can this Wales side break into the worlds top 4?

by Pot Noodle Miner Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:59 am

First topic message reminder :

How good is this Welsh side really? it will be interesting to see if this Welsh side can live up to its hype and put Italy to bed and then finally beat a top 4 nation when we play France as we havnt managed to beat a top 4 side for a while now despite looking capable of it, it all seems to go to waste as we fluff our chances against the worlds best, i can't wait to see what happens against Italy and i hope Wales don't hold back otherwise it could be close we must give 110% and play it as a final rather than a Sunday friendly, it would be amazing to see this Welsh side further improve on their performances against Italy and France and then we could look forward to trying to make history and beating the wallabies on their own patch.

Just hope the boys stay composed and seize their moments as it can be so easy to be too caught up in all the hype at the moment especially for such a young side. Interesting and exciting times, can't wait for it all to unfold!

by majesticimperialman Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:38 pm

wales606 wrote:
majesticimperialman wrote:Why is being in the top 4 a big deal for Wales?

Well im sure we would like to be 1st in the world

But if we finish the year in 4th then we will be a top seed in the next WC - which is why the Aus tour is so important.

Sure i understand that if you win your next 2 games and get a Grand Slam this year, you will then move in to 4th place in the IRB rankins.

Then come the summer tours to Australia, which although you go there with gusto and determination, you seldom win against Aus.

But the RWC is still another 3/4 years away yet, and will you still be 4th in the IRB rankins then?

by Cymroglan Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:52 pm

Maj there is no reason why this young Welsh side cant continue to improve over the next four years.
It does not matter what the results are in the past this side is out to make it's own history, they did not let the poor record of wins at HQ hinder them.

by maestegmafia Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:00 pm

majesticimperialman wrote:
wales606 wrote:
majesticimperialman wrote:Why is being in the top 4 a big deal for Wales?

Well im sure we would like to be 1st in the world

But if we finish the year in 4th then we will be a top seed in the next WC - which is why the Aus tour is so important.

Sure i understand that if you win your next 2 games and get a Grand Slam this year, you will then move in to 4th place in the IRB rankins.

Then come the summer tours to Australia, which although you go there with gusto and determination, you seldom win against Aus.

But the RWC is still another 3/4 years away yet, and will you still be 4th in the IRB rankins then?

The RANKINGS this year effect the choices for the seeded teams for the RWC in 2015. So if you are a top 4 team in 2012 you will have a draw for a pool that does not also contain a top four team.

Meaning that is it likely that you avoid a regular top three side like NZ Oz or SA until the Quarters or even Semis.

by majesticimperialman Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:05 pm

I understand that now. Cheers for that, was not aware of that to be honest.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:49 pm

maestegmafia wrote:That's the key point fly.

The top five after NZ, SA, Australia, France, Wales and Ireland, are all very evenly matched teams that can take a result against each other at any time.

What nonsense. Just utter utter nonsense.

We're constantly reminded that Wales "might" win a grandslam. Reality check: you haven't won anything yet, not even the 6N. Get over yourselves. Wait until you've done something and then start to brag. Crikey. It does my head in.

Last time you won a grandslam you still couldn't foot it in the top 5. I don't see what's different this time around except the other 6N teams are slightly weaker if anything.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:52 pm

Cari wrote:I don't see why not. They almost beat France and Oz in the RWC.

I just knew before reading it that the "almost" win would be brought up sooner or later. Rolling Eyes

I have to admit, if you keep up all these almost wins, you might almost be a good team, almost any time soon, and almost make it into the top 4.

by maestegmafia Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:17 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:That's the key point fly.

The top five after NZ, SA, Australia, France, Wales and Ireland, are all very evenly matched teams that can take a result against each other at any time.

What nonsense. Just utter utter nonsense.

We're constantly reminded that Wales "might" win a grandslam. Reality check: you haven't won anything yet, not even the 6N. Get over yourselves. Wait until you've done something and then start to brag. Crikey. It does my head in.

Last time you won a grandslam you still couldn't foot it in the top 5. I don't see what's different this time around except the other 6N teams are slightly weaker if anything.

Wales results against top sides are close, their ranking is justified by their results.

