Will Ospreys lose (Ulster gain) Bowe in the summer?

by Kingshu Wed 16 Nov 2011, 4:39 pm

Theres normally a lot of talk but it seams this summer is the year it could happen, Bowe returns to Ulster.

What do Ospreys fans think about their chances of keeping Bowe?
Do you wish to keep him as much as in prev years?
would it free up a NWQ player spot for another position?

What do Ulster fans think of the chances of getting Bowe back?
Do we need him as much as we used to?
Could the unthinkable happen and he moves to another Province?

Does it all depend on how well the Ospreys and Ulster do this year and he'll go with the one he sees as having the best chance of winning things with?

Have to say the current Ulster squad with Bowe added would scare any team (plus whatever else Humph manages in the summer).

by **rodders** Wed 16 Nov 2011, 4:46 pm

Kingshu wrote:
What do Ulster fans think of the chances of getting Bowe back?
Do we need him as much as we used to?
Could the unthinkable happen and he moves to another Province?

I think we've a good chance of getting him back. With the emergence of Gilroy, Spence and D'arcy we don't need him as much as we used to but I'd love to see him back. It would be the biggest signing we could make IMO.

I'd have no problem if he went to another province as I like to see the best players in the country and the other provinces doing well. I think he'd be the perfect replacement for Horgan and Leinster would be a perfect for him but then Howlett is no spring chicken at Munster either.

I hope he comes back to where he belongs though Wink

.

by Standulstermen Wed 16 Nov 2011, 4:51 pm

I've already said it on another thread. Munster would be ideal for him. Ulster dont need him as much but still wouldnt turn our noses up at him.

Where would he fit in though? In place of Gilroy you would assume. Not going to displace Cave or Spence at 13 and he isnt a 12. You would imagine Trimble is safe too.

A lot will ultimately depend on the relative successes of Ulster/ANother province and the O's and also his form. He has looked out of sorts since and during the RWC but i think this is more to do with fitness.

by Rava Wed 16 Nov 2011, 4:54 pm

Rodders

. No smoke without fire mate.

Leinster and/or Munster will attempt to take him ahead of Ulster. A lot will depend on how hungry he is for success, and where he best see that happening. Another QF spot for us in this years HC might just convince him to come back "home".

by **rodders** Wed 16 Nov 2011, 4:58 pm

Rava wrote:Rodders . No smoke without fire mate.

That depends who's blowing the smoke Rava Very Happy

!........

by Standulstermen Wed 16 Nov 2011, 4:59 pm

I see Eddie O'Sullivan has quit the US job as well. Any chance of a coaching role for him in Ireland or is he worth it?

by thebandwagonsociety Wed 16 Nov 2011, 5:02 pm

Leinster will reluctantly trade Carr to Ospreys for Tommy.
Any takers
Anybody
Tumbleweed

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Wed 16 Nov 2011, 5:03 pm

Isn't EOS going for the England job?

by **rodders** Wed 16 Nov 2011, 5:07 pm

EOS is a brilliant manager. Like he says you can't whisk an egg with a cheesegrater. Legend. Get him back here!

by Rava Wed 16 Nov 2011, 5:10 pm

Standulstermen wrote:I see Eddie O'Sullivan has quit the US job as well. Any chance of a coaching role for him in Ulster or is he worth it?

Feic off Stand we don't want him!! Wink

by maestegmafia Wed 16 Nov 2011, 5:17 pm

To be honest Bowe hasn't performed well for a while, looks slower than he did a few years ago when he arrived at the Ospreys.

There are plenty of young players snapping at his heels but his reputation and experience see him in front.

I dont think he would be a massive loss to the Os should he go.

by Kingshu Wed 16 Nov 2011, 5:21 pm

My own thoughts are;

He would benefit from a central contact, he's getting to the stage where he'll need rested to get teh best out of him, Ospreys have been good at releasing him for Irish duty, but could do with more rest. Think his forms off as he needs a good rest.

At Ulster over the last few years i've been really really wanting to see him return, however this year I don't feel it as strong, but would still love it.

