Un-Capped Choices of the Home Nations?

Any suggestions for un-capped wonders that might make next years tour down under?

Steve Shingler - Usefull utility back, also unlikely to be capped due to the farce that went on earlier in the year.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Steve Shingler - Usefull utility back, also unlikely to be capped due to the farce that went on earlier in the year.

Interesting call, covers flyhalf, inside centre, outside centre and fullback.

Simon Zebo of Munster could be a good call as wing cover.

Gareth Davies of the Scarlets has the makings of a great scrum half, but I can't see him making the Lions tour unless Mike Phillips and Rhys Webb get injured and he plays for Wales between now and then.

Maes the problem I have is that most players I can think of will probably be capped prior to the B&I tour of Aus.

More than likely but we can deal with the here and now for this thread.

Well from a welsh point of view uncapped players who could (providing they take their chances next season) push for the Lions are Matthew Morgan, Rhoddri Jones and Liam Williams. But like I said I think they will most likely get capped prior to the Lions tour.

I know this is off topic, but have the Scarlets really been asked by the Welsh coaching team to develop Rhodri Jones into a tight head? Huw Llywelyn Davies suggested as much on S4C the other day.

luckless_pedestrian wrote:I know this is off topic, but have the Scarlets really been asked by the Welsh coaching team to develop Rhodri Jones into a tight head? Huw Llywelyn Davies suggested as much on S4C the other day.

I have no idea.

As with any young prop looks great in the loose but struggles in the scrum.

Depends if the likes of May, Wadeband JJ get capped by England. Out of interest, do you think foreign based players (ie in France) will be available for selection or will the policy of ignoring them continue?

Jonathan Joseph at London Irish would be my tip.

As far as Scottish players are concerned, Tim Visser could have a shot, but he'll certainly be capped by then.

To my mind the best uncapped players in Scotland are Grant Gilchrist (Edinburgh lock), Rob Harley (Glasgow blindside) and Matt Scott (Edinburgh inside centre). These guys won't be Lions next summer.

funnyExiledScot wrote:Jonathan Joseph at London Irish would be my tip.

As far as Scottish players are concerned, Tim Visser could have a shot, but he'll certainly be capped by then.

To my mind the best uncapped players in Scotland are Grant Gilchrist (Edinburgh lock), Rob Harley (Glasgow blindside) and Matt Scott (Edinburgh inside centre). These guys won't be Lions next summer.

Scott is capped, fES, for his brief cameo out of position in Dublin. You could have Mark Bennett instead?!

Simon Zebo, Richard Strauss, Dave Kearney and Ian Madigan for Ireland maybe.

Tim Visser for Scotland.

That loosehead prop chap with the Mohawk who plays for quins.

luckless_pedestrian wrote:I know this is off topic, but have the Scarlets really been asked by the Welsh coaching team to develop Rhodri Jones into a tight head? Huw Llywelyn Davies suggested as much on S4C the other day.

I have heard talk of that, personally I really hope not. Just look at John Yapp, he was a promising young player and then got shunted about, and ended up a backup to the backups. Although after seeing Kick-club on Scrum V I wouldn't be too upset to see Jones converted to a fly half.

Rodders a few Ulstermen worth a shout - Spence, McAllister, Gilroy and Marshall are all possibilities for the tour party

Maybe geoff, maybe.....

roddersm wrote:Simon Zebo, Richard Strauss, Dave Kearney and Ian Madigan for Ireland maybe.

Tim Visser for Scotland.

That loosehead prop chap with the Mohawk who plays for quins.

rodders, Zebo, really? Is he honestly going to get on that plane ahead of North, Cuthbert, Bowe, Ashton, Visser, etc.? Just can't see it, sorry

Ashley Beck

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:rodders, Zebo, really? Is he honestly going to get on that plane ahead of North, Cuthbert, Bowe, Ashton, Visser, etc.? Just can't see it, sorry

North and Bowe, no. The other 3 maybe.

Ashton wouldn't be near the Lions squad imo. The most overrated player in history.

Asbo - I guess with injuries the larger players on the wings seem to pick up Zebo could well be a possibility, if someone takes a knock over the season.

There will be tons of uncapped choices to pick from in Ireland, because Kidney certainly won't give them the chance. The likes of Wales, England etc seem to trust in their young talent and take risks more. So there are less options.

My bad are we talking the Lions tour ?, I was thinking the next Nation tours - in that case virtually all names mentioned have no hope in my opinion.

Ashley Beck's a great footballer, Ruby. Maybe the 2017 Lions tour for him?

