Moffet is still a Genius

I'm talking about David Moffet, not Moffets Ghost. He gives his view on changing the Regional set-up which we all know is in need of change.

He calls for Welsh players going abroad to be banned from playing for Wales, mirroring what already happens in New Zealand and Australia.

Moffett outlined his views on the state of the Welsh game as French vultures continue to hover over our best Grand Slam talent and the regional game is facing something of a financial crisis.

It was a decade ago that Moffett and his WRU bosses changed the landscape of the domestic game by replacing the leading club sides with the Ospreys, Blues, Scarlets, Dragons and defunct Celtic Warriors.

None of the regions have cracked Europe and appear less likely to do so, given the loss of so much leading talent.

He continued: “Here are three strategies that I think would work to address this threat to Welsh rugby.

“First, the WRU could create four genuine Welsh rugby provinces and divest some of the centralised functions to them.

“Secondly, the WRU and money-men could jointly own the provincial teams on a 50-50 basis. Thirdly, as the WRU and provincial teams would jointly own the players’ contracts, central contracting becomes superfluous. Players who play outside Wales would not be selected for the national side.

“My reasons for suggesting this course of action are simple. Every Great Big Idea (GBI) has its day.

“Perhaps the shelf time of regional rugby is nearing its ‘use by’ date. What was right in 2003 may not be appropriate almost 10 years on."

The article can be accessed here: http://www.walesonline.co.uk/rugbynation/rugby-news/2012/04/21/david-moffett-calls-for-urgent-change-to-rescue-regional-rugby-in-wales-91466-30804407/

I quite like his idea. No doubt he attracts some hatred for pushing through 'regionalism' but if he didn't then nobody would have.

If we just pick Welsh based players: Halfpenny, Cuthbert, Davies, Roberts, North, Priestland, L.Williams - Faletau, Warburton, Lydiate, AWJ, Evans, A.Jones, Rees, Bevington.

James, Owens, Rees/Buck, R.Jones, Webb, Biggar, S.Williams.

So what are the WRU waiting for? Enforce this after the Australia tour.

More backs playing in Wales that may be in contention for international honours: Ashley Beck, Morgan Stoddart, Liam Williams, Jason Tovey, Hanno Dirksen (if/when WQ), Adam Hughes, Rhys Webb, Gareth Davies.

More forwards playing in Wales that may be in contetnion for international honours: Bradley Davies, Richard Hibbard, Justin Tipuric, Duncan Jones, Rhodri Jones, Aaron Shingler, Lou Reed, Lewis Evans. Tighthead, could be either Nathan Buck, Joe Rees or Scott Andrews. Personally, Andrews had been given chances to develop his game by Wales and the Blues and hasn't. I'd go with one of the former two.

"First, the WRU could create four genuine Welsh rugby provinces and divest some of the centralised functions to them."


So, basically what he wanted to happen in the first place, then?

I guess so. IMO, the WRU now has no choice but to do it. They certainly need part ownership with the Blues.

Part ownership with the Blues I agree with. Scarlets need to be left to keep building as they are, and I think if the O's keep playing and winning like they are under Tandy things will come good for them too. Just need to really work on regularly bringing in bigger crowds now.

Yep I agree with all of that, but the other three can still improve in certain aspects.

David Moffett has recently been trying to set up a new Rugby League team in NZ.

Last updated 08:41 06/03/2012SharePrint Text Size - New Warriors co-owner Owen Glenn is already pushing for a second National Rugby League franchise in New Zealand....Glenn has only had shares in the Warriors for days but the New Zealand multi-millionaire is already lobbying for a second Kiwi team and has held talks with a consortium led by former NRL chief executive David Moffett.

David Moffett briefly wrote for a newspaper in Canterbury three years ago.

New Zealanders know their rugby. They weren't exactly dazzled by his rugby expertise and it came to an abrupt end.

Moffet is the reason we're in this mess, well partly.

Granted this is what he wanted originally, but WALES WILL NEVER ACCEPT REGIONS!!!

We are too small, too parochial, and too passionate to all stand together week in week out against a foreign enemy!

We want to beat each other, we want to stand opposite our neighbours and bay for blood.

The only way we move forward as a nation is with clubs. I know I sound like an old fogy, someone who wasn't able to accept regionalism, and never gave it a chance. I am not, I accepted it gladly, I thought it would be a step in the right direction, but it never inspired me. Even though a cardiff boy I struggled with the Blues, even the day at twickers V Gloucester, in France V Toulon, and at the MS V Leicester + Tolouse. I was there for all but just struggled to get as passionate about the generic feel of the name/badge/team!

