The most important Welsh rugby game for a generation?

To avoid duplicate topics this thread isn't about our changes against Samoa but more to put the idea out there that this game against Samoa on Sunday morning is the most important game for at least 10 years. We win and we have 2 games to use as build up for a QF against possibly Australia (I beleive that by the time we meet Fiji their world cup hopes will be gone so don't expect the same challenge as they provided us 4 years ago). We lose and that's it, WG is likely to leave, many excellent players will never play in a world cup ever again and I think we'd take a long time to get over it(esecially given our narrow defeat to SA). It could really harm us going into the next 12/24 months of international games.

Do other posters agree or can they shed light on other games that have held higher signifance to this one? Maybe going even further back than 10 years? Could this be the most important Welsh rugby game of all time? Ok, i might be getting ahead of myself but as a relative newcomer to rugby (only been a proper fan for the last 4-6 years) so hoping more seasoned fans can put this game into its rightful context.

Looking forward to your input.

Nope I would probably agree with that. massively important to Wales

If we assume that none of the Northern Hemisphere teams will actually win the tournament anyway, then you could say that one of Wales' Grand Slam securing games in 05 or 08 were bigger.

I also think you don't do justice to how many good players you seem to have who are plenty young enough to make an impact next time.

That said, if you lose to Samoa then I'd say it's world cup over for you, as I can't seem them losing to Fiji, so it is still a completely massive game, and considering that your management team have been in place for precisely a world cup cycle, it is pretty much the culmination of four years work.

Good luck with it. Should be a great one for neutrals. Will be keeping a close eye on Fa'asavalu (Quins player). Him vs Warburton should be fascinating.

HERSH wrote:

Fair reflection HERSH, was even considering deleting due to the lack of interest. Let's hope your interaction brings the masses though!

Fair point I guess, we're capable of winning Grand Slams but on the global scene that doesn't amount to much. Saturday saw a very different Wales side, organised, composed and good in the contact area. We need the same performance against Samoa or many will think that the SA game was a flash in the pan. (I don't irrespective) - People also seem to be talking about Samoa as the lesser nation here, a nation that has recently beaten Australia in their own back yard. If Wales can get out of this group then they will have nothing to fear in the 1/4's and maybe there will be some pressure off then. However, if we fail to beat Samoa our RWC is over. Showtime awaits and "Sunday bloody Sunday" may never sound the same again

I feel like the Pied piper sometimes, I think its a good post by the way.

and it is a really important game for Wales, imagine the fallout if they lose to Samoa, again.

Wales should treat this game as they would versus a 6N side,and play there natural game.I think now they have won a match SA will only get stronger and will win the group.
Play your strongest side,have your most creative backline the game won`t be won up front.Your setpiece/breakdown should equal Samoa,keep your defensive lines,and play your natural game.

I would like the SA performance to become our "natural game" - Our natural game at RWC's in the past has been of the headless chicken variety and we have ended up being the filling of a hot Vindaloo

We now have a captain who leads by example.

RubyGuby wrote: If Wales can get out of this group then they will have nothing to fear in the 1/4's

Except Australia

Big difference between fear and respect.

I think an oz-wales 1/4 would be one hell of a match, probably better than anything that would follow, i.e teams being scared to play because they have more to lose. I certainly wouldnt fear the result as much as i did the SA game, reckon we would run them all the way, especially if we got quick turnover ball and got toby and his crew running straight down the coopsters channel. I certainly dont think that the oz forwards are quite the same as the saffers, not as domineering, plus the way sams playing it would be a hell of a tussle between him and pocock.

Cant wait for sunday early o'clock

Cymroglan wrote:We now have a captain who leads by example.

I stressed this massively as a reason for being hopeful at this world cup, sure hes young, but who wouldnt follow that guy wherever he was going?! We've got a 6 who loves nothing more than to do the really dirty work and a number 8 who is a real threat making gains with ball in hand.

I dont remember the last time we had any of that PLUS a working front 5 providing a solid (enough) platform.

but yes, on topic, this game is massive for us, if we play to the same level as the previous game, we'll win well enough and I'll rest a lot easier knowing that SA wasnt our 'world cup final'.

Good luck Wales! Wanted you to beat the boks!

Rugby Uberlord wrote:Good luck Wales! Wanted you to beat the boks!

Thanks mate

I'm not sure if its just nerves, but why are us Welsh so afraid of Samoa?

Based on current form, we nearly took down a very good Springbok side, we have a very fit team, and plenty of strong runners and defenders. Our backrow is finally very good technically and are all decent ball carriers, we have a strong front row.

Not wanting to shoot myself in the foot, and no disrespect to Samoa, but Namibia perhaps made them look good. Watching the game the defense was nearly non existent for most of the tries.

IronMike wrote:I'm not sure if its just nerves, but why are us Welsh so afraid of Samoa?

