared up to any Hamas supporters, it would have been, of course, myself arrested for breach of the peace, not the Hamas lot, such is the two-tier policing situation today.

Duty281 wrote:If I had squared up to any Hamas supporters, it would have been, of course, myself arrested for breach of the peace, not the Hamas lot, such is the two-tier policing situation today.

But if other people don't do it, you assume they must be racist themselves. OK, fine.

Some really angry looking pro-Palestine folk around here too. Nearly walked into one yesterday on the footpath on a busy high street. He was wearing a Free Palestine t-shirt with the clenched fist. I was wearing my comfortable navy blue shorts (no, not our navyblueshorts, that's a bit hard from here) and a faded light grey t-shirt. Like a walking Israeli flag just about. It wasn't intentional - just what I managed to thrown on. I got a mean stare from this bloke who was probably thinking what I was thinking. Anyway, I managed to survive... and so did he. We can both count ourselves lucky.

Pal Joey wrote:Some really angry looking pro-Palestine folk around here too. Nearly walked into one yesterday on the footpath on a busy high street. He was wearing a Free Palestine t-shirt with the clenched fist. I was wearing my comfortable navy blue shorts (no, not our navyblueshorts, that's a bit hard from here) and a faded light grey t-shirt. Like a walking Israeli flag just about. It wasn't intentional - just what I managed to thrown on. I got a mean stare from this bloke who was probably thinking what I was thinking. Anyway, I managed to survive... and so did he. We can both count ourselves lucky.

Were you wearing Hi-Tecs? If so, he might have been fantasizing about you.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Duty281 wrote:If I had squared up to any Hamas supporters, it would have been, of course, myself arrested for breach of the peace, not the Hamas lot, such is the two-tier policing situation today.

But if other people don't do it, you assume they must be racist themselves. OK, fine.

No, they don't have to square up to them, you brought that up. I merely said people need to call them out, or not march with them. They don't need to square up to them.

Further, the two tier policing refers to people outside the pro-Palestine protest (such as myself). It doesn't apply to someone in the march.

Also, I don't assume they're racist. They are racist by association.

And I gave you several reasons why people didn't want to go up to them at all - all of which are perfectly valid and reasonable.

So are they racist or not - yes or no?

Meanwhile, back in the real world, the vast majority of today's violence rather predictably came from the far-right rent-a-riot crew.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Pal Joey wrote:Some really angry looking pro-Palestine folk around here too. Nearly walked into one yesterday on the footpath on a busy high street. He was wearing a Free Palestine t-shirt with the clenched fist. I was wearing my comfortable navy blue shorts (no, not our navyblueshorts, that's a bit hard from here) and a faded light grey t-shirt. Like a walking Israeli flag just about. It wasn't intentional - just what I managed to thrown on. I got a mean stare from this bloke who was probably thinking what I was thinking. Anyway, I managed to survive... and so did he. We can both count ourselves lucky.

Were you wearing Hi-Tecs?

No, just an old pair of Nike Ariel Sharons.