I understand the clubs would struggle in europe, so maybe a regional setup for euro games only, similar to the super set up.

I just can't see how copying structures will help us, the regional system works in Ireland because they have the borders, the history, the feeling for the region. WE ARE NOT IRELAND!!!

"He calls for Welsh players going abroad to be banned from playing for Wales, mirroring what already happens in New Zealand and Australia."

Dan Carter played for Toulon didn't he? Then returned I think when the RWC was around the corner.
Also NZ has had its financial problems in the past. Otago being the most recent. I wish Moffet would shut up and keep his nose out of our business.

Ali Williams was at nottingham, SBW at Toulon...

But they generally all go back to NZ to play for club and country!

But I'm with you, I wish he would shut up and butt out!

thebluesmancometh wrote:Moffet is the reason we're in this mess, well partly.

Granted this is what he wanted originally, but WALES WILL NEVER ACCEPT REGIONS!!!

We are too small, too parochial, and too passionate to all stand together week in week out against a foreign enemy!

We want to beat each other, we want to stand opposite our neighbours and bay for blood.

The only way we move forward as a nation is with clubs. I know I sound like an old fogy, someone who wasn't able to accept regionalism, and never gave it a chance. I am not, I accepted it gladly, I thought it would be a step in the right direction, but it never inspired me. Even though a cardiff boy I struggled with the Blues, even the day at twickers V Gloucester, in France V Toulon, and at the MS V Leicester + Tolouse. I was there for all but just struggled to get as passionate about the generic feel of the name/badge/team!

I understand the clubs would struggle in europe, so maybe a regional setup for euro games only, similar to the super set up.

I just can't see how copying structures will help us, the regional system works in Ireland because they have the borders, the history, the feeling for the region. WE ARE NOT IRELAND!!!

The mess we are in now is our own fault. Moffet brought to us the right idea, he and others didn't execute it well and what we have now is the mess. Like I said, our fault, because some of us wanted our own way. I thought the title would wind up valleys folk though, not the clarts.

It's not a matter of accepting regions, we need it, 100% need it. Being too small a nation is one of the reasons for, not against. There's no time for being parochial, but granted it is a possitive in you are playing in a Welsh or English premiership. I realise there are still some blinkered ones only concerned about beating each other but we are better off without them. The new generation is coming to fruition and lets let it continue to do so.

I'm all for some sort of change to the set-up, but never reverting back to the old clubs. What chances do Cardiff or Cross Keys have against the Leinsters and Toulouse' ? Because before the regions they would be condeding 70+ points. If you don't believe me go back and check the archives. What a massive step backwards it would be after all that Regionalism has done for the Wales team and for the development of players.

It works well in Ireland. We need to mirror the NZ model a bit more. Even they had issues with Super rugby teams at the start but have learnt. I'm suprised at you not feeling you are able to follow the Blues, they are stand alone after all. Any changes to the Prem may require a re-structuring of the Rabo, HEC and 6 Nations; it requires a NH restructure when we are still trying to fit in games against the SH and go on Lions tours then to World Cups. We have to make do with what we have now, but going back to the clubs is certainly not the solution.

Cardiff Dave wrote:"He calls for Welsh players going abroad to be banned from playing for Wales, mirroring what already happens in New Zealand and Australia."

Dan Carter played for Toulon didn't he? Then returned I think when the RWC was around the corner.
Also NZ has had its financial problems in the past. Otago being the most recent. I wish Moffet would shut up and keep his nose out of our business.

Have you not heard of the sabbatical?

Think about this. You are the NZRU and you have the best played in THE WORLD and any club in France would pay big money to get their hands on him, even if for a season. His contract with you is due to end and you want him to stay in NZ and play for as long as possible. The solution is the sabbatical, allowing them to play abroad for around 6 months then have him return to home shores and sign a new 4 year contract. Smart move. Dan earnt 900,000 without it harming his All Blacks chances. DC is happy, NZ are happier.

I believe he may get another, as will McCaw. The longer they stay in NZ the longer their playing careers. For now I believe both are comitted to New Zealand Rugby.

I never know what to make of Moffet,as a New Zealander I always get the feeling that hes telling everybody,us what we already know,I was driving about a couple of weeks ago and Moffet came onto the radio telling us how bad the Welsh were a few years back for not letting the All Blacks do the Haka,but only for the fact that they had broken some agreement that he had made.