Looking at some of the names mentioned here we should be expecting a touring party of around 150 players.

To be honest from what I have seen in the last month or so I'd rather have Kearney jr or Gilroy than Zebo. I know a number of my fellow Irishmen disagree with me but for me he is the most over hyped player in Irish rugby, at the moment.

roddersm wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:rodders, Zebo, really? Is he honestly going to get on that plane ahead of North, Cuthbert, Bowe, Ashton, Visser, etc.? Just can't see it, sorry

North and Bowe, no. The other 3 maybe.

Ashton wouldn't be near the Lions squad imo. The most overrated player in history.

Zebo ahead of Visser & Cuthbert? Are you sure?

sugarNspikes wrote:Looking at some of the names mentioned here we should be expecting a touring party of around 150 players.

Well if Gatland takes a leaf out of Woodwards book 150 could be a bit on the conservative side.....

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

roddersm wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:rodders, Zebo, really? Is he honestly going to get on that plane ahead of North, Cuthbert, Bowe, Ashton, Visser, etc.? Just can't see it, sorry

North and Bowe, no. The other 3 maybe.

Ashton wouldn't be near the Lions squad imo. The most overrated player in history.

Zebo ahead of Visser & Cuthbert? Are you sure?

If I was sure I wouldn't have said 'maybe'

Oh aye, fair do's

roddersm wrote:

sugarNspikes wrote:Looking at some of the names mentioned here we should be expecting a touring party of around 150 players.

Well if Gatland takes a leaf out of Woodwards book 150 could be a bit on the conservative side.....

I just knew someone would bring that up!

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:Jonathan Joseph at London Irish would be my tip.

As far as Scottish players are concerned, Tim Visser could have a shot, but he'll certainly be capped by then.

To my mind the best uncapped players in Scotland are Grant Gilchrist (Edinburgh lock), Rob Harley (Glasgow blindside) and Matt Scott (Edinburgh inside centre). These guys won't be Lions next summer.

Scott is capped, fES, for his brief cameo out of position in Dublin. You could have Mark Bennett instead?!

Oh yes, forgot about that cameo.

Mark Bennett's parents are taking him to Disneyland next summer so he won't be able to go.

But kindergarten might let him out early!

Christian Wade or Jonny May

luckless_pedestrian wrote:Ashley Beck's a great footballer, Ruby. Maybe the 2017 Lions tour for him?

Not if he starts at 12 in the Aus tour.

If he gets a chance to shine in the tour then he could replace S.Williams and force himself into the 12 shirt for the AI, with Roberts just returning from injury.

And with Roberts never really performing for the Blues, who knows...perhaps Beck will be at 12 in the next 6N

What with the lack of centres in Scotland and England (and Kidneys obsession with Darcy), then a 6N starting welsh centre playing well could well be on the plane

Lot of ifs, but Beck is hugely talented - at the moment, I would happily swap Roberts for him as a Blues supporter. Maybe the same will happen for Wales.

If there's an injury or two at hooker Tom Youngs could make it. Looks set to be Tigers first choice hooker by next season so if he has a good year he could sneak in as a dark horse. He'd be a certainty for the England tour to SA had he not missed 4 months through a back injury. Former England under 20s IC who also played for England 7s, short, powerful with good speed and hands who loves to scrummage as much as he loves hitting things at pace.

England have a plethora of rapid backs that could make it if they have a good season next year with their clubs as they could easily miss out on the AI and 6N action due to the timing of the EPS announcements. Look out for George Ford (last years IRB Young player of the year a young fly half with an O'Gara esque kicking game), JJ Joseph (rapid OC/wing), Anthony Watson (fullback that ran round and through Ireland under 20s for 80 mins in the junior 6N), Marlon Yarde (Monye style young winger) and Charlie Walker (young and rapid OC/wing who drifts through defences for fun).

Tom Youngs is actually the best shout I have heard so far - I can see that happening. Doesn't have to be any injuries either to be honest.
Hartley keeping the England shirt but the Lions selectors deciding that Youngs is a better choice is perfectly feasible.

Then he only has to be preferred to one of Best, Ford and Rees.
If he is a regular for Leicester then that could happen; Chuter is getting on a bit as well.

Some good names up there guys... Keep them coming....!

I would obviously back Trinder and 12trees but think we are already very strong at centre collectively. Scrum-half is a fairly weak area, perhaps Ben Spencer?

