What would be your all time greatest fifteen ?

Pick anyone you want, PLEASE don't CRITICISE each other, as it should be an expression of all you love about rugby union.

It is a diverse game and we all admire different aspects of the game, cunning, guile, power and technical excellence are all part of the great game.

Please enjoy..!

Now let me think of my team...

1. Nick Poppelwell

2. Bobby Windsor

3. Carl Hayman

4. Bakkies Botha

5. Colin Meads

6. Dai Morris

7. Richie McCaw

8. Mervyn Davies

9. Gareth Edwards

10. Carlos Spencer

11. Shane Williams

12. John Dawes (Captain)

13. Bleddyn Bowen

14. Gerald Davies

15. Serge Blanco

Coached by Carwyn James and Jim Telfer

Players I have seen/were active since I followed rugby seriously (a bit off the wall as well)

1. Rodrigo Roncero
2. Rafael Ibanez
3. Chris Budgen (for heart and determination)
4. Simon Shaw
5. Victor Matfield
6. Neil Back
7. Richie McCaw
8. Jamie Heaslip
9. Augustin Pichot
10. Dan Carter (predictable yeah)
11. Vilimoni Delasau
12. Sonny-Bill Williams
13. Brian O'Driscol
14. Rupeni Caucau
15. Juan Martin Hernandez

Coached by Sir Ian McGeechan and Jim Telfer

Jumper, am loving your Budgie/Chicken selection - it's not likely to be a common one, but he is a great in his own way

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Jumper, am loving your Budgie/Chicken selection - it's not likely to be a common one, but he is a great in his own way

Thats a very abbrasive front row there mate.. great team thanks...

HHmmmm im so bad at these, cos one day ill say a team , but then the next day it might be totally different...been many a good player.

Ok here goes
1 Oz du Rant
2 Keith wood
3 Carl Hayman
4 Eales
5 Martin Johnson (C)
6 Richard Hill
7 Michael Jones
8 Zinzan Brooke

9 Gareth Edwards
10 Dan Carter
11 Jonah Lomu
12 Tim Horan
13 Phillipe Sella / Brian O'Driscoll
14 David Campese
15 Serge Blanco / Cristian Cullen

du randt
fitzpatrick
g price

whetton
eales

hill
m jones
m davies

edwards
carter

lomu
horan
gerber
gerald davies

cullen

I'm go use a slightly different tact and list the all time XV that at one stage or another really wowed me more than any other from my generation (I am 22)

01 Tom Smith
02 Keith Wood
03 Martin Castrogiovanni
04 Martin Johnson
05 Paul O'Connell
06 Serge Betson
07 George Smith
08 Joe Van Niekerk
09 George Gregan
10 Jonny Wilkinson
11 Jonah Lomu
12 Tana Umaga
13 Brian O'Driscoll
14 Jason Robinson
15 Christian Cullen

I found the exclusions of Olivier Magne, Ali Williams, Richie McCaw, Frederic Michalak, Dan Carter and Mario Ledesma to be very difficult.

I realise that there will be criticisms of that team but its personal preference.

Greatest all-time XV? I could give you the usual list of names we all know- Michael Jones, David Campese etc.

But I'd rather give you my greatest XV. A personal and left-field choice. And recent. I'm not going to lie, I'm 22 and I started watching rugby in a serious way at around the age of 10. That's a timeframe that excludes the careers of some of the greatest ever.

1. Sylvain Marconnet
2. Mario Ledesma
3. John Hayes
4. Paul O'Connell
5. Martin Johnson
6. Richard Hill
7. Richie McCaw
8. Sergio Parisse
9. Agustin Pichot
10. Dan Carter
11. Christoph Dominici
12. Yannick Jauzion
13. Brian O'Driscoll
14. Vincert bleedin' Clerc
15. Simon Mason

You're 22? I had you down for in your 70s - sorry

01 Tom Smith
02 Keith Wood
03 Paul Wallace
04 Martin Johnson
05 John Eales
06 Colin Charvis
07 George Smith
08 Scott Quinnell
09 Rob Howley
10 Carlos Spencer
11 Jonah Lomu
12 Scott Gibbs
13 Allan Bateman
14 Shan Williams (wrong wing, but I don't care)
15 Christian Cullen

These are probably my favourite players from my era. Pretty much off the top of my head.

There are some great names up there lads. Like the personalised posts.. very interesting...

Are you going to start a personal fave 15 thread Maesteg?