I think we could do with him, just as an experience top level player to help in the tighter games. With Danielli leaving an experienced back would be missed.

I think Ospreys will be desperite to keep him, Williams isn't far of retiring, and they will also want to keep an experienced back. If he left they would prob get in another NWQ winger, prob for SH as they can play during 6 nations.

I'd rather see him stay at Ospreys than move to another Province.
This may sound bad, but the way I see it what makes the Provinces special, is that if your from a Province and are good enough you play for that Province, its the home pride that makes them. Player only leave if they can't play for there home Province. Bowe is good enough to play for Ulster so if in Ireland its Ulster he should play for.

If we lose that Home pride, then you'll pave the way for of players moving to the current best province and make it harder for the others to hold onto their players and grow. Also fans prefer to see their own local players, it keeps that connection

by Kingshu Wed 16 Nov 2011, 5:29 pm

On the EOS front, I saw him on BBC2 for an Ulster game,

I actually thought at the time he was wanting the Ulster job, as he had a red white and blue tie, and a poppy on.

by Standulstermen Wed 16 Nov 2011, 5:51 pm

I wouldnt mind EOS at Ulster as a coach Rava. Not sure how it would work with McL mind you although they worked together for ireland.

EOS has done plenty of Ulster coverage for the beeb Kings. Did a few games last season too

by Don Alfonso Wed 16 Nov 2011, 10:14 pm

I'd take both in a heartbeat. Assuming we don't have Danielli next year, our two primary wingers will be Gilroy and Trimble.

Who's our back-up under that? An out-of-position centre, Spence or Whitten? Conor Gaston? Chris Cochrane? And out-of-poistion D'Arcy? In losing McCrea, Seymour (who looked pretty handy), McIlwane and Smth we got rid of some fellas who weren't fantastic by any stretch of the imagination, but who have a bit of experience, and can do a job. We need another winger, and they need to be IQ.

Comical Eddie would do wonders for what culd be a very potent backline.

by Standulstermen Wed 16 Nov 2011, 10:25 pm

Im inclined to agree with you on EOS Don. When you consider the rugby we played under Eddie for Ireland we may have underacheived but we played some fantastic stuff.

I would love to see Bowe back but we also need to see if Nelson/Gaston/Gilroy will make it. There is room to do both i think but i do think Munsters need in this area is greater than ours. (however i am selfish so screw them)

by Don Alfonso Wed 16 Nov 2011, 11:03 pm

Ha ha - nice final thought, Stand.

The youngsters would still very much get their shot. Trimble and Bowe will probably feature in the 6N (although who really knows in 2013?). In their absence, Gilroy would have to be joined by another youngster.

by Cari Thu 17 Nov 2011, 9:13 am

Kingshu wrote:Theres normally a lot of talk but it seams this summer is the year it could happen, Bowe returns to Ulster.

What do Ospreys fans think about their chances of keeping Bowe? 50/50. It's entirely up to Tommy, but he did only sign for three years, and that's up at the end of this season I think (if I've done the maths right!).
Do you wish to keep him as much as in prev years? Would love the O's to keep him, but I'd also like to see him continue to enjoy his rugby and excel in it. If that does mean he has to go to another club, then it's up to him, and I'd be happy for him.
Would it free up a NWQ player spot for another position? I wasn't sure what you meant there...but when Tommy isn't available for the O's, they just reshuffle the pack a bit to cover, and we have some talented players coming up through the ranks.

by Standulstermen Thu 17 Nov 2011, 9:19 am

AS i understood it Bowe signed a 2 year deal with a 3rd year option. The two years will be up at the end of this season

by Cari Thu 17 Nov 2011, 9:20 am

Standulstermen wrote:AS i understood it Bowe signed a 2 year deal with a 3rd year option. The two years will be up at the end of this season

by **rodders** Thu 17 Nov 2011, 9:23 am

On EOS, he said that he's looking for a job closer to home. Stand I know he's commented on BBCNI before but not for a while so perhaps he is looking at some sort of role at Ulster?

