Leinster in talks with a top notch 2nd row?

First topic message reminder :

Just seen this on the Leinsterfans forum. "There are serious talks going on with Top Notch second row. Obviously I cant say who,but hopefully we can get this guy across the line..."

The guy that posted this is supposed to be an ultra reliable source. Any thoughts on who it could be?

red_stag wrote:We would have to get rid of Botha.

It would suit us so well though. We pay Botha a small fortune. We'd pay Ross nothing.

Munster are bleeding cash at the minute and we need to get Thomond Park paid off.

You do have some fairly big names who are NIE in all fairness, I imagine Howlet and Lualala are on big bucks too.

red_stag wrote:Have any Leinster people heard anything about Mike Ross leaving. Its doing the rounds since before Christmas in Munster.

Thats probably before Tom Court turned yer man Bent into a folding deckchair at Ravers..... .....

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

red_stag wrote:We would have to get rid of Botha.

It would suit us so well though. We pay Botha a small fortune. We'd pay Ross nothing.

Munster are bleeding cash at the minute and we need to get Thomond Park paid off.

You do have some fairly big names who are NIE in all fairness, I imagine Howlet and Lualala are on big bucks too.

I think the plan is to have Howlett and Botha gone by end of season. Bring in Mike Ross on a central contract and leave use the squad to cover Howletts absense.

CJ Stander is a project player so pretty sure IRFU pay his salary. Then we just have Wian du Preez and Casey Laulala.

Overall we will miss them but we'd see a massive difference in salary.

Wonder if it the natural athlete / big bad Courtney Lawes

Ye Id rather see Hagan or Bent go to Munster. Our scrum would really suffer if Ross left.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Ye Id rather see Hagan or Bent go to Munster. Our scrum would really suffer if Ross left.

I actually don't rate Mike Ross that highly. There would be a short term pinch for Leinster but it would benefit them I think.

My main enthusiasm for idea is cash related. (I also don't rate BJ Botha that highly)

red_stag wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Ye Id rather see Hagan or Bent go to Munster. Our scrum would really suffer if Ross left.

I actually don't rate Mike Ross that highly. There would be a short term pinch for Leinster but it would benefit them I think.

My main enthusiasm for idea is cash related. (I also don't rate BJ Botha that highly)

Fair enough. I think a lot of us underrate Ross big time though. I personally would hate to see him leave.

I like Ross in terms of his scrummaging and he has got fitter but he is still next to useless around the park. he does everything averagely. He tackles but never really wins the collision, he rucks but rarely quickens our ball or slows theirs.

He is a good scrummager (not even a great one) and that is about it. Don't get me wrong we'd be worse without him but he isn't a great player overall.

There is no way that Ross is under rated. Its like the stage of John Hayes career where EVERYONE was claiming how invaluable he was to the team.

I've seen Leinster shunt guys off a scrum after Cian Healy does the damage with Ross getting the praise. Happened a fair bit last season.

red_stag wrote:There is no way that Ross is under rated. Its like the stage of John Hayes career where EVERYONE was claiming how invaluable he was to the team.

I've seen Leinster shunt guys off a scrum after Cian Healy does the damage with Ross getting the praise. Happened a fair bit last season.

+1

Yes last season everyone was saying how invaluable he was to the team. But during the AIs he was being unfairly criticized. Some people were even calling for him to be dropped and that Bent should be ahead of him.

Cant say I saw anyone suggest that.

There was certainly noises being made from within the Irish camp (backed up ably by Thornley) that mike Ross was poor against SA and was started against Fiji to regain form but that Bent was snapping at his heels in terms of selection.

Anyone else heard the Carlin "the fastest man in world rugby" Isles rumour?

Mickado wrote:Anyone else heard the Carlin "the fastest man in world rugby" Isles rumour?

Id doubt its true.

Mickado wrote:Anyone else heard the Carlin "the fastest man in world rugby" Isles rumour?

To Leinster??

Surely not. Cant imagine them using up a NIQ spot on a player whose never played Union before.

Golden wrote:

Mickado wrote:Anyone else heard the Carlin "the fastest man in world rugby" Isles rumour?

