Day 13- French Open Men's semifinals

First topic message reminder :

Friends, v2ans, countrymen lend me your ears.
I have come to preview this semifinal fixture not to curse it;
The memory of the matches that these men play often live after them;
The unforced errors are often interred with their bones;
So let it be with Roger. The noble Novak
Hath told you Roger is ambitious;
If it were so, it was a grievous fault;
And grievously Roger might answer it;
Roger was my friend, faithful and just to me;
But Novak says he was ambitious;
And Novak is an honourable man;
He had brought many Grand Slams home to Switzerland;
Whose gleam did fill the trophy cabinets;
Did this in Roger seem ambitious?
When his twins have cried, Roger has stayed up;
Ambition should be made out of sterner stuff;
You did see in Paris many times now;
Thrice the 'Grand Slam' was presented;
Which he did thrice refuse; was this ambition?
Yet Novak says he was ambitious;
And Novak is an honourable man
You did all love him once, not without cause;
What reason withholds you to cheer for him?
O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts;
Bear with me, for now I must pause to do this preview

http://www.presentationmagazine.com/famous-speeches-friends-romans-countrymen-11673.htm


Mens semifinals:

Nadal(2) vs Ferrer (6)
Head to Head Record: Nadal 15-4 Ferrer
Last meeting: Rome Semis Nadal 7-6 6-0 Ferrer
Head to Head in Grand Slams: Ferrer 2-1 Nadal
Clay Head to Head: Nadal 12-1 Ferrer

Djokovic (1) vs Federer (3)
Head to Head Record: Federer 14-11 Djokovic
Last meeting: Rome Semis Djokovic 6-2 7-6 Federer
Head to Head in Grand Slams: Federer 5-4 Djokovic
Clay Head to Head: Federer 3-2 Djokovic

Predictions so far:
Ferrer- Invisible Coolers
Nadal- Lydian, Jahu, Haddie Nuff, Bogbrush, Social, Barrystar, Legendkiller, Mangamuri, Tom, Summer, SFP

Federer- Jahu, Lydian, Invisible Coolers, Haddie Nuff, Legendkiller, Tom
Djokovic- Barrystar, Bogbrush, Social, Mangamuri, Summer, SFP

barrystar wrote:

lydian wrote:Question: What do you think is Federer's best ever clay-court match (I dont mean winning FO09 final)...but quality of win?
I'm going for his victory here last year over Djokovic.

The 2011 SF is the best I have seen for quality of play and quality of opponent, but his 2009 SF vs. Del Boy pushes it very close indeed, Del Boy looked unbeatable during patches of that match.

Haas 2009.

I can't go with Haas 2009 for quality - Fed seemed to spend the first two sets stunned by the enormity of Rafa's loss, played some epic points and games at the clutch, and then ran away with it. Both Del Boy and Djoko's defeats were higher quality, even if they lacked the same drama.

laverfan wrote:

barrystar wrote:It was 1984, Connors beat Mac in 1982 and Mac beat Lewis in 1983.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoOwJlysdLI

Think I'm right in saying that Alan Mills told Mac after the 1984 demolition job on Jimmy C that Mac had only committed something like three or four UEs in the whole match. It was very much pay back for the titanic 1982 Wimbledon final tussle between the two that Connors edged.

They have said play is due to resume shortly

Good call Barry with the delpo match, yes I remember watching that thinking Fed was on his way out (like a couple of days back after that 2nd set too!) but he did remarkably well to come back. I guess similarly in that previous round Haas match too - that was more a battle/struggle of form though.

Also...is Fed 3rd best ever on clay (Nadal>Borg>Federer) or is there a shout for guys like Vilas, Muster, Guga, Lendl to be ahead of him?

...and Wilander.

barrystar wrote:I can't go with Haas 2009 for quality - Fed seemed to spend the first two sets stunned by the enormity of Rafa's loss, played some epic points and games at the clutch, and then ran away with it. Both Del Boy and Djoko's defeats were higher quality, even if they lacked the same drama.

I agree, Barry. The reason for me to lean towards the Haas match was that he could control his demeanor and still play to win, despite the inner turmoil. By the time Del Po came around, he had already digested Nadal's exit.

DelPo FO 2009 was almost a precursor to USO 2009. The FO was a pretty good match. March of Destiny, perhaps.

Yes LF, it certainly fuelled DP's belief he could live with Federer, so even though he lost that RG match it helped him no doubt.
You can only imagine how Roger must have felt when Rafa went out...it probably created a whole heap of internal pressure to get to the final.

lydian wrote:...and Wilander.

Vilas for me, hands down.