We were eighth last year we have improved and now we are fifth with two home games one we should win, the other will be close. Win both of those and we are grandslam champs and fourth.

There is no arguing or justifying needed those are facts.

by Guest Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:22 pm

Almost, nearly, close.

Almost only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:25 pm

But it's not facts. Those are "IFs".

Facts of recent games are not in fact close as you are claiming.

You lost to Australia at home on the scoreboard the difference was 6, but you scored a late try when Oz emptied their inexperienced touring bench to get some test time and you never looked like winning. This game was billed as "revenge" and "pay back" for the 3/4 play off loss...when a severely rotated and uninterested Australia side won without breaking a sweat with one eye on the departure lounge.

In your most recent home and away tests against NZ, the aggregate score was 108-44

South Africa haven't brought a full strength test side on tour to Wales in some time, but still haven't lost. The last time you played a SA full selection in South Africa the aggregate score was 80-38.

A little closer to home, Wales have beaten France just twice in a decade. The last time you played in France, you lost by 20 points.

I'm not saying you can't make it, just that perhaps the bravado should be tuned down until you do.

by maestegmafia Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:27 pm

Mitey do you think other teams should be in fifth place instead of Wales right now?

by slartibartfast Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:29 pm

Maesteg ignore them, they just jelous types

by slartibartfast Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:31 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:
Cari wrote:I don't see why not. They almost beat France and Oz in the RWC.

I just knew before reading it that the "almost" win would be brought up sooner or later.

I have to admit, if you keep up all these almost wins, you might almost be a good team, almost any time soon, and almost make it into the top 4.

Didn't England almost win last week? You haven't stopped going on about that?

by maestegmafia Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:33 pm

slartibartfast wrote:
miteyironpaw wrote:
Cari wrote:I don't see why not. They almost beat France and Oz in the RWC.

I just knew before reading it that the "almost" win would be brought up sooner or later.

I have to admit, if you keep up all these almost wins, you might almost be a good team, almost any time soon, and almost make it into the top 4.

Didn't England almost win last week? You haven't stopped going on about that?

That was a very positive step for England as they almost lost in their two previous games.

by Liam Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:33 pm

SafeAsMilk wrote:Almost, nearly, close.

Almost only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades.

Completely agree, as a Welsh fan the amount of times we have thought we were on the brink of stardom we failed to deliver. But for me, and maybe other Welsh fans, we see this as a genuine chance to break into the elite of rugby, that is the SH teams and compete consistantly for the title in the 6 nations. I see this simply because of the depth of players and more importantly, the players attitudes. In previous grandslam wins, we had big personalities like Thomas and Henson who would always seem to man sausage it up off the pitch. But I feel this team despite it's average age is very mature, has around 6 or 7 players who can reach potentially very good, maybe world class level. We already have 3 IMO, Jones, Jenkins and Warbs, I think the SH teams would take them if they were offered them. The group is tight knitted and I really do believe they are level headed and showed that they aren't resting on their success at the WC and are on the brink of a possible GS victory. You may not like us Welsh fans being optimistic all the time, but for me, this team has a genuine chance of becoming a powerhouse in world rugby.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:41 pm

Wales results against top sides are close, their ranking is justified by their results.
...
There is no arguing or justifying needed those are facts.

But it's not facts. Those are "IFs".

Facts of recent games are not in fact close as you are claiming.

You lost to Australia at home on the scoreboard at full time the difference was 6, but your blushes were saved when SW (now retired) scored a late try when Oz emptied their inexperienced touring bench to get some test time and you never looked like winning. This game was billed as "revenge" and "pay back" for the 3/4 play off loss...when a severely rotated and uninterested Australia side won without breaking a sweat with one eye on the departure lounge.

In your most recent home and away tests against NZ, the aggregate score was 108-44

South Africa haven't brought a full strength test side on tour to Wales in some time, but still haven't lost. The last time you played a SA full selection in South Africa the aggregate score was 80-38.

A little closer to home, Wales have beaten France just twice in a decade. The last time you played in France, you lost by 20 points.