To Leinster??

Surely not. Cant imagine them using up a NIQ spot on a player whose never played Union before.

That rumour was started on boards.ie... He said that there was nothing on the internet about it. He just heard it off someone else.

Mickado wrote:There was certainly noises being made from within the Irish camp (backed up ably by Thornley) that mike Ross was poor against SA and was started against Fiji to regain form but that Bent was snapping at his heels in terms of selection.

Ross hadn't played much before had he? I thought it was about him getting up to speed.

Golden wrote:

Mickado wrote:Anyone else heard the Carlin "the fastest man in world rugby" Isles rumour?

To Leinster??

Surely not. Cant imagine them using up a NIQ spot on a player whose never played Union before.

Remember Billy Ngwini (can't be arsed finding out the proper spelling) had a trail too? It wouldn't say it's beyond the realms of possibility.

Mickado wrote:

Golden wrote:

Mickado wrote:Anyone else heard the Carlin "the fastest man in world rugby" Isles rumour?

To Leinster??

Surely not. Cant imagine them using up a NIQ spot on a player whose never played Union before.

Remember Billy Ngwini (can't be arsed finding out the proper spelling) had a trail too? It wouldn't say it's beyond the realms of possibility.

Oh yeah I remember that! Did he ever even come here for a few sessions? It was supposed to be some sort of trial period type of thing yes?

He played against LI in Donnybrook in a preseason friendly if I recall correctly. Didn't work out too well for him though!

Mickado wrote:He played against LI in Donnybrook in a preseason friendly if I recall correctly. Didn't work out too well for him though!

It says on wiki he couldn't get a visa so he had to leave. He is playing in Italy now. I was watching highlights of him on youtube playing rugby league, looked a cracking player. Wonder what went wrong.

I cant imagine Leinster would want Carlin Isles. They have really good back 3 options:

- Fitzgerald
- Kearney
- Kearney
- Conway
- Nacewa
- McFadden
- Carr

And Isles isn't gonna play anywhere except wing.

I wouldn't want him tbh

Exactly for the same money you could bring in a great second row or #12 - positions where you have little quality by contrast

red_stag wrote:Exactly for the same money you could bring in a great second row or #12 - positions where you have little quality by contrast

It's my grand plan (Schmidt calls me every week to work out what he's gonna do) that Darcy and BOD will retire after the Lions (which BOD will be on not Darce) along with Leo. I am thinking we'd move McFadden and Fitz in to the centres and possibly O'Malley but our starting centres would be McFadden and Fitz. In reserve we have Sexton/Madigan, EOM, Macken and a few guys coming through the ranks so we should be good there.

Definitely agree re: locks though that is where we should invest and we have invested badly in the last while with Sykes, Roux, Denton all not being that great although I guess Roux has been injured for the most part

McFadden is not a centre. Anything remotely of note for Leinster or Ireland has always been as a winger.

Think Fitz could be a good centre though.

D'arcy is contracted by the IRFU until the end of 2013/14 is he not? He wanted a longer contract but didn't get it.

I think Damien Browne’s contract is up at the end of this year and there’s rumours that he might not be re-signing with us. Roux was only on a one year contract but as you say, was badly injured early on so may be given more time to prove his worth. Noel Reid is a decent option to have at 12 too, although he didn’t cover himself in glory at the start of the season he was surrounded by equally inexperienced players and may benefit from being blended into the team in the same way as some of his other piers were.

McFadden will stay on the wing for the rest of the season I’d say (barring injury) he is reported to have told Schmidt that he doesn’t care where he plays but would prefer to play in one position for the majority of the season. In fairness, he’s playing the best rugby of his career so far right now, but I do agree Pete, that his long term future is as a 12.

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

red_stag wrote:Exactly for the same money you could bring in a great second row or #12 - positions where you have little quality by contrast

It's my grand plan (Schmidt calls me every week to work out what he's gonna do) that Darcy and BOD will retire after the Lions

Yeah. Joe told me he has been winding you up. He says he is waiting to see how long it is before you realise that Darce has a contract until 2014.