Nadal, Borg, Federer, Vilas. If you are going to bring in Wilander, then I would add Muster, Lendl, Agassi to the list, and we can go on all day.

lydian wrote:
You can only imagine how Roger must have felt when Rafa went out...it probably created a whole heap of internal pressure to get to the final.

... and Federer admits it in one of his post RG interviews. He was 'expected' to win.

Reckon Rog felt more pressure following the 09 Rafa exit at RG than at any time in his career. Here was the best chance - perhaps the ONLY chance - to win the French.
I well recall having got totally tied up at work and calling up the score of his match against Tommy Haas to see him two sets down, 3-4, 30-40 and thinking, crickey, lose this point and Haas serves for the match.
Then followed the inside-out forehand BP saver, the come-back against del Potty and ultimate triumph. Scary times.

Ah, Rafa and Ferrer are back. Bet Ferrer was glad to get off.

I think you've got to be slow to proclaim Federer the 3rd greatest claycourter of all time, there's too much 'what if' involved.

Put simply, he has not played enough matches on clay or won enough tournaments (10). Jimmy Connors played a similar amount of clay court tennis, won more tournaments (12) and made three slam finals on clay, one of which he won vs. Borg (all at the US Open 1975-1977) as well as winning 40 matches at RG.

What you can say is that Fed is one of the greatest players ever who played less than a quarter of his matches on clay but whose record of success on clay bears comparison with many clay-court greats: 5 RG finals including a W, closing on the record of RG match wins (54 at the mo), 6 titles at Hamburg/Madrid and many losing finals to the one and only Rafa is a record that almost any clay-court specialist would be proud of, but at less than 250 clay court matches and 1 clay slam it does not make him top-three material.

HEAD showed a cute advert with Djoko + Sharapova

Kaboooom!

Rafa picks up where he left off. Perhaps Haddie is right. He does want to watch the football and this match is an irritant and cramping his style.

Rafa takes second set 6-2 for a two sets to love lead. Can't see this one lasting much longer.

sirfredperry wrote:Rafa takes second set 6-2 for a two sets to love lead. Can't see this one lasting much longer.

I agree, especially, since Rafa has just broken Ferrer's serve to start the third set. I'm not even sure Novak could live with Rafa in this form.

Ferrer gone awol. Probably rushing to go home.

This might be the quickest SF Nadal has ever had on clay.

Just noticed now. Slamtracker on FO site give the score at least 5 second faster than we see it no TV. Signal going slow over french fields.

Let's hope Rafa dishes out a bagel so this god awful match can conclude asap.

Novak has a solid chance to beat Rafa. He is no Ferrer who basically conceded the match before even stepping on court.

There is no way Rafa is gonna roll over Novak in straight sets.

If they both play to potential it's 50:50 on clay over five sets.

Of course Novak may not even get past Roger.



emancipator

Well Nadal having a training session here, and except if Djoko wins in quick 3 sets over Fed, and not over 4 or 5 sets, Djoko will be tired playing 3 last matches over 5 sets and Nadal will mince him on Sunday.

Rog and Nole might as well jack it in now. Seems little point in actually holding the event. They could save a lot of time by just presenting the Musketeer's Cup, or whatever it's called, to Rafa on day one.

Hahahaha, nice one Sir FP.

Nadal is playing great but it really is a disgraceful effort from Ferrer who started just dumping the match ages ago. Zero mental strength.

Double break for Rafa in third set. Doubt if Ferrer can even get his customary two games in this set.

sirfredperry wrote:Rog and Nole might as well jack it in now. Seems little point in actually holding the event. They could save a lot of time by just presenting the Musketeer's Cup, or whatever it's called, to Rafa on day one.

If Roger beats Novak then yes.. hand the trophy to Rafa.

If Novak gets to the final.. get ready for a war. There is no way Rafa is gonna beat him easily. If you believe that you haven't been watching their matches over the last 18 months. Sure Rafa won the last two, but this is the big one, and Novak will be focused and determined. The only caveat I would add to that is if Novak has a long five setter today with Fed. In that case he may not have enough left in the tank to challenge Rafa.

Nadal in nucelar mode. Ferrero Rocher in melting mode.

Nadal in great form. Should win this slam.

Wimbledon? Lets just say he doesn't play too badly there either, so if he is in this type of form I can't see Murray getting near that slam title

Don't think it's gonna matter how long Nole takes to beat Rog. He's not gonna beat Rafa. Just hope it's a good match and Rafa can, at least, get stretched.

