Wales v Australia, 1/12/12, k/o 14:30. DISCUSSION/MATCH THREAD, PREDICTIONS POLL & TEAMS

[Guest]

First topic message reminder :

So, on the back of Wales's 10-33 defeat to New Zealand, and Australia's 19-22 victory over Italy, we look towards the final Autumn fixture for both teams.

Having played each other five times in the last twelve months, with the three Tests in the Summer ending 27-19, 25-23, and 20-19, this was, prior to the Autumn, the SANZAR scalp Wales must have felt they could realistically take on home soil.

How important is it for Wales to win? Must they win to hold onto their 'top-8' status, to try and avoid either England or Ireland, and equally so Argentina and Samoa, in their World Cup group? Or do they need to win to halt the decline since the Grand Slam success and the competitiveness of the Australia tour in the Summer? Do they need to win to have any hope of defending their 6 Nations crown? What effect does regional form have upon the way the players performed this Autumn? Can they beat Australia, and how? Should we look outside the current squad, especially in certain positions in the pack, due to injury and non-released players? If so, who do we bring in?




It has not gone to plan for Wales. Sitting in 4th spot on the iRB rankings following the Grand Slam success, they were in 6th place prior to the Autumn series and attempting to regain the coveted 4th to ensure a 'favourable' draw for the World Cup. However, they now sit tentatively in 7th position, only just ahead of Argentina and Samoa, both victorious at the Millennium Stadium, and a defeat to the Wallabies will mean they will have fallen from 4th to 9th following 7 straight Test defeats, and they will be in the third 'tier' for the World Cup seedings. This means they would face one of the first tier (New Zealand, South Africa, Australia, France) and one of the second tier (England, Ireland, Samoa, Argentina) in their group if they lose next Saturday.

This cannot be the position Wales expected to be in three weeks ago, yet having been deservedly beaten in the first two fixtures due to playing a pedestrian, 'territorially-minded' game-plan, they can have little complaint. It was only until the last half hour of the NZ game that Wales displayed any acceptance that their tactics were not conducive to success; you cannot score tries without the ball, and against the best teams you will be slaughtered if you kick down their throats. With New Zealand able to take it down a notch or two around the 50 minute mark, having being invited onto the ball, which they duly did, scoring 33 unanswered points, Wales finally played the running rugby they ought to be famed for, but it was too little too late.

Aside from the tactical noose that is evidently not working, or indeed not being implemented successfully and without error so that Wales can play the low-risk strategy Gatland favours, selection has been a major issue. For the Argentina game, with Ryan Jones and Dan Lydiate injured,
Josh Turnbull started at 6, with his club captain McCusker the back row cover on the bench. Both of these were selected ahead of their Scarlets teammate Aaron Shingler, who was playing exceptionally better rugby at regional level and, when called upon against New Zealand, performed admirably and effectively, something that cannot be said for Turnbull and McCusker. Mike Phillips, although excellent defensively, and a danger when sniping at close quarters, as he did yesterday, is woefully slow to the breakdown, especially when a linebreak is made, something in itself that is too infrequent for Wales. Tavis Knoyle is marginally better, although he himself, like the admission of Shingler, is arguably no longer the strongest scrum half for his region, with Gareth Davies in fine form. With Richie Rees, perhaps the best Welsh distributor after Dwayne Peel, no longer in Gatland's plans, and Rhys Webb ignored, there is decidedly little to choose from. Poor service, whoever it comes from, has been used poorly by Priestland, subject to ironic cheering from the crowd when successfully kicking to touch prior to Wales's first try against NZ and when replaced by James Hook. Priestland has been kicking almost persistently to the detriment of the team, but with the constant repetition of the mantra about 'territory' and "playing in the right areas" ('Re-boot the attack' section), the coaches must be pleased with his decision making, his only fault his execution. With James Hook having played 13 minutes all Series, and unavailable for the Australia game, and the extent of Dan Biggar's injury unknown at present, Priestland is likely to remain in the 10 shirt. Liam Williams performed admirably when he stepped up for George North, as did Scott Andrews for the injured Aaron Jarvis. The latter will likely start in Jarvis's absence, but with a reliance of Halfpenny's boot, Liam Williams will, in all probability, miss out. With French-based players (the excellent Charteris, Phillips, and the somewhat out of form Gethin Jenkins) missing out on selection due to the game falling outside the iRB window, and possibly English-based players too, the squad may be weakened somewhat. With AWJ unavailable, Bradley Davies floored, and uncertainty over Ian Evans, we are facing something of a second row crisis. However, for me, the best 15 we could produce, based on who is in the squad, is as follows. Feel free to add your own:

