Will Ospreys lose (Ulster gain) Bowe in the summer?

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Theres normally a lot of talk but it seams this summer is the year it could happen, Bowe returns to Ulster.

What do Ospreys fans think about their chances of keeping Bowe?
Do you wish to keep him as much as in prev years?
would it free up a NWQ player spot for another position?

What do Ulster fans think of the chances of getting Bowe back?
Do we need him as much as we used to?
Could the unthinkable happen and he moves to another Province?


Does it all depend on how well the Ospreys and Ulster do this year and he'll go with the one he sees as having the best chance of winning things with?

Have to say the current Ulster squad with Bowe added would scare any team (plus whatever else Humph manages in the summer).

What if Ulster’s HQ was in Cavan (for example)?

Not suggesting it, just wondering.

OK if that is the case then that obviously puts Ulster at a massive disadvantage in terms of recruiting players from the other provinces.

Maybe George Osborne should plump up for the tax difference to put Ulster on an even playing field?

roddersm wrote:OK if that is the case then that obviously puts Ulster at a massive disadvantage in terms of recruiting players from the other provinces.

Maybe George Osborne should plump up for the tax difference to put Ulster on an even playing field?

When you take into account that the NI government are donating money towards Ravenhill's revamp then it evens out I'd say.

Not sure what you mean Mick? What has the stadium revamp got to do with an individual player potentially losing out on a lucrative tax benefit by moving North?

Nothing directly I suppose, i'm just saying it works in swings and roundabouts. You get shafted on the tax thing but get money from the government for the stadium.

It is the location of the ground that is deemed to be the deciding factor.

An office in one of the 3 provinces would make no difference.

As for the ground developement I beleive it when I see it - worrying rumours it has been delayed till 2013.
Don't underestimate the ability of the numpties in Stormont and NI soccer to screw the whole thing up between them.

geoff998rugby wrote:It is the location of the ground that is deemed to be the deciding factor.

An office in one of the 3 provinces would make no difference.

As for the ground developement I beleive it when I see it - worrying rumours it has been delayed till 2013.
Don't underestimate the ability of the numpties in Stormont and NI soccer to screw the whole thing up between them.

Looking at ground location, it is probably a precident set to make sure that soccer wages are taxable, as they would private jet themselves to the Isle of Man, Monaco or Jersey the end of each day.

thebandwagonsociety wrote:

geoff998rugby wrote:It is the location of the ground that is deemed to be the deciding factor.

An office in one of the 3 provinces would make no difference.

As for the ground developement I beleive it when I see it - worrying rumours it has been delayed till 2013.
Don't underestimate the ability of the numpties in Stormont and NI soccer to screw the whole thing up between them.

Looking at ground location, it is probably a precident set to make sure that soccer wages are taxable, as they would private jet themselves to the Isle of Man, Monaco or Jersey the end of each day.

Or in this instance...Letterkenny or Monaghan....

geoff998rugby wrote:It is the location of the ground that is deemed to be the deciding factor.

An office in one of the 3 provinces would make no difference.

As for the ground developement I beleive it when I see it - worrying rumours it has been delayed till 2013.
Don't underestimate the ability of the numpties in Stormont and NI soccer to screw the whole thing up between them.

I think this is safe enough the money was all rubber stamped ok.

FAI can't mess it up now.

But intresting that Casement hasn't started rebuilding yet either, but I guess they are waiting tioll the end of this summers games to start.

geoff998rugby wrote:It is the location of the ground that is deemed to be the deciding factor.

An office in one of the 3 provinces would make no difference.

As for the ground developement I beleive it when I see it - worrying rumours it has been delayed till 2013.
Don't underestimate the ability of the numpties in Stormont and NI soccer to screw the whole thing up between them.

The current state of play with regard to the ground improvements: -

IRFU Ulster Branch proposes to increase the capacity of Ravenhill in Belfast from its current capacity of 11,712 to a venue capable of holding approximately 18,000 spectators by 2015. The total projected cost of this proposal is estimated at between £13 and £14 Million.
The construction of these facilities and ground improvements is subject to European Procurement Policy and must be fully commissioned for operation by 31st May 2014.

Construction of the two new stands at either end of the ground will commence December 2012 and will be completed in time for the start of the 2013/14 Season.
Construction of the new Stand to replace the existing is due to commence at the end of the 2012/13 season and be completed in 13 months. Other work includes the reconfiguration of existing entrances and new turnstiles. The War Memorial is to be relocated but will remain within the grounds.

Guys with all these projects there are various things that have to happen. The Consultants bid was put in a couple of weeks ago. We expect to hear on this shortly.

The pre-qualification process for Windsor Park was submitted last Thursday. Due to the size (value 26-30m) this has to be advertised Europe wide and the process takes a bit longer. Casement Park is in the same category and I expect the process will start for it pretty soon.

Call me a cynic but no money has passed hands yet and the development was originally going to start at the end of this season.

geoff998rugby wrote:Call me a cynic but no money has passed hands yet and the development was originally going to start at the end of this season.