I'm not saying you can't make it, just that perhaps the bravado should be tuned down until you do.

by Cymroglan Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:51 pm

mitey the question was Can this Wales side break into the top 4?

I for one think they can and I also believe they can even do better than that.
This young side is out to make it's own history past results should not and will not bother them.

by slartibartfast Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:52 pm

Aggregate scores?

C'mon Mitty let it all out, this is all because Wales won last week in twickers - I was there with my pink cowboy hat on. What was the aggregate score, oh yes 12-19.

by Liam Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:57 pm

slartibartfast wrote:Aggregate scores?

C'mon Mitty let it all out, this is all because Wales won last week in twickers - I was there with my pink cowboy hat on. What was the aggregate score, oh yes 12-19.

#Desperation stuff it really is. I'm sitting back quite comfotably knowing this is a promising welsh side with a wonderful chance at a GS, then a realistic chance of winning a test down in OZ

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:58 pm

Cymroglan wrote:mitey the question was Can this Wales side break into the top 4?.

I for one think they can and I also believe they can even do better than that.
This young side is out to make it's own history past results should not and will not bother them.

On what evidence? To be in the top four, you have to oust one of the others. This would be SA, NZ, Oz or France. Other than France on one of their bad days, you don't look like beating them even once, let alone regularly enough to live there.

Secondly did when "TOP 4" become a Thing? Is this just a way of putting yourself in the company of teams you don't realistically have a chance of beating? Why not just say "fourth place"? It just looks like more self-aggrandising and as I'm pointing out, it's baseless.

P.S. I posted aggregate scores, rather than the pain of listing a host of humilating defeats, but I can if you prefer - it doesn't change the fact that these teams are atleast twice as good as you - that's just facts.

I'm sitting back quite comfotably knowing this is a promising welsh side with a wonderful chance at a GS, then a realistic chance of winning a test down in OZ

In the way that Nero sat back comfortably knowing they had a promising youthful fire service with a realistic chance of getting on top of things?

by Cymroglan Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:04 pm

miteyironpaw

Are you aware that being in the top four at the end of this year is the Thing ?

by Liam Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:06 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:
Cymroglan wrote:mitey the question was Can this Wales side break into the top 4?.

I for one think they can and I also believe they can even do better than that.
This young side is out to make it's own history past results should not and will not bother them.

On what evidence? To be in the top four, you have to oust one of the others. This would be SA, NZ, Oz or France. Other than France on one of their bad days, you don't look like beating them even once, let alone regularly enough to live there.

Secondly did when "TOP 4" become a Thing? Is this just a way of putting yourself in the company of teams you don't realistically have a chance of beating? Why not just say "fourth place"? It just looks like more self-aggrandising and as I'm pointing out, it's baseless.

P.S. I posted aggregate scores, rather than the pain of listing a host of humilating defeats, but I can if you prefer - it doesn't change the fact that these teams are atleast twice as good as you - that's just facts.

I'm sitting back quite comfotably knowing this is a promising welsh side with a wonderful chance at a GS, then a realistic chance of winning a test down in OZ

In the way that Nero sat back comfortably knowing they had a promising youthful fire service with a realistic chance of getting on top of things?

Yes but your comparing your views with past Welsh teams, this is a very different side to the welsh team of the last 5 years. Granted there are still some familiar faces, but the likes of Faletau, Lydiate, Warbs, North, 1/2p, Charteris, Cuthbert, JD2 and DOC there is a genuine chance we can compete on a regular basis.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:07 pm

Are you aware you are getting into a circular argument?

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:08 pm

martyr_94 wrote:
miteyironpaw wrote:
Cymroglan wrote:mitey the question was Can this Wales side break into the top 4?.

I for one think they can and I also believe they can even do better than that.
This young side is out to make it's own history past results should not and will not bother them.

On what evidence? To be in the top four, you have to oust one of the others. This would be SA, NZ, Oz or France. Other than France on one of their bad days, you don't look like beating them even once, let alone regularly enough to live there.

Secondly did when "TOP 4" become a Thing? Is this just a way of putting yourself in the company of teams you don't realistically have a chance of beating? Why not just say "fourth place"? It just looks like more self-aggrandising and as I'm pointing out, it's baseless.