Morg

Youve misread partly, but even so you are wrong!

If your blinkered enough to not see how there is, and always will be problems with the idea of regional rugby when wales has no regions to speak of then I suggest you go sit in a dark room and watch past glories, and GS videos for the rest of your days.

I did suggest the club game runs it's normal season with regional selection for HC games.

The regions have done little but localize our talent pool, and cut the number of young talent to a certain few who will pressured from an early age to succeed!!

The set up of the 'warm up' league has done more for Welsh rugby than the regions. While we're on it who has come through a regional set up and contributed to a GS that wouldn't have come through a club set up and done exactly the same? Isn't it more likely that for every 30 boys selected at U16 level for each region, there would be 4 times more participants at the same level getting the same high level of coaching, and recieving the same opportunities??? Our player pool would be greater, our number of quality players would increase and the NT would grow stronger because of it!!!

PS we are not Ireland, they have fought and died for their regions, they have history it means somethin to them. We are not NZ, we don't have the same participation numbers, culture, physiology!

We need to follow a welsh set up, incorporate the welsh way, and tailor it to become succesfull, until this happens our NT may go through the odd decent period where we avoid SH clubs at WC's, and win GS's when other team are in turmoil or restructure, but a sustained succesfull NT/club game will not happen!!

thebluesmancometh wrote:Moffet is the reason we're in this mess, well partly.

Granted this is what he wanted originally, but WALES WILL NEVER ACCEPT REGIONS!!!

We are too small, too parochial, and too passionate to all stand together week in week out against a foreign enemy!

We want to beat each other, we want to stand opposite our neighbours and bay for blood.

The only way we move forward as a nation is with clubs. I know I sound like an old fogy, someone who wasn't able to accept regionalism, and never gave it a chance. I am not, I accepted it gladly, I thought it would be a step in the right direction, but it never inspired me. Even though a cardiff boy I struggled with the Blues, even the day at twickers V Gloucester, in France V Toulon, and at the MS V Leicester + Tolouse. I was there for all but just struggled to get as passionate about the generic feel of the name/badge/team!

I understand the clubs would struggle in europe, so maybe a regional setup for euro games only, similar to the super set up.

I just can't see how copying structures will help us, the regional system works in Ireland because they have the borders, the history, the feeling for the region. WE ARE NOT IRELAND!!!

Agreed and Cardiff being just Cardiff at the Arms Park under proper management that puts the interests of the club first, and not gambling on property deals, would work.
However, I believe the Ospreys would be ok as they are if they had their own proper rugby ground.

That's a stupid reply isn't it bluesman? It may lead me to believe that you are stupid.

I did state it was not a matter of accepting regionalism, that's exactly the problem because 50% still haven't accepted it. Who's to say that'll go on forever though? Certainly not you.

What you don't get is there isn't enough money, quality playing squad, a large enough playing pool nor enough quality coaches and certainly not enough money (again) to bring any of them in. The regions were set up to feed the national team, their academies were set up to feed them and the premiership. It's clearly working. I don't see how anyone could say otherwise or even dream that the clubs are capable of doing the same.

PS, I actually do know where aren't Ireland or NZ. They are similar in rugby terms though. I've suggested we mirror the NZ model bit my bit. It will never be as good or identical as theirs. But again, that wasn't what I suggested.

Anyway, my post wasn't focusing on the regions so much, it was more to do with strengthening them and the national team, i:e, Moffets centralised contract idea. That's a NZ idea too btw.

Were you steviegien on 606?

Moffett will tell anyone prepared to listen that the 3 Grand Slams for Wales in the last 8 championships are all because of him.

Perhaps he is right?

Perhaps it has nothing to do with the players, or the coaches?

Perhaps it really is down to an administrator who bashed the square peg of Welsh Rugby into a circular regional hole.

You are so one eyed it's mad!!!

50% of people accepting regionalism is a very optimistic on your part, but it is rising, as children get older it's all they know, but that doesn't make it right!

If regionalism is accepted, and maybe it will be, it won't be by anyone who knew tha game as a club prem, and that is very sad. The face of welsh rugby has been manipulated, and tailored to suit a few businessmen who were self elected into positions of power!