Based on current form, we nearly took down a very good Springbok side, we have a very fit team, and plenty of strong runners and defenders. Our backrow is finally very good technically and are all decent ball carriers, we have a strong front row.

Not wanting to shoot myself in the foot, and no disrespect to Samoa, but Namibia perhaps made them look good. Watching the game the defense was nearly non existent for most of the tries.

Fiji put nearly 50 points on this Namibia side that has (correct me if im wrong) never won a world cup test match and are the lowest ranked team in the competition.

Was just looking at some world cup stats regarding Wales vs Samoa.

One thing that sticks out, during world cups Wales have played Samoa twice and lost twice.

So I think Welsh fans should have a reason to be nervous, as a neutral I just hope its a cracking match as both teams seem to be playing well at the moment.

I'm confused, help me out guys.

I should want Wales to win being a home nation plus I was disapointed that you didn't stuff the Bok's, but on the other hand I'd love it if Samoa won, again??????

being british we naturally want the underdog to win. Although on results Samoa shouldn't be the underdog they have everything stacked against them. we love to see people rising against adversity

having said that i don't want samoa to win...

HERSH wrote:I'm confused, help me out guys.

I should want Wales to win being a home nation plus I was disapointed that you didn't stuff the Bok's, but on the other hand I'd love it if Samoa won, again??????

You're battling the problem that is sympathy hersh, dont worry, by february thatll be long gone and youll be back to wanting everyone to stuff us

HERSH wrote:I'm confused, help me out guys.

I should want Wales to win being a home nation plus I was disapointed that you didn't stuff the Bok's, but on the other hand I'd love it if Samoa won, again??????

You keep supporting the underdog?

I think this is probably our biggest game of the last 10 years.

Yes there were Grand Slams but this is the WC.

I expect us to win on Sunday and also the rest of our group games.

As for this Welsh team, I am not sure if it one by design or default. Throughout his tenure I think Gatland has made many mistakes and his thinking has sometimes been muddled.

However we have arrived here with what is effectively the changing of the (old) guard and the emergence of some good young players that could be here for the next 3 world cups and that has to be a good thing.

This World Cup will see the international swansong of Shane, Steve Jones, Byrne. The thing is that will only make the team stronger in my view.

I look forward to a GS in 2012.

Let's not get carried away - it's just the most important since the last most important game!

In six attempts we have a 50% record in getting beyond the pool stage, I've lost count of the number of "most important" games I've watched Wales play.

It's important because it's the next game, it's the world cup and we all want to see Wales perform well on the world stage. If we loose I'll be gutted - but I was gutted when we lost to the BaBas in the last minute a few months back. If you're a Welsh rugby fan - every game is the "most important".

I think one of the most important games for the last 10 years was last week,

If Wales had beated SA it would have been our most important victory since beating Aus in thr 1987 WC 3rd place playoff.

The Samoa game is now very important for this young side,

I feel confident, and a 1/4 against Aus should be a cracker.

The most important Welsh rugby game for a generation?

Dont be so silly this game is no where near the importance of a Grand slam winning game...
Wales aren't going to win this cup, regardless of whether we beat Fiji and or Samoa.
It would be nice to beat Samoa, but I won't be broken hearted or cheesed off if we don't and my day will carry on as normal.

Beating England in the World Cup warm up game was far more important.

But that game has already been won. It's the most important one because it's the next one you can do anything about.

If Wales lose it'll be a big kick in nuts. If they win, well they should shouldn't they?

HammerofThunor wrote:But that game has already been won. It's the most important one because it's the next one you can do anything about.

If Wales lose it'll be a big kick in nuts. If they win, well they should shouldn't they?

No... Wales don't have a god given right to win rugby games, and Wales and Samoa are fairly even...
This is as close to Apia as Samoa will ever get as a home game in the world Cup.
Wales and Samoa have a 4-3 win record so it's all up in the air, and it will be a big achievement for Wales to win, though I do back them to do it.

It's a WC game it should be the most important to you all till the next one!

Good luck Wales, I actually find myself wanting you to win this one. As a neutral I hope you do as the game vs Oz should be immense.

As an aside, I get the feel from your team that a lot of it has come together irrespective of the coaches actions rather then because of them. And that seems to be a good thing.

This is Wales most important game since last Sunday thats for sure

georgestowersbiceps wrote:To avoid duplicate topics this thread isn't about our changes against Samoa but more to put the idea out there that this game against Samoa on Sunday morning is the most important game for at least 10 years. We win and we have 2 games to use as build up for a QF against possibly Australia (I beleive that by the time we meet Fiji their world cup hopes will be gone so don't expect the same challenge as they provided us 4 years ago). We lose and that's it, WG is likely to leave, many excellent players will never play in a world cup ever again and I think we'd take a long time to get over it(esecially given our narrow defeat to SA). It could really harm us going into the next 12/24 months of international games.