P.S. I posted aggregate scores, rather than the pain of listing a host of humilating defeats, but I can if you prefer - it doesn't change the fact that these teams are atleast twice as good as you - that's just facts.

I'm sitting back quite comfotably knowing this is a promising welsh side with a wonderful chance at a GS, then a realistic chance of winning a test down in OZ

In the way that Nero sat back comfortably knowing they had a promising youthful fire service with a realistic chance of getting on top of things?

Yes but your comparing your views with past Welsh teams, ...

You can't have it both ways. The poster I am arguing with said "Our results against top teams are encouraging" or something along those lines. So it wasn't me that started with the apparently invalid comparisons.

Reminder:

Wales results against top sides are close, their ranking is justified by their results.
...
There is no arguing or justifying needed those are facts.

by Cymroglan Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:08 pm

Argument ? I took it to be a discussion but obviously you have taken it to heart.

by slartibartfast Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:09 pm

Cymroglan wrote:miteyironpaw

Are you aware that being in the top four at the end of this year is the Thing ?

Ah! He didn't know... That explains mitey's responses laughing

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:11 pm

Stop trying to divert to avoid losing the point.

The point is you've made claims (collectively):

"Our results against other top4 teams are encouraging, we're *almost* winning".

I then pointed out the fact that you're no where near "almost winning" against the top4 teams, and now you are saying that historical scores are irrelevant?

Which is it? facts or fiddling in the wind?

by Cymroglan Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:18 pm

mitey Your opinion is valued thumbsup

Why do you take so much interest in a side if you truly believe it's so poor as you make out ?
All you do all the time is try and belittle any Welsh achievement why do you need to do that ? it comes across as being very unsporting.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:20 pm

It's a community service Cymroglan, by trying to help you keep your feet on the ground, you'll hopefully be less shattered when the disappointment arrives. Hug

by PJHolybloke Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:21 pm

slartibartfast wrote:
Cymroglan wrote:miteyironpaw

Are you aware that being in the top four at the end of this year is the Thing ?

Ah! He didn't know... That explains mitey's responses

Alternatively, he just doesn't really care as his own team has been ranked in the top two for like ever?

by maestegmafia Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:25 pm

The point is getting into the top four by the end of the year.

Everything about the recent matches suggests Wales have a very realistic chance of acheiving that goal.

Comparing past results is not irrelevant but this team is so obviously improving all the time.

Wales France and Ireland and England if they get two more wins stand a chance of getting that forth spot. The rest of the six nations will see one of those four teams make fourth place. Then the summer tours and AIs will also be very important.

Wales are currently in the best situation to achieve that in a very long time as they are leading the six nations, are showing good form, have a large squad of very talented players.

None of us are being unrealistic in suggesting that we can make forth.

For now all that is important is that we win the grandslam and have a good tour to Oz.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:25 pm

PJHolybloke wrote:
slartibartfast wrote:
Cymroglan wrote:miteyironpaw

Are you aware that being in the top four at the end of this year is the Thing ?

Ah! He didn't know... That explains mitey's responses

Alternatively, he just doesn't really care as his own team has been ranked in the top two for like ever?

Alas, my beloved England haven't been in the top four for almost three months...

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:26 pm

maestegmafia wrote:The point is getting into the top four by the end of the year.

Everything about the recent matches suggests Wales have a very realistic chance of acheiving that goal.

Comparing past results is not irrelevant but this team is so obviously improving all the time.

And I'm saying what about recent matches suggests you will beat NZ, SA, Oz or France enough to gain fourth place on the IRB rankings.

You won't get into the top four no matter how much you beat Italy by, or how many times you beat Scotland or Ireland. Even England are only ranked 5th currently (rightly so as we are rebuilding). So given you scraped past Scotland, England and Ireland by so few points in such lucky circumstances, what makes you think you'll suddenly starting knocking over these teams you haven't beaten in decades?

by slartibartfast Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:29 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:Stop trying to divert to avoid losing the point.

The point is you've made claims (collectively):

"Our results against other top4 teams are encouraging, we're *almost* winning".