Djokovic will beat Rafa. It's his destiny

sirfredperry wrote:Don't think it's gonna matter how long Nole takes to beat Rog. He's not gonna beat Rafa. Just hope it's a good match and Rafa can, at least, get stretched.

Good job Novak doesn't go on court with that attitude. He'd never have won anything.

GSM to Rafa 6-2, 6-2, 6-1. Surely Andy M would have got more games than this.

All done. Top play from Nadal, Ferrer a total disgrace. Even Murray might of taken a set from Nadal.

Rafa ruffles David's hair as if to say, "Don't worry son, you'll get another opportunity."

Ferrer is a very good player at what he does but he is predictable and Nadal likes players who are predictable.

I think Murray would have given Nadal a more difficult match because he tends to be more unpredictable and inventive.

Ferrer is 30 years of age and all the better players are younger than he. Hence Ferrer doesn't have many other chances. He probably said to Ferrer: Vidal Sassoon?

sirfredperry wrote:GSM to Rafa 6-2, 6-2, 6-1. Surely Andy M would have got more games than this.

Tell that to the clown that said that he was glad Ferrer won the other day as he'd give Nadal a tougher match.

Today Rafael Nadal beats David Ferrer 6-2 6-2 6-1

Last year in the semi at RG rafael Nadal beat Andy Murray 6-4 7-5 6-4.

As for the other semi I have a feeling Novak Djokovic will come out on top.

CaledonianCraig wrote:

sirfredperry wrote:GSM to Rafa 6-2, 6-2, 6-1. Surely Andy M would have got more games than this.

Tell that to the clown that said that he was glad Ferrer won the other day as he'd give Nadal a tougher match. :roll:

Today Rafael Nadal beats David Ferrer 6-2 6-2 6-1

Last year in the semi at RG rafael Nadal beat Andy Murray 6-4 7-5 6-4.

I wont argue with that Craig but what I will say is Rafa is in the form of his life imo and playing better than last year.. 2011 was not a particularly good year all round for Rafa but whatever it is that has made the difference it shows.

I cannot see either Djokovic or Federer beating Rafa in the final. He has been imperious throughout. Nadal playing at his best beats Federer or Djokovic playing at their best on clay in my opinion.

CC. well, I must say I was surprised by the view of many that somehow Ferrer was gonna make a match of it. I know he beat Rafa in Melbourne last year but Nadal was clearly injured. The Spanish players generally seem so in awe of Rafa, and he plays so well against them, that nothing seems to work for them. They're beaten before they even start.
Just hope the final is a decent match, but Rafa looks in the sort of form to eat anybody alive.

Well just as Roger Federer is recognised as the overall GOAT well on clay Rafael Nadal is the GOAT.

Haddie - do you think Djokovic Mk II might have turned Nadal into a potential Nadal Mk III ? One of the keys to longevity is motivation and perhaps last year as well as the AO 2012 may have been a "turning point" with Nadal. If Djokovic takes a small step backward to return to a Djokovic Mk 1.5, then perhaps the next four in a row grand slammer might well be Nadal MkIII ?

Notes
Nadal Mk I the original clay court specialist.
Nadal Mk II the Federer slayer
Nadal Mk III ? The beast (as per his uncle).

Nore Stat I think what happened last year has been well documented by me on other threads ..particularly to socal after Monte Carlo.. Rafa is now a lot more comfortable in his own skin.. there were definitely problems in the camp and Rafa cant cope when things are out of control. He was not focussed, distracted and unhappy in general..( same as when he pulled out of Wimbledon when his parents marriage broke up) but peace reigns once more Vamos Rafa your back

1st match:
11 people voted for Nadal, while 1 for Ferrer

The majority were proved right here

Uh, oh. The threat of rain has temporarily delayed the start of the match.

606v2 Odds for 2nd semi:
6:6 Votes either way- 50%

Not sure if that means anything though.

As if Rafa were not playing well enough anyway, he now might face a guy who's had to play on some part of Saturday as well.
Spose you could argue, however, that the Fed-Djoko winner will be fresher if they have a long match spread over two days rather than have to do it all in one go.
Beginning to think that it's not only likely that Rafa will play Djoko but it's also quite important he does. Reckon Fed would get more games in the final than Ferrer in the semi, but doubt if many would want to see a repeat of the 2008 crushing RG win.

RG radio which I'm listening too says that rain is due to hang around until 9pm with a 50% probability...so that 2.5hrs chance of play (after this spell of rain). Unless one of them finishes quickly this may well be going on tomorrow as well...Nadal will be showering off in the locker room glad to have got his match done.

Poor scheduling by RG. They should have played the other simultaneously on Lenglen.