1. Paul James
2. Ken Owens
3. Scott Andrews
4. Luke Charteris
5. Ian Evans
6. Aaron Shingler
7. Sam Warburton
8. Toby Faletau
9. Tavis Knoyle
10. Dan Biggar
11. George North
12. Scott Williams
13. Jonathan Davies
14. Alex Cuthbert
15. Leigh Halfpenny

16. Matthew Rees
17. Ryan Bevington
18. Samson Lee
19. Ryan Jones
20. Justin Tipuric
21. Lloyd Williams
22. Rhys Priestland
23. Liam Williams

*If both starting second rows are unavailable, we are in something of a crisis. We would likely be forced to start with Ryan Jones at lock, and possibly Lou Reed too, with Aaron Shingler covering the position, and someone else coming in to fill a replacement position. But I do not know who.

This is far from the 15 I think is the 'best', but it is the best of what I can make with who is in the squad.

So on to Australia. I do not believe that they are a confident team, nowhere near the free-flowing, off the cuff team of two years ago, with key players such as David Pocock struggling (though the excellent Michael Hooper has stepped up in his absence) and James Horwill suffering with injury. At the end of a long tour, Wales have to see them as beatable. Yet, on the back the tightest of wins against Italy, they will surely be fully prepared, and any expectations of catching them dreaming of the sunny shores of home will most probably be misplaced, and punished by the men in gold. Berrick Barnes is a key man, who will punish Wales on the scoreboard in a manner Priestland chose not to in the first half against New Zealand; any mistakes will be chipped away 3 by 3, and if we kick to the Wallabies three quarters, they have the running ability to cut us to shreds. Yet the size of our midfield ought to be an asset, and if we keep the ball in hand, Scott Williams and Jon Davies are capable of both creating and scoring tries. I feel their selection over the injury prone Jamie Roberts, who has been ineffective, and needs time away from international rugby to regain form and develop his game from simply being a human wrecking ball, is imperative to Wales playing a quicker game, less reliant on their formulaic and obvious ball carriers, something Samoa said they were all too aware of. The England-Australia game was tight, but winnable for England, a team who I think are about on a par with Wales, both playing their own brand of tactically poor rugby that does their talented players a disservice (no Mike Phillips pun intended). In this sense, Wales can and should win, regardless of their form in the previous 3 games. It's imperative for World Cup rankings, but perhaps more importantly, to stop the slide and finally get the win, and psychological boon that comes with it, that they ought to have had in the Summer, but for some silly mistakes.

Wales team to face Australia:
15. Leigh Halfpenny
14. Alex Cuthbert
13. Jonathan Davies
12. Jamie Roberts
11. Liam Williams
10. Rhys Priestland
9. Mike Phillips

1. Gethin Jenkins
2. Matthew Rees
3. Scott Andrews
4. Luke Charteris
5. Ian Evans
6. Aaron Shingler
7. Sam Warburton (capt)
8. Toby Faletau.

Bench:
16. Ken Owens
17 Ryan Bevington
18. Samson Lee
19. Ryan Jones
20. Justin Tipuric
21. Tavis Knoyle
22. Dan Biggar
23. Scott Williams

Australia team to face Wales:

15. Berrick Barnes
14. Nick Cummins
13. Adam Ashley-Cooper
12. Ben Tapuai
11. Drew Mitchell
10. Kurtley Beale
9. Nick Phipps

1. Benn Robinson
2. Tatafu Polota Nau
3. Ben Alexander
4. Kane Douglas
5. Nathan Sharpe (capt)
6. Scott Higginbotham
7. David Pocock
8.Wycliff Palu

Bench:
16. Stephen Moore
17. James Slipper
18. Sekope Kepu
19. Dave Dennis
20. Michael Hooper
21. Brendan McKibbin
22. Mike Harris
23. Digby Ioane.