Rugby is not international only, it's a saturday afternoon at St mellons playing fields, it's a sunday morning at Abergavenny, it's a prem game between 2 of the most bitter rivals, it's a div 3 south east game between 2 neighbouring towns, and it's am U9's flag pulling ball chasing contest!!!

The whole sport is and never will be all about winning the 6N or WC, and thats where why we have these problems. The regions have sacrificed club success for player localization, they turn away 25 talented players per year for a select few who enter their academies. Infact I'd go as far to say as 50% of players who show real promise have to drop out at some point due to travel/financial issues!!!

The earlier you narrow the player pool, the smaller the opportunity for int quality players become, and the more chances of mistakes happening!

The premiership is now a nothing league, for amatuers who don't have any real ability. The young players learn nothing in the prem because the gulf in class is so large!

1000's were chanting "Cardiff, Cardiff" at the Arms Park recently when Cardiff Blues played Ulster yet some on here suggest dropping the word Cardiff from the name of the team. If there was a "Blues, Blues" chant I didn't hear it.
The market is there and it wants brand Cardiff and not bland Blues or the pretend regionalism that goes with it.

8500 at Connaght and 9000 at Ulster!!!

Morgannwg wrote:

Were you steviegien on 606?

I remember him.

thebluesmancometh wrote:You are so one eyed it's mad!!!

50% of people accepting regionalism is a very optimistic on your part, but it is rising, as children get older it's all they know, but that doesn't make it right!

If regionalism is accepted, and maybe it will be, it won't be by anyone who knew tha game as a club prem, and that is very sad. The face of welsh rugby has been manipulated, and tailored to suit a few businessmen who were self elected into positions of power!

Rugby is not international only, it's a saturday afternoon at St mellons playing fields, it's a sunday morning at Abergavenny, it's a prem game between 2 of the most bitter rivals, it's a div 3 south east game between 2 neighbouring towns, and it's am U9's flag pulling ball chasing contest!!!

The whole sport is and never will be all about winning the 6N or WC, and thats where why we have these problems. The regions have sacrificed club success for player localization, they turn away 25 talented players per year for a select few who enter their academies. Infact I'd go as far to say as 50% of players who show real promise have to drop out at some point due to travel/financial issues!!!

The earlier you narrow the player pool, the smaller the opportunity for int quality players become, and the more chances of mistakes happening!

The premiership is now a nothing league, for amatuers who don't have any real ability. The young players learn nothing in the prem because the gulf in class is so large!

I don't see how I'm 'one-eyed' in accepting Regionalism. I'd rather accept it for the possitives it's doing for Welsh rugby, because it is doing just that, rather than cry for the old clubs to come back because it was entertaining to see fighting in the local derbies. So I wouldn't see how it isn't right, when it is the right idea for developing rugby union in Wales. As that is my main concern, I'm not overly concerned about club rivalries like you and others. You know I used to think it was mostly the valley communties that hated the regions, but they just hate Cardiff. It's Cardiff that hate the Regions. I can't see why they hate the concept as they aren't much of a region.

The rest Steve, is just rubbish so to save repeating nonsense I'm going to ignore it. I've already stated that I think central contracting is a step in the right direction, hence me bringing this article to people's attention.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:

Were you steviegien on 606?

I remember him.

I do too. Talked a lot of irrelevant nonsense if you disagreed with him and repeated it over & over...and overused the exclamation mark often.

Morgannwg wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:

Were you steviegien on 606?

I remember him.

I do too. Talked a lot of irrelevant nonsense if you disagreed with him and repeated it over & over...and overused the exclamation mark often.

Something you never do of course. Nor do you resort to insulting people who disagree with you.

You are as one eyed as you are arrogant mate, calling me steve is a nice little tease though.

I suspect you know little of the regional infrastructure, youth set up, or junior systems so you know what, I'm going to leave it there with you.

If you honestly believe that compacting all our resources into 4 areas is a good idea, then you would probably enjoy the idea of just team wales. We would then probably be succesfull in the rabo and HC, let's ditch everyone outside the Wales team, save a fortune and allow our best players to play together.

I suggest you get involved in the set up in some way, gain a little experience then we'll talk.

Morgannwg wrote:That's a stupid reply isn't it bluesman? It may lead me to believe that you are stupid.

I did state it was not a matter of accepting regionalism, that's exactly the problem because 50% still haven't accepted it. Who's to say that'll go on forever though? Certainly not you.