From England some people have already mentioned very good players like Christian Wade, Jonny May and Jon Joseph. For what it is worth, they don’t seem that far away from a cap at the moment to me. I’d like to throw in a few forwards

Ed Slater or Graham Kitchener of Leicester might be worth a shout. Kitchener always looked skilful in the second row. He’s got good hands and a great pass on him, but it seems to me that Leicester have really got him working on the close contact and carrying game. He’s now making ground in heavy traffic. At only 22 I would be really surprised if he doesn’t make it onto the international stage. Same goes for Slater who really was a find for Tigers, he has improved so much in the last two seasons that he has gone from unknown to a fixture in the first team squad. He’s shown metal and at only 23 must be in with a shot of recognition. Away from Leicester you could throw in Matt Garvey too, who I reckon he will be capped this summer.

Joe Marler is an obvious one from an English point of view, especially if his scrumaging carries on improving the way it has been.

The final one I would suggest is Carl Fearns, I don’t believe he has actually been capped, but I think he did play in a match against the Barbarians for England... not sure why caps weren’t awarded though.

Competition for places is going to be intense enough amongst the established internationals - I just cannot see anyone who is currently uncapped getting anywhere near the touring party.

Joseph, May, Madigan, Marler and Visser are the only names that chime with any sort of realism but surely they will all be capped on the summer tours?

Hanno Dirksen ?

geoff998rugby wrote:Tom Youngs is actually the best shout I have heard so far - I can see that happening. Doesn't have to be any injuries either to be honest.
Hartley keeping the England shirt but the Lions selectors deciding that Youngs is a better choice is perfectly feasible.

Then he only has to be preferred to one of Best, Ford and Rees.

It looks likely that Ken Owens will supercede Matthew Rees for the Scarlets and for Wales. I haven't seen Tom Youngs play, but being better than Matthew Rees might not be sufficient for him.

I haven't seen Tom Youngs play, but being better than Matthew Rees might not be sufficient for him.

He provides a very different option to Rees so it may be a choice of horses for courses. If the management want real mobility rather than outright brute force Youngs could get the nod. He's short (5 foot 9) and stacked but at 16 and a half stone not the most weighty customer so if the tactic is to smash Aus clean off the park then he might lose out but if the name of the game is pace and power then he could jump the likes of Hartley and the bigger units and get in the squad. The pace of an IC with a taste for big hits may suit the gameplan against the Aussies nicely. He needs to grab the Tigers 2 shirt first though.

I actually think Tom Youngs could be the best Hooker in thr NH inside 3 years - from what I have seen he looks the real deal.

Cumbrian; Slater and Kitchener are great shouts. Both have improved immensely.

From a Welsh prespective and totally based on from my picks are:-

Ashley Beck (Ospreys - Centre)
Adam Hughes (Dragons - Centre)
Liam Williams (Scarlets - Full Back, Wing Option)
Kieran Murphy (Scarlets - Back Row)
Nathan Buck (Dragons - Tighthead)

Centre is wide open with Davies & Roberts out. I would imagine that opens the door for both Beck and Hughes to fight it out to partner Williams. Bishop is the only other real threat to those 2.

Liam Williams hopefully has impressed Gatland at the Camps during the 6 Nations. He's been brilliant.

Kieran for me though is just outstanding. A brilliant No 8 who is quick and powerful. I know he is the only one in that list not playing regular rugby but I think he's that good Gats should look at him early. Probably a season to soon for him though until he establishes himself as the starting 8 there.

Nathan Buck needs to be looked at Gatland. He is the only young Tighthead Prop who is currently playing regular rugby. The Dragons scrum is looking fairly solid as well in what has been a problem area ever since Rhys left. Again I expect Mitchell to go instead based on his Exeter form but long term Gats needs to address the lack of Tighthead in Wales and at the moment Buck is making a good case for inclusion.


Plenty of talent coming through the ranks though as other posters have elluded too but until they really nail down their spots for the Regions Gats shouldnt really reward them as you want them to work for it.

Tom Youngs according to this article:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-union/international/untested-youngs-could-join-brother-on-englands-tour-7658032.html

Now that would be a punt. He has great potential though. Fantastic ball carrier. Still a little shakey on his throw.

I think there is too much quality and competition for places for there to be an uncapped player going next year. The last uncapped player to go on tour with the Lions was Greenwood in 1997.

I cannot see an uncapped player going on this Lions tour apart from one position,number 9.
There is not a stand out 9 anywhere.A super season from a bolter could well nick a spot I reckon.

Taffineastbourne wrote:I cannot see an uncapped player going on this Lions tour apart from one position,number 9.
There is not a stand out 9 anywhere.A super season from a bolter could well nick a spot I reckon.

Apart from Mike Phillips who is one of the best nines in World Rugby.