My Personal Fave....

1 Nick Popplewell
2 Keith Wood
3 Carl Hayman
4 Norm Hadley
5 Simon Shaw
6 Mickey Skinner
7 Pat Lam
8 Tim Rodber

9 Gary Armstrong
10 Waisele Serevi ( i know he wasnt brill at 15 aside but..)
11 Jonah Lomu
12 Brian Lima
13 Inga Tuigamala
14 Jason Robinson
15 Serge Blanco

Quite alot of Islanders...but i just love the way they play the game. Brtually physical and uncompromising...but fun and care free in attack.

Call it an XV of the last decade or so

01 Gethin Jenkins
02 John Smit (C)
03 Carl Hayman
04 Martin Johnson
05 John Eales
06 Richard Hill
07 Richie McCaw
08 Sergio Parisse
09 Gareth Edwards
10 Daniel Carter
11 Shane Williams
12 Tana Umaga
13 Brian O'Driscoll
14 Jonah Lomu
15 Christian Cullen

Ahem, one...obvious exception..

best xv i have ever seen live would be

cullen
robinson/shane (half each)
gerber
horan
lomu
carter
joost (get well soon)

os
fitzy
haymans

jones
whetton

hill
mccaw
shelford

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:You're 22? I had you down for in your 70s - sorry

Actually, you know what I'm not 22. I'm 23.

First sign of senility

Ok...
John Gallagher
John Kirwan
Joe Stanley
Warwick Taylor
Craig Green
Grant Fox
David Kirk
Wayne Shelford
Michael Jones
Allan Whetton
Murray Pierce
Gary Whetton
Steve Mcdowell
Sean Fitzpatrick
John Drake (RIP)

Most convincing World Cup winning team ever and sweep any team mentioned here- including Bill's. (except maybe dragoich and jb1973).

Apart from John Galagher is that team a full kiwi team?

It's always difficult selecting a greatest XV of all time as there have been so many great players down the years and I find myself continually arguing with myself over almost every position.

The only way I can do it is by limiting selection to players who have graced the pitch during my lifetime, albeit that some I will select were towards the end of their careers when I arrived on this rock. Anyway, here is my team, and explanation of selection and notable mentions for omitted players to follow.

15. JPR Williams
14. David Campese
13. Danie Gerber
12. Mike Gibson
11. Jonah Lomu
10. Jonny Wilkinson
9. Gareth Edwards

1. Os du Randt / Charlie Faulkner
2. Sean Fitzpatrick / Bobby Windsor
3. Fran Cotton / Graham Price
4. Martin Johnson
5. John Eales
6. Michael Jones
7. Richie McCaw
8. Zinzan Brooke


First up, you will see I have selected two front rows. If I was picking individually by position then I would go for the first. Two behemoth props sandwiching the most cerebral hooker to play the game. However, there is always an argument when selecting the front row, to pick as a unit, and I honestly don't think there has been a better one in my lifetime than the 'Viet Gwent'. All good players in their own right, but a great unit and one worthy of selection in an all time great team.

The second row speaks for itself. Two World Cup winning captains who would drive this team forward to perfection.

In the back row, you have to have Jones, the only question is in which shirt. I have gone for him at 6, as I genuinely feel that McCaw, despite his critics harping on about 'cheating' all the time, has moved openside play on to a whole different level again. He has everything, he carries, tackles and dominates the breakdown. He also leads with distinction, and even in this team with leaders throughout, I would probably give him the armband as well. Zinzan completes the all All Black back row, for his all round footballing skills.

Edwards speaks for himself and there is no need at all for me to try to justify his selection at 9, but I know that my pick at 10 will cause debate. For me it is simple, at his best Jonny was the most complete outside half of the last 40 years. Maybe not as flashy or silky as some others, but he could play, make no mistake, and could get those around him playing as well. He kicks off both feet, and importantly in todays game, can defend. All round, a great player.

Mike Gibson again speaks for himself at 12. He was at the end of his career when I was born, but a true legend of the game and would slot in nicely alongside Danie Gerber outside him. His hard running of off Gibson's intelligent play, now that is a partnership.

The wingers were easy to pick. The Aussie was simply magic at times, and the Kiwi changed the face of modern rugby in 1995. There have been other greats on the wings, but these two were both special.

And lastly at full back I pick a man who for me is peerless. He had it all, and stands alone in his position. Some players who achieve greatness get referred to solely by their first name, and everyone knows who people mean. This man goes one step further, and needs no name to be said, step forward and take a bow, JPR.

