Rate your national coach as it stands NOW. (6Ns)

First topic message reminder :

Do what it says on the tin.

Twelve months ago many posters had different views regarding their national manager/coach than are currently popular.

Rate your current your opinion.

And next year the results a repeat poll outcome can be compared.

Poll closes before SH Rugby Championship

rodders wrote:McGahan can't drop ROG as hes an IRFU contracted player which supercedes the Munster coaches authority.

Unless the IRFU agree otherwise ROG will be starting 10 at Munster until his contract runs out. They aren't paying him to sit on the bench for Munster and need him fit for Ireland duty.

eh, Peter Stringer with central contract dropped for Tomas O'Leary (and there was no drop in form from Stringer).

Tomas O'Leary dropped for Conor Murray (who still is on a provincial contract).

DOC dropped for D Ryan.

I don't think there should be an issue if the replacement is Irish qualified.

Stag, that is quite an exciting munster backline

Sin é wrote:
eh, Peter Stringer with central contract dropped for Tomas O'Leary (and there was no drop in form from Stringer).

Tomas O'Leary dropped for Conor Murray (who still is on a provincial contract).

DOC dropped for D Ryan.

I don't think there should be an issue if the replacement is Irish qualified.

Sin in all those cases the person dropped ended up being replaced on the national side by the person they were dropped for.

The IRFU were at the heart of those descisions, certainly they weren't done without their prior approval.

rodders wrote:

Sin é wrote:
eh, Peter Stringer with central contract dropped for Tomas O'Leary (and there was no drop in form from Stringer).

Tomas O'Leary dropped for Conor Murray (who still is on a provincial contract).

DOC dropped for D Ryan.

I don't think there should be an issue if the replacement is Irish qualified.

Sin in all those cases the person dropped ended up being replaced on the national side by the person they were dropped for.

The IRFU were at the heart of those descisions, certainly they weren't done without their prior approval.

Do you seriously think that Kidney would have a problem with Munster starting JJ or Keatley (both IQ) ahead of ROG?

Kidney would be doing cartwheels around the place if he got another IQ 10 playing HCup rugby, particularly if they ousted the encumbent by competition (just because ROG was old wouldn't be that helpful).

You Irish guys can't half blether! This thread was about the whole 6N but just seems to have been commandeered by you lot!

Sin é wrote:
Do you seriously think that Kidney would have a problem with Munster starting JJ or Keatley (both IQ) ahead of ROG?

Yup, a big problem. Unless the IRFU deem Keatley or JJ ready to take up ROGs spot in the National set up.

They aren't paying ROG a >200k a season to twiddle his thumbs. They need two fly halves on the payroll so until they see someone else as the second best in the country then no way will they allow ROG to be dropped by Munster.

No chance, Penney would be gone before the season is out. Penney knows where he sits in the pecking order, as do the other provincial coaches .

How would Kidney know if JJ/Keatley are ready to step up to international rugby unless their allowed to play a significant amount of HEC/Rabo games?

Exactly.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:You Irish guys can't half blether! This thread was about the whole 6N but just seems to have been commandeered by you lot!

I know what you mean RuggerRadge, but I assumed it was mostly because you Scottish lot were happy and content with your manager, and so had nothing to say!

Smirnoffpriest wrote:I know what you mean RuggerRadge, but I assumed it was mostly because you Scottish lot were happy and content with your manager, and so had nothing to say!

Nah we're not! We just cannae get a word in sideways!

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Smirnoffpriest wrote:I know what you mean RuggerRadge, but I assumed it was mostly because you Scottish lot were happy and content with your manager, and so had nothing to say!

Nah we're not! We just cannae get a word in sideways!

That makes a change!

We seem to be the only ones wanting to discuss their coach!!

I had a good debate with Elderking about Lancaster.

What do you think of Gatland Smirnoff.

Not wanting to put words in his mouth but I rate Gatland pretty highly as a coach, not so much as a tactician.

His plan A was enough in the 6N to bludgeon the opposition to death with a monstrous set of backs and a strong set piece, but as was noted on the Lions thread he doesn't have much of a plan B.

he also needs to stay away from DIY, especially when ladders are involved.

What I wouldn't give to have someone like Gatland for Scotland who picks on form rather than reputation or past glories.

I was quite unhappy with him 2010/2011 6Ns, but amazing way the untested youngsters took to international rugby preWC and how tight we seemed in the WC and 6Ns - where we'd played 12 games and the 3 we lost were lost by a combined 5 points against the Finalists and two previous winners - has made me comfortable with Gats, and the way he's replaced Williams so we haven't really missed him, and is replacing Rees bodes well for the future.

I think he should be given until the 2015 WC so we can see what he can do, despite me expecting a downturn in performance post-Lions tour due to fatigue.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Not wanting to put words in his mouth but I rate Gatland pretty highly as a coach, not so much as a tactician.

His plan A was enough in the 6N to bludgeon the opposition to death with a monstrous set of backs and a strong set piece, but as was noted on the Lions thread he doesn't have much of a plan B.

he also needs to stay away from DIY, especially when ladders are involved.

What I wouldn't give to have someone like Gatland for Scotland who picks on form rather than reputation or past glories.

Ahh but he's only recently started picking on form - we were crying out for Lydiate to be given a go for a whole season before he was, we had to put up with Andy Powell and Jon Thomas instead. During that time he picked Bennett, Gareth Cooper, Deiniol Jones (while gearing up for the WC), Phillips while badly out of form, Mark Jones and then players like Tom James and Gareth Williams. While those players were there I was crying and cursing just as much as you Scots seem to be doing now

Gatlands greatest Weakness is his reliance on Mike Phillips at 9.

IMO the worst Wales player by some distance. If he spent as much time being a Scrum Half as he did being "an extra flanker" Wales IMO would be a far stronger team.

I shudder to think what Roberts, JD2, North et al could do with the quicker service of someone like Rees or if Peel had realised his potential.

I don't know RuggerRadge, I think you see just what Phillips brings when he's missing - when on form he's snipping runs, physicality, good chips/kicks and defence are great and really keep the opposition honest/thinking.

The weakness is that Gats hasn't developed a Plan B for when Phillips is off form, which seems frequently these days, and Gats hasn't developed a player ready to step in for Phillips and bring faster service, but while also holding that threat of sniping runs to check the defence.

I just looked at the summer tests, and in comparison Genia and Phillips. Blair and Custiter really nulified Genia well wheras Phillips was left looking dodgy at best and hopeless at worst.

Yup, that was Phillips when he's off form - the comparison to the WC where he really stood out and caused problems for almost every side we played against, to the Oz tour where there wasn't any comparison between him and Genia, was huge.

That's when we need a plan B and we need to trust in players like Webb, Knoyle and Williams to change the game.

*EDIT - though to be fair, in the conditions Scotland played in, it was a lot harder to make sniping breaks and play a great passing game. So was a lot harder for Genia to stand out