I then pointed out the fact that you're no where near "almost winning" against the top4 teams, and now you are saying that historical scores are irrelevant?

Which is it? facts or fiddling in the wind?

Depends on which historical scores you wish to pick. Eg in the last 6months-ish losing by a point to SA and France is almost? If you go back 12months then the scores get worse.

I'm sure if we had a graph the trend is an upward one - hence the Title of this post.

Here's a fact: Wales moved from 8th to 5th, so, why couldnt they move up to 4th? You point at past results and previous failures to stay there - but as already posted the feeling is that as a team Wales are much better placed in terms of player pool and attitude.

by maestegmafia Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:30 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:The point is getting into the top four by the end of the year.

Everything about the recent matches suggests Wales have a very realistic chance of acheiving that goal.

Comparing past results is not irrelevant but this team is so obviously improving all the time.

And I'm saying what about recent matches suggests you will beat NZ, SA, Oz or France enough to become a top 4 team?

The fact that we lost narrowly to those sides recently and our consistenly improving form points to us having a good opportunity to win those games.

We have more chance of beating top three teams now than in the last twenty to thirty years.

by PJHolybloke Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:31 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:
PJHolybloke wrote:
slartibartfast wrote:
Cymroglan wrote:miteyironpaw

Are you aware that being in the top four at the end of this year is the Thing ?

Ah! He didn't know... That explains mitey's responses

Alternatively, he just doesn't really care as his ~~own~~ old team has been ranked in the top two for like ever?

Alas, my beloved England haven't been in the top four for almost three months...

Oh yeah, sorry about that - I just totally forgot - fixed it for you. can this Wales side break into the worlds top 4? - Page 2 3610695981

by Cymroglan Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:32 pm

PJ the more he types the more it shows Very Happy

by slartibartfast Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:33 pm

PJHolybloke wrote:
slartibartfast wrote:
Cymroglan wrote:miteyironpaw

Are you aware that being in the top four at the end of this year is the Thing ?

Ah! He didn't know... That explains mitey's responses

Alternatively, he just doesn't really care as his own team has been ranked in the top two for like ever?

What?

by PJHolybloke Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:34 pm

Nothing.

can this Wales side break into the worlds top 4? - Page 2 590675

by PJHolybloke Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:34 pm

Cymroglan wrote:PJ the more he types the more it shows

Don't it though. Very Happy

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:35 pm

slartibartfast wrote:
miteyironpaw wrote:Stop trying to divert to avoid losing the point.

The point is you've made claims (collectively):

"Our results against other top4 teams are encouraging, we're *almost* winning".

I then pointed out the fact that you're no where near "almost winning" against the top4 teams, and now you are saying that historical scores are irrelevant?

Which is it? facts or fiddling in the wind?

Depends on which historical scores you wish to pick.

Tell me you didn't type that with a straight face!

Here's a fact: Wales moved from 8th to 5th, so, why couldnt they move up to 4th? You point at past results and previous failures to stay there - but as already posted the feeling is that as a team Wales are much better placed in terms of player pool and attitude.

Because you got there by beating teams that you have beaten consistently recently. You've got a 50% strike rate near or near enough with Ireland and England. Neither team is as strong as they have been recently, so squeaking a win was always possible. Don't forget your elevation was also courtesy of other results falling in your favour and at least three crucial calls going your way.

What I'm saying is that the results you have achieved are consistent with recent history, whereas the ones you seem to be counting in advance are not. What you want to do is look selectively at the results you choose to look at and use them as a basis for extrapolating extremely unlikely results.

You can just as easily lose narrowly to France, who lose to England, then lose the entire series to Australia (or almost win it, depending on how you choose to see it), and end up back in 8th spot...

by Cymroglan Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:45 pm

Mitey it's all ifs and buts the results will do all the talking. Wales could win a GS or maybe come second we could also have a bad Australian tour or we could have a brilliant one.
We will know by the end of the year how good or bad this Welsh side is but I for one am happy with the progress we are making.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:47 pm

What progress?

As far as I can see the only difference between this years 6N and any other years is that England are rebuilding. Perhaps in beating the big brother (albeit controversially) you've started to get a bit carried away?

by slartibartfast Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:50 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:
slartibartfast wrote:
miteyironpaw wrote:Stop trying to divert to avoid losing the point.