[bedfordwelsh]

Here is what I would go with if the likes of Biggar and Evans come through injury worries

Jenkins ( No longer 1st choice but James isn't available so experience essential)
Rees
Andrews (made me eat my hat and had very good game)
Evans
Charteris
Shingler
Faletau
Warburton

Phillips (Still best of a bad bunch)
Biggar

North
JD
Sc Williams
Halfpenny

Li Williams

[gavstar]

read rp in press today saying, his words,' i have been playing with blinkers on and was afraid to make mistakes'

my question to him would be 'why?'

gethin said more or less the same after the samoa match about this fear of mistakes.

what sort of 'culture' is there in the camp i wonder?

one of the 'newcomers' liam, obviously wasn't of the same mind set, and didn't he have a real go.

the 'new' theory that has been used ( for last 3 seasons so not new) is to have the players comment on each others performance, and some players find this very intimidating.

biggar to start hopefully.

[maestegmafia]

read rp in press today saying, his words,' i have been playing with blinkers on and was afraid to make mistakes'

my question to him would be 'why?'

gethin said more or less the same after the samoa match about this fear of mistakes.

what sort of 'culture' is there in the camp i wonder?

one of the 'newcomers' liam, obviously wasn't of the same mind set, and didn't he have a real go.

the 'new' theory that has been used ( for last 3 seasons so not new) is to have the players comment on each others performance, and some players find this very intimidating.

biggar to start hopefully.

There is a massive amount of pressure on these guys to perform and to be frank they are not used to dealing with that responsibility at such a young age as Priestland, 25 or 26. The guy has he hopes of a nation and the eyes of the world on him.

Thank god he is seeing a sports psychologist, hopefully it will do him the world of good. He is a talented lad. We have all seen how good he can be. Lets hope they can get him back on form.

[Cyril]

one of the 'newcomers' liam, obviously wasn't of the same mind set, and didn't he have a real go.

That's a good point. He looked like he was really up for it and enjoying himself. Not something that could be said of a lot of his team mates. I wonder if Spala etc is driving the enthusiasm and positive-thinking out of the players.

[maestegmafia]

The Wallabies are facing the loss of powerful (Tongan Born) lock Sitaleki Timani after he was cited for allegedly striking an opponent in the test against Italy last weekend.

Timani appeared to smack prop Andrea Lo Cicero Vaina in the mouth with his forearm during a scuffle involving Lo Cicero, Italian hooker Leonardo Ghiraldini and Wallabies captain Nathan Sharpe in the 13th minute of the test.
Footage also shows a high tackle on Sharpe that appears to have sparked the confrontation, as well as Timani's subsequent blow catching Ghiraldini in the face.

Lo Cicero, a stout front-rower, is shown wrenching two-metre-tall Sharpe backwards, with his arm around the Australian's neck.
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During the ensuing scuffle, Sharpe appears to plant his palm over Lo Cicero's face before Timani plants the alleged strike on the hooker's jaw.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/timani-charged-with-striking-faces-ban-20121127-2a476.html#ixzz2DMucIutP

[Cyril]

During the ensuing scuffle, Sharpe appears to plant his palm over Lo Cicero's face before Timani plants the alleged strike on the hooker's jaw.

Woah, tag team!