So that's my team. People who came close for me were, 'Buck' Shelford, a true warrior, Joost van der Westhuizen, a wonderful player who I always enjoyed watching, and Christian Cullen, a player who at his best was undefendable with ball in hand.

There are of course many more, but I have waffled enough now and have work to do, so that's it from me, in the words of the folks from Dragons Den, 'I'm Out'.

1 Leaonard
2 Wood
3 Carl Hayman
4 Matfield
5 Martin Johnson (C)
6 Richard Hill
7 Mcaw
8 Dallaglio
9 Dawson
10 Dan Carter
11 Jonah Lomu
12 Greenwood
13 Brian O'Driscoll
14 David Campese
15 Jason Robinson / Cristian Cullen

Maybe not the greatest but that team would tear any opposition apart.

My favourite team of players I've seen:

1. Tom Smith
2. Keith Wood
3. Phil Vickery
4. Martin Johnson
5. Doddie Weir
6. Jason White
7. Richie McCaw
8. Sergio Parisse
9. Rob Howley
10.Gregor Townsend
11.Jonah Lomu
12.Scott Gibbs
13.Brian O'Driscoll
14.Jeff Wilson
15.Christian Cullen

Probably not the best XV, players like Matfield, Joost, Horan and Campese would make that, but these guys were all personal favourites to watch.

OK I've only included players that I've seen play so mine would be:

15 Christian Cullen
14 Jason Robinson
13 Brian O'Driscoll
12 Frank Bunce
11 Jonah Lomu
10 Dan Carter
9 Joost Van der westheivan(sp)
8 Zin Zan Brooke
7 Ritchie McCaw
6 Richard Hill
5 Paul O'Connell
4 Martin Johnson
3 Carl Hayman
2 Keith Wood
1 Phil Vickery

Not too sure on the props.

A few tight calls there so honorable mentions to Neil Back, Doug Howlett, Tana Umaga, Victor Matfield, Brad Thorn, Tim Horan, Sergio Parisse, Shane Williams, Yanick Jauzion and Joe Roff.

I've gone for players that I actually remember playing. I think the forwards would dominate in the tight and still be able to run amock in the loose.

15. Serge Blanco
14. Shane Williams
13. Jeremy Guscott
12. Will Greenwood
11. Emile N'tamack
10. Jonathon Davies
9. Gary Armstrong

1. Tom Smith
2. Keith Wood
3. Dai Young
4. Victor Matfield
5. John Eales
6. Francois Pienaar
7. Josh Kronfeld
8. Abdel Benazzi

mckay1402 - how could you select N'tamack?! Do you not remember 1995!?

1 Jason Leonard
2 Sean Fitzpatrick
3 Al Baxter. Just kidding. Olo Brown.
4 Colin Meads
5 John Eales
6 Michael Jones
7 Richie McCaw
8 Zinzan Brooke
9 Gareth Edwards
10 Dan Carter
11 Jonah Lomu
12 Tim Horan
13 Philippe Sella
14 John Kirwan
15 Christian Cullen

well no actually I can't but I can remember him scoring some pretty decent tries. he was a superb winger. Should I assume that he scored a last minute try against Scotland?

Actually now I'm reading about it I do remember it. Well it's this sort of thing that made him so good...

1 Jason Leonard
2 Sean Fitzpatrick
3 Olo Brown
4 Ian Jones
5 John Eales
6 Francois Pienaar
7 Michael Jones
8 Zinzan Brooke
9 Gareth Edwards
10 Phil Bennett
11 Jonah Lomu
12 Jeremy Guscott
13 Mike Gibson
14 David Campese
15 Christian Cullen

Because I couldn't quite make up my mind I went for a squad of players that I have watched play.

1 Os duRant
2 Sean Fitzpatrick (c)
3 Olo Brown.
4 Martin Johnson
5 John Eales
6 Michael Jones
7 Richie McCaw
8 Zinzan Brooke
9 Joost Van etc
10 Dan Carter
11 David Campese
12 Tim Horan
13 Philippe Sella
14 Geoff Wilson
15 Christian Cullen

16 Jason Leonard
17 Keith Wood
18 Victor Matfield
19 Lawrence Dallaglio
20 George Gregan
21 Andrew Merthens
22 Tana Umaga

Seems like I should have Gareth Edwards but I have never seen him play or Gerber.
Am I one of the few not to pick Lomu?

nganboy wrote:Am I one of the few not to pick Lomu?

