Premiership Rugby is to begin discussions next month about an alternative competition to the Heineken Cup that could include an element of southern hemisphere opposition.

First topic message reminder :

Could be interesting. Would be great for the continued development of Argentina.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/club/9741136/Premiership-Rugby-to-set-up-talks-to-break-deadlock-over-new-Heineken-Cup-competition.html

Premiership Rugby is to begin discussions next month about an alternative competition to the Heineken Cup that could include an element of southern hemisphere opposition.

By Gavin Mairs
11:00PM GMT 12 Dec 2012

The move comes after a fourth round of talks involving European stakeholders, held at a hotel near Heathrow Airport, failed to end the impasse over the future structure of the Heineken Cup from 2014.

Among proposals likely to come under consideration are an Anglo-French competition, while there is thought to be interest from Argentina to establish professional clubs below their national side that could be based in Spain.

While there is still hope that a deal can be done for English clubs to remain in the European tournament, one source said last night it was time for “big thinking”.

The English clubs’ position is strengthened by their new television deal with BT Vision from 2014 which would be lucrative enough to replace the income from both the Premiership and European competitions.

Divisions between the English and French clubs — who are demanding reform of the tournament, including a reduction of clubs from 24 to 20 — and their Rabodirect Pro 12 counterparts are thought to have widened.

While the proposal by the representatives of the Celtic and Italian clubs for an expanded tournament of 32 clubs is now thought to be off the table, their overriding preference is said to be to maintain the status quo.

Premiership Rugby had hoped that a breakthrough would have been possible after presenting details of a possible compromise over their demands that only the top six of the Pro 12 clubs qualify and financial guarantees over funding.

The English clubs’s suggestion was for the top four Pro 12 sides to automatically qualify, with the next two qualifiers based on geographical spread to ensure every country was represented in the tournament.

Sources say there was no give in the Pro 12 position, which currently guarantees two places for Scotland and Italy, during the three-hour meeting.

The English and French clubs however pointed out that as they had served the necessary two years’ notice on the current accord back in June, it was not realistic to expect them now to accept the status quo six months on.

It is understood that Premiership Rugby remains hopeful that an agreement can still be reached and are prepared to re-examine their own proposals over the festive period.

But this will also go hand-in-hand with exploratory talks about filling the nine European weekends with an alternative tournament.

While no date was set for another stakeholder meeting, the ERC board is scheduled to meet on Feb 6 next year, when a further review will take place.

I would be suprised

TJ wrote:I would be suprised

Why wouldn't they?

Because it would be ruining two or three IRB sanctioned completions

Sorry are you saying why would the IRB sanction it or why would the RFU/SARU sanction it?

Any either or all.

This kind of idea - a season of northern hemisphere teams playing southern hemisphere teams - is as fanciful as Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy.

But, for one season, if I were in charge of all things, I would chuck all existing structures and make it happen. THAT would be the biggest boost to Rugby since the inception of the Rugby World Cup. Would be massive. Everyone, everywhere would benefit. No losers.

TJ wrote:Because it would be ruining two or three IRB sanctioned completions

I don't think the competition will happen, but even if it did I can't see how that is a position the IRB could adopt. For it to happen the relative parties would have to first serve notice in the competitions they are already in, and the IRB can't force them to play in a competition they don't want to. France & England have already served notice without the IRB saying they can't because it ruins the HC. The IRB could in theory not sanction a new competition, but the other competitions would already have been 'ruined' and there would be little credibility in the IRB insisting the members it represents can't establish a new competition that they want to be a part of rather than have nothing at all.

If the IRB got involved it would have to be to make all European nations with pro teams get involved.

HammerofThunor wrote:Why wouldn't they? Have the IRB ever got involved in any domestic competition?

Tournaments below national representative level are covered in IRB regulation 16.2 (Matches, tours and tournaments below National Representative level)

http://www.irb.com/mm/document/lawsregs/regulations/04/23/20/100518gfirbhandbook2010freg16english.pdf

Essentially tournament rights are devolved down to the participating Unions.

Interestingly though, I did turn up broadcasting rights. The PRL deal with BTVision has to be ratified by the RFU. IRB REGULATION 13. BROADCASTING RIGHTS http://www.irb.com/mm/document/lawsregs/regulations/04/23/23/42323_pdf.pdf

Nothing I can find either on the ERC site or the the IRB appears to empower it in any way other than as an informal grouping of Unions.