Where's Geoff when you need him??

I'd love to see EOS work with Ulster. I think after the RWC 2007 disaster people have forgotten all the good things he did with Ireland.

The only thing I'd be worried about is he might drop Ferris and bring in Simon Easterbuy..... Sad

by Standulstermen Thu 17 Nov 2011, 9:32 am

On PR they mentioned he had been linked with Cardiff this morning. Im not convinced about McLaughlin as a head coach but at the same time you cant argue with the progression of the team under him and Humph Sr.

My issue is with all the ex players in the set up. Longwell, Bell, Doak, Clarke, Davidson, McCall etc

I think our coaching perspective is too narrow. I know Davidson played in france and McCall is now thriving at Saracens but other than that there isnt really the experience of different styles and different perspectives to bring onto the training pitch. I think we need a fresh approach (moreso in the backs) to help McLaughlin. EOS would offer this but i suspect he would have to be head coach if he came to Ulster.

by **rodders** Thu 17 Nov 2011, 9:42 am

Well stand to be fair Muller is the forward coach now.

I agree though I think it can be healthy to have that outside perspective, provided you don't dilute your identity.

Our attacking play hasn't been great at times and when we don't dominate up front we tend to be found wanting. We do rely heaviliy on individual brilliance from the likes of IHumph too to create things.

Our angles of running were very poor against Clermont and we really didn't capitalise enough on alot of really strong forward carries from he likes of Touhy and Ferris.

by johnnymonaghan Thu 17 Nov 2011, 11:46 am

Given EOS's relationship with Davy Humps, is it not a tad unlikely that he will feature at Ulster?

I'm not suggesting that there is no mutual respect etc but is there too much history?

by Dorothy_Mantooth Thu 17 Nov 2011, 11:52 am

Standulstermen wrote:AS i understood it Bowe signed a 2 year deal with a 3rd year option. The two years will be up at the end of this season

What do these 3rd year options mean?

by Cari Thu 17 Nov 2011, 11:54 am

Dot - it meant that if Tommy wants to stay on after two years he wouldn't have to re-negotiate a new contract, and likewise, if he wants to go after two years he's not restricted, I think.

by Dorothy_Mantooth Thu 17 Nov 2011, 1:23 pm

Cari wrote:Dot - it meant that if Tommy wants to stay on after two years he wouldn't have to re-negotiate a new contract, and likewise, if he wants to go after two years he's not restricted, I think.

So as far as the club is concerned its really a 2 year deal? As after the 2nd year they have no control over wither the player stays or not. I have heard of these deals in Scotland before, the sell deals to the media as being 3 year deals, but the players usually leave after 2.

Thanks for the explanation.

by Breadvan Thu 17 Nov 2011, 1:37 pm

I'd be diasappointed if Tommy left, but you can't blame him for wanting to return home if he does leave. He's been an absolute legend for us over the past 4 yrs. Intercept try v Scarlets my personal favourite. Disagree with what MM has posted. He's still got it imo..

by Cari Thu 17 Nov 2011, 1:38 pm

I'm guessing there Dot, I'm never sure how sports contracts work, they all seem to be a rule unto themselves.

Breadvan - steady on there fella, we'll do the post mortem when it happens eh? But yeah Tommy still has IT. Always has IT. Always will Smile

by pete (buachaill on eirne) Thu 17 Nov 2011, 2:04 pm

I'd love Bowe to move back to Ireland, preferably Connacht or Ulster. Mainly Ulster I think.

by **rodders** Thu 17 Nov 2011, 2:07 pm

Connacht!