Do other posters agree or can they shed light on other games that have held higher signifance to this one? Maybe going even further back than 10 years? Could this be the most important Welsh rugby game of all time? Ok, i might be getting ahead of myself but as a relative newcomer to rugby (only been a proper fan for the last 4-6 years) so hoping more seasoned fans can put this game into its rightful context.

Looking forward to your input.

Boy... Nothing like putting a bit of pressure on your team....

Maybe a wee bit late on this point but agree about Warburton. Barring a terrible injury scenario he should be providing leadership within the squad for a good few years ahead and when was the last time we had a back rower who has made so many line-breaks and individual turnovers at such a young age. When's the last time we had a captain who led by example this much, let alone one this young? If that wasn't enough, Tipuric seems to be molding into a very similar type of player at the Liberty.

Progressively, every group game remaining will take on the mantle of most important game if we come through the previous one successfully. Only the promised land of the QF's will officially mark these four years down as more sucessful than the four before them.

Every game is the most important game, we are always on the cusp of a great leap forward and even though in recent history we have made several leaps forward we are still very much knocking on the door but failing to open it.

Pathetic use of metaphor but you get the drift

"we are still very much knocking on the door but failing to open it."

Maybe there's a door bell somewhere?

Knowsit17 wrote:Maybe a wee bit late on this point but agree about Warburton. Barring a terrible injury scenario he should be providing leadership within the squad for a good few years ahead and when was the last time we had a back rower who has made so many line-breaks and individual turnovers at such a young age. When's the last time we had a captain who led by example this much, let alone one this young? If that wasn't enough, Tipuric seems to be molding into a very similar type of player at the Liberty.

Progressively, every group game remaining will take on the mantle of most important game if we come through the previous one successfully. Only the promised land of the QF's will officially mark these four years down as more sucessful than the four before them.

You had it with your previous captain!!!
Utter disrespect to Matthew Rees, a Lions hooker, under-rated until he became injured, down to earth, and always led from the front, and probably was the first name that Gatland pencilled in each match. He was also instrumental in negotiating the player WC performance bonus.

the thing is people say about samoa beating wales twice in the world cups, most receant one was what 12 years ago??? why should that affect us, i mean completely different teams and wales last match v samoa they won (and didnt biggar have a shocker) there is nothing to feel, we took on one of the most physical sides in the world cup and matched them and in certain areas dominated them.

I wonder if Wales can finally put to rest their defeats to those Giants of the SH, Samoa and Fiji, because these 2 behemoths of the game have destroyed what were certain Welsh shoo-in's to win previous World cups.

Who can honestly forget 4 years ago, when an unbeatable Welsh side came to grief against those pesky Fijians. Oh how i cried and cried when Wales were humiliated, and then i wiped those tears of mirth off my self- satisfied and very pleased face, and then thought this might happen again in another world cup. Well, its not Fiji this time and i hope the result is different!! Honest!!! C'mon Wales, all of England are behind you.

Sure you beat Samoa in your last match but if I recall it was a close run thing and you had home advantage.... Sundays match will be as close to a home RWC tie to Samoa as they will ever get no matter how much Welsh support turns up.

Wales should take a lot of positives from last weekends match but performing well and winning under pressure are two different things. Against SA they had nothing to lose... they were the underdog, they had another chance if things didn't go their way.... this time they are the favourites, they have no more cards left if they lose.. its a completely different mindset.

Who will win... too difficult to tell really, its going to be one intense match though and I expect the physios of both sides to be on overtime post match.

english warrior wrote:I wonder if Wales can finally put to rest their defeats to those Giants of the SH, Samoa and Fiji, because these 2 behemoths of the game have destroyed what were certain Welsh shoo-in's to win previous World cups.

Actually the 1999 defeat was avenged when we smashed them by 50 points in 2000!

We were all over Samoa in 2009, and in 2010 stuck half a weak team out against Fiji and almost came unstuck.
Hell even 2007 had a lot of iffy things in it that made the game that way. We out scored Fiji in tries, Stephen Jones missed nearly all his kicks. Late and dangerous tackles went unpunished that simply wouldnt of happened with a northern hemisphere referee.

I doubt Samoa will get away with any rough stuff on Sunday, Alain Rolland is a fussy referee in the tackle and isn't afraid to card players.

Alyn:

You are taking a chance having a go at S Jones for exiting the 2007 RWC, Flyhalf will come up with some story it was Hook's fault, I remember 2003 RWC when S Jones kicked another poor clearance when we were up on the score board to Robinson and the rest is history. Not a great record for S Jones, hope he does not play in this RWC.

Most people won't have an issue with Stephen Jones having a swansong run-out in the RWC as long as he doesn't kick the ball (out of hand or off the tee) and doesn't try and run it.

Just pop up passes to Roberts & North for 20 mins before Hooky goes to 10 and all will be fine.