He's rated much higher outside NZ than in NZ I always feel.

That's what I said the other day

nganboy wrote:That's what I said the other day

Its true though. I think until recently we have put England on a pedestal here and his demolition of England and France (our strongest teams) caught many eyes.

maestegmafia wrote:Apart from John Galagher is that team a full kiwi team?

Geez Maestig, talk about the pot and kettle. Yes gallagher is one of the very few rare players any good to make it into the ABs where his rugby was learned elsewhere, unlike some teams I know.

And hows the coaching Maestig? Need any more?

My favourite - and totally irrational XV:

O. Du Randt (SA)
K. Wood (Ire)
J. Leonard (Eng)
O. Roumat (Fra)
V. Matfield (SA)
R. Hill (Eng)
T. Rodber (Eng)
D. Richards (Eng)

J. van der Westhuizen (SA)
G. Townsend (Sco)
J. Lomu (NZ)
P. Sella (Fra)
B. O'Driscol (Ire)
J. Robinson (Eng)
C. Cullen (NZ)

M. Castrogiavanni (Ity)
S. Fitzpatrick (NZ)
S. Shaw (Eng)
G. Smith (Aus)
R. Howley (Wal)
F. Contepomi (Arg)
J. Lewsey (Eng)

15 Christian Cullen
14 David Campese
13 Jason Robinson
12 Jonah Lomu
11 Shane Williams
10 Dan Carter
9 Gareth Edwards

8 Zinzan Brooke
7 Ian Jones
6 Francois Pienaar
5 John Eales
4 Martin Johnson
3 Olo Brown
2 Sean Fitzpatrick
1 Jason Leonard

I looked at that backline...
and I jizzed in my pants

I did a poll on this last year and it caused an unbelievable amount of handbags.

I can only provide a first and second XV and say that I have seen various players live and video footage of all of them. I'm 34.

MY GREATEST – First XV

15: Christian Cullen (New Zealand)
14: David Campese (Australia)
13: Philippe Sella (France)
12: Mike Gibson (Ireland)
11: Jonah Lomu (New Zealand)

10: Phil Bennett (Wales)
9: Gareth Edwards (Wales)

8: Zinzan Brooke (New Zealand)
7: Michael Jones (New Zealand)
6: Richard Hill (England)
5: Colin Meades (New Zealand)
4: Frik du Preez (South Africa)
3: Graham Price (Wales)
2: Sean Fitzpatrick (New Zealand)
1: Os du Randt (South Africa)

MY GREATEST – Second XV
(Runners Up, No Players From First XV Permitted)

15: Andy Irvine (Scotland)
14: Gerald Davies (Wales)
13: Danie Gerber (South Africa)
12: Tim Horan (Australia)
11: John Kirwan (New Zealand)

10: Barry John (Wales)
9: Joost van der Westhuizen (South Africa)

8: Wayne Shelford (New Zealand)
7: Richie McCaw (New Zealand)
6: Ian Kirkpatrick (New Zealand)
5: John Eales (Australia)
4: Martin Johnson (England)
3: Fran Cotton (England)
2: John Smit (South Africa)
1: Jason Leonard (England)

Viet Gwent
Willie John
Jonno
Pienaar
Merv
M Jones

Gareth
Carter

Gerald
Bateman
Sella
Kirwin

JPR

The Lomu question is interesting - I think it probably is true to say that he's rated higher outside NZ. I think that this may be down to some kind of reverse prejudice - he's so popular, it's not fashionable to like him.

But take a look at the stats: still the youngest ever All Black test player (19 years, 45 days), still the holder of the most tries scored in a World Cup, RWC 95 Player of the Tournament, International Hall of Famer and a Commonwealth Games gold medallist (for 7's).

Incredible.

George Carlin

I'm 69 and saw all the players in your 1st and 2nd Greatest XVs playing live. I reckon you've made excellent picks.

Optimist - respect to that, you're a very lucky man.

But Lomu never won a world cup so he must be useless

Taylorman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Apart from John Galagher is that team a full kiwi team?

Geez Maestig, talk about the pot and kettle. Yes gallagher is one of the very few rare players any good to make it into the ABs where his rugby was learned elsewhere, unlike some teams I know.

And hows the coaching Maestig? Need any more?

That is the most moronic reply I have read. Sort your attitude out before you reply in the future.