You're a cynic

Aparently Tommy Bowe will sign for either Munster or Ulster this week. Leinster and Biarritz are said to be also interested. Bowe is currently the highest paid player in the UK on about €340k per anumn. Ospreys need to cut the wage bill.

This is big descision for Bowe at this stage of his career...go to Munster for the tax rebate or come to Ulster and win silverware......

People saying Ulster don't need Bowe- I can't get my head around it. Danielli will be out on his ear at the end of the season, so we have... two wingers in total! In the entire squad.

Yep, I'd say we need another back three player at least! Where could we get an Irish-qualified back three player?

People will say ok 'Bowe and Trimble will start, so what about Gilroy?' But in reality if Bowe and Trimble are on central contracts those two will be rotated. Gilroy will get plenty of gametime, until eventually he supplants one of the two. That's the way it should be.

Best use of resources is for Bowe to come to Ulster; Leinster and Munster don't need him.

I just hope he doesn’t end up with Munster. Dougie Howlett, legend that he is, hardly gets his hands on the ball down there. At least with Ulster Bowe might actually score a few tries, rather than kick-chase-set up a ruck-1 out-1 out-1 out-dropgoal.

Mickado wrote:Nothing directly I suppose, i'm just saying it works in swings and roundabouts. You get shafted on the tax thing but get money from the government for the stadium.

Yeah, pretty much. The IRFU own Ravenhill and they're getting a free facelift! Didn't they also get some government funding to redevelop Lansdowne Road though? (in the heady days of Bertie and the Bandits).

They could live around the border and cross it each morning as they go to work?

Oops - now all the Northern players will be looking for homes in Ravensdale! Sorry, about that slip up IRFU and broke Irish Government!

Notch wrote:People saying Ulster don't need Bowe

Ulster don't need people who say that Ulster don't need Bowe!

Notch wrote:

Mickado wrote:Nothing directly I suppose, i'm just saying it works in swings and roundabouts. You get shafted on the tax thing but get money from the government for the stadium.

Yeah, pretty much. The IRFU own Ravenhill and they're getting a free facelift! Didn't they also get some government funding to redevelop Lansdowne Road though? (in the heady days of Bertie and the Bandits).

They got the bulk of it [funding] from the Irish Government, Notch. That's why some of us were so mad about the 'name' change for an historic stadium. The company that got the naming rights didn't put close to the biggest part of the funding up.

We'd take him at Leinster, but would he like sitting on the bench?

I'd say he'd be a starter for Leinster but we don't really need him. Thought Dave Kearney was class for the wolfhounds. Hope to see him get some more heino appearances for Leinster.

Ulster is the logical choice.

Munster have Felix Jones Jones and Denis Hurley covering fullback. With Keith Earls, Luke O'Dea, Johne Murphy, Simon Zebo and Doug Howlett on the wings.

Leinster have Isa Nacewa and Rob Kearney at fullback. Shane Horgan, Luke Fitzgerald, Dave Kearney, Fionn Carr and Andrew Conway on the wings.

Ulster have Stefan Terblanche and Adam Darcy at fullback. They have got Craig Gilroy, Andrew Trimble and Simon Danielli as wingers.

Ulster could do with just one more top class winger.

Bowe is actually in a precarious place in his career. His choices won't be easy. He knows that Stag is right. I'm sure, if he's weighing his options, he sees that. He knows too that the longer he delays a return to any of the 'four' Provinces - I was reminded there are four of us by someone above a few weeks back!! - but the longer he delays his return, the less room there will be for him, as even more understudies will be waiting in Provincial wings

His best self advertising bet is now fully in a green shirt, playing for Ireland. That's his 'show reel' for prospective Irish employers. He knows he has to perform there if he's thinking of returning home.

If he has a so-so Six Nations then he'll be wondering if he's just stayed one year too many away and that his best option then might be to stay with Ospreys, who might have lost their stars but in the coming seasons might be a more gritty bunch with more 'honesty'.

Tough choices for Bowe... not all of them as clearcut as you might first imagine.

Tommy's coming home - it is just a question of where.

One Province has definitely got a inside track though

Geoff, would it be fair enough to say that this is a 2 horse race between Ulster and Munster?

I don't think Bowe will have any trouble getting a starting spot at any of the provinces.

He is 28 now though and in the prime of his career and needs to think carefully about his next move.

He's been playing far too many games over the past few seasons and I think this has caught up with him this year, plus Ospreys have been in disarray which hasn't helped his form.

The sooner he gets back to Ireland (cough Ulster ) the better for everyone.

I personally would not go that far but I would say that in this three horse race one horse is a fair way in front and I am not displeased and that another horse is in danger of being losing contact

If he has a so-so Six Nations then he'll be wondering if he's just stayed one year too many away and that his best option then might be to stay with Ospreys

Surely if he can't get the deal he wants in Ireland he'll nip across the channel and top up his bank balance with a French club. His size and speed would make him very popular and as long as he had the right releases written into his contract he should be fine. The Ospreys aren't likely to splash big cash on retaining a winger (especially if it's a straight choice between retaining one of their props and a winger) when they have young talent coming through and an agreement with the WRU not to spend more than £3.5m on the HEC playing squad.