Don't tell him I put you wide, he'll kill me.

Mickado wrote:I think Damien Browne’s contract is up at the end of this year and there’s rumours that he might not be re-signing with us. Roux was only on a one year contract but as you say, was badly injured early on so may be given more time to prove his worth. Noel Reid is a decent option to have at 12 too, although he didn’t cover himself in glory at the start of the season he was surrounded by equally inexperienced players and may benefit from being blended into the team in the same way as some of his other piers were.

McFadden will stay on the wing for the rest of the season I’d say (barring injury) he is reported to have told Schmidt that he doesn’t care where he plays but would prefer to play in one position for the majority of the season. In fairness, he’s playing the best rugby of his career so far right now, but I do agree Pete, that his long term future is as a 12.

Completely agree with this but as you said I think his long term future will be as a 12, we have a fair few wingers coming through the academy at the moment also. I personally have always liked McFadden at 12 that being said I think he is a really bad 13 which is strange seeing as he can play the two positions either side of it!

Also Jen don't scare me, Joe and I are like this

Didn't realise Darce has that long left on his contract, that is not what I had hoped, maybe Joe is gonna cut him off.

red_stag wrote:McFadden is not a centre. Anything remotely of note for Leinster or Ireland has always been as a winger.

Think Fitz could be a good centre though.

I could say he's more of a Centre than Keith Earls but I'm a bigger man than that

In fairness he was always a centre, he has only played on the wing in the last couple of seasons.

For me. Earls, Fitz and Ferg are just versatile players that can play anywhere in the three-quarters. We can all argue over who is best where, (and we would most likely disagree) but any of them can do a job in any of those positions.

Perhaps we should start a thread about where you would play them all if you had to play them in the same backline?

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:
Also Jen don't scare me, Joe and I are like this

You mean he never told you about him begging Bod to play another year so the 3 of them could all leave together?

In fairness, a fit Bod would walk into most sides in World rugby, even in September 2013.

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:For me. Earls, Fitz and Ferg are just versatile players that can play anywhere in the three-quarters. We can all argue over who is best where, (and we would most likely disagree) but any of them can do a job in any of those positions.

Perhaps we should start a thread about where you would play them all if you had to play them in the same backline?

Wow that backline would set the AIL alight! ....

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:
Also Jen don't scare me, Joe and I are like this

You mean he never told you about him begging Bod to play another year so the 3 of them could all leave together?

In fairness, a fit Bod would walk into most sides in World rugby, even in September 2013.

haha! You're playing with me now!

I think the obvious succession plan (if we decide not to recruit in the centre) is for McFadden and Fitz to come in for Darcy and BOD respectively.

Imagine this

Reddan (wonder how long he has left?)
Sexton
Kearney
McFadden
Fitzgerald
Nacewa
Kearney Sr

That backline is RAPID!

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

Mickado wrote:I think Damien Browne’s contract is up at the end of this year and there’s rumours that he might not be re-signing with us. Roux was only on a one year contract but as you say, was badly injured early on so may be given more time to prove his worth. Noel Reid is a decent option to have at 12 too, although he didn’t cover himself in glory at the start of the season he was surrounded by equally inexperienced players and may benefit from being blended into the team in the same way as some of his other piers were.

McFadden will stay on the wing for the rest of the season I’d say (barring injury) he is reported to have told Schmidt that he doesn’t care where he plays but would prefer to play in one position for the majority of the season. In fairness, he’s playing the best rugby of his career so far right now, but I do agree Pete, that his long term future is as a 12.

Completely agree with this but as you said I think his long term future will be as a 12, we have a fair few wingers coming through the academy at the moment also. I personally have always liked McFadden at 12 that being said I think he is a really bad 13 which is strange seeing as he can play the two positions either side of it!

Also Jen don't scare me, Joe and I are like this

Didn't realise Darce has that long left on his contract, that is not what I had hoped, maybe Joe is gonna cut him off.

Who are these wingers coming through in the academy? Boyle, SCM, Hudson? I see Hudson as more of a full back. The other two don't look great. SCM is the only player in the academy that doesn't have a senior cap.