Why the flip would Bowe go to Connacht?? The guy is one of the best wingers in the game and still at his peak!

by Rory_Gallagher Thu 17 Nov 2011, 2:10 pm

Do Ulster really need him? We already have Trimble, Gilroy, Danielli, Gaston and others who can play wing. If Bowe comes back, I could see Gilroy's development being halted. Even if Gilroy was showing better form, he would have to be playing a LOT better than Bowe or Trimble to get ahead of them. I couldn't see him displacing either of them just because of their reputations.

by Cari Thu 17 Nov 2011, 2:11 pm

Pete - that's not a bad idea. I'd like Tommy to go to Connacht. Could be a nice little pre-retirement job for him, and I fancy Galway Wink

by Kingshu Thu 17 Nov 2011, 2:36 pm

Cari wrote: and I fancy Galway

What all of it?

by Kingshu Thu 17 Nov 2011, 2:41 pm

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Do Ulster really need him? We already have Trimble, Gilroy, Danielli, Gaston and others who can play wing. If Bowe comes back, I could see Gilroy's development being halted. Even if Gilroy was showing better form, he would have to be playing a LOT better than Bowe or Trimble to get ahead of them. I couldn't see him displacing either of them just because of their reputations.

I don't think Danielli, will get a new contract, so Bowe would take his spot, Gilroy would get plenty of games, might not be ahead of Bowe and Trimble, but they aren't going to play every game and will be on Ireland duty, Gilroy could learn more from Bowe as well.

by geoff998rugby Thu 17 Nov 2011, 2:59 pm

Hi guys - been away a bit. Lost my password and then work made me too busy.

My two pennies worth on Bowe and EOS.

Bowe is indeed free to make a change next summer.
However I am not convinced it is Ulster. We need to spend big money out on new NIQ contracts next year - two needed in positions 6 to 9 - can we afford him ?
We would like him, especially, if the NIQ does go down to 4, which is what is being touted. Interestingly all of the 3 senior provinces have their contracts aligned to make this possible.

All could do with him:

Ulster as a replacement for Danielli
Leinster as a replacement for Horgan and Carr
Munster as a replacement for Howlett

As for steady Eddie I just can't see him working under Humph - too much history. Also unlikely to accept McLaughlin as his boss. He would make a decent backs coach though.

Trying his hand in England or France seems more likely to me

by Cari Thu 17 Nov 2011, 3:02 pm

Kinghu - I've never been to Galway so I'm willing to give it a whirl Wink

by **rodders** Thu 17 Nov 2011, 3:04 pm

Welcome back Geoff!!! Yahoo

by MrsP Thu 17 Nov 2011, 3:18 pm

Team sheet if EOS came to Ravenhill would be 80% empty.

He would never be able to cope with having to select Ulstermen week in week out!

by Standulstermen Thu 17 Nov 2011, 4:35 pm

Good to see you posting again Geoff.

Do you think Henry and Faloon are now considered 7's then if we are to look out for a 6? What about Pedrie? I love the big man but do you think Ulster might let him go?

by **rodders** Thu 17 Nov 2011, 4:40 pm

What about Diack? He seems to be out in the cold at the minute. He can cover 6 and 8.

Is the situation that bleak with Ferris that we are looking at an imminent replacement or are we just looking to boost our squad depth?

by Shifty Thu 17 Nov 2011, 7:53 pm

I think it's very likely, Nikki Walker the Scottish winger is likely to go, I wouldn't be suprised if Bowe goes also. the wage bill needs trimming apparently due to the poor attendences and lack of money the region is generating. Shane has signed a 2 year deal, so he will obviously have one space.

Secondly Dirksen, Eli Walker, Tom Prydie need chances to play, not to mention 19 year old Luke Morgan who is apparently on fire at the moment. Something has to give because all this Welsh talent cannot go to waste.

by geoff998rugby Fri 18 Nov 2011, 9:31 am

Standulstermen wrote:Good to see you posting again Geoff.

Do you think Henry and Faloon are now considered 7's then if we are to look out for a 6? What about Pedrie? I love the big man but do you think Ulster might let him go?

If we assume that it is 4 NIQ next year, which seems to be the case, then my take is that Danielli will not be replaced.
Pienaer will be re-signed/has re-signed (I don't know). Muller re-signing is a big plus in making this happen.
If he didn't re-sign we would get another 9. I think he will stay.
With Muller and Afoa already signed up that leaves one NIQ slot and that will be in the back row.