Ospreys have no choice - my understanding is that if Tommy wants to he can invoke the 3rd year clause and stay.

Fortunately for Ospreys it is my understanding he can't wait to get home as he feels that Ospreys experiment has gone pear shaped and that his future lies with a leading Irish province

If Bowe goes to France he can kiss his Ireland career goodbye.

He needs to come home if he wants another 3/4 seasons of International rugby.

He can still go to France at 31/32 after the next RWC if he wants.

Were I Bowe, I would certainly be looking at Ulster.

Though if he joins Munster, Declan Kidney will never drop him for Ireland

Is Adam Darcy still in contract next season?

The deal wouldn't be the thing I'm talking about. The playing time would be...feeling part of the squad, feeling you contributed a sizeable chunk to them winning something meaningful - in his books at this stage, that's probably a HC.

Yes, I'd assume his best option for all those hopes is Ulster. Leinster's (and indeed Munster's) constant issues is sustaining the beef and the bulk of the forward departments. I think they both have their backs positions catered for. And there might be a few disgruntles around if Bowe is airlifted into either of those sides to break down the 'promotion' string operating in those sides.

Just thoughts on the issue. Just personal thoughts. Of course he might very well end up in either Leinster or Munster

I think our contracted back three players for next season are Andrew Trimble, Craig Gilroy, Adam D'Arcy and Jared Payne. Then Gaston, who doesn't seem highly rated and is only a Academy player anyway (right?). Then Nevin Spence and Ian Whitten are centres who can provide emergency cover on the wing.

So Bowe would go a long way. C'mon Tommy. Come home oh ye prodigal son.

Mickado wrote:Is Adam Darcy still in contract next season?

Yep 1 more year.

Other than the backrow Ulster contracts are all sorted for next year - oh unless some winger becomes available

They’re preparing the fattest ox in the land already lads. I can hear the knives being sharpened.

Court – Best – Afoa
Muller – Touhy
Ferris – Kaino – Henry
Peinaar – iHump
Trimble – Wallace/Whitten – Cave/Spence – Bowe
Payne

Lads, that’s a seriously good team. Thank god ye can’t win in Dublin

Only a matter of time Bikkies!

1; Court
2; Best
3; Afoa
4; Muller
5; Tuohy
6; Ferris
7; Henry
8; Kaino
9; Pienaar
10; Humph
11; Trimble
12; Wallace
13; Cave
14; Bowe
15; Payne

Thats a line up that would scare any team! Even Leinster.

yuou beat me to it mick

Its just a pity for Bowe that he won't be back at Ulster in time to pick up a HEC winners medal.....

Love the people talking as if Kaino is a done deal! We'll just wait and see on that one, shall we?

Of course, Wannenburg instead of Kaino or even Wilson still makes it a pretty decent team.

roddersm wrote:Its just a pity for Bowe that he won't be back at Ulster in time to pick up a HEC winners medal.....

... this season

If Bowe goes to France he can kiss his Ireland career goodbye

He still gets selected for Ireland whilst playing in Wales. As long as he got the right releases in place he should be fine.

Its just a pity for Bowe that he won't be back at Ulster in time to pick up a HEC winners medal

A possibility Rodders but I bet the Ulster coaches are wrapping their first team in cotton wool.

It’s a much better use of the foreign imports. That’s a quality team with 5 foreigners in it, if Leinster played all of our foreign players the team would be:

VDM – Strauss – White
Toner – Cullen
O’Brien – Heaslip – Jennings
Reddan – Berquist
Fitz – Darcy – O’Malley – McFadden
Nacewa

Not as good as our first team.

Basically Ulster looked at the team and asked if we don’t have a player in the Irish squad in a given position, plug it with a savage international class player.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

If Bowe goes to France he can kiss his Ireland career goodbye

He still gets selected for Ireland whilst playing in Wales. As long as he got the right releases in place he should be fine.

Its just a pity for Bowe that he won't be back at Ulster in time to pick up a HEC winners medal

A possibility Rodders but I bet the Ulster coaches are wrapping their first team in cotton wool.

Wrong - other than those with the Irish set up Ulster will be playing there stongest XV Friday week.

Something like McAllister/Black, Kyriacou, Afoa, Muller, Tuohy/Stevenson, Henry/Diack, Wannenberg, Faloon, Pienaer, Humphreys, Gilroy, Whitten/Marshall, Spence, Whitten/Gaston, Terblanche

There will be, as usual no rotation at Ulster

There probably should be though. We'd be better off looking at a few squad players to reward them and see if they can make the step up.

Mick, I agree. I thin if you are going to bring in an NIQ, might as well bring in a guy who the other players can learn from and can push the group onto the next level.

I think it's only right that we play the strongest team possible in the next three/four Pro 12 games. We definitely want to be in the knock out stages of that this season if this team is to realize it's potential.

Geoff, if Paddy Wallace doesn't make the match day 22/23 for Ireland would he be released back to the province?

I can't see Paddy being released to be honest.

Also we may possibly lose one of Tuohy, Henry or Spence.