The point is you've made claims (collectively):

"Our results against other top4 teams are encouraging, we're *almost* winning".

I then pointed out the fact that you're no where near "almost winning" against the top4 teams, and now you are saying that historical scores are irrelevant?

Which is it? facts or fiddling in the wind?

Depends on which historical scores you wish to pick.

Tell me you didn't type that with a straight face!

Here's a fact: Wales moved from 8th to 5th, so, why couldnt they move up to 4th? You point at past results and previous failures to stay there - but as already posted the feeling is that as a team Wales are much better placed in terms of player pool and attitude.

Because you got there by beating teams that you have beaten consistently recently. You've got a 50% strike rate near or near enough with Ireland and England. Neither team is as strong as they have been recently, so squeaking a win was always possible. Don't forget your elevation was also courtesy of other results falling in your favour and at least three crucial calls going your way.

What I'm saying is that the results you have achieved are consistent with recent history, whereas the ones you seem to be counting in advance are not. What you want to do is look selectively at the results you choose to look at and use them as a basis for extrapolating extremely unlikely results.

You can just as easily lose narrowly to France, who lose to England, then lose the entire series to Australia (or almost win it, depending on how you choose to see it), and end up back in 8th spot...

E.g Beating France at home at home when the last match was narrowly lost ?

As you say skipping back down to 8 is ifs and buts.

Are you saying you can't see the improvement in the welsh game over the last twelve months?

You think England are on the way up after losing their last match, but other supporters aren't allowed to?

by RubyGuby Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:51 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:What progress?

As far as I can see the only difference between this years 6N and any other years is that England are rebuilding. Perhaps in beating the big brother (albeit controversially) you've started to get a bit carried away?

Get some rest Mighty, you need it - Looks like the 3rd Slam is upon is in 6-7 years and this team can only get better eh! Rebuilding Yahoo

you've been rebuilding for 10 years thumbsup

by slartibartfast Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:54 pm

PJHolybloke wrote:Nothing.

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:55 pm

Not at all. I think England will be rebuilding for a couple of years. There's still a lot of experimentation pain to go through, possibly another new coach by the look of it, different systems, mistakes. We should be peaking again around 2015..

What you are interpreting as an improvement in the Welsh game based on results, is in fact nothing more than everyone else in the competition having fallen back a bit.

France is the highest ranked team in the tournament, and you haven't played them yet. Everyone else was 5 or lower are the kick-off, and this wasn't the England team that earned that 5th ranking. It's a new team.

Now it seems inevitable that whomever won the Wales-Ireland game would take up that spot. And as I've said, you were a bit lucky to win it on a refereeing decision that the IRB have all but apologised for.

As an England fan I'm proud and pleasantly surprised at how good England have been given the number of new faces, but I'm not going to use that as a basis to predict we'll be top 4 or top 3 or #1 by the end of the year, or whatever nonsense you're dreaming up. Perspective, all I'm asking for is a reasonable amount of perspective.

by Cymroglan Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:57 pm

miteyironpaw wrote:Not at all. I think England will be rebuilding for a couple of years. There's still a lot of experimentation pain to go through, possibly another new coach by the look of it, different systems, mistakes. We should be peaking again around 2015.

What you are interpreting as an improvement in the Welsh game based on results, is in fact nothing more than everyone else in the competition having fallen back a bit.

France is the highest ranked team in the tournament, and you haven't played them yet. Everyone else was 5 or lower are the kick-off, and this wasn't the England team that earned that 5th ranking. It's a new team.

Now it seems inevitable that whomever won the Wales-Ireland game would take up that spot. And as I've said, you were a bit lucky to win it on a refereeing decision that the IRB have all but apologised for.

by PJHolybloke Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:58 pm

slartibartfast wrote:
PJHolybloke wrote:Nothing.

by RubyGuby Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:58 pm

the pain!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can almost feel it Wales

by miteyironpaw Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:59 pm

PJHolybloke wrote:
slartibartfast wrote:
PJHolybloke wrote:Nothing.

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