I honestly believe we will be on the look out for 2 players to complement Ferris, Henry, Faloon, Diack and McCormish. No one coming through is close so that is 2 imports - 1 IQ and 1 NIQ.
One will be a 7 and one will be a 6/8. Given the lack of genuine 7's in Irish rugby the 7 may have to be NIQ in which case it is bye bye Pedere.

Having said that we may. again fail to persuade a southerner to come north in which case we may just selttle for what we have - a lot of negotiations to be done yet.

by thebandwagonsociety Tue 22 Nov 2011, 9:15 am

geoff998rugby wrote:
Standulstermen wrote:Good to see you posting again Geoff.

Do you think Henry and Faloon are now considered 7's then if we are to look out for a 6? What about Pedrie? I love the big man but do you think Ulster might let him go?

If we assume that it is 4 NIQ next year, which seems to be the case, then my take is that Danielli will not be replaced.
Pienaer will be re-signed/has re-signed (I don't know). Muller re-signing is a big plus in making this happen.
If he didn't re-sign we would get another 9. I think he will stay.
With Muller and Afoa already signed up that leaves one NIQ slot and that will be in the back row.

I honestly believe we will be on the look out for 2 players to complement Ferris, Henry, Faloon, Diack and McCormish. No one coming through is close so that is 2 imports - 1 IQ and 1 NIQ.
One will be a 7 and one will be a 6/8. Given the lack of genuine 7's in Irish rugby the 7 may have to be NIQ in which case it is bye bye Pedere.

Having said that we may. again fail to persuade a southerner to come north in which case we may just selttle for what we have - a lot of negotiations to be done yet.

Geoff, which southerner would Ulster be looking at? Dom Ryan seems to be unusually low in the Leinster backrow pecking order at the minute (McL, SOB, Heaslip as starters, Jennings on the bench and Ruddock getting captained behind them when he is used). Personally I think D Ryan is a better option than McL and Ruddock and should be on the bench with Jennings starting. Might he be a target for you? For his own sake, and Ireland's options down the line, Ulster might be a good option.

by geoff998rugby Tue 22 Nov 2011, 9:31 am

We would love southern player to come north but no one wants to make the move.

McLaughlin, Conway and Ruddock have all turned us down in the last 2 years.

by Rava Tue 22 Nov 2011, 9:41 am

Hi Geoff, good to hear from you again.
What's the news on Ferris. I recently heard there were moves afloat to get him sorted with a job. I would think it will be sooner rather than later though. There was also talk of an operation in USA that was potentially costing 250k but with a limited success rate.

by **rodders** Tue 22 Nov 2011, 9:48 am

geoff998rugby wrote:We would love southern player to come north but no one wants to make the move.

McLaughlin, Conway and Ruddock have all turned us down in the last 2 years.

Does it effect their tax rebate if they move up here?

Whats the thoughts on bringing back Roger Wilson? That would free up an NIQ spot if he replaced Pedre? Any reason why Diack isn't being selected?

by geoff998rugby Tue 22 Nov 2011, 9:59 am

Roger Wilson seems very very happy at Northampton.
We enquired about him last summer too - he said no.

Diack isn't doing the hard yards simple as that - he doesn't deserve to be picked.
To put it crudely - he needs a bomb put up his ar$e

by thebandwagonsociety Tue 22 Nov 2011, 10:17 am

roddersm wrote:
geoff998rugby wrote:We would love southern player to come north but no one wants to make the move.

McLaughlin, Conway and Ruddock have all turned us down in the last 2 years.

Does it effect their tax rebate if they move up here?

Whats the thoughts on bringing back Roger Wilson? That would free up an NIQ spot if he replaced Pedre? Any reason why Diack isn't being selected?

I'd have thought some smart person could figure out a loophole. With the offseason, away games and any downdays during the weeks bundled with a quick train down to Dublin and back, they might keep themselves resident in Ireland for tax and some agreement could happen between IRFU and Ulster on a split of money for services.

by geoff998rugby Tue 22 Nov 2011, 10:34 am

If they play for Ulster they must pay British tax - no loop hole.

This has been looked into believe me

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