The only promising winger coming through is Adam Byrne but he's not in the academy.

Is Byrne not in the Academy!?
He doesn't have a pro contract either though right!?

There is also Carr and Conway who are senior capped players who I haven't put down and if we have a problem we can move Ferg or Fitz on to the wing and put in the very good Eoin O'Malley

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Is Byrne not in the Academy!?
He doesn't have a pro contract either though right!?

There is also Carr and Conway who are senior capped players who I haven't put down and if we have a problem we can move Ferg or Fitz on to the wing and put in the very good Eoin O'Malley

Byrne is in the Leinster u19 team. Its been a quick rise to the top for him. Thats why ive been hyping him up so much!

Don't kid yerselves lads.

Darce's contract ends 2014

Isa's contract ends 2014

Joe Schmidt's contract ends 2014

The 3 of them are trying to convince Bod to join them in a lash at 5 HCs in 6 years.

After that you can do all the player development you like. Under a new coach too.

Regarding Ferg and Luke. National management see them as wingers. It ain't fair to ask them to play centre for us and shift about the whole time.

Ferg himself asked for a run in one position. (With out asking for a specific one like some players) He is playing a stormer out there at the moment. Leave him at it.

Time for him to come in later if needed. Like Umaga. He moved in further the older he got. Often joked that if he kept playing he would end up a prop. (Fecker probably could have done it too)

I think the management (Leinster and Irish) will quickly see the pair of them as possible centres when BOD and Darce are gone

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:I think the management (Leinster and Irish) will quickly see the pair of them as possible centres when BOD and Darce are gone

I agree. but WHEN the two lads are gone could well be another 18 months. One of them it will definitely be another 18 months.

I am genuinely surprised about Darcy hanging on that long.

He's in good form now though isn't he? He was my MOTM against Edinburgh.

D'arcy has said he'll keep playing until he's told he's to old. Fair play to him. He wants his career to be as long as possible.

Ah lads. He's top notch. In great form, and a year younger than Bod.

He's not even 33 yet.

We all want to see young players developed but you can't throw out a gem like Darce at 33 when he is playing well. Use the Rabo and player injury to bring on the young lads. Unless they are ripping the Jersey off the lads in place.

Even Keatly is only getting to that stage this season.

Feckless Rogue wrote:D'arcy has said he'll keep playing until he's told he's to old. Fair play to him. He wants his career to be as long as possible.

Its funny though a lot of people criticise players like John Hayes or ROG for doing that.

red_stag wrote:

Feckless Rogue wrote:D'arcy has said he'll keep playing until he's told he's to old. Fair play to him. He wants his career to be as long as possible.

Its funny though a lot of people criticise players like John Hayes or ROG for doing that.

I was thinking exactly that stag - people don't say 'fair play' to ROG for playing for as long as he possibly can, in fact he has been heavily criticised for it. I see a lot of paralell's with D'Arcy who I think should start thinking about calling it a day.

That being said If I was in their shoes I would do the same. Similar with someone like Paul O'Connell.

They are paid a really high wage now. If they "retire" they are only in their mid 30s with kids and a family to support probably for the next 20 years.

Make the most of it and get every penny you can.

As John the Bull Hayes would say "Make hay when the sun shines".

red_stag wrote:

Feckless Rogue wrote:D'arcy has said he'll keep playing until he's told he's to old. Fair play to him. He wants his career to be as long as possible.

Its funny though a lot of people criticise players like John Hayes or ROG for doing that.

Only if they are not performing. In fairness people can be one eyed about Legends/Liginds from their own province.

I never criticized Hayzer. I have family from the same parish. Rog is an enigma wrapped in a mystery. Great player in his day. I would even keep him in the Irish Squad until the end of the season. But only for the odd cameo off the bench.

Bod and Darce are a bit younger than Hayes. But backs go earlier, so fair enough.

The difference is that Hayes was needed! And Darcy doesn't appear in the paper every other week talking about how he just can't accept that he's number one anymore. He'll play till he's too old, he'll be too old when he's replaced with a younger player. He'll be replaced with a younger player when the younger player is better.

That's not how ROG operates.