[maestegmafia]

Forward Aaron Shingler says Wales must go out to bully the Wallabies on Saturday as the real possibility of suffering an autumn Test series whitewash is "almost unthinkable".
Shingler's words mirrored the sense of desperation for Rugby World Cup semi-finalists and Six Nations champions Wales as they go into their final Test of 2012 on a six-Test losing streak.
A fourth successive home defeat of the autumn campaign would see Wales drop out of the world's top eight-ranked teams and into tier three for next week's 2015 World Cup pool draw.
"Everything is on the line," said Shingler, who replaced the poleaxed Bradley Davies just three minutes into Wales' 33-10 defeat by New Zealand on Saturday.
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"It's important we don't come away with four losses. It is a massive, massive week.
"We've got to be very accurate, very aggressive and look to bully them (Australia).
"A whitewash is almost unthinkable. We've trained well every week, our preparation has been good, it just hasn't gone as we would have liked on the field."


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/we-must-bully-wallabies-says-desperate-wales-20121126-2a37i.html#ixzz2DMvKjzzG

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

Guess it evens things up in a way for Wales if he does get banned, both sides will be missing an enforcer for different reasons.


Does seem massively inconsistent again though, there were several punches thrown (both sides) in the England game

[maestegmafia]

Guess it evens things up in a way for Wales if he does get banned, both sides will be missing an enforcer for different reasons.


Does seem massively inconsistent again though, there were several punches thrown (both sides) in the England game

In which game?

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

Guess it evens things up in a way for Wales if he does get banned, both sides will be missing an enforcer for different reasons.


Does seem massively inconsistent again though, there were several punches thrown (both sides) in the England game

In which game?

Sorry the SA game

Louw through one to the head of player when he was penalised for breaking of the scrum, I think Tom Youngs got at least one in on Estebez during the spat with his brother and a Saffer got a cheeky one in on and England forward as the cuddle fest was being split up.

None of it was anything special but they were punches. There isnt a zero tolerance policy for fighting, ist still seen as part of the game to some extent.

[gavstar]

i understand the players are under pressure to perform maes, but these guys have been around the set up a while now, and on the world stage.

i wonder how young dan biggar will cope , 22/23 isnt he?

[maestegmafia]

I think there is a discernibly different view taken, to for recent example, Andrew Hore on Brad Davies to a silly little handbag spat like the young brothers on Etzbeth.

Unfortunately unless the law is black and white referees struggle to enforce anything with empathy.

[maestegmafia]

i understand the players are under pressure to perform maes, but these guys have been around the set up a while now, and on the world stage.

i wonder how young dan biggar will cope , 22/23 isnt he?

I don't think Biggar copes well.

When I wrote that post I thought, you know Priestland is the same age as Barry John was, but John couldn't handle the pressure, he left the game because of it.

To be honest i thought Priestland played some great rugby on the weekend. He needs to sort his kicking out, but to be fair 99% of his kicking was superb.

[glamorganalun]

Here is what I would go with if the likes of Biggar and Evans come through injury worries

Jenkins ( No longer 1st choice but James isn't available so experience essential)
Rees
Andrews (made me eat my hat and had very good game)
Evans
Charteris
Shingler
Faletau
Warburton

Phillips (Still best of a bad bunch)
Biggar

North
JD
Sc Williams
Halfpenny

Li Williams

Bedford:

I agree with your 9 to 15, I think they pick themselves after the last game but Cuthbert is by far our best finisher so I suspect L Williams will be dropped to the bench with North replacing him. Looking at the pack, we are going to struggle as England were under pressure from Australia in the scrum. I agree with Lyn Jones on scrum V, R Jones should go to 8 Warburton at 6 and Tipuric at 7 but I would be happy with Shinger at 6 Jones 8 and Warburton at 7. Toby had his best game by far but he still drops the ball, does not offload, pass with an overlap and does not control the ball at scrum time. Gatland will probably still pick him at 8, R Jones at 6 and Warburton at 7.

Looking at our pack you highlighted it seems to be made up of players not first choice for their teams and/or in losing packs except I Evans and maybe Charteris, worrying it is like the team fielded for the first test in Australia, worrying!

[gavstar]

maes, there's a job going in a clock makers near you, you have to be good at wind ups !!!!!!! 99% great rugby from rp!!!!

and similarly, you cant assess how biggar will cope on the worold stage.....he's hardly been on it has he !!!!!!!

there's another wagon going by your house next week, i'll expect you will be on it, true to form!!! tick tock tick tock

[flyhalffactory]

maes, there's a job going in a clock makers near you, you have to be good at wind ups !!!!!!! 99% great rugby from rp!!!!

and similarly, you cant assess how biggar will cope on the worold stage.....he's hardly been on it has he !!!!!!!

there's another wagon going by your house next week, i'll expect you will be on it, true to form!!! tick tock tick tock

Maesteg mate
I probably am one of the few posters who aree with you albeit to a lesser extent.......... Priestland wasnt that good (there were worse performers..... Cuthbert should have had a hat-trick if not four tries and his tackling was dire, Warburton had a good game but Faletau!!...)but he had a much better game than posters are saying. As the Scrum5 pundits said most of the time the naivity of the Welsh players meant that he had very little options on.

Amazing that some would drop Priestland when it was plainly obvious 17 first half miss tackles and so many turnovers where the real problem was, Phillips rarely held the ruck line, and Faletau for the fourth game rarely positioned himself in front of the half backs, Priestland therefore was often in No Mans Land as far as options having received slow or no ball from his halfback partner, and with no cover from his 8

[gboycottnut]

wales should stick to what they do best and that is use a 15 man lineout plan. That looks like the only way Wales can score tries just now against any of the Southern Hemisphere teams such as Argentina and Samoa.

[ScarletSpiderman]

No 10 replacement on the bench Spiderman if Biggar isn't fit? And however good Lee is, Scott Andrews certainly deserves to retain his place in the side after the performance he put in against NZ.

What fly half replacement is there in the squad?? I have not heard of anyone being called up.

True, but if by tomorrow Biggar is looking anything less than 80%, I would have thought someone (be it Morgan, Stephen Jones...whoever) would be called up as a precaution. Otherwise, if Priestland gets injured during the game, we're facing the scenario of having Liam or Scott Williams having to play first receiver.

I was going on who is in the squad right now. If there is a fly half called into the squad then obviously they would take to the bench. Also if we did go down to having no fly half I think Halfpenny may do a decent job there, he does seem to have a good eye for what is in front of him, he has a decent tactical boot, and also can sling a pass out well enough.

[munkian]

Get McShingler in

Other options ?

Hook
Dan Evans (Dragons)
Matthew Morgan
Rhys(sp?) Patchell
Sweeney
Henson

[maestegmafia]

maes, there's a job going in a clock makers near you, you have to be good at wind ups !!!!!!! 99% great rugby from rp!!!!

and similarly, you cant assess how biggar will cope on the worold stage.....he's hardly been on it has he !!!!!!!

there's another wagon going by your house next week, i'll expect you will be on it, true to form!!! tick tock tick tock

I think you are overly persuaded in your opinion by others negative thoughts on Priestland. Three appaulling misses for touch is not the sole criteria to judge a performance.

Re Biggar, watching him week in week out for the ospreys he struggles under pressure and falls apart worse than Priestland. Re watch Ospreys vs Tigers.

Unlike you I am willing to give players a chance on the positives in their game, not write them off on small negatives.

[maestegmafia]

Team Likely to be picked if fit in my opinion is:

1 Geth
2 Rees
3 Andrews
4 Charteris
5 Evans
6 Jones
7 Warburton
8 Faletau
9 Phillips
10 Priestland
11 Cuthbert
12 Roberts
13 Davies
14 North
15 Halfpenny

16 Bevington
17 Owens
18 Lee
19 Shingler
20 Tipuric
21 Knoyle
22 Biggar
23 S Williams

If Roberts is out, Scott steps up. If North is out L Williams, if Evans Ryan goes to second row and Shingler to 6. If Biggar is not fit Wellies might put his boots on?

I'd like to see Patchell or Tovey introduced.

The management must be confident of Biggar being fit as they haven't called up and flyhalfs so far this week..! Scott Williams played ten for the last quarter when we beat England at Cardiff last summer, I think he also played there vs Namibia. Not that that is much consolation for our poor run of injuries in the face of such an important match.

[TycroesOsprey]

Team Likely to be picked if fit in my opinion is:

1 Geth
2 Rees
3 Andrews
4 Charteris
5 Evans
6 Jones
7 Warburton
8 Faletau
9 Phillips
10 Priestland
11 Cuthbert
12 Roberts
13 Davies
14 North
15 Halfpenny

16 Bevington
17 Owens
18 Lee
19 Shingler
20 Tipuric
21 Knoyle
22 Hook
23 S Williams

If Roberts is out, Scott steps up. If North is out L Williams, if Evans Ryan goes to second row and Shingler to 6.

Hook is back in France Maes so it will be Biggar or AN Other on the bench. Roberts doesnt deserve a spot ahead of Sc Williams imo but I agree Gatland will pick him if fit. Harsh on Liam as he had a good game on saturday, great hands to put Cuthbert away for the try but if Roberts is fit he will drop out of the 23.

[maestegmafia]

Team Likely to be picked if fit in my opinion is:

1 Geth
2 Rees
3 Andrews
4 Charteris
5 Evans
6 Jones
7 Warburton
8 Faletau
9 Phillips
10 Priestland
11 Cuthbert
12 Roberts
13 Davies
14 North
15 Halfpenny

16 Bevington
17 Owens
18 Lee
19 Shingler
20 Tipuric
21 Knoyle
22 Hook
23 S Williams

If Roberts is out, Scott steps up. If North is out L Williams, if Evans Ryan goes to second row and Shingler to 6.

Hook is back in France Maes so it will be Biggar or AN Other on the bench. Roberts doesnt deserve a spot ahead of Sc Williams imo but I agree Gatland will pick him if fit. Harsh on Liam as he had a good game on saturday, great hands to put Cuthbert away for the try but if Roberts is fit he will drop out of the 23.

Of course he is I forgot he wasn't allowed release. Biggar might have a big opportunity to prove his supporters right then.

[RubyGuby]

I can't see him giving Priestland another chance here with the lads state of mind. Has to be Biggar

[samuraidragon]

Team Likely to be picked if fit in my opinion is:

1 Geth
2 Rees
3 Andrews
4 Charteris
5 Evans
6 Jones
7 Warburton
8 Faletau
9 Phillips
10 Priestland
11 Cuthbert
12 Roberts
13 Davies
14 North
15 Halfpenny

16 Bevington
17 Owens
18 Lee
19 Shingler
20 Tipuric
21 Knoyle
22 Hook
23 S Williams

If Roberts is out, Scott steps up. If North is out L Williams, if Evans Ryan goes to second row and Shingler to 6.

Hook is in France, where his club requires him (Geth & MP are surplus to requirements). I wouldn't have Roberts even if fit, and am amazed you don't find a space for Liam W after his outstanding performance amidst a sea of mediocrity. It would be a kindness to RP not to pick him - he's already visiting the shrink to try and overcome the trauma of the past few weeks.

[TycroesOsprey]

For all our injuries thats pretty close to out best XV with only Andrews and Ryan coming in. When you think Andrews is our 4th choice tighthead its a worry for scrumtime.

[maestegmafia]

For all our injuries thats pretty close to out best XV with only Andrews and Ryan coming in. When you think Andrews is our 4th choice tighthead its a worry for scrumtime.

You would think so but our scrum did well with him last weekend. He's not the worry that many would have you believe.

[gavstar]

[quote="maestegmafia Unlike you I am willing to give players a chance on the positives in their game, not write them off on small negatives.[/quote]

i agree with that maes, thats why i want biggar to be given his chance at international level, same number of chances as priestland has had and lets go from there.

[TycroesOsprey]

For all our injuries thats pretty close to out best XV with only Andrews and Ryan coming in. When you think Andrews is our 4th choice tighthead its a worry for scrumtime.

You would think so but our scrum did well with him last weekend. He's not the worry that many would have you believe.

Dunno Maes I've watched him for the Blues and hes taken some real beastings this season. Admittedly the blues pack have been about as aggressive as Ghandi but I still think its a weakness. At least Adam and Mitchell should be back for the six nations.

[samuraidragon]

maes, there's a job going in a clock makers near you, you have to be good at wind ups !!!!!!! 99% great rugby from rp!!!!

and similarly, you cant assess how biggar will cope on the worold stage.....he's hardly been on it has he !!!!!!!

there's another wagon going by your house next week, i'll expect you will be on it, true to form!!! tick tock tick tock

Maesteg mate
I probably am one of the few posters who aree with you albeit to a lesser extent.......... Priestland wasnt that good (there were worse performers..... Cuthbert should have had a hat-trick if not four tries and his tackling was dire, Warburton had a good game but Faletau!!...)but he had a much better game than posters are saying. As the Scrum5 pundits said most of the time the naivity of the Welsh players meant that he had very little options on.

Amazing that some would drop Priestland when it was plainly obvious 17 first half miss tackles and so many turnovers where the real problem was, Phillips rarely held the ruck line, and Faletau for the fourth game rarely positioned himself in front of the half backs, Priestland therefore was often in No Mans Land as far as options having received slow or no ball from his halfback partner, and with no cover from his 8

RP started very well, with some neat chips into space, but after the missed touches he crumbled. The tackling was indeed a huge problem, especially on Savea,where nobody went low. Cuthbert wasn't the only culprit by any means. JD2 missed several, Halfpenny too, so did Priestland for that matter.They had trouble adjusting to the power and speed of the ABs. Agree about the Phillips delivery - but nothing new there, it's always like that.

[maestegmafia]

For all our injuries thats pretty close to out best XV with only Andrews and Ryan coming in. When you think Andrews is our 4th choice tighthead its a worry for scrumtime.

You would think so but our scrum did well with him last weekend. He's not the worry that many would have you believe.

Dunno Maes I've watched him for the Blues and hes taken some real beastings this season. Admittedly the blues pack have been about as aggressive as Ghandi but I still think its a weakness. At least Adam and Mitchell should be back for the six nations.

Aye could well be to with who's around him. Certainly looked much better for Wales than early season at the Blues.

[wales606]

For all our injuries thats pretty close to out best XV with only Andrews and Ryan coming in. When you think Andrews is our 4th choice tighthead its a worry for scrumtime.

You would think so but our scrum did well with him last weekend. He's not the worry that many would have you believe.

Dunno Maes I've watched him for the Blues and hes taken some real beastings this season. Admittedly the blues pack have been about as aggressive as Ghandi but I still think its a weakness. At least Adam and Mitchell should be back for the six nations.

Aye could well be to with who's around him. Certainly looked much better for Wales than early season at the Blues.

He has only played about 3 times for the Blues and has looked much improved - I don't remember him struggling much on his side of the scrum except when the entire pack was in retreat.

[wales606]

1. Gethin Jenkins
2. Matthew Rees
3. Scott Andrews
4. Ryan Jones
5. Luke Charteris
6. Aaron Shingler
7. Sam Warburton
8. Toby Faletau
9. Mike Phillips
10. Dan Biggar (please god)
11. Liam Williams/North (50/50)
12. Scott Williams
13. Jonathan Davies
14. Alex Cuthbert
15. Leigh Halfpenny

16. Ken Owens (Hibbard if fit)
17. Ryan Bevington
18. Samson Lee
19. Ian Evans
20. Justin Tipuric
21. Tavis Knoyle
22. Rhys Preistland
23. Jamie Roberts/Ashley Beck

[maestegmafia]

1. Gethin Jenkins
2. Matthew Rees
3. Scott Andrews
4. Ryan Jones
5. Luke Charteris
6. Aaron Shingler
7. Sam Warburton
8. Toby Faletau
9. Mike Phillips
10. Dan Biggar (please god)
11. Liam Williams/North (50/50)
12. Scott Williams
13. Jonathan Davies
14. Alex Cuthbert
15. Leigh Halfpenny

16. Ken Owens (Hibbard if fit)
17. Ryan Bevington
18. Samson Lee
19. Ian Evans
20. Justin Tipuric
21. Tavis Knoyle
22. Rhys Preistland
23. Jamie Roberts/Ashley Beck

Good shout there mate...!

[bedfordwelsh]

For me if Evans is fit then he starts but Ryan moving up with Shingler coming in at No6 would be a good move.

I think Liam Williams deserves to start but at whose expense North or Cuthberts?

Cuthberts defence is still suspect for such a big lump so I would go with North and Williams

[maestegmafia]

For me if Evans is fit then he starts but Ryan moving up with Shingler coming in at No6 would be a good move.

I think Liam Williams deserves to start but at whose expense North or Cuthberts?

Cuthberts defence is still suspect for such a big lump so I would go with North and Williams

I agree.

I think if North is fit, Williams won't get a place in the starting XV. Though he may well deserve it. North and Cuthbert have been scoring tries for fun all season.

[maestegmafia]

From the BBC on our injury list...!!!


"The good new for Wales was that lock Evans took part in training on Tuesday.
But centre Roberts (hip) will not train in the early part of this week and back-row Jones (head) has stitches and will take a limited part in training until the end of the week."

"Fly-half Biggar (shoulder) was due to resume some rugby training on Monday afternoon after being forced off in the defeat by Samoa. The Welsh Rugby Union say he is not yet ready to take contact but is hoping to be in contention later in the week.
Scarlets wing North (hip) is continuing his rehabilitation and also remains in contention to return after being forced to withdraw from the side to face the All Blacks."

[bedfordwelsh]

I wouldn't start Roberts even if he is fit, thoguht Williams and Davies worked well, As commented earleir O/H could be a worry if Biggar not fit.

[wales606]

If it is possible that Biggar is not going to be fit, shouldn't they have called up a 3rd FH?

Ceri Sweeney has been playing well

[maestegmafia]

If it is possible that Biggar is not going to be fit, shouldn't they have called up a 3rd FH?

Ceri Sweeney has been playing well

No one has been called up.

[Morgannwg]

They may call someone up, I think they're waiting just another 24 hours on the fitness on Dan Biggar and some others. Team should be announced by thursday.

[maestegmafia]

They may call someone up, I think they're waiting just another 24 hours on the fitness on Dan Biggar and some others. Team should be announced by thursday.

Wednesday would be too late.

[maestegmafia]

Really not sure what options are available to us this late in the day should Biggar be declared unfit...?

Stephen Jones and Gavin Henson are the only tens in welsh rugby to have been involved with the squad in the last 12 months.

I don't think I would want either to get a last minute call up. Likewise it would be unfair on a youngster to enter the Frey so late in the campaign.

Though a fresh face might add to Wales ability..?

Matthew Morgan maybe??? That would be a shock.

Steven Shingler was actually not a bad call.

[samuraidragon]

I seem to remember Scott Williams putting in a shift at 10 in one of the World Cup warm-ups. Or is my memory playing tricks?

[bedfordwelsh]

I seem to remember Scott Williams putting in a shift at 10 in one of the World Cup warm-ups. Or is my memory playing tricks?

SD,

Am not sure if he actually played there but I do think he has been mentioned as emergency cover before if need be. I am surprised they haven't called cover up especially with Hook going back to Perpignan.

Maybe they don't think there anyone out there worth calling up which is a sad reflectionif that the case.

[TJ1]

Predictions? Aus win by a fair bit

[samuraidragon]

Or maybe they're confident Biggar will be fit? Hope so anyway!

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

Henson isnt available due to the PRL agreement (assuming LW are bound by that since they arent a full member?) I cant imagine theyd block his release if it was their decision
Shingler certainly isnt available for the same reason.

[RubyGuby]

Some of this is coming home to roost with so many players being unavailable for what many see as an important game. The planning and the management by the WRU needs a serious review.

[BlueNote]

It's very hard to pick given that players are potentially becoming available at different points in the week - do you go for an option you'd marginally have preferred had both been fit from the off but who has been unable to be fully involved in the team prep or the guy who has been able to be involved the whole way? And if you do that in one case, are you then more reluctant to do it in another?

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