What you don't get is there isn't enough money, quality playing squad, a large enough playing pool nor enough quality coaches and certainly not enough money (again) to bring any of them in. The regions were set up to feed the national team, their academies were set up to feed them and the premiership. It's clearly working. I don't see how anyone could say otherwise or even dream that the clubs are capable of doing the same.

PS, I actually do know where aren't Ireland or NZ. They are similar in rugby terms though. I've suggested we mirror the NZ model bit my bit. It will never be as good or identical as theirs. But again, that wasn't what I suggested.

Anyway, my post wasn't focusing on the regions so much, it was more to do with strengthening them and the national team, i:e, Moffets centralised contract idea. That's a NZ idea too btw.

Were you steviegien on 606?

50% haven't bought the myth of regionalism? I would estimate it's a lot more than that. Upper 90s easy.
Nevermind. As long as team Wales are doing alright, who cares?

Exactly Dave!

Morgannwg wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:

Were you steviegien on 606?

I remember him.

I do too. Talked a lot of irrelevant nonsense if you disagreed with him and repeated it over & over...and overused the exclamation mark often.

thebluesmancometh is nothing like stevieg and it is you that is spouting nonsense.

No, that's defintely steviegen. The final stupid reply seals it. I'll just avoid the posts from now on otherwise I could say something that would get me into trouble with the mods.

Dave, your thoughts on the central contract idea are welcome. Your slagging off of the regions got boring weeks ago though, besides there has already been two articles doing that and they're still flowing, Valleys Rugby plan for example.

And Dave, I don't remember a Cardiff Dave on 606, who were you formerly known as?

LondonTiger wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:

Were you steviegien on 606?

I remember him.

I do too. Talked a lot of irrelevant nonsense if you disagreed with him and repeated it over & over...and overused the exclamation mark often.

Something you never do of course. Nor do you resort to insulting people who disagree with you.

Examples?

bluesman, I've reported your post. You are a child that takes yourself and comments to seriously. Something steviegen often did when I disagreed with his postings. Hence me pointing it out. Of course I could be wrong and you aren't him, but the similarities seem too similar right now.

Speaking as a poster the regions nonsense has gone on long enough don't you think? At the risk of having this thread merged with the others slagging off regionalism can you ask that people don't talk about it here? As I did state I wanted to discuss the central contracting idea. The Prem being played in the summer has been mentioned before too, that's interesting.

Morgannwg wrote:No, that's defintely steviegen. The final stupid reply seals it. I'll just avoid the posts from now on otherwise I could say something that would get me into trouble with the mods.

Dave, your thoughts on the central contract idea are welcome. Your slagging off of the regions got boring weeks ago though, besides there has already been two articles doing that and they're still flowing, Valleys Rugby plan for example.

And Dave, I don't remember a Cardiff Dave on 606, who were you formerly known as?

No that wasn't me.
Look, regionalism is a lie. A big one with brass knobs on. The Ponty/Cardiff grief shows it all too well and has done ever since this rubbish began.
The best thing for Welsh rugby in the capital is for Cardiff to be just Cardiff. That is my honest opinion as their efforts to appear to be regional and fair to all have failed totally. They have wasted money and lost support all at the same time. Add to this the crazy stadium deal plus Thomas's inept management and we have what we have.

Can we just have one more comment from Morgannwg on similarities that seem too similar, please?

Absolute gem.

Morgannwg wrote:

Speaking as a poster the regions nonsense has gone on long enough don't you think?

Agreed. Now you're talking.

Dave

Is morg a proper wind up merciant I take it? I was worried for a moment I had upset a well rounded poster.

Ah Cas, I believe you need to answer on another thread. Don't try and pop at me at on this thread though because I pointed out your ridiculous posts on that one, it's like watching paint dry .

Can I point out that all posts on the subject are welcome, because I don't see where I have gone wrong. Posting petty insults and latching onto each other is childish, I'm here to discuss the subject, which isn't the failure of regionalism or bringing back dead clubs. That doesn't go out to Dave btw, goes out to Cas, Blues and london tiger.

"That doesn't go out to Dave btw, goes out to Cas, Blues and london tiger. ."

Well I won't pretend that doesn't hurt ...

I've been officially PM'd.

Wheres the 'hangs head in shame in the naught corner' smiley?

Cardiff Dave wrote:

No that wasn't me.
Look, regionalism is a lie. A big one with brass knobs on. The Ponty/Cardiff grief shows it all too well and has done ever since this rubbish began.
The best thing for Welsh rugby in the capital is for Cardiff to be just Cardiff. That is my honest opinion as their efforts to appear to be regional and fair to all have failed totally. They have wasted money and lost support all at the same time. Add to this the crazy stadium deal plus Thomas's inept management and we have what we have.

Yes we know, regionalism is bad this, that and the other. I'd rather take steps to improve it though after the poor execution in the first place. Which may mean you waving bye-bye to Cardiff. Still I've yet to see someone explain how the old clubs going back professional would be better, not even JPR can explain how, because I don't think it's possible.

Even your Cardiff need a region IMO but should probably base/stage most of their games at Cardiff, you don't see Leinster go outside of Dublin. Cardiff needs the valleys, they need a top flight time that doesn't go by that name.

Leinster are Dublin based for one reason, 90% of their fan base is in Dublin, very similar to Cardiff, Swansea, Llanelli, Newport!!!

Probably in Cardiff's case, but not sure about the others. But, seeing as they were told they should also represent the valleys I think they should become a Region. It may work, it may not. Seems to do be doing the others a bit of good, probably more to the Scarlets and Ospreys.

Morgannwg wrote:

Yes we know, regionalism is bad this, that and the other. I'd rather take steps to improve it though after the poor execution in the first place. Which may mean you waving bye-bye to Cardiff. Still I've yet to see someone explain how the old clubs going back professional would be better, not even JPR can explain how, because I don't think it's possible.

Even your Cardiff need a region IMO but should probably base/stage most of their games at Cardiff, you don't see Leinster go outside of Dublin. Cardiff needs the valleys, they need a top flight time that doesn't go by that name.

Why wave bye-bye to Cardiff when clearly the market is there?
That is exactly where they have gone wrong by pretending to be regional. Ponty never bought into it and why should they?
Looks to me as the best thing for team Wales would be having just Cardiff without the Blues nonsense.
Cardiff doesn't need the valleys either (whatever that means).
They attracted huge crowds in the past simply by being a rugby club based in the capital city. Not surprisingly they called themselves Cardiff and it worked.

thebluesmancometh wrote:Leinster are Dublin based for one reason, 90% of their fan base is in Dublin, very similar to Cardiff, Swansea, Llanelli, Newport!!!

I'm shocked.

Well lets be a little brutal here...

Cardiff have been the most succesfull 'region' since they became, in european context anyway!
They are struggling at present financially, but I suspect Thomas is playing some sort of game with the WRU for finances. Oh woe is us, unless you want your capital team to go under we need money kinda thing.

It's just a matter of time before the Scarlets are recalled on their huge debts and hit an almighty iceberg.

Cuddy is going to get pee'd off sooner rather than later with all the problems they're having with stadia, Neath etc...

And the Dragons will be there or there abouts to become Wales number one region, and europes 102nd ranked highest team!

The structure in place is for the sacrifice of grass roots rugby to aid the national team, and boy the pink cowboy hat brigade are enjoying it, most of those who were at the MS this year wouldn't notice if the Blues, Ospreys and Scarlets went under, unless Wales lost to Italy!

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Why wave bye-bye to Cardiff when clearly the market is there?
That is exactly where they have gone wrong by pretending to be regional. Ponty never bought into it and why should they?
Looks to me as the best thing for team Wales would be having just Cardiff without the Blues nonsense.
Cardiff doesn't need the valleys either (whatever that means).
They attracted huge crowds in the past simply by being a rugby club based in the capital city. Not surprisingly they called themselves Cardiff and it worked.

I just meant the name Cardiff. Of course the market is there, so it makes sense to keep the majority of games in Cardiff but they also need to take steps to embrace this conept we are discussing. Actually you'll find the only time the valleys supported you is when you played Gloucester/Leicester in the HC. You wouldn't have got that many without them, I doubt it anyway.

Morgannwg wrote:Probably in Cardiff's case, but not sure about the others. But, seeing as they were told they should also represent the valleys I think they should become a Region. It may work, it may not. Seems to do be doing the others a bit of good, probably more to the Scarlets and Ospreys.

So after the Celtic Warriors demise, Cardiff were "told" what to do?
Light the blue touch paper and retire.
In general, people object being told what to do. They usually like to make up their own mind.

They do generally make up their own mind.
I believe both Ponty and Cardiff were told that would now become one. Surely you of all people know this. If Blues were half owned by the WRU I for one believe the Union